Fantasmic theme...yikes

[twob4him]

I am going to try to word this so as to NOT offend anyone. I am not passing judgement just stating MY opinion. (no flames please) So here goes...

I am planning a return trip to Disney with my family. I have been to all the parks before except Hollywood Studios. I am a huge Disney World fan and to help get prepared we are trying to watch Disney movies we have never seen. I have heard wonderful things and not so wonderful things about HS's Fantasmic show. I thought I would just watch the movie Fantasmic to find out what it is all about. To be blunt, I was shocked. It started out ok but then it got to the whole Mickey Sorceror thing with magic and evil etc. A few minutes later went right into evolution and the "earth is millions of years old and this is how it looked etc.". All of these themes are extremely disturbing to me. Does anyone know what this whole "evil side" of Disney is all about? Did Walt Disney approve of Fantasia? I mean was he still alive when it was made? I just thought Disney was all cuteness and charm and princesses and goodness. OK so any Fantasmic gurus out there want to educate me on this? Thanks!

 

[powellrj]

You must have missed the movies like Bambi and Snow White. There was nothing warm and fuzzy about most of the Disney movies if you really think about it.

I have a friend who always like to say that Walt must have really hated his mom because many of the movies have the moms die and the kids are raised alone, with dad or an evil step mom.

 

[twob4him]

You must have missed the movies like Bambi and Snow White. There was nothing warm and fuzzy about most of the Disney movies if you really think about it.

I have a friend who always like to say that Walt must have really hated his mom because many of the movies have the moms die and the kids are raised alone, with dad or an evil step mom.

true true...that's so funny...I mean I realize there was an evil witch of course in Snow White and lots of the princess movies... but good always wins. But in Fantasmic, Mickey himself was indulging in the evil...big difference. Disney appears to be glorifying it. And poor Bambi...I just watched that a few weeks ago. At least the "father" steps up to the plate and it turns out alright. In any case, I just feel like Fantasmic is completely out of line with the typical Disney movie theme. And now stepping back, isn't the Sorceror Hat the theme of HS? I don't know, maybe I am just different from the mainstream...I really try to avoid evil and all that.

 

[notsosnowwhite]

I know what you're saying - there's something more dark about Fantasia. It scared the bejeezus out of me when I was little and I'm still creeped out by it today. I could do without the Spectromagic parts featuring the Fantasia characters, but that's just me.

From what I understand it is exactly what it was meant to be - a story created for adults more so than children.

 

[crisi]

First, the Fastamic show and the Fantasia movie are two different things. Fantasmic does take peices from Fantasia (Sorcerer Mickey in particular), and IS dark and IS overwhelming for a lot of small children. Good triumphs over evil in the end, but never forever......

Fantasia is a movie about the interpretation of music. Disney considered it one of his proudest achievements. Disney was not afraid of magic, of science, or art or of evil. He was heavily involved in the production of Fantasia. At one time, the Pastoral sequence had all the centaurettes topless, the Hayes board made him drape their breasts.

 

[crisi]

I have a friend who always like to say that Walt must have really hated his mom because many of the movies have the moms die and the kids are raised alone, with dad or an evil step mom.

That isn't a Disney thing, its a children's literature thing. Orphans or half orphans are a huge part of kids literature - The Grimm fairy tales were making great use of the evil stepmother long before Disney. From Snow White to the Little Matchgirl to Oliver Twist to Tom Sawyer and Anne of Greene Gables. Being an orphan gives a kid loss of protection and the power to control their destiny in one easy plot device.

 

[twob4him]

First, the Fastamic show and the Fantasia movie are two different things. Fantasmic does take peices from Fantasia (Sorcerer Mickey in particular), and IS dark and IS overwhelming for a lot of small children. Good triumphs over evil in the end, but never forever......

Fantasia is a movie about the interpretation of music. Disney considered it one of his proudest achievements. Disney was not afraid of magic, of science, or art or of evil. He was heavily involved in the production of Fantasia. At one time, the Pastoral sequence had all the centaurettes topless, the Hayes board made him drape their breasts.

Wow I never knew that...its funny cause it seems on one hand, Walt wants everything nice and peaceful and perfect...I remember seeing his "vision for a future" city on view when you ride the People Mover in MK. Everything is beautiful and tidy. On the other hand, you see here he is "not afraid" of the evil side. And as you said, it is a good literary device to use "orphaning" to move the plot along. Well, thanks so much for your input....

I know what you're saying - there's something more dark about Fantasia. It scared the bejeezus out of me when I was little and I'm still creeped out by it today. I could do without the Spectromagic parts featuring the Fantasia characters, but that's just me.

From what I understand it is exactly what it was meant to be - a story created for adults more so than children.

Oh dear....I just saw Spectromagic too...I don't remember any creepy figures...I will have to pay attention now that I know a bit more about it. I am just very dissappointed.




I am going to go out on a limb here and assume Disney was not a christian? Do you know? Anyone?

 

[crisi]

Wow I never knew that...its funny cause it seems on one hand, Walt wants everything nice and peaceful and perfect...I remember seeing his "vision for a future" city on view when you ride the People Mover in MK. Everything is beautiful and tidy. On the other hand, you see here he is "not afraid" of the evil side. And as you said, it is a good literary device to use "orphaning" to move the plot along. Well, thanks so much for your input....

Walt Disney was a much more complex individidual than you give him credit for.

Disney was a Methodist - IIRC - let me check though. Nope - Congregationalist.

 

[okeydokey]

I enjoy Fantasia, I think it is visually beautiful. And since earth is millions of years old, that part doesn't bother me either.

