Ladies, sons and bathrooms

[Angel Ariel]

We're talking about not making an 8 year old go into a crowded bathroom without adult supervision if that isn't something they can handle.

There are options that exist for that child besides having that child in the ladies room.

 

[Tara1988]

Wait.

So, the girl or woman who might feel uncomfortable changing a pad or tampon in a ladies' room with a boy standing in front of his mom's stall or at the sink waiting should be the one to find a companion bathroom? Really?

I think this thread officially jumped the shark .

Why on earth would they feel uncomfortable changing their pad or tampon in the privacy of their own stall? The boy isn't looking in the stall watching what they are doing. The boy is in there to do his business and leave, just like anyone else using the restroom. If it's that big of a deal to change a pad or tampon, wouldn't they also be uncomfortable with a little girl standing in front of a stall or at the sink? Wouldn't it be just as uncomfortable to have a little girl peeping in the stall as it would a little boy?

 

[Tara1988]

Half the time my girls are out and about in the world with their father. Why is that never the question asked - where the girls go to the bathroom. They just go to thei gender appropriate bathroom when they are school aged or thereabouts. Why is that appropriate for girls but not boys? There are options at Disney they are just not as convenient.

I never said that was appropriate for a little girl. If my daughter was alone with my husband, she would go into the bathroom with him until she is comfortable going alone. The exact same for when my boys are with me.

 

[Tattylou]

I'm sure they've made up their mind by now and it seems like everyone is just arguing....

 

[Angel Ariel]

Why on earth would they feel uncomfortable changing their pad or tampon in the privacy of their own stall? The boy isn't looking in the stall watching what they are doing. The boy is in there to do his business and leave, just like anyone else using the restroom. If it's that big of a deal to change a pad or tampon, wouldn't they also be uncomfortable with a little girl standing in front of a stall or at the sink? Wouldn't it be just as uncomfortable to have a little girl peeping in the stall as it would a little boy?

You are looking for rationality when there might not be any. Is it rational for a young girl to feel uncomfortable changing a pad or tampon in a private stall? Maybe not, depending on their age and how long they've been menstrating. Does that make their feelings any less valid? No. I won't teach my daughter that her feelings are not valid if some other person doesn't think she should feel that way. GYou don't have to agree, but it should be respected all the same.

If an older boy needs the accommodation of having a parent with him and the same sex parent is not available, then the mom and child should find a companion restroom, or a smaller/less crowded restroom (like, for ex, restaurant bathrooms). The onus shouldn't be put on the girls to find a different restroom, but on the boy and parent to find a restroom that meets their needs while also respecting others.

 

[snowman]

I think many 8 year old of both genders know a thing or two about menstruation, if not raised in a bubble. These are third graders, for goodness sake. An 8 year old boy who wants to go in the ladies room with mommy has issues, although I've never met one. Overprotective helicopter moms - yep, they exist. Having b/g twins as my youngest, both would have been mortified if ds13 came into the ladies room at 8 (as they should be).

My DS will only be in the 2nd trimester of 2nd grade (January birthday and school start date cut-off is October)when he turns 8. Stalls, whistles, panic word, moms at exits.....all great suggestions I have been giving here for how to keep him safe and not lost while using the bathroom in large places.

 

[Tara1988]

Why do you think 8 year old girls are with their mom? My girls went into the ladies room all of the time without me, starting around 5/6, like my boys. Kids will survive (and actually flourish) not being joined at the hip with mom.

If they were comfortable going alone at 5 or 6 that is fine, but if they told you they were afraid to go alone, would you make them?

 

[Tara1988]

Oh my goodness. Who is advocating letting an 8 year old walk around WDW alone?! Letting them use a restroom alone, with parent standing right outside the door is light years away from letting them walk around wdw alone.

That is walking around an area of WDW alone. They are still somewhere in WDW, they are out of their parents sight. And even with the parent "right outside the door" the child can still have an opportunity to wander off. My husband and I have gotten separated at the bathrooms at WDW even though he was standing there waiting. In crowds, it is very easy to lose sight of someone, especially a child

 

[Tara1988]

I'm just going to assume you don't know any 8 year old boys by the way you are assuming they are scared little babies. It is not normal for an 8 year old boy to be afraid of the men's room! That is absurd. And a little frightening.

It is not normal for a girl to be afraid of the mere presence of a boy. That is absurd.
The fear isn't of a men's room. The fear is of being in a crowded unfamiliar place alone. And I have known plenty 8 year old boys who were completely fine using a men's room elsewhere, but at a huge theme park where there are thousands of people, they felt differently. And girls of that age who felt the same about going alone

 

[jvalic33]

I hate to add such a spin to this post, but coming from a background as I did and having numerous children, I can't help but chime in.

