HELP! Problem with cats...

[beck0321]

At this point, I am at a loss on what to do about this situation. Two of my cats are constantly fighting with no end in sight apparently. Here's a little backstory...

I have three cats, all male: Dempsie, Bengal and Sushi. Bengal is the dominant male (even though he is the most sickly of the bunch ), Dempsie is extremely submissive, and Sushi is neutral. They are all indoor (we live by a very busy street). Have lived together with no problems for the last 4 years.

However, within the last year, Bengal has begun picking on Dempsie, to where it ends up with them fighting; doing that horrible screaming thing cats do and getting scratches on their face. The weird thing is though that I'll come home for lunch or from work every day and they'll be sleeping together and getting along just fine. But, it has gotten to the point where any time Bengal gets near Dempsie, Demspie will start growling and hissing (even if Bengal is paying him no mind) and of course this triggers Bengal's attack instinct (I guess). Sometimes Demspie can't even go to the litter because Bengal will follow him to the back and just watch him, which Dempsie is uncomfortable with of course. It also goes on during the middle of the night with the growling, hissing and screaming; we just close the bedroom door now.

I have tried Feliway, didn't work. I have TRIED to discipline Bengal by getting over him, holding the scruff of his neck, gently pushing his head down and saying NO! I had read somewhere that's how mama cats discipline their young, and that actually seemed to work for a little while, about a month. But now it's back to the same thing. Bengal KNOWS he's doing wrong because as soon as he hears me coming to discipline him, he runs under the bed now to where I can't get to him.

The crap thing is that they're both good cats! My cats are not aggressive toward me or DH at all. They all have their claws, yet never scratch us, don't bite or try to attack us in any way EVER. I love all my cats so much (I am such the cat person), and I would hate to have to get rid of one because of this. But because it isn't getting any better, I'm starting to think that's the only option.

I am actually having to think about giving Demspie away. But it would have to be to someone I know and trust not to mistreat him, and accept him as part of the family. He really needs to be in a one-cat household. I just don't know what else to do. But I also don't know anyone who could take him.

I won't give Bengal away. He has cost us SO much in medical bills and has chronic feline asthma, which needs medication and monitoring. He's also "my" cat. Bengal is the only one of our cats that vies for MY attention. The other two love DH and want his constant attention. I guess I just have a stronger connection with Bengal than Dempsie, so I am being selfish in that way I guess in wanting to keep him.

I don't know what to do...I just really need some advice or something. This has been weighing on my mind for so long and it's to the point where I think something needs to be done, but I don't know where to go from here

 

[si-am]

I am confused; you say that Bengal is picking on Dempsie... but Dempsie is starting the fights? Maybe Dempsie senses that Bengal is sickly and is trying to establish dominance.

I don't really have any great advice for you-- our cats fight all the time too, but they don't hurt each other. I don't think it's fair for you to give away your husband's cat though if you don't want to give away "yours."

 

[bevgray]

I'm so very sorry to hear this. If Feliway is not working, you may have to find a new home for one of the cats. Some questions first.

1. Have you taken your boys to the Vet to make sure that Bengal's health issues haven't escalated to the point that he is in pain or some other cause that would make him less social with the other cats? Or that Dempsie hasn't developed his own health problems? Keep in mind, that when cats are ill, they don't show it but pain/discomfort can manifest is the "leave me alone" fights.

2. Are your boys all neutered?

3. Has your home situation changed (a new family member, a new house, something that might have stressed the cats)?

4. Is "Bengal" a Bengal or mixed-Bengal (sadly, the Bengal breed can develop aggression as they get older, particularly the males). Not all cat breeds are created equal. Just like dog breeds, there is quite a variation in the cat breeds and how they interact with people and each other. Bengals are not as social with each other as some breeds (such as Burmese and Tonkinese who seem to thrive on other feline company) and there may be territorial and/or jealousy issues at work between your cats. I had a big Bengal boy who was an absolute love. Got along splendidly with his Tonkinese "sister" and "brother" until he reached the age of 5. Then, he started terrorizing the little female to the point that he inflicted a nasty bite wound in her neck. He also stalked her and wouldn't let her get to the pans. I even tried separating the pans but it did no good. Now mind you, nothing in the household had changed. They had been raised together. They were inside, neutered cats. Something just set him off and we never did find out what. All the time this was happening, he remained the most loving cat to me. Ultimately, I had to make the heart-breaking choice to find a new home for him since he was becoming dangerous to the other cats.

6. You might check with your Vet to see if he/she can recommend an animal behaviour expert. Sometimes they can spot issues with the environment that are stressing the animals that aren't visible to us.