 

[cinderwannabe]

Ok I feel kinda "lost" (for lack of better/more colorful words). I NEVER realized the connection between Fantasmic and Fantasia! DUH!!!

 

[daleswife]

Wow I never knew that...its funny cause it seems on one hand, Walt wants everything nice and peaceful and perfect...I remember seeing his "vision for a future" city on view when you ride the People Mover in MK. Everything is beautiful and tidy. On the other hand, you see here he is "not afraid" of the evil side. And as you said, it is a good literary device to use "orphaning" to move the plot along. Well, thanks so much for your input....


Oh dear....I just saw Spectromagic too...I don't remember any creepy figures...I will have to pay attention now that I know a bit more about it. I am just very dissappointed.




I am going to go out on a limb here and assume Disney was not a christian? Do you know? Anyone?

Found this on http://www.disneylies.com/legends/waltdisney.html

Walt Disney was a Christian and a bit of a conservative one at that. In fact, when Disneyland first opened, he didn't even allow blatant Satanists into the park.

 

[maddiesmom0116]

No worries - we should all be able to voice out opinion.
I have always disliked fantasia- it is long and creepy. Walt Disney's original rabbit he had drawn for Warner Bros ( I think)was a dark character also. I think a little of that creative voice was left over when he did Fantasia. Fantasmic doesn't really focus on all of that though in my opinion, touches on it but it is so much more. I like Fantasmic, but cannot sit through 5 minutes of Fantasia.

 

[Sandy321]

Its Oswald the Rabbit, and Disney just got the rights back (we took the Mickey's Milestone's Tour - for ages 12 and up I think) anyway from Wiki

Oswald was introduced in 1927 after Disney’s series of Alice Comedies had run its course. Disney signed a new contract with Universal Studios head Carl Laemmle where he would produce a series of cartoons for Charles B. Mintz and George Winkler. The first Oswald cartoon, Poor Papa, was rejected by the Universal studio heads due to poor production quality and the sloppiness and age of Oswald. After this, Disney, together with Ub Iwerks, created a second cartoon called Trolley Troubles featuring a much younger, neater Oswald. The short officially launched the series and proved to be Disney’s greatest success yet.

A few of Oswald’s adventures dealt with humour related to the procreative abilities of his species, as illustrated in the episode description of Poor Papa: “Oswald gets a visit from the stork... again and again and again. He has to resort to a variety of strategies to stop the continual flow of babies.” Trolley Troubles also showed Oswald surrounded by numerous baby rabbits, this time heckling him while on the job. Other cartoons, however, generally placed Oswald in more human-type conditions and situations.

In spring 1928, with the series going strong, Disney asked Mintz for an increase in the budget. But Mintz instead demanded that Walt take a 20 percent budget cut, and as leverage, he reminded Disney that Mintz owned the character, and revealed that he had already signed most of Disney’s current employees to his new contract: Iwerks and Les Clark were among the few who remained loyal to Walt. Disney refused Mintz’s demand, disassociating himself from Oswald after the series first season. While finishing the remaining Oswald cartoons, Disney, Iwerks and Clark created the cartoon hero who would become The Walt Disney Company’s lasting symbol: Mickey Mouse, the most famous of Walt Disney’s characters.

We love Fantasia as well as Fantasmic, the music is amazing - and I agree it can be frightening to small children - it is intense (but as far as the evil theme, that's in WISHES also, just not as intense as F! imo)

 

[Tnkrbelle565]

Hey Cathy!

You can watch Fantasmic on YouTube if you want to try it out before your trip. All the Disney shows/rides/parades/parties, etc are on YouTube.

 

[pepperderr]

I may have seen Fantasia but I too agree it was not what I expected. We went to WDW for the first time as a family last year. My son's were 8 and 4. My 4yo was scared most of the time until he said he killed the witch then he was ok. For me it was nice to say I went and saw it but I did not enjoy it like I expected. The music and special effects were good of course but otherwise I didn't like the show. We are going back next year and I am not planning on us going back to see Fantasmic again. We would rather do other stuff with our time now that we already saw it. Honestly, I think that was my least favorite part of being at Disney Wolrd last year.

PEPPERDERR

 

[crisi]

Its Oswald the Rabbit, and Disney just got the rights back (we took the Mickey's Milestone's Tour - for ages 12 and up I think) anyway from Wiki

When Disney and Warner fell out over Oswald, Disney created Mickey Mouse and Warner created Bugs Bunny. If you watch old Oswald cartoons he kind of is the love child of Mickey and Bugs, with a little Donald thrown in for good measure.

 

[lntsmom]

Hm...okay, Fantasia was an attempt to use classical music as a source of inspiration for the cartoons that went with them. Obviously, A Night on Witch Mountain wouldn't be about fairies and rainbows. Chernabog is an amazing creation. I never saw any of the pieces as glorifying evil...it seems to me they are simply recognizing it.

As for the Sorcerer's Apprentice, while the theme may be magic, it's actually a nice little moral lesson for children: do what your elders tell you to do or there will be immediate and horrific results.

Did you notice there's also the Ave Maria??? And much silliness...hippos and alligators and mushrooms and all?

I think they chose evocative pieces of music and went where the music led them.

 

[maxiesmom]

I think they chose evocative pieces of music and went where the music led them.

I agree!

I wouldn't try and read too much into it. Hopefully it isn't the whole "magic" thing causing you concern, because Disney World is full of magic!

 

[kgle]

I guess I must be lost...how does "the Earth is millions of years old" and evolution equate to evil?

 

[twob4him]

Thank you all for such nice comments!!!! I was afraid I would come home and find all kinds of stuff! I laughed reading that "Disney Urban Legend" page....but I am glad about Walt Disney...I think I can sleep tonight now!