Is Cinderella a hypocrite?

[Hoku]

In one scene, she says, "Well, if there's one thing, they can't order me to stop dreaming." But then, not long after, she gets mad at the dog saying, "You need to get rid of those dreams."

Hmm...

 

[skiingfast]

In both case isn't she talking about the same thing, moving forward?

 

[Hoku]

A noble idea, skiingfast, but I don't think that's the case. Let's establish definitions first: She describes dreams as "a wish your heart makes." Fair enough.

When she says, "At least they can't order me to stop dreaming", she's taking consolation that her mean step-family at least can't overstep those bounds. She can still dream, even if reality bites.

Then, she kind of traps the dog. She asks him if he's been dreaming again and he nods happily "yes". Then she asks if he was chasing and catching the cat, to which he answers, again, "yes". Of course, for a dog this certainly is the dream his heart made. But then she gets mad at him and tells him to get rid of those dreams.

It kinda seems like the dog is her scapegoat in this situation. I just find it ironic that she brags about how nobody can take her dreams, but then she tries to take the dreams of someone else. Know what I mean?

 

[skiingfast]

I think what you mean, is you should take "Is" and the question mark off the thread title.

 

[pixiewings71]

No she's not, because she's telling the dog to give up his dream of chasing and catching the cat. Because it's not nice and because he would get into trouble.......her dreams aren't of chasing and catching her step-sisters....

 

[Hoku]

I think what you mean, is you should take "Is" and the question mark off the thread title.

LOL. Well, I didn't want to approach it that opinionated partly because others might think differently. Case in point...

No she's not, because she's telling the dog to give up his dream of chasing and catching the cat. Because it's not nice and because he would get into trouble.......her dreams aren't of chasing and catching her step-sisters....

True, but he is a dog, after all, and not expected to have much higher ambitions. Besides, just because it's a dream doesn't mean it has to be reality. Cinderella certainly didn't expect her dreams to come true at that point, but she still liked to have them.

She said "they can't take away my dream" because a dream is intangible. But they DID try to take away everything she wanted in the tangible world. With that logic, it should be ok for a dog to dream of chasing cats, even it can't happen in the real world. The entirety of her "dream definition", is "a dream is a wish your heart makes when it's fast asleep". I think Cinderella is my least favorite princess partly because of this, but for other reasons, too.

I dunno. Just hoped to start a fun, evolving conversation.

 

[PinkBudgie]

Ok, as long as we are analyzing princess movies, here is something that always bothered me from Beauty and the Beast. I'll give you Cinderella is a hypocrite if you help me out with this one:

How old was the prince when he was turned into the Beast?

The stained glass windows show a young man who "sneered at the gift" from an old woman. Yet he has to love and be loved before his 21st birthday. In the song Lumiere (sp?) says "10 years we've been rusting..." So he was only 11 years old at the time? That seems like a harsh punishment for a boy still learning and growing. And where were his parents? Why was he answering the castle door all by himself?

 

[Hoku]

Ok, as long as we are analyzing princess movies, here is something that always bothered me from Beauty and the Beast. I'll give you Cinderella is a hypocrite if you help me out with this one:

How old was the prince when he was turned into the Beast?

The stained glass windows show a young man who "sneered at the gift" from an old woman. Yet he has to love and be loved before his 21st birthday. In the song Lumiere (sp?) says "10 years we've been rusting..." So he was only 11 years old at the time? That seems like a harsh punishment for a boy still learning and growing. And where were his parents? Why was he answering the castle door all by himself?

You are so right! Wow. No wonder the poor boy had issues. 11 years old, no parents or peers, only people serving him all the time? What a lonely, confusing childhood! Makes me think maybe the enchantress was more cruel and unkind than he was.

 

[skiingfast]

How many animated children were missing a parent in Disney movies?

 

[Hoku]

How many animated children were missing a parent in Disney movies?

True! That seems to be a hallmark, doesn't it. But at what age does this count? The loss of a parent or parents is critical to many stories like Bambi, Lion King, Snow White and Cinderella.

But then we get into gray areas. Tianna, Belle and Pocahontas lost parents but it didn't seem to affect their lives in the same way. Maybe because they still had one good parent left and maybe also because they were older when it happened.

An even more challenging question is what Disney characters always had BOTH parents. The only one I can think of is Mulan.

 

[kayleigh83]

I have had that EXACT same thought! LOL I'm glad I'm not the only one to notice that!

 

[pixiewings71]

LOL. Well, I didn't want to approach it that opinionated partly because others might think differently. Case in point... True, but he is a dog, after all, and not expected to have much higher ambitions. Besides, just because it's a dream doesn't mean it has to be reality. Cinderella certainly didn't expect her dreams to come true at that point, but she still liked to have them.

She said "they can't take away my dream" because a dream is intangible. But they DID try to take away everything she wanted in the tangible world. With that logic, it should be ok for a dog to dream of chasing cats, even it can't happen in the real world. The entirety of her "dream definition", is "a dream is a wish your heart makes when it's fast asleep". I think Cinderella is my least favorite princess partly because of this, but for other reasons, too.

I dunno. Just hoped to start a fun, evolving conversation.

Well, it's definitely interesting to think about, but I stand by what I said. I still think she isn't a hypocrite, but I definitely understand your point. You know....if the dog had caught the cat then the step-mother would have had the dog killed...Cinderella was trying to protect her dog, that's why I don't think she's a hypocrite.

Ok, as long as we are analyzing princess movies, here is something that always bothered me from Beauty and the Beast. I'll give you Cinderella is a hypocrite if you help me out with this one:

How old was the prince when he was turned into the Beast?

