How would you handle this?

[Tuffcookie]

OP, I think everyone is in agreement on this. Your DD should not be going back to dad's until something changes. I also know you could get in a lot of trouble for holding back on visitation so you will need to make a police report out to cover yourself and protect your DD. If you do that, the police will contact children services. By law, children's services has a certain time frame to investigate.

I know the step mom has a full plate right now but you should have been contacted a lot sooner about this situation rather than waiting to find out on Sunday when she was brought home.

The thought of her dad even thinking of driving her home when in a drunken state is scary.

So many things happened here that a 7 year old should not have been exposed to. And once your ex and his new wife decided carry on with their fight in front of your DD it WAS your business!

I'm also thinking this may not have been the first time for the drunkeness & violence but maybe the others times have been hushed up. Out of curiousity, was there any violence when you were married to him?

to your DD and you.

TC

 

[OceanAnnie]

I would do everything in my power to make sure she never has to go back there again.

Precisely.

 

[cabanafrau]

OP, you need to get a handle on this from a legal perspective pronto. Depending on how much bigger of a mess this turns into, you could find yourself facing accusations of failure to protect and having your DD removed from your custody.

A seven year old with toileting issues will definitely have red flags flying all over with protective services, the court, etc., etc. Make sure you have an absolutely skilled pitbull of a lawyer & then bring this issue to the authorities before you have to face them in a defensive posture. Possibly it may be wise to request the court to direct where they want your DD to receive counseling. She desperately needs it & if the court sends her somewhere they will be very receptive to the reports. It tends to be a little different when a parent chooses the counselor & is paying the bill. Generally those reports are viewed skeptically.

 

[OceanAnnie]

OP, you need to get a handle on this from a legal perspective pronto. Depending on how much bigger of a mess this turns into, you could find yourself facing accusations of failure to protect and having your DD removed from your custody.

A seven year old with toileting issues will definitely have red flags flying all over with protective services, the court, etc., etc. Make sure you have an absolutely skilled pitbull of a lawyer & then bring this issue to the authorities before you have to face them in a defensive posture. Possibly it may be wise to request the court to direct where they want your DD to receive counseling. She desperately needs it & if the court sends her somewhere they will be very receptive to the reports. It tends to be a little different when a parent chooses the counselor & is paying the bill. Generally those reports are viewed skeptically.

Also, keep good documentation as to dates and facts. You will need them.

Good luck. I'm sorry for all that your DD and you are going through.

 

[alliecats]

OP, sorry to read you are going through this. How horrible for your DD. I can't even imagine how traumatized she must be if she is soiling herself.

I want to echo what everyone else has said but also to say, it's not a 7-year old's job to sit down with an alcoholic, abusive father and explain to him the issue. It's not her responsibility to even be in the same room with this conversation. She needs to be sheltered completely from that conversation--in fact, I would have that conversation myself with him on the phone while she is out of the house. You have no way of knowing if he will get violent again, so don't expose either of you to a face-to-face confrontation.

Get a lawyer NOW.

Hang in there. I am sorry you all are going through this. I can't imagine how hard it must be for you to see her suffering like this.

 

[NMAmy]

Holy cow, of course that child should not be visiting her father until he gets some help. As others have said, call your attorney ASAP. And, please, do not force your dd to confront her dad about why she's upset. She is so obviously traumatized--why would you make her confront the man who has her terrified?

Call your attorney to get visitation revoked until your ex gets some help and set up some counseling for your child. I'm so sorry your family is going through this.

 

[usnuzuloose]

No, please do not make her sit with him to disscuss this issue. Why did the stepmom not call the police and have him arressted? Take pics of her injuries. At least there is solid proof to a judge that this is going on. Please document everything for your attorney as well. Please keep us posted. My prayers are with you. Jo

 

[We_Love_Disney]

No Flames please!

Depending on the state you live in, the judge you get, and the story your former husband tells, if you deny visitation then you can be held in contempt of court and face punishment.

Your 'version' of what happened needs to be substantiated by an outsider.

