Kerry and Bush supporters. A question for y'all.

[Pin Wizard]

I can't imagine something that horrible coming out. I would still weigh everything for the one I support. If I decided I couldn't vote for him, I wouldn't vote at all. Not giving a vote to the other guy!

 

[peachgirl]

Back to Bush's military service and lack thereof...

The proof that he was a no show is that there's no proof that he did show. Had he been where he was supposed to and done what he was supposed to do, it would have been documented.

There is plenty of evidence, including what little the Bush people will release to show he was mia much of the time. I've posted it on this thread more than once.

There's also no disputing that he cut out of the NG early, so how can anyone complain because Kerry left Vietnam 4 months early???


It really is simple, if Bush could prove he completely and fully served in the NG, he would. Why on earth would he withhold this information if he had it???

I just wish I could go to Bush's website and get as complete a disclosure on his service as I can Kerry's. Kerry provides a fully documented account of his time in Vietnam. You'd think Bush could about his days as a Tom Cruise wannabee.

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[MICKEY88]

Originally posted by wvrevy
Aside from the debate about the military grading process, this is the salient point. Those men WERE NOT in the field "with him". Yes, they were "in the field", but under enemy fire, do you really believe these men were watching and evaluating someone on another boat ? The men that actually served WITH John Kerry in the field ALL support him.

I'm sorry, but the "Swift Boat Veterans for Bush" strike me as a bunch of vets angry about Kerry's post-war activities that saw an opportunity to hit at him while also making a few bucks by selling some books. It's as simple as that, really. When they lay down with the type of people that published that book and that fund their cause, they lose all credibility.

were they under fire..???.interview I saw stated that they weren't even under fire when kerry earned one of the purple hearts


they also showed a clip from 30+ years ago where one of the swift boat guys challenged Kerry's story on the Dick Cavett show.

so it's hardly something new...

 

[peachgirl]

First, my apologies to everyone on this thread for the side-tracked hi-jacking that has ensued, and I fully accept responsibility for participating.

I feel your pain....been there, done that....

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[GaryAdams]

Those men WERE NOT in the field "with him"

i just want to make sure i understand you?
your saying that only Kerrys boat was on patrol?
there were never any other boats maybe on patrol with his?or even in the same area?
are you saying that none of them were even stationed at the same port?


as far as being underfire and watching someone else,maybe in the pentagon you didnt have to watch the people in the office next to yours, but in the field its a little different when you have 3 or 4 boats all in the same river in the same fight,(let alone any ground troops in the area) you tend to watch the others to make sure they are ok, let alone be in communication with them so you can mantain support and care out tatics.(never mind being in radio contact with the different air crews overhead,be they choppers or planes)

keep pretending that you dont understand how some things work.





bedknobbery see above.
btw, there is a big difference between a bank branch in a office building and men who were all stationed at the same base.

 

[wvrevy]

Originally posted by Teejay32
Have you read the book?

Thanks, but I prefer my fiction to be better written

I read the sample chapter they made available, I've seen numerous interviews with the author (Chris Mathews from Hardball made the guy look like a moron) and I have seen the ad...Why on earth would I spend the money to read even more lies ? There is no truth to what these men are saying...why feed their greed just to read more of it ?

 

[BedKnobbery2]

Originally posted by Teejay32
Have you read the book?

Have you read this one: Fraud: The Strategy Behind the Bush Lies and Why the Media Didn't Tell You
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/t...f=sr_1_1/002-8536909-6747255?v=glance&s=books ?

or this one: The Five Biggest Lies Bush Told Us About Iraq http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/t...f=sr_1_1/002-8536909-6747255?v=glance&s=books ?

or this one: Worse Than Watergate: The Secret Presidency of George W. Bush
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/t...t_1/002-8536909-6747255?v=glance&s=books&st=* ?

 

[GaryAdams]

Thanks, but I prefer my fiction to be better written

i feel the same way about michael moore.




sorry had to throw it out there lol
honest i tried to bite my tongue. lol

btw, i have seen the movie

 

[Teejay32]

I'll take that as a no. Just wondering.

"The Secret Presidency of George W. Bush" (!?) Geez. I suppose next we'll find out Cheney has been acting as V.P. since 2001.

I'd better go read that one....

 

[bsears]

Kerry's record can be found here :http://www.johnkerry.com/about/john_kerry/military_records.html

Simple question: If Bush has nothing to hide, why won't he release his records? Why were they "lost" then "accidently destroyed" then the microfilm copy also " destroyed" then, no, some of them have been found. Why is the answer always that it is ancient history when it pertains to Bush, but vital information when it applies to Kerry?

So how about this....as soon as Bush releases all his records, we can talk again. Until then, all I see is one candidate who has a very secretive tarnished record slinging mud at a decorated war hero.

