Fastpass return or replacement?

[AnnabelleTheTalkingTree]

I'm really curious how many people who usually stay deluxe or club level are going to downgrade to value or even offsite as there are no real benefits to staying deluxe

We usually do deluxe (most times through DVC rental), the biggest perk being the convenience of location. We really don't like Disney buses so much, so we choose to stay at either the MK area resorts or Crescent Lake (or a split stay between the two) to keep the busing to a minimum. Even with the discount you get renting points, I'm not sure that convenience is worth the money anymore considering the absence of other on-site perks like FP and ME. My family is likely not going to start staying moderate or value, just because of the busing situation. I feel like at that point I may as well stay off-site and spend less on the room and use an uber to get to the parks. But then at THAT point, we love Disney for the Disney bubble, and staying off-site isn't an option we love either. That leaves us with basically no options we are excited about for a Disney vacation. Sure we could shorten our trip, but then we're ...drumroll please... paying more and getting less for our money (theme of the day here) and that just rubs me the wrong way. So likely scenario is, not only do we NOT stay on-site, we just won't go to Disney at all. I LOVE Disney, this would break my Cinderella-castle-loving heart, but there are lots of other places to go. If we're not enjoying Disney anymore for any number of factors, we will just go elsewhere. We go to Disney for vacation. Vacation is supposed to be enjoyable. If Disney isn't enjoyable, we don't go to Disney.

Maybe this Genie thing will evolve in a way that will not be a total disaster. Maybe they will wind up announcing some type of additional perk for on-site guests. Maybe there will be virtual standby for most rides (which would make this whole thing a lot more palatable). Maybe, when our trip comes up in the spring, we go and this system actually winds up being better than expected. BUT if it doesn't - if this makes me feel nickeled & dimed, or stressed, if I don't like being forced to wake up at 7am on vacation, if I feel like I'm not getting my money's worth.... then I'm out.

 

[AnnabelleTheTalkingTree]

....

According to Len Testa during his live chat yesterday, the virtual standby was pulled at the last minute because it was to complicated. I'd have to go back and listen again as to whether it was the programming that was to complex or it was considered to be too complicated for the casual guest to understand.

That seems off to me, wasn't paper fastness basically just an older version of a virtual standby without the technology we have now? Isn't DLP doing virtual standby?

Maybe they figure it out and introduce it at a later date?

I am really hoping for this because I feel like virtual standby is the only thing that could save this.

 

[cakebaker]

I am really hoping for this because I feel like virtual standby is the only thing that could save this.

I was actually happy they dropped the idea of a standby VQ. The idea that we’d have to schedule a time to stand in line for hours seemed crazy to me and with the ability for them to shut down standing in line, it almost guaranteed they’d be shutting lines down in the evenings close to closing to prevent people from getting in lines at the last minute.

I would hope with Genie the days of long lines snaking thru the park would be over and that’s really the only reason to have standby vq’s.

 

[Marionnette]

That seems off to me, wasn't paper fastness basically just an older version of a virtual standby without the technology we have now? Isn't DLP doing virtual standby?

Maybe they figure it out and introduce it at a later date?

I am really hoping for this because I feel like virtual standby is the only thing that could save this.

G+ is a digital version of the legacy (paper) FP. You get a return time. You enter thru the Lightning Lane (formerly the FP queue) and you can only hold one at a time.

The virtual queue for standby lines was going to go into effect when standby waits got too long. The physical line would get closed and the guest would be directed to join a virtual queue. When the physical line got to a manageable length, the guest in the virtual standby queue would be invited to go stand in the standby queue. So, basically if the wait time was 60 minutes for the attraction, Disney might close the standby line. Once that queue reaches a more reasonable length (maybe 30 minutes or less), you get an alert that you can now join the line with an additional 30-minute wait.

 

[Karin1984]

That seems off to me, wasn't paper fastness basically just an older version of a virtual standby without the technology we have now? Isn't DLP doing virtual standby?

Maybe they figure it out and introduce it at a later date?

I am really hoping for this because I feel like virtual standby is the only thing that could save this.

DLP has one virtual standby line still in testing.

 

[AnnabelleTheTalkingTree]

G+ is a digital version of the legacy (paper) FP. You get a return time. You enter thru the Lightning Lane (formerly the FP queue) and you can only hold one at a time.

The virtual queue for standby lines was going to go into effect when standby waits got too long. The physical line would get closed and the guest would be directed to join a virtual queue. When the physical line got to a manageable length, the guest in the virtual standby queue would be invited to go stand in the standby queue. So, basically if the wait time was 60 minutes for the attraction, Disney might close the standby line. Once that queue reaches a more reasonable length (maybe 30 minutes or less), you get an alert that you can now join the line with an additional 30-minute wait.

This would be good for me, with little kids. I want to ride SDMT, for instance, but my two little ones just can't wait in a 90 minute line. They could do 30 minutes though. I'd love an unpaid option to come back when lines are more manageable for my family. Otherwise I'm forced into paying for LL, or just skipping the headliners.

