Guess who has the best selling jersey in the NFL as of today

[robinb]

To be fair, the two are not mutually exclusive. It is possible to support someone's free speech rights while at the same time believing they're an idiot. It's possible to believe in their message, but not in the method of delivery. Everything doesn't have to be so black & white.

Honestly, that's the problem with this whole discussion of "police brutality". There's essentially 2 camps:

Camp one: police brutality and racial profiling are a myth.

Camp two: every single instance of a black man shot by police is irrefutable proof that racism is rampant among police.

Ugh

See, and from what I've seen, Camp 2 types vastly outnumber Camp 1.

It's all about perspective.

The problem is making up ridiculously polarized "camps" and assigning people to them.

 

[Bilberry]

I don't watch football. Never played the sport either. I hope though that the NFL doesn't experience long term issues from the players protest and reaction from fans. To me it seems there are better marketing answers that would help the NFL players better get their message across out without alienating many in their fan base.

I play tennis. Recently I saw retired tennis star James Blake came out with a book on the racial issues he has experienced in his life. Blake, who is black, was the tennis player tackled by a NY city police officer by mistake a few years ago. It made national news. James Blake appears to be taking a different approach to getting his message out. He too wants to see changes that will improve America. Of course when I saw that it had me thinking that potentially NFL players could watch and possible follow James Blake to see how his ideas are received by the public.

 

[Hikergirl]

That's exactly why they go nowhere. There's too much having to be reassured that one side is not always 100% right, too much getting bogged down in having a tit for tat over small details and ignoring the larger points.
If I had to guess, I'd say you and I probably mostly disagree on the topic of kneeling and the problems associated with it. I do think we were finding common ground on our desire for things to stop being so one side against the other, stop with the pretty little arguments and childish bickering (people in general, not you and I). For me, it's frustrating to then see your comment about both sides because it feels like being back to square one.

That was not my intent at all, and I do apologize if I came across that way.
I was just trying to say that as long as we can recognize that our own side has to be honest, not just the other, then I agree with everything you said.
That was unfair, you never pointed to only one side having an issue with honestly, that was something I assumed you meant from your post.

 

[ELKA]

The problem is making up ridiculously polarized "camps" and assigning people to them.

I disagree, the problem is assigning derogatory names to people who are in the middle who would like to deal with issues instead of threats of violence or division.

 

[kimblebee]

@rickybobby @Mizzoufan will either of you answer the question I posted a few pages back?

Do either of you own any clothing with the flag on it? Have you ever used a napkin or plate with the flag on it? Own a throw pillow or blanket with the flag?

 

[FlightlessDuck]

How about the Pennsylvania fire chief calling Mike Tomlin the n-word after the Steelers stayed in the locker room?

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/nat...l-slur-steelers-mike-tomlin-article-1.3522247

I mean, he's sorry now. But he still said it.

 

[rickybobby]

That's interesting. I've heard many arguments from Camp 1.
I have never, once in my life, heard anyone suggest the position you espouse in Camp 2. Perhaps failure to understand the position of Camp 2 is part of the problem.

How about the Pennsylvania fire chief calling Mike Tomlin the n-word after the Steelers stayed in the locker room?

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/nat...l-slur-steelers-mike-tomlin-article-1.3522247

I mean, he's sorry now. But he still said it.

I have no qualms with Tomlin. I think that what he said was blown out of proportion.

 

[amberpi]

I have no qualms with Tomlin. I think that what he said was blown out of proportion.

So you EVER think that's ok? What in the ever living what?

ETA: That's not a non-binary issue that can or cannot be blown out of proportion. He said it, or he didn't. It's that easy. Sadly, I've had to walk out of dates (literally, get up and just walk out) twice once when that word was used and once when another slur was used. How is that even possible now?

 

[Mizzoufan]

@rickybobby @Mizzoufan will either of you answer the question I posted a few pages back?

Do either of you own any clothing with the flag on it? Have you ever used a napkin or plate with the flag on it? Own a throw pillow or blanket with the flag?

No, I don't own anything with a flag in it. I believe the flag shouldonly be flown. Not wore not as decoration.

 

[hereyago]

How about the Pennsylvania fire chief calling Mike Tomlin the n-word after the Steelers stayed in the locker room?

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/nat...l-slur-steelers-mike-tomlin-article-1.3522247

I mean, he's sorry now. But he still said it.

I doubt he is truly sorry, just saying...

 

[bananasplitkids]

Wow I'm really surprised this thread is still open.

I don't watch football. Never played the sport either. I hope though that the NFL doesn't experience long term issues from the players protest and reaction from fans. To me it seems there are better marketing answers that would help the NFL players better get their message across out without alienating many in their fan base.

I play tennis. Recently I saw retired tennis star James Blake came out with a book on the racial issues he has experienced in his life. Blake, who is black, was the tennis player tackled by a NY city police officer by mistake a few years ago. It made national news. James Blake appears to be taking a different approach to getting his message out. He too wants to see changes that will improve America. Of course when I saw that it had me thinking that potentially NFL players could watch and possible follow James Blake to see how his ideas are received by the public.