But the news is not all bad. Not everyone is drinking the koolaid. yesterday's poll shows Bush with a 3 point lead among vets, down from a double digit lead just weeks ago.

 

[wvrevy]

Originally posted by Teejay32
I'll take that as a no. Just wondering.

"The Secret Presidency of George W. Bush" (!?) Geez. I suppose next we'll find out Cheney has been acting as V.P. since 2001.

I'd better go read that one....

Why don't you go read the SEC's report on the fraud committed by Halliburton while Cheney was in charge....

 

[Paradise]

Originally posted by peachgirl
From Colin Powell:




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From Colin Powell:

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"I am angry that so many of the sons of the powerful and well-placed... managed to wangle slots in Reserve and National Guard units...Of the many tragedies of Vietnam, this raw class discrimination strikes me as the most damaging to the ideal that all Americans are created equal and owe equal allegiance to their country." (Colin Powell’s autobiography, My American Journey, p. 148)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Now that is a MAN I respect. Sec. Powell knows what he is talking about.

 

[wvrevy]

Originally posted by GaryAdams
i feel the same way about michael moore.

sorry had to throw it out there lol
honest i tried to bite my tongue. lol

btw, i have seen the movie

I'm sorry, was there a fact in there that Moore got wrong ?

Moore is a documentarian, and yes, he makes comments about the subject he's documenting....But he didn't make up stories and then lie about them being true, as these people have.

 

[BedKnobbery2]

Originally posted by GaryAdams

bedknobbery see above.
btw, there is a big difference between a bank branch in a office building and men who were all stationed at the same base.

True....the only enemies I'm trying to keep my eyes open for and avoid are doggie deposits on the side walk while I'm walking into the building. So I probably have slightly less on my mind while I'm observing the lady in the bank than the other swift boat veterans had at the time they were observing John Kerry.

 

[spearenb]

Originally posted by wvrevy
I'm sorry, but the "Swift Boat Veterans for Bush" strike me as a bunch of vets angry about Kerry's post-war activities that saw an opportunity to hit at him while also making a few bucks by selling some books. It's as simple as that, really. When they lay down with the type of people that published that book and that fund their cause, they lose all credibility.

I'm dying to ask if you really thought Richard Clarke had any credibility but that would be probably hyjacking this thread further....

 

[Teejay32]

Originally posted by wvrevy
Moore is a documentarian, and yes, he makes comments about the subject he's documenting....But he didn't make up stories and then lie about them being true, as these people have.

What part did they invent? I haven't read it either. If they feel Kerry is unfit for the Presidency, and say so, that is opinion (based on helpful guidelines within this thread.)

 

[spearenb]

Originally posted by wvrevy
I'm sorry, was there a fact in there that Moore got wrong ?

Moore is a documentarian, and yes, he makes comments about the subject he's documenting....But he didn't make up stories and then lie about them being true, as these people have.

The true question is there a fact that Moore actually gave the whole truth to? Flying out the Saudi Royal family a day or two after 9/11 comes to mind here....

Sort of like what the Kerry camp is claiming against Bush's camp about his comments on Hardball isn't it?

Changed your mind yet to vote for Bush?

 

[wvrevy]

Originally posted by spearenb
I'm dying to ask if you really thought Richard Clarke had any credibility but that would be probably hyjacking this thread further....

Check the link below.....but ABSOLUTELY Richard Clarke was credible. Do I think he also sensationalized some of what he said in the press to sell a few books ? Possibly. But at the same time, you're talking about a man that was appointed by Reagan, not Clinton, so I don't think I'd just ignore everything the man has to say just because I happen to support the person he is accusing of screwing up. Do you think Clarke lied to the 9/11 commission ?

Clark's Resume

 

[wvrevy]

Originally posted by Teejay32
What part did they invent? I haven't read it either. If they feel Kerry is unfit for the Presidency, and say so, that is opinion (based on helpful guidelines within this thread.)

They say Kerry didn't do the things his record shows him to have done. They claim his one injury was "just a scratch", despite the fact that shrapnel was removed from his arm (besides, when did severity of injury become a requirement for a purple heart ?). They claim a LOT of things that just plain aren't true. (And that's in just the part I've read, seen, and heard them discuss).

 

[wvrevy]

Originally posted by spearenb
The true question is there a fact that Moore actually gave the whole truth to? Flying out the Saudi Royal family a day or two after 9/11 comes to mind here....

Sort of like what the Kerry camp is claiming against Bush's camp about his comments on Hardball isn't it?

Changed your mind yet to vote for Bush?

Is the devil wearing ice skates and a parka ?

There's a difference in the two things you cite: one was put out by an "entertainer" that was making a film, the other is being bandied about as truth by a political campaign. So, you're saying that the Bush crew are no better than Michael Moore in your eyes ?