Unfortuantely, cats aren't always social with each other and, once they start exhibiting "don't like each other" behaviour, separation may be the only answer. If any of your cats are "purebloods", you might also check with their breeders to see if they have any suggestions. Best of luck. I know how distressing this can be. I'm assuming that the third male is getting along with the others? Keep in mind though, if you do chose to find Dempsie a new home, Bengal may turn on the other cat as his next target if it is a matter of jealousy or territory.

Another option, depending on your home, is just keeping the cats separated (this means closed off from each other entirely, separate litter boxes, etc.). I was in an apartment with mine and it was not feasible to do that. If you have a basement or spare room, it might be possible.

 

[Imzadi]

What do you mean Bengal is the most sickly? Have you taking him to the vet lately to be checked? As a PP said, he could be getting sicker, and it's setting off Dempsie's dominance issues.

How many litter boxes are there? Sounds like Dempsie needs his own litter box.

Last, I suggest bringing the cats in to have their nails clipped once a month. Not declawed, clipped. Or see if a pet groomer can come to the house to do it. Clipping their nails is less drastic than giving one of the cats away. you always have that option later.

I routinely clip my kitty's nails, but I've been doing it since she was tiny. She's used to me doing it and there are still times she does not tolerate it. Since yours are adults, you might need professional help to hold the cats down so you do not lose an arm or an eyeball in the process.

This way, they can still fight. They will probably do a lot of biting, but it will be less scratching that they can do to each other.

 

[bevgray]

Uh, no. I clip my cats' nails too but if they are fighting, clipping nails will not resolve the trouble and I guarantee, puncture wounds in the neck from a serious bite are far more dangerous than scratches. The OP has described a situation where one cat is stalking the other to the point of keeping him from a litter box. These cats are unhappy and something is causing the dissension. While nail clipping is always a good idea, this situation sounds far more advanced than a simple case of one cat got frightened or upset and attacked the other for a single instance.

One possibility just occured to me. Has there been another cat hanging around outside (stray, neighbor's cat?) I had a pair of Siamese once (litter brothers who were very close to each other). My cat was the most gentle, sweetest animal you could find. Except when another animal came into the yard (cat or dog). Then, he turned into the Tasmanian Devil and, when he couldn't get out to fight the intruder, would attack his brother.

 

[Scurvy]

I agree with Imzadi that you should clip the cats' claws, or have them clipped. No, it won't prevent biting or solve the problem but it will at least help with the clawing while you are trying to solve this.

I also agree with previous posters that you need to take Bengal and Dempsie to the vet to make sure that this is not being caused by a health issue with one or the other. Is it possible that you could restrict the cats to different parts of your home (at least while you aren't there to observe them and step in if it's necessary) until you can have them each evaluated by a vet?

Finally, I was thinking the same thing that bevgray mentioned. If you do choose to get rid if Dempsie, it's entirely possible that Bengal will turn on Sushi next. You should consider that when making your decision. Separating him from Dempsie but leaving Sushi in Bengal's area might help you to see if that will be the case, though it might take a while for him to turn his attention to Sushi if he can still smell Dempsie in the area. Whatever is causing this behavior might mean that he is going to have to be an only cat for the rest of his life.

 

[beck0321]

Hey! Thanks for the responses. To answer some questions (not in the order of the PP questions though)

1. Bengal has allergy issues, where he will sometimes get some kind of rash or having an allergic reaction to something. Plus he has chronic feline asthma that needs daily medication and needs to be monitored for an attack to give him the rescue inhaler.

2. Dempsie is for sure not trying to establish dominance, he is the one that always hides and is the most timid, so Bengal is the one picking on him. However, it has gotten to the point that anytime Bengal is around him (doesn't matter if Bengal isn't even paying attention to him) he will hiss and growl because I guess he is scared, which I think just makes the situation worse because it makes Bengal want to chase and jump on him. However, when they are fighting, I'm sure it's Bengal that's being the aggressor because only Dempsie is the one screaming and hissing.

3. Dempsie isn't really "DH's" cat, we got all of them when we were together. I was just saying that Sushi and Dempsie seem to want his attention more than they care about mine. Sushi is the worse about that with DH though. He NEEDS DH's attention. Most of the time Dempsie is hiding (which he has always done) and we don't see him. DH doesn't even care most of the time that Sushi revels in his attention and just ignores the cats mostly, so I don't think I'm being too unfair to DH when it comes to that. But DH did bring up a good point, if Bengal would start picking on Sushi. Sushi doesn't display any signs of being submissive in the least though, he is just our sweet man...like the hippy cat or something

4. None of them are purebreds and I think Bengal is just a plain ol orange tabby. But that situation described about the PP's bengal cat sounds just like what is going on here (Bengal is about 5 or 6).