The stained glass windows show a young man who "sneered at the gift" from an old woman. Yet he has to love and be loved before his 21st birthday. In the song Lumiere (sp?) says "10 years we've been rusting..." So he was only 11 years old at the time? That seems like a harsh punishment for a boy still learning and growing. And where were his parents? Why was he answering the castle door all by himself?

ROFL...I never even did the math. LOL That's hilarious......

 

[candygirlIRE]

An even more challenging question is what Disney characters always had BOTH parents. The only one I can think of is Mulan.

In Tangled... although they were sadly absent for most of her life.
In Sleeping Beauty... ditto


ummmm can't think of any others.... Wait! Wendy, Michael, John all had mum and dad!

Incredibles?


Or are we just talking about Princesses?

 

[PinkBudgie]

Lots of Disney characters were missing one or two parents but the Beast is the only one I can think of where it just isn't discussed or acknowledged. I agree it makes the enchantress seem more cruel. If he was at least 17 or 18 when it happened, then maybe by then he would have been old enough to be responsible for snubbing the old lady.

The Incredibles are a family with both mom and dad.

 

[LavenderPeach]

Ok, as long as we are analyzing princess movies, here is something that always bothered me from Beauty and the Beast. I'll give you Cinderella is a hypocrite if you help me out with this one:

How old was the prince when he was turned into the Beast?

The stained glass windows show a young man who "sneered at the gift" from an old woman. Yet he has to love and be loved before his 21st birthday. In the song Lumiere (sp?) says "10 years we've been rusting..." So he was only 11 years old at the time? That seems like a harsh punishment for a boy still learning and growing. And where were his parents? Why was he answering the castle door all by himself?

LOL! I had no idea this issue had been bothering you for so many years! I always assumed it was a young man (or older teenager) who sneered at the gift. I know he has until his 21st birthday and I know the song says "10 years" but i guess i never did the math either! Maybe this is what happens when you're married to a math teacher, lol.

 

[LavenderPeach]

Ok, as long as we are analyzing princess movies, here is something that always bothered me from Beauty and the Beast. I'll give you Cinderella is a hypocrite if you help me out with this one:

How old was the prince when he was turned into the Beast?

The stained glass windows show a young man who "sneered at the gift" from an old woman. Yet he has to love and be loved before his 21st birthday. In the song Lumiere (sp?) says "10 years we've been rusting..." So he was only 11 years old at the time? That seems like a harsh punishment for a boy still learning and growing. And where were his parents? Why was he answering the castle door all by himself?

Okay, I just read this to DH and he didn't think it seemed confusing. I asked him if he thought it seemed like a harsh punishment for a young boy and he said (and I quote) "It's an evil witch! You don't disrespect an evil witch no matter what age you are." So I asked him what about his parents, where were they and why was he answering the castle door by himself? DH's answer was, "He's was being cheeky and a cheeky boy answers the door, even if he's not supposed to."

 

[Hoku]

Well, it's definitely interesting to think about, but I stand by what I said. I still think she isn't a hypocrite, but I definitely understand your point. You know....if the dog had caught the cat then the step-mother would have had the dog killed...Cinderella was trying to protect her dog, that's why I don't think she's a hypocrite.

Fair enough. Cinderella needs a champion since she can't defend herself here. I'm sure your argument is exactly what she would say, too. (Still don't like her though)

In Tangled... although they were sadly absent for most of her life.
In Sleeping Beauty... ditto

Clever sub-category! It makes me wonder how Tarzan might fit into this. He was adopted and thought he was a gorilla. He never knew any other parents. Gorilla dad was kinda gruff and distant, but he was there.

Or are we just talking about Princesses?

Nope. Any disney animated movie. So the Darling crew counts, but Peter Pan, himself, and the lost boys made up for that. Then again, we get another adoption scenario.

Lots of Disney characters were missing one or two parents but the Beast is the only one I can think of where it just isn't discussed or acknowledged.

What about the original Alice? We only know of her sister. But I guess the Burton version fills that in for us.

 

[oilergirl]

How old was the prince when he was turned into the Beast?

The stained glass windows show a young man who "sneered at the gift" from an old woman. Yet he has to love and be loved before his 21st birthday. In the song Lumiere (sp?) says "10 years we've been rusting..." So he was only 11 years old at the time? That seems like a harsh punishment for a boy still learning and growing. And where were his parents? Why was he answering the castle door all by himself?

HA! I never even noticed that before! 5 years I could see... lol

 

[PinkBudgie]

Okay, I just read this to DH and he didn't think it seemed confusing. I asked him if he thought it seemed like a harsh punishment for a young boy and he said (and I quote) "It's an evil witch! You don't disrespect an evil witch no matter what age you are." So I asked him what about his parents, where were they and why was he answering the castle door by himself? DH's answer was, "He's was being cheeky and a cheeky boy answers the door, even if he's not supposed to."

Yes, it has always bothered me and he has a point- she's evil. BUT... the pictures in the stained glass window when they tell the story show a young man that looks like he is at least 18 to 20! I think it the art work at the start that bothers me most.

 

[pixiewings71]

Fair enough. Cinderella needs a champion since she can't defend herself here. I'm sure your argument is exactly what she would say, too. (Still don't like her though) Clever sub-category! It makes me wonder how Tarzan might fit into this. He was adopted and thought he was a gorilla. He never knew any other parents. Gorilla dad was kinda gruff and distant, but he was there.Nope. Any disney animated movie. So the Darling crew counts, but Peter Pan, himself, and the lost boys made up for that. Then again, we get another adoption scenario.What about the original Alice? We only know of her sister. But I guess the Burton version fills that in for us.

You don't have to, my DD11 likes her enough for both of us. Cinderella is her favorite, and man the look on her face when she met her for the first time.....priceless.