I shouldnt be suprised at this point...

[NewJersey]

Joe, so you can understand that sexual orientation isn't a choice..please answer this question:

Can you pretend to be attracted to men?


I assume your answer is no. Same goes for me on the flipside..I cannot pretend to be attracted to women.

I was born this way. Wake up and face the facts in front of you.

Mum's the word Joe? Or can you not throw the Bible at facts, so there's no room to respond?

 

[Thizz]

I just want to say how pleased I am to see another religion represented on this forum..Especially yours

Up until very recently, I was a christian who did studies of Islam. I fell in love with what it teaches, and as an african American, I look up to the likes of malcolm x.

The short of it, thank you. And to the people who've never met a muslim, we are a very gentle group.

 

[JennyMominRI]

The short of it, thank you. And to the people who've never met a muslim, we are a very gentle group.

This would be my experience with the Many Muslims I have know IRL

 

[crcormier]

The Bible says to take thoughts contrary to the Word of God "captive." That is, do not dwell or act on them.

Okay then. So acting on homosexual urges is a sin. Thinking of them is a sin. Is being attracted to someone of the same sex a sin? If so, where does it say that?

 

[crcormier]

This would be my experience with the Many Muslims I have know IRL

I have not had the opportunity to know many, but my experience has been the same.

 

[JoyG]

You sir, have become a sheep to religion. You blindly believe in a book, that was written hundreds of years after the death of your savior. To say god dictated the scriptures to people, is almost as ludicrous of the idea of a mere mortal walking on water. Which presents anotherquestion, do you believe this book to the extent of believing a man walked on water?

Thizz,

Sorry to keep coming back to you...I've tried to stay out of this conversation but I'm intrigued by your posts. I haven't seen many Muslims participate in our religious discussions here on the Dis so I have some questions for you. You stated your point was the same, so I went back to your post to figure out your point. Was it that Christians "blindly" follow a book that they believe God dictated? I wonder b/c I just googled the Qu'ran and I found this:

"The Qur'an (in Anglicized form: Koran ) is certainly the greatest literary work in classical Arabic and for all Muslims stands as the definitive word of God (in Arabic: Allah ) spoken to the prophet Muhammad by the angel Gabriel. When reading the Qur'an , you should realize that, for all Muslims, the text you are reading is quite literally the voice of God; because the Qur'an is the direct speech of God in Arabic"

From this link: http://www.wsu.edu/~dee/ISLAM/QURAN.HTM


It seems like for Muslims, they believe the same thing about their scriptures that it is the word of God written down by humans. Did I get this right?



Edited to add: I hope this post doesn't come off as confrontational. I also wanted to extend welcome to you here. It will be interesting to talk to you about your beliefs.

 

[LukenDC]

The short of it, thank you. And to the people who've never met a muslim, we are a very gentle group.

I'm glad to see a Muslim perspective on the DIS. And I agree with you, the majority of Muslims are peace loving people. Every religion has its fanatics and Christianity is no different.

 

[Thizz]

Mum's the word Joe? Or can you not throw the Bible at facts, so there's no room to respond?

In all fairness, it isn't a fact that gay people are born that way. It isn't a fact it is a choice to be homosexual. If you are talking about you, and only you, then i think it is a fair question, but not otherwise.


I do believe that homosexuality is a beautiful thing. Why? Because homosexuality isn't a disease, nor a curse. It is a gift. A gift given by god (I'll use your name). It is the greatest gift of all. True love. By being gay, one must defy public stereotypes, endure hatred and discrimination, and love with all one's heart. How many instances of domestic abuse do you see from gay couples? How many instances of divorce in those lucky couples who are married? How many instances of gays campaigning for the limitation of civil rights?

Speak of salvation. Speak of sin. Use these things to talk of Catholic priests. Use these things to talk of aldulterers. Use these things to talk of murderers and rapists and bigots. They are guilty of sin. They need salvation. Do not use these things to talk of people fairer than yourself.

 

[LukenDC]

I do believe that homosexuality is a beautiful thing. Why? Because homosexuality isn't a disease, nor a curse. It is a gift. A gift given by god (I'll use your name). It is the greatest gift of all. True love. By being gay, one must defy public stereotypes, endure hatred and discrimination, and love with all one's heart.

That is one of the most beautiful things that I have read on the DIS. It does indeed take a lot of courage, honesty, and love to live as a gay person in the face of such hatred and misunderstanding.

 

[Thizz]

Thizz,

Sorry to keep coming back to you...I've tried to stay out of this conversation but I'm intrigued by your posts. I haven't seen many Muslims participate in our religious discussions here on the Dis so I have some questions for you. You stated your point was the same, so I went back to your post to figure out your point. Was it that Christians "blindly" follow a book that they believe God dictated? I wonder b/c I just googled the Qu'ran and I found this:

"The Qur'an (in Anglicized form: Koran ) is certainly the greatest literary work in classical Arabic and for all Muslims stands as the definitive word of God (in Arabic: Allah ) spoken to the prophet Muhammad by the angel Gabriel. When reading the Qur'an , you should realize that, for all Muslims, the text you are reading is quite literally the voice of God; because the Qur'an is the direct speech of God in Arabic"

From this link: http://www.wsu.edu/~dee/ISLAM/QURAN.HTM


It seems like for Muslims, they believe the same thing about their scriptures that it is the word of God written down by humans. Did I get this right?