 

[rmclain73]

I do not hate this yet, but of course there are still lots of questions.

Back in the day of the paper fastPass we were able to cover lots of rides. I hope Disney offers the chance to add another FastPass if your scheduled ride is far out. In the past at WDW, and at DL, you could book a new ride 90mins or 2 hours after booking your first if your scheduled FastPass was later in the day. If that comes back then I feel $15 is very worth it. My thoughts also are that if you played the refresh game with the FP+ system then you will continue to do so with the Genie system as people will be constantly changing plans. Maybe Disney will drop more passes through out the day as they did in the past as well.

I do remember with paper tickets people would often approach us, as we did to others, with passes they could no longer use as they decided to leave the park earlier than the schedule FastPass time. Will the average Joe be kind enough to cancel a FastPass if they decide to leave opening up more options for those still in the park? A nice feature of the app would be if when leaving the park and you had FastPasses still not used you get a notification asking you if you are coming back later, or want to cancel.

Not sure on the LL+ until I see the costs. I see some people saying they would not spend $X to ride something that is 5 mins long. I see it the other way, I am willing to spend $X to keep me from waiting 90mins.

 

[AnnabelleTheTalkingTree]

I was actually happy they dropped the idea of a standby VQ. The idea that we’d have to schedule a time to stand in line for hours seemed crazy to me and with the ability for them to shut down standing in line, it almost guaranteed they’d be shutting lines down in the evenings close to closing to prevent people from getting in lines at the last minute.

I would hope with Genie the days of long lines snaking thru the park would be over and that’s really the only reason to have standby vq’s.

If this really puts an end to those kinds of lines, I'm okay with that.

 

[ATL Gator]

I'm really curious how many people who usually stay deluxe or club level are going to downgrade to value or even offsite as there are no real benefits to staying deluxe

Our family of 4 made AK Lodge reservations for the Sat.-Tues. before Thanksgiving thinking we would receive a ton of benefits for staying Deluxe. Turns out we would probably only get an extra 2 hours in one park on Monday night, 30 minutes in the morning, and pretty much no advantages with ride waits. We will be cancelling reservations and getting a nearby 3BR VRBO and save almost $2,000.

 

[Bibbobboo2u]

Staying at Deluxe will offer the benefit of extra evening hours at Epcot and MK, currently each having one night per week. I would expect rides to be walk-ons/limited waits, including Tier 1s, based upon the number of Deluxe rooms. This could save the "pay-to-play" cost of up to $25 (est max but who knows at this point) per person per Tier 1 ride. This "saves" a family of four $100 per ride. With two Tier 1 rides per park, that would be $200 "saved". Multiply that times 2 parks, for total "savings" of $400 in a week. The price difference between moderate and deluxe resorts is typically going to be much more than $400 for a week. It is more like $400+ per day. I don't see the benefit to staying deluxe to obtain extra evening hours. I guess that the main benefit will have to be that you enjoy the resort and its amenities.

 

[Sandisw]

I see the same talking points being raised by people defending this abomination. And of course, there were problems with the old system. But I just find it odd that they can’t imagine a solution that doesn’t have Disney reaching into your pocket some more. But of course “everyone else does it” etc etc.

I’d also like you to imagine a world where Disney had invested in rides instead of blowing billions on digital systems that were sold on their ability to reduce staffing costs. And this is ultimately the reason Disney is where they are. We’ve had close to 20 years of chronic underinvestment in the parks. Each park should have gotten an e ticket every 4-5 years since opening. Instead, we’ve more hotels, dvc where they couldn’t fill those same hotels. Ride closures and of we were lucky value engineered replacements that didn’t even have the same capacity.

Add all of this to the multitude of cost reductions. Not just big things like magic express or parking. No longer having 2-4 full time custodians per restrooms. The Light bulb crews that replaced bulbs at 80% of their expected lights so you don’t have blown light everywhere. Monorails maintenance. Basic things like benches. Etc etc. Etc

I feel for people who didn’t experience WDW up to the late 90s. Because what we have now is a shallow imitation of those once glorious parks. You’ve to go to Tokyo now to get that same experience.

Excpwt all of us who are not outraged and can see how it may work better for us and are okay with paying are entitled to feel that way too.

I get people feel Disney has gone to far and those people have tough choices to make on where to spend their dollars.

But personally. I just don’t get upset over something that could work in my favor. I pay more in life now for convenience and the free old
FP systems didn’t always work for us in how we did our split stays and the different groups.

I definitely think this seems to be turning more people away more than is exciting people.

Less for mor me? Absolutely. Am I okay with it? Yes because I’ll adjust how I do things. Why? Because we enjoy WDW even without going full blown at the parks.