Get your daughter to her pediatrician to rule out a physical problem with the bowels. Let daughter tell DR what happened. DR will need to write a letter indicating what was told to him and that her bathroom issues are as a result of what she saw.

Take your child to a counselor that specializes in PTSD and get a diagnosis.You will need the counselor to write to the court stating that your daughter is in danger and should not be visiting her father.

This all has to happen BEFORE you deny the father visitation. I would advise you to talk to the father. Tell him your daughter is suffering and is afraid of him due to the exposure at the last visit. Suggest that she take some time to readjust to the idea of visiting, whether by skipping, or shortened visits or sitting down with him. It goes against everything you want to do as a parent, I know, but if you act as judge and jury, you will be the one in trouble. Courts are very very hesitant to deny a father the right to visit their child.

By no means will this be a slam-dunk. Courts have been known to send the children back to their own abuser. It is a sad no-win situation for everyone.

 

[Colleen27]

No way would I send my child for visitation in that situation! I would be talking to my lawyer ASAP about ending visitation or at the very least making sure it is supervised, though I know from personal experience that's far easier said than done (my ex actually has a child abuse conviction on his record, but DS wasn't involved in that situation, and we've been unable to get his visitation rights removed).

Where does the step-mother stand on legal action? That will probably make a big difference on how much you're able to do, legally, because if she's going to "stand by her man" and deny the whole thing you aren't going to get far on a 7yo's word.

As far as having your daughter talk to him, she's seven and scared. Confronting her alcoholic father about his spousal abuse is not something she needs to be worrying about! Talking to him about it is your job. A child is naturally fearful/reluctant to criticize a parent at that age, and the abuse in this situation will only magnify her anxiety. You need to act as go-between for her and her father for a while, to help her get over her fears rather than forcing her to face them.

 

[barkley]

call child protective services.

in some states it is illegal to engage in a phsical altercation in front of a child (this is the basis cps is using in the "teen mom" case). cps can use domestic violence witnessed by a child as a basis for denying visitation, or strictly monitoring it (and i would demand a court appointed monitor-not stepmom or another adult related to the case) by reporting to cps you will have documentation that can assist you in protecting your dd.


i understand your dd being fearful of her dad, but i also have to wonder how she is feeling towards her step mom. if she witnessed this abuse, and then experienced her step mom take the time to remove other children from the home to protect them, but NOT her, i have to wonder if she feels safe with stepmom/or is questioning if stepmom will always make her (your dd) a low priority choice in matters of safety.

i would be BEYOND livid if (1) stepmom left my child with a drunken and dangerous man, (2) stepmom removed my child from her father's home without notifying me as soon as was reasonably safe, (3) stepmom did not tell me what my child had witnessed/experienced esp. after there were signs (soiling clothes) that my child was traumatized. i would seriously question weather i could trust THIS adult with my child as well.

cps can mandate that no visitation occur pending the outcome of the investigation. you do not need a ptsd diagnosis rushed to in order to protect your child, use cps as an independant protective mechanism.


get your ducks in a row-make some notes before you call (they are available 24/7). ask dd who was at the house (unless you know the names of the other kids), who was at the house they went to, jot down the names of anyone who might verify the soiling incident at scouts (and would have seen the bruising on step mom's face), jot down the dates and aprox. times you have called step mom regarding this. all will be valuable to cps in constructing an accurate picture of what has occured.

 

[OceanAnnie]

call child protective services.

in some states it is illegal to engage in a phsical altercation in front of a child (this is the basis cps is using in the "teen mom" case). cps can use domestic violence witnessed by a child as a basis for denying visitation, or strictly monitoring it (and i would demand a court appointed monitor-not stepmom or another adult related to the case) by reporting to cps you will have documentation that can assist you in protecting your dd.


i understand your dd being fearful of her dad, but i also have to wonder how she is feeling towards her step mom. if she witnessed this abuse, and then experienced her step mom take the time to remove other children from the home to protect them, but NOT her, i have to wonder if she feels safe with stepmom/or is questioning if stepmom will always make her (your dd) a low priority choice in matters of safety.