The way I personally differentiate, is the fact that Muhammad is the last prophet Allah sent for the benefit of humanity. Allah trusted him with his word. Over a period of twenty three years he dictated the words of the Qu'ran to him(obviously not all at once). He trusted this to his prophet. Not some scholar of the time, but his personal prophet. I find it hard to believe God would trust the writing of his book to just anyone.

With that being said, I personally have doubts as to whether it is the word of god.

 

[jimmiej]

salmoneous- in response to your post to me:

-For salvation, or IOW, to be made righteous before God. As you know, the 10 C's were seperate from the hundreds of other laws God gave the Jews.

-If my church (or any other) is not following the intent of NT church rules, that doesn't nullify the rule. We will be held responsible! I refer you to Revelations 2-3 where God told the local churches what He did & did not like about the way they conducted their church. As per my previous post on this, taking all the NT in context, I believe we ARE following the letter of the law. How can the older women teach the younger w/o speaking?

-I would point out to you that the consequences for sexual sins are VERY severe. See my earlier post of Scripture. And again, "bending" rules doesn't make it OK with God, necessarily.

-I looked at several translations & also a few Bible commentaries. The original language seems to be saying those who participate in homosexual acts, such as those stated in Romans 1. There, it talks about those acts being unnatural from a Godly perspective. As you say, what about monogamous homosexual relationships? While it could be interpreted that this type of relationship is NOT what is being described, there's still two problems in my mind. Romans 1 (homosexuality unnatural) AND marriage/sexual relationships in the Bible are always man/woman.

-Some parts of the Bible are easy to understand & some are more complicated. I believe there are some things God doesn't want us to understand this side of heaven. It's the same with our own children. They understand "don't play with fire." They don't always understand "no sex before marriage." They think they're in love & it's OK. That being said, I think it's important we study the original language, different translations, commentarys, & above all, pray for understanding.

-I hope I got to all your questions. As you can see by my counter below, DW & I are headed to WDW in a couple days. We have a lot to do to get ready to leave at 5am(!) Sunday. I have enjoyed debating with (most) of you.

 

[jimmiej]

But Jimmie, I don't think the Bible allows for Naked Segway, either...

ETA you speak very well about your beliefs. But I just saw your location and HAD to comment.

Sure, Song of Solomon!

 

[jimmiej]

Well, my "book" tells me that he is a mere mortal. One endowed with the privilege of being one of the prophets of Allah.

So, can we agree to disagree, or are you going to try to give me "proof" he is more than I say he is?

There is no God but Allah, and Muhammad is his Prophet.

Can you prove "There is no God but Allah?"

 

[JennyMominRI]

Can you prove "There is no God but Allah?"

Jimmie..You realiize ALLAH simply means G-d in Arabic... He is the G-d of Abraham.. The same G-d you and I worship... Christians and Jews that speak arabic call G-d Allah

 

[crcormier]

-I hope I got to all your questions. As you can see by my counter below, DW & I are headed to WDW in a couple days. We have a lot to do to get ready to leave at 5am(!) Sunday. I have enjoyed debating with (most) of you.

Hey, maybe we'll see you there!!!

 

[jimmiej]

Jewish law never had anything to do with salvation in the first place.

I used the wrong terminology. According to the OT, when the Jews obeyed God's law, it proved them faithful & holy before God.

Exodus 19

3 Then Moses went up to God, and the LORD called to him from the mountain and said, "This is what you are to say to the house of Jacob and what you are to tell the people of Israel: 4 'You yourselves have seen what I did to Egypt, and how I carried you on eagles' wings and brought you to myself. 5 Now if you obey me fully and keep my covenant, then out of all nations you will be my treasured possession. Although the whole earth is mine, 6 you will be for me a kingdom of priests and a holy nation.' These are the words you are to speak to the Israelites."

Galatians 3:19

19What, then, was the purpose of the law? It was added because of transgressions until the Seed to whom the promise referred had come.

Galatians 3

6Consider Abraham: "He believed God, and it was credited to him as righteousness." 7Understand, then, that those who believe are children of Abraham. 8The Scripture foresaw that God would justify the Gentiles by faith, and announced the gospel in advance to Abraham: "All nations will be blessed through you." 9So those who have faith are blessed along with Abraham, the man of faith.

 

[jimmiej]

Jimmie..You realiize ALLAH simply means G-d in Arabic... He is the G-d of Abraham.. The same G-d you and I worship... Christians and Jews that speak arabic call G-d Allah

I disagree! Did Allah have a son named Jesus who came to save the world from their sin? And Muhammad means nothing to me.

 

[JennyMominRI]

I used the wrong terminology. According to the OT, when the Jews obeyed God's law, it proved them faithful & holy before God.

.

OK,I'll go with that description

 

[Thizz]

I disagree! Did Allah have a son named Jesus who came to save the world from their sin? And Muhammad means nothing to me.

Yes, YOUR GOD(English for ALLAH) did.


MY GOD(read: ALLAH) did not.

 

[JennyMominRI]

I disagree! Did Allah have a son named Jesus who came to save the world from their sin? And Muhammad means nothing to me.

Arab Christians who say ALLAH will say he did

Tell me,do you think you worship a dfferent G-d than the G-d of the Jews.e Jews don't have a Jesus who is the son of G-d(except in the sense that we are all sons and daughters of G-d) who died to save the world from their sins.