Out of college, I worked with teenage rapists. They were both victims and victimizers. They were under the age of 18 and were remanded as young as 12. Many of them molested siblings that were as little as one year old. The abuse and behavior stemmed from abuse that usually started at home, within their families, the last place anyone would expect it. All that said, these individuals sought out places where they could find their victims and even many staff I worked with sexually assaulted the kids in the home. The most savvy predators were extremely smart, IQs well over 130 and were calculating and socially adept enough to trick their victims into compromizing situations and often felt uncatchable. As a staff you are able to read the bios of their victims and the various stories, etc.

That experience made me leery of things the average person would never think of. I even study relatives with my children for that reason. Considering we are doing the best we can to protect our children, we shouldn't be criticized if we err on the side of caution and bring an 8 or 9 year old into a stall with us. Even minor groping is a form of assault and that happened to me on a regular basis on the NYC subway, you can't get much more public than that. A child can be fondled or groped within seconds and it could be more damaging than one might think.

Also, I attended a college where our dorms and bathrooms were unisex and girls could be showering in a stall right next to one of the football players who lived in the room next door. It was not a big deal at all. Considering there are stalls in the restrooms, I think it is much more acceptable for a boy to go in the womens bathroom than vice versa and I don't see what the issue is.

Mom's do what you feel is best because once something happens, the mark that is left on your child could be indelible.

 

[Tara1988]

What exactly do you think dads who are out in public..wdw or anywhere else...alone with their 8 year old daughters do?

They do what their daughter is comfortable with. Whether that's letting them go alone, taking them in the restroom with them, or using a family restroom if/when those are available.

 

[Tara1988]

My DD is with me now cause she's 4 and I posted earlier that she wouldn't go into a stall to potty when a 4/5 year old boy was in the restroom.

Again, I see no problem with an older boy in the ladies room if he's under direct supervision of mom, including being in the stall with her.

What would you feel is an appropriate age for a mom to stop escorting her daughter into the ladies room?

I don't think it should be based on an age. It should be based on the daughter being comfortable with going alone. My 5 year old and 1 year old boys come in the stall with me when they can fit, otherwise the oldest stands in front of my stall with either both hands on the door or his back to the door, whichever makes it least likely for someone to think he is looking in the stall next to us

 

[Aladora]

My DS will only be in the 2nd trimester of 2nd grade (January birthday and school start date cut-off is October)when he turns 8. Stalls, whistles, panic word, moms at exits.....all great suggestions I have been giving here for how to keep him safe and not lost while using the bathroom in large places.

snowman, I have to give you kudos for not letting this thread get to you. You came here with a question that may, at first glance, be misunderstood as a helicopter parent wanting reassurance that it is okay to take an older child into a washroom designed for the opposite gender. You have received a ton of opinions, most of which do not apply to your question or situation and you have handled it with grace. I can only imagine how tough it must be to start parenting when a child is grade school aged. I've been parenting my son for 10 1/2 years and I am still learning on the job!

It sounds as though he has made his feelings about this known to you and you have received some great advice here, if it were me I would give up on this thread before it devolves even more into crazy-town than it already is!

 

[Gracie09]

It is not normal for a girl to be afraid of the mere presence of a boy. That is absurd.
The fear isn't of a men's room. The fear is of being in a crowded unfamiliar place alone. And I have known plenty 8 year old boys who were completely fine using a men's room elsewhere, but at a huge theme park where there are thousands of people, they felt differently. And girls of that age who felt the same about going alone

no one said a girl is afraid (well except for my former foster daughter) in the presence of a boy but that they are uncomfortable dealing with some personal issues that may arise in a less than private stall. Like it or not there are gaps in the door. And if a girl is still trying to figure out the world of puberty and is embarrassed to be dealing with it on the other side of a wall with a boy, in the room designated for HER gender, that is a totally valid feeling and should not be dismissed because of perceived fear on behalf of the mother of the boy. If your son cannot use his appropriate gender bathroom as a grade schooler the onus is on you to figure out a way that he can use the restroom that does not infringe on the rights of girls. Whether that is a companion bathroom, restaurant bathroom or first aid bathroom.

 

[Tara1988]

No, I agree. And I think you have to be 14 to get into the park without an adult. They're worlds apart on the independence scale.

I have no idea how Tara got walking around WDW as a child from suggestions that they can use the restroom alone.

Because alone in that big crowded restroom, is just like being alone anywhere else in WDW. And it is highly possible and even likely that they get separated when leaving the restroom. (It has happened to me and my husband as adults, I can only imagine how much easier it is to lose sight of a small child in those crowds.)

Totally disagree with you. Eight year old boys know a heck of a lot more than I did at 8 years old. The things my daughter gets off the bus telling more or horrifying. Is your 5 year old your first? 8 is the new 13 for inappropriate behavior I think.