 

[AnnabelleTheTalkingTree]

Staying at Deluxe will offer the benefit of extra evening hours at Epcot and MK, currently each having one night per week. I would expect rides to be walk-ons/limited waits, including Tier 1s, based upon the number of Deluxe rooms. This could save the "pay-to-play" cost of up to $25 (est max but who knows at this point) per person per Tier 1 ride. This "saves" a family of four $100 per ride. With two Tier 1 rides per park, that would be $200 "saved". Multiply that times 2 parks, for total "savings" of $400 in a week. The price difference between moderate and deluxe resorts is typically going to be much more than $400 for a week. It is more like $400+ per day. I don't see the benefit to staying deluxe to obtain extra evening hours. I guess that the main benefit will have to be that you enjoy the resort and its amenities.

Our next stay is a dvc stay, I'm praying my little kids will just fall asleep in the stroller at night so hubby and I can take advantage of this.

 

[Marionnette]

Staying at Deluxe will offer the benefit of extra evening hours at Epcot and MK, currently each having one night per week. I would expect rides to be walk-ons/limited waits, including Tier 1s, based upon the number of Deluxe rooms. This could save the "pay-to-play" cost of up to $25 (est max but who knows at this point) per person per Tier 1 ride. This "saves" a family of four $100 per ride. With two Tier 1 rides per park, that would be $200 "saved". Multiply that times 2 parks, for total "savings" of $400 in a week. The price difference between moderate and deluxe resorts is typically going to be much more than $400 for a week. It is more like $400+ per day. I don't see the benefit to staying deluxe to obtain extra evening hours. I guess that the main benefit will have to be that you enjoy the resort and its amenities.

But those 2 nights with Extra Evening Hours are limited to Epcot on Mondays and MK on Wednesdays. No HS. No AK. So, if you want quick access to FOP, you will pay. Want to skip the line for SD? You still have to pony up $$. And other than getting access to RAT without having to pay $$, what makes those 2 extra hours at Epcot even worthwhile?

 

[Bibbobboo2u]

Because we enjoy WDW even without going full blown at the parks.

I thought about something similar after considering the impact of Genie on our touring style. It may be a good system for guests who don't go full blown at parks or for those who don't have spending caps. However, we are in the group that does go "full-blown", so it has a lot of downside for us. Like everything else, YMMV!

 

[Bibbobboo2u]

But those 2 nights with Extra Evening Hours are limited to Epcot on Mondays and MK on Wednesdays. No HS. No AK. So, if you want quick access to FOP, you will pay. Want to skip the line for SD? You still have to pony up $$. And other than getting access to RAT without having to pay $$, what makes those 2 extra hours at Epcot even worthwhile?

I agree. I don't see the benefit to staying Deluxe, other than for the reason that you love the resort and its amenities.

 

[kevind2112]

We've been to Disney 5 times. This December will be our 6th trip. If this new system is put into place as outlined here, we're absolutely done, and may even cancel our Xmas trip this year. I love planning our trips, and understand a Disney vacation is much more complex than hitting the beach. But, this is just getting ridiculous.

I've spent a ton of money for flights, and an insane rate for a value resort & park passes because it's Xmas. We are thousands into this trip without even talking about food, and now apparently without even talking about getting on any rides. All this money spent just for the "privilege" of walking into a park would be the last straw for me. No special value for staying onsite anymore (30 minutes extra in the morning? Please). How many hundreds of dollars per day am I going to have to spend for the privilege of getting on a few rides?

Honestly, bring back FP+ for me. It wasn't perfect by any means, but it worked for us.

(Here's hoping my rant is completely unfounded, and that these rumors are just that! )

So we discussed this as a family last night. We've decided that while we will forge ahead with our already planned trip at Christmas for, family and sentimental reasons, we are done after this one. We already have some sunk costs into this trip, so we'll bite the bullet and make the best of it.

We'll find other things to do for future vacations. Visit Europe, Hawaii, maybe even Universal! The direction they have chosen for Disney World, $$$ over literally everything else, has finally broke us. We're though with it. Sad, we LOVE Disney World, and have had so many great experiences and so many great memories. But, it's truly not worth it anymore...

 

[Jennasis]

But how much will the extra purchase LL be?

Also WHY must there be so many names?? Genie, Genie+, Lightning Lane, MDE...it's like they go out of their way to be confusing.

 

[AnnabelleTheTalkingTree]

Just a sidenote, I feel like information on the unpaid version of Genie has been really light.

Or maybe it's just that the unpaid version of Genie is light on features.

 

[Bibbobboo2u]

Did anyone pick up on this from updated WDW FAQ about Genie+?
At Walt Disney World, the introductory pricing is $15 per ticket per day.

How long before that goes up?

 

[Spyral]

So we discussed this as a family last night. We've decided that while we will forge ahead with our already planned trip at Christmas for, family and sentimental reasons, we are done after this one. We already have some sunk costs into this trip, so we'll bite the bullet and make the best of it.

We'll find other things to do for future vacations. Visit Europe, Hawaii, maybe even Universal! The direction they have chosen for Disney World, $$$ over literally everything else, has finally broke us. We're though with it. Sad, we LOVE Disney World, and have had so many great experiences and so many great memories. But, it's truly not worth it anymore...

This is us as well. We decided to go ahead and do our already planned trip for similar reasons, but it will be our last.