i would be BEYOND livid if (1) stepmom left my child with a drunken and dangerous man, (2) stepmom removed my child from her father's home without notifying me as soon as was reasonably safe, (3) stepmom did not tell me what my child had witnessed/experienced esp. after there were signs (soiling clothes) that my child was traumatized. i would seriously question weather i could trust THIS adult with my child as well.

cps can mandate that no visitation occur pending the outcome of the investigation. you do not need a ptsd diagnosis rushed to in order to protect your child, use cps as an independant protective mechanism.


get your ducks in a row-make some notes before you call (they are available 24/7). ask dd who was at the house (unless you know the names of the other kids), who was at the house they went to, jot down the names of anyone who might verify the soiling incident at scouts (and would have seen the bruising on step mom's face), jot down the dates and aprox. times you have called step mom regarding this. all will be valuable to cps in constructing an accurate picture of what has occured.

You raise some very good points and have given the OP some great advice.

I too, was shocked the step-mother would leave your DD with your ex in his drunken agitated condition. And to know that he was going to drive your DD while drunk is alarming as well. The step-mother showed serious lack of judgment. And I would wonder about her, but I wouldn't give her the benefit of the doubt. Not with my child's safety.

I wouldn't want DD around the father or the step-mother.

 

[TLuvsD]

First, hug your daughter. Then start making phone calls---lots of phone calls, your attorney, call child protective services, call the district attorney. Get your daughter to the doctor. Try to get your ex to waive vistation right now (email would be great) but if you are under a court order, you need to find out how to make sure your daughter does not have to go there. (Maybe he doesn't want to deal with the bathroom issues, if that works, use it while you get the legal stuff done).

Good luck, and please update when you can....I know many of us will be thinking of you and your daughter.

 

[Imzadi]

I hope you have been taking pictures and documenting the soiled clothes as proof.

If the step-mom still has the bruise, take a picture of that, too. Don't ask for the picture, just whip out a camera or cell phone camera. Partners get weird in domestic violence situations and suddenly become protective of the batterer if it means cops or lawyers may get involved.

Third: Did you come from a domestic violence history yourself? You ask questions and think up situations, like wanting your DD to sit down and talk to the dad, like being in the same room with him is still okay and appropriate, that people themselves who have witnessed or come from violent situations think is okay. Whereas, normal people, (most other posters here,) are saying get the heck out of Dodge and deny any sort of interaction at this time. And get DD counseling.

DD and you might need some professional counseling together, to get through this.

 

[disney_family_1247]

Wrong? No way. My kids would not go back to a man like that. You need to report him and maybe a court will force him into therapy or anger management or rehab. Your child is in danger, not to mention his wife. I work with at-risk families and there is help available. Your child's safety and mental health are at stake!

 

[hambirg]

I also know you could get in a lot of trouble for holding back on visitation so you will need to make a police report out to cover yourself and protect your DD.

OP, you need to get a handle on this from a legal perspective pronto. Depending on how much bigger of a mess this turns into, you could find yourself facing accusations of failure to protect and having your DD removed from your custody.

These!!!

Protect yourself and your daughter. She needs you to.

 

[Planogirl]

I wouldn't necessarily go too hard on the step-mother. She was likely very upset and thank goodness that she came back for your daughter. I know that if I was punched that I might not react as I should initially.

It sounds like overall a very bad situation though and no way should your daughter go back to stay there again. You need to talk to the ex but your daughter should not have to.

 

[pls5286]

Sorry I have not been on to update.

Ex is still not talking to me. I have tried to get him to, but he will not which makes me feel like he is trying to make like entire incident did not occur and he knows how protective I am when it comes to my kids.

I am not coming down too hard on step-mom. She has been up front and honest with me about the entire incident. She knew DF and I were not home Sat night when this happened, but yes she has both of our cell # and my moms and my sons. The main thing is she made sure DD was safe. I told her next time to call one of the three of us and bring her to us. This was the first time DD spent the night w/step mom w/out her father there.