I've also experienced, what I hope, was an isolated 8/9 year being a sexual deviant. Like, serial killer style scary.

Is someone suggesting letting an 8 year old tour the park all by themselves? Quite a leap.

My 5 year old is my oldest, and I guess it has been a while since I was 8. I can't say for sure I knew anything at all about the male anatomy then, and probably not as much as I should have about the female anatomy. I certainly didn't know a thing about sex then.

Well, that's all well and good I guess. We don't have classroom bathrooms. Never had a school that did.

And for us, there's a difference between appropriate nakedness and predatory behavior. We don't teach our kids there's anything shameful with nakedness or their bodies. We teach them what's appropriate and who it's appropriate with.

I don't know about boys, but I'm pretty sure they're just as free in locker rooms and changing in front of each other as girls.

I don't teach him that it is shameful, just private. But I've always been a private person when it came to being undressed. I've always changed in a private stall. Maybe its just that I've had enough experiences to know undressing in front of a woman is no different than undressing in front of a man.

 

[Angel Ariel]

That is walking around an area of WDW alone. They are still somewhere in WDW, they are out of their parents sight. And even with the parent "right outside the door" the child can still have an opportunity to wander off. My husband and I have gotten separated at the bathrooms at WDW even though he was standing there waiting. In crowds, it is very easy to lose sight of someone, especially a child

If you are literally standing *at* the door..not by the door somewhere a few feet away, but *at* the door (which is what I suggested), and it is a bathroom with only 1 entrance/exit, then I don't see how the child will "wander off."

Comparing that to adults waiting for each other is apples and oranges. Adults waiting for an adult would be nearby, but not right at the door, and yes, in that situation it cn be easy to lose sight of someone. But that is, again, a far different thing than standing *at* the door itself.

 

[aaarcher86]

It is not normal for a girl to be afraid of the mere presence of a boy. That is absurd.
The fear isn't of a men's room. The fear is of being in a crowded unfamiliar place alone. And I have known plenty 8 year old boys who were completely fine using a men's room elsewhere, but at a huge theme park where there are thousands of people, they felt differently. And girls of that age who felt the same about going alone

Afraid and uncomfortable are not the same thing.

And even I despise dealing with my period in public.

I can't even pretend to understand your reasoning of a huge public area and a restroom being the same thing. Because Main Street and Rapunzels restroom are so similar.

 

[Angel Ariel]

It is not normal for a girl to be afraid of the mere presence of a boy. That is absurd.
The fear isn't of a men's room. The fear is of being in a crowded unfamiliar place alone. And I have known plenty 8 year old boys who were completely fine using a men's room elsewhere, but at a huge theme park where there are thousands of people, they felt differently. And girls of that age who felt the same about going alone

No one ever said girls would be *afraid* of a boy. Please stop twisting people's words.

 

[Angel Ariel]

They do what their daughter is comfortable with. Whether that's letting them go alone, taking them in the restroom with them, or using a family restroom if/when those are available.

No dad I know brings their 8 year old daughter into the men's room.

 

[Angel Ariel]

I hate to add such a spin to this post, but coming from a background as I did and having numerous children, I can't help but chime in.

Out of college, I worked with teenage rapists. They were both victims and victimizers. They were under the age of 18 and were remanded as young as 12. Many of them molested siblings that were as little as one year old. The abuse and behavior stemmed from abuse that usually started at home, within their families, the last place anyone would expect it. All that said, these individuals sought out places where they could find their victims and even many staff I worked with sexually assaulted the kids in the home. The most savvy predators were extremely smart, IQs well over 130 and were calculating and socially adept enough to trick their victims into compromizing situations and often felt uncatchable. As a staff you are able to read the bios of their victims and the various stories, etc.

That experience made me leery of things the average person would never think of. I even study relatives with my children for that reason. Considering we are doing the best we can to protect our children, we shouldn't be criticized if we err on the side of caution and bring an 8 or 9 year old into a stall with us. Even minor groping is a form of assault and that happened to me on a regular basis on the NYC subway, you can't get much more public than that. A child can be fondled or groped within seconds and it could be more damaging than one might think.

Also, I attended a college where our dorms and bathrooms were unisex and girls could be showering in a stall right next to one of the football players who lived in the room next door. It was not a big deal at all. Considering there are stalls in the restrooms, I think it is much more acceptable for a boy to go in the womens bathroom than vice versa and I don't see what the issue is.

Mom's do what you feel is best because once something happens, the mark that is left on your child could be indelible.

Most people here have not had an issue with it *if you are taking the boy into the stall with you.* if Gyou consider it no longer appropriate to have gyour child in the stall with you, then it is no longer appropriate for them to be in the ladies room.