5. I REALLY don't want to have to get rid of Bengal since he is my baby! I feel like I have this responsibility to take care of him, if that makes sense. He almost passed away about two years ago because of undiagnosed feline asthma and was in LSU vet hospital for a week (after seeing TWO other vets who could not tell me what was wrong). He is really a nice cat to us humans, and he gets along with Sushi. Of course I want to do what's best for all involved.

6. I am scheduling a visit with the vet for Dempsie today to talk about what's going on. Bengal just went to the vet a few weeks ago and he's fine as far as the vet can see. Didn't really bring up the fighting because at the time it had stopped and had been that way for at least a month. Just started up again last week. Also,if one of them has a hidden illness it would be Dempsie more than the other two since we seldom see Dempsie to really assess his situation in that regard.

7. They do each have their own litter box, but Bengal follows Dempsie to whichever one.

Sorry if I'm leaving anything out. I just really love all my cats, but I don't want them to be miserable in my home. I am just at a loss you know? Just thinking about it is making me want to cry. I don't know if I could even give one away, that would be so hard to handle

 

[beck0321]

I agree with Imzadi that you should clip the cats' claws, or have them clipped. No, it won't prevent biting or solve the problem but it will at least help with the clawing while you are trying to solve this.

Sorry I didn't mention that above, but I do clip Bengal's claws once a week. Dempsie freaks out if we try that with him, but I do it occasionally. I know I need to clip his more often.

I also think putting them in separate rooms while we are away is a good idea. I am going to try that.

ETA: Also, isn't it ironic, the photo I have for my avatar?! They were all best friends like up until a year ago!

 

[Katieinwonderland]

Is there anyway you can separate the cats, maybe just for a few days to see how it goes? I have three cats, two boys and a girl, and the girl (Magic) gets picked on by the boys all the time. She was causing all kinds of problems (peeing outside the litter box, hissing at DH and I etc) and we finally figured out she was just scared of the boys. Now we keep her in our master bedroom when we're not in the house - we have a litter tray in there for her too so she can use the litter tray in peace (the boys would follow her to the litter tray too, then pounce on her ) They still chase her when we're in the house, but she can run to us and we can pick her up or we can break up the fights.

Maybe just some time apart would give you an indication as to how the other two would get along by themselves if it was just the two of them, and you can see if Bengal would end up picking on Sushi (such a cute name BTW!)

 

[beck0321]

Uh, no. I clip my cats' nails too but if they are fighting, clipping nails will not resolve the trouble and I guarantee, puncture wounds in the neck from a serious bite are far more dangerous than scratches. The OP has described a situation where one cat is stalking the other to the point of keeping him from a litter box. These cats are unhappy and something is causing the dissension. While nail clipping is always a good idea, this situation sounds far more advanced than a simple case of one cat got frightened or upset and attacked the other for a single instance.

One possibility just occured to me. Has there been another cat hanging around outside (stray, neighbor's cat?) I had a pair of Siamese once (litter brothers who were very close to each other). My cat was the most gentle, sweetest animal you could find. Except when another animal came into the yard (cat or dog). Then, he turned into the Tasmanian Devil and, when he couldn't get out to fight the intruder, would attack his brother.

I've thought about the stray cat issue before and that COULD be it (although they will fight a few times a day and it is everyday). There are two cats that I know of that like to come into our yard. They have been doing this for the three years we have lived in the neighborhood. I don't know what I can do to keep them out. All our houses are raised so they can go under the house if they want to as well. I think these two might belong to someone since they have been around for three years straight, but none of my immediate neighbor's owns them (maybe someone on the next street). One of my neighbors just got a dog too but she doesn't care about the cats hanging around, so they haven't been deterred.

 

[beck0321]

Is there anyway you can separate the cats, maybe just for a few days to see how it goes? I have three cats, two boys and a girl, and the girl (Magic) gets picked on by the boys all the time. She was causing all kinds of problems (peeing outside the litter box, hissing at DH and I etc) and we finally figured out she was just scared of the boys. Now we keep her in our master bedroom when we're not in the house - we have a litter tray in there for her too so she can use the litter tray in peace (the boys would follow her to the litter tray too, then pounce on her ) They still chase her when we're in the house, but she can run to us and we can pick her up or we can break up the fights.

Maybe just some time apart would give you an indication as to how the other two would get along by themselves if it was just the two of them, and you can see if Bengal would end up picking on Sushi (such a cute name BTW!)