I disagree with following his - Blake's lead. I remember when that happened and it was a news story for a brief moment and that was it. It is not a national story and it seems very few are still listening. Kapernick started this a whole season ago and were still talking about this and he isn't even in the league anymore. I feel that by kneeling it is doing exactly what protest are supposed to be about, it is to make you uncomfortable in hopes that true conversations can begin which includes listening and trying to understand the other sides viewpoint and experiences. I think James Blake and how he is approaching what happened to him makes everyone feel comfortable and unfortunately his experience gets lost.

 

[rickybobby]

@rickybobby @Mizzoufan will either of you answer the question I posted a few pages back?

Do either of you own any clothing with the flag on it? Have you ever used a napkin or plate with the flag on it? Own a throw pillow or blanket with the flag?

Sorry, wearing a shirt with a flag on it is not in my or many others opinions equitable to kneeling for the anthem.

OK, whatever gets you through the day.
But, thank you for proving my point, you surely didn't disappoint.

On that note, feel free to continue your "discussion"

Not a discussion. A lecture.

 

[Gumbo4x4]

The problem is making up ridiculously polarized "camps" and assigning people to them.

I don't disagree, but that's the reality. The fringe has the voice & if you're not part of their fringe, then in their eyes, you're at the opposite end and there is no in between.

 

[Hikergirl]

How about the Pennsylvania fire chief calling Mike Tomlin the n-word after the Steelers stayed in the locker room?

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/nat...l-slur-steelers-mike-tomlin-article-1.3522247

I mean, he's sorry now. But he still said it.

That is pretty despicable.

 

[ELKA]

How about the Pennsylvania fire chief calling Mike Tomlin the n-word after the Steelers stayed in the locker room?

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/nat...l-slur-steelers-mike-tomlin-article-1.3522247

I mean, he's sorry now. But he still said it.

Yep, he did and should be reprimanded by his district. Volunteer firemen can be suspended, and or let go. He is not getting paid for his job so it wouldn't be a firing. He is a Chief, I don't know what the rules are in that case.

 

[FlightlessDuck]

NFL players and coaches: "We are protesting the anthem as a show of unity in what we feel is the continued systemic racism in the realms of power in this country"
Fire chief: "You're an n-word!"

 

[rickybobby]

So you EVER think that's ok? What in the ever living what?

ETA: That's not a non-binary issue that can or cannot be blown out of proportion. He said it, or he didn't. It's that easy. Sadly, I've had to walk out of dates (literally, get up and just walk out) twice once when that word was used and once when another slur was used. How is that even possible now?

No, I mean what Tomlin said about expecting 100% cooperation on staying in the locker room for the anthem. Not what the fire chief said. Let's save that for another thread.

 

[cabanafrau]

I have no qualms with Tomlin. I think that what he said was blown out of proportion.

Blown out of proportion? All I know about it is from his own words. Taking the racial slur out of it doesn't even begin to lessen the disgusting thought behind it.

 

[Wendy31]

@rickybobby @Mizzoufan will either of you answer the question I posted a few pages back?

Do either of you own any clothing with the flag on it? Have you ever used a napkin or plate with the flag on it? Own a throw pillow or blanket with the flag?

I can't answer for either of the other posters, but I will answer for myself.

I wear red, white, & blue around patriotic holidays, but our family does not wear clothes made to look like the flag. (For example, I may wear cropped blue jeans w/ a white tank top & a red sleeveless button-up top over the white tank top.) I admit that we have worn the Old Navy flag t-shirts on 4th of July; however, in my mind, the flag in its entirety being printed on a t-shirt is different than wearing clothes that look they are made from the flag, if that makes sense. I don't have an American flag bikini. LOL! We don't own any throw American flag pillows or blankets. However, in July, I decorate our fireplace mantel w/ some red & white striped material & candle holders that are blue w/ star cutouts. I hang a wooden flag on our front door during the month of July as well. We have used napkins w/ flags printed on them during 4th of July celebrations. I can't remember ever using a plate w/ an American flag on it, but I won't say that I haven't.

We also have an American flag flying on our front porch, which, at night, is lit by our porch light. We dispose of used/worn flags correctly.

I know you're trying to make the point that using an American-themed napkin during a 4th of July celebration is just as much of a disrespect to the flag as not standing during the National Anthem, but I will respectfully disagree with you. I think one needs to look at context in both instances. Suggesting that the two things are the same is, at best, a bit disingenuous, &, at worst, rather smug & condescending.

 

[aprilgail]

I don't watch football. Never played the sport either. I hope though that the NFL doesn't experience long term issues from the players protest and reaction from fans. To me it seems there are better marketing answers that would help the NFL players better get their message across out without alienating many in their fan base.

.

The charity I work with makes a good percentage of their money raffling sports memorabilia off- right now we can not even give the football crap away, people just don't want anything to do with football because of the crap they are pulling.