A little about the relationship w/my ex and me. We were married for 4 yrs. He was drinking before we got together but quit when he found out when he was diagnosed as diabetic. Things were fine until I had to quit working due to illness and being pregnant also. He started slowly drinking again, but hiding it. He was never violent with me, but got to where he wasn't bringing much food into the house. He would buy 1 pack of hotdogs for supper, eat 6 himself, and expect the other 4 to feed the rest of us. 2 5 yr olds and a 1.5 y/o and me. I got to the point where I was eating very little. My son noticed and asked my mom "Mema why doesn't mommy eat anymore?" and my mom took it upon herself to come in my home and look for food and the cupboards were basically bare.

Of course she told my dad this and they questioned me as we were on food stamps and they wanted to know where the food was and I told them he would not buy food or give me the card to buy food. The only other time we had been short on food was right after the doctors took me off work and we literally did not have money for food. That time my parents bought us food and put it in my house. This time was a different story. My parents fed me and the kids at their house. We had a his, hers and ours. They said they would not feed him because he had all the food stamp money and would not buy food for us to eat at home.

His drinking increased and he began to bring beer into the house and I began looking for an out about this time as I knew we were done. The only thing was the only income I had was Child Support for my son at a little over $300/month. I was fighting for my disability and waiting on a hearing. The icing on the cake was the day he lost his temper w/ his dau and threw a hairbrush across the room and hit her in the eye and gave her a black eye.

I began talking to my parents. I asked my dad if I could move back home with my two kids. I was going to let my home be repo'd. It was in my name only. They said no I could not move back home, but they would finaincially support me and my kids until my disability came thru. The next day I went, got a restraining order on him, got his DD's maternal grandmother and helped her get temporary custody and got him out of here.

It took him a year for him to be able to see his girls without his dad or his sister there, because of his temper and his drinking. Maternal grandmother has got his oldest dau again. Not completely sure of the circumstances. Her mom is out of the picture and has been for 12 yrs.

I will check with the lawyer who handled my divorce Monday and see what it will take to get the supervised visits put back in place and talk DDs school counselor. She doesn't go back to her dad's until Nov 13. because we did some weekend swaps.

 

[Hidden_Mickey]

Whenever I see a post about visitation like this, I just shake my head. I have not been divorced so this is foreign to me. There is no way my kid would visit a person like this. I cannot believe parents like this have a legal right to visitation, which seems to be more important than the child's right to be safe, in the court's eyes. The child cannot defend herself in this situation, and what happened is something that she will never forget. It's one thing when your ex is a jerk, but when he is dangerous there should be no way they let a kid in his presence again until the kids are teens and can fend for themselves if necessary.

 

[dispor]

I am not coming down too hard on step-mom. She has been up front and honest with me about the entire incident. She knew DF and I were not home Sat night when this happened, but yes she has both of our cell # and my moms and my sons. The main thing is she made sure DD was safe. I told her next time to call one of the three of us and bring her to us. This was the first time DD spent the night w/step mom w/out her father there.

I don't understand why you feel that step-mom acted appropriately. She knew enough to get her grandkids out of there. She left your daughter there. She didn't make a simple phone call to you. It was your EX that contacted stepmom after she had left, not the other way around. Stepmom didn't tell you about the incident AT ALL until you found out about it from your daughter. I wonder how much else she hasn't told you.

While you are getting counseling for your daughter, I think it might be a good idea to get some counseling for yourself as well.

 

[kelleyrn2000]

Based on what you've told us, IMO it would be negligent on your part to send her back. As a parent, we have to protect our children from both physical and emotional trauma.

Believe me, your dd will never forget the image of what happened out of her mind. If you can, I would try to have her talk to a counselor to help her cope with her feelings. Do what you need to do to protect dd, she needs you!


ETA: Stepmom should have told you when she dropped dd off the first time, what happened, if not immediately after the incident. She should know how upsetting that must have been for your dd!