I do really like that idea. They stay on or under the bed all day while we're not home anyway so I don't think he'll feel too confined.
And you're Cheeto looks like my Bengal! How cute

 

[Melora]

We have 3 cats so I understand how you feel.

I wanted to tell you about an incident with my cat when a strange cat came into our yard... It was the middle of the night and Leo (part ragdoll, sweetest cat in the world neutered boy) went out of his mind when the strange cat came to the window and jumped up towards him. Leo attacked the screen, screaming and hissing and tore a HUGE gash in the screen. He had never done anything like this before. Then he jumped down and chased our older girl cat around the house like he wanted to hurt her. We grabbed him (we were all half asleep because it was about 3 AM) and he was hot and panting and basically really freaked out.

It never happened before and its never happened since but it was VERY strange situation.

Not really sure if that whats going on with your kitties but there is definitely something setting them off.

 

[beck0321]

Got an appointment for the vet this afternoon, so I'll see what he says I guess. I'd like to think that I'm being a good pet parent, but I feel like I've lost control of the situation and I feel really bad about it.

 

[si-am]

We have 3 cats so I understand how you feel.

I wanted to tell you about an incident with my cat when a strange cat came into our yard... It was the middle of the night and Leo (part ragdoll, sweetest cat in the world neutered boy) went out of his mind when the strange cat came to the window and jumped up towards him. Leo attacked the screen, screaming and hissing and tore a HUGE gash in the screen. He had never done anything like this before. Then he jumped down and chased our older girl cat around the house like he wanted to hurt her. We grabbed him (we were all half asleep because it was about 3 AM) and he was hot and panting and basically really freaked out.

It never happened before and its never happened since but it was VERY strange situation.

Not really sure if that whats going on with your kitties but there is definitely something setting them off.

Something like this happened at our house last year too! A stray was hanging around the yard, frequently coming on to the deck to check out our cats through the window. Our female would go absolutely CRAZY whenever she saw it, and then she'd try to attack our male cat, I swear she wanted to kill him.

Finally we taped some poster board on the bottom half of the sliding glass door so that stray couldn't see our cats and vice versa, and it stopped coming around.

 

[beck0321]

Something like this happened at our house last year too! A stray was hanging around the yard, frequently coming on to the deck to check out our cats through the window. Our female would go absolutely CRAZY whenever she saw it, and then she'd try to attack our male cat, I swear she wanted to kill him.

Finally we taped some poster board on the bottom half of the sliding glass door so that stray couldn't see our cats and vice versa, and it stopped coming around.

Our house is raised, so they can't come face to face, but they will see another cat in the backyard from the porch. I don't know if that's the issue though because this happened just yesterday and Bengal didn't immediately attack Dempsie, and they were all on the porch together at the time.

I DO wish I could make those cats stop coming around though because one of them has attacked me twice and I really don't like it (and I love ALL animals, but can't stand this one). Even after that though I can't bring myself to spray it with the hose...DH has no problem with it though...

 

[Scurvy]

I DO wish I could make those cats stop coming around though because one of them has attacked me twice and I really don't like it (and I love ALL animals, but can't stand this one). Even after that though I can't bring myself to spray it with the hose...DH has no problem with it though...

Some of the suggestions on this thread might help with that. There are lots of ways to discourage other cats from hanging out in your yard or under your house. As a cat lover, I can understand why you might not want to spray the cats with a hose, but unless you're doing it when it's freezing outside it isn't going to be any more than a minor annoyance for the cat. Some of the suggestions are postentially harmful (cayenne is believed to cause eye damage, mothballs are toxic if ingested) but most of them will just make the cat feel your property is not a desirable place to be.

 

[pppiglet]

We found black pepper was easy to sprinkle on our front porch and kept outside cats from spraying on our front door. We have issues all the time with 10 cats. Someone is always picking on someone. We've been trimming the nails lately as some have had minor scratches. The two fosters we had living in my back office went home last night, so after I clean the room and reorganize I'll be opening that half of the house to my cats and hopefully that gives them more places to hide from each other. I have one male that stares at one female and pisses her off until she's hissing at him constantly. Next thing I know she's going up to him and kissing him on the nose.

 

[Imzadi]

I have TRIED to discipline Bengal by getting over him, holding the scruff of his neck, gently pushing his head down and saying NO! I had read somewhere that's how mama cats discipline their young, and that actually seemed to work for a little while, about a month. But now it's back to the same thing.

You know, if this worked, you might just have to keep doing this every month. It sounds like Bengal regards you as the Alpha Cat and does listen for a while. It would be better than giving a cat away.