Equal Marriage Supporters

[smartestnumber5]

No son, this is a SNAP:



Good to see ya, Rich.

And smartestnumber.

I actually thought you were referring to me as "Rich" for a minute. It though--gee, Uncle Remus thinks I'm a guy named Rich--odd.

Then I realized you were talking to two different people!

 

[smartestnumber5]

But we face many of the same issues all over again when it comes to our family. If (again, God forbid) something were to happen to Jen, our foster daughter would be taken back into state custody and placed into another foster home. I’m not licensed, so she couldn’t stay with me. If our foster daughter needed to be hospitalized for some reason, I could be denied visitation with her.

GF and I are thinking we will likely go the foster/adopt route when it comes to having kids as well, and this is the thing that is most scary to me. I mean the lack of social recognition, and 1000+ federal benefits we're not entitled to, that all is horrific. But in some sense it's just money, it's just a house, it's just social respect. But to think that one has no legal claim to one's child--and what that could mean if something happened to the other partner, or if the other partner decided to take the child away--that's just unfathomable.

I know there is a case in MI that really hasn't gotten much attention at all (I know there is another that I think went to the VA supreme court over a couple who had married in MA before they had children and I believe the fact of their marriage actually helped the non-birth mom when it came to her legal rights to the kids even in VA where the marriage is not recognized.) I've only seen a few reports of it in gay newspapers. But the case apparently is that the couple (two women) had been together for years and had two children and the bio-mom one day decided to end the relationship and just took the kid away. The non-bio-mom took her to court and it became this huge court battle. Meanwhile, bio-mom began suffering mental problems and ended up in a mental health facility for awhile. One of the courts allowed the non-bio-mom to have the kids at this time. But bio-mom was released from the mental health facility and a higher court sided with her, pointing out that the non-bio-mom had no legal rights to the kids as there is no 2nd parent adoption in MI. So as of now bio mom has the kids and non-bio-mom has no idea where they are and has not seen or heard from them in years.

It's just sickening. And it's really sickening to think how many people don't even have one bit of sympathy over this. I know there have been posters on other DIS threads who, when told about the legal situation of same-sex couples in relation to their children basically just shrugged and said "Yeah well my spouse and I would have to jump through a lot of hoops to adopt kids too." As if it's the same--as if their spouse might just walk away with the kids and deny them all contact and have every legal right to do so. The lack of compassion some people have is just absolutely staggering.

 

[DVC~OKW~96]

Yes, there are legal things that same gendered couples can do to try and approximate some of the rights of marriage, but as we've seen those are woefully lacking when it comes to be honored, and even acknowledged.

The article just posted by Uncle Remus about the family that was kept away from their partner/parent here in Florida even with the proper documents shows us that.

A health care surrogate paper is not going to suffice if the hospital staff choose to ignore that directive.

With regard to children, here in Florida gay folk can act as foster parents, but (although I've read differently recently, but cannot confirm) cannot legally adopt. That makes so much sense, eh?

 

[PghLybrt]

http://www.whiteknot.org/

 

[Uncle Remus]

I actually thought you were referring to me as "Rich" for a minute. It though--gee, Uncle Remus thinks I'm a guy named Rich--odd.

Then I realized you were talking to two different people!

Let's have another laugh:
It's All Because (The Gays Are Getting Married)

 

[Micca]

Sounds good to me. As if it's not hard enough to find someone to love you for the rest of your life, you're supposed to eliminate half the poplulation????

 

[DVC~OKW~96]

That was an alternately funny and bitter video, Uncle Remus. I understand the satire, but it was all to close to the way things really seem to be (point of view of some people).

How really is it that any two people who marry affect any other two people who are married? I can't get my mind around that one. How is it exactly that two people marrying threaten the sanctity of any other marriage (that is allowed to be dissolved in divorce, that is allowed to last for no more than ohhhhh, 54 hours, that is allowed to be repeated unlimitless times)? How is it that the sanctity of those types of unions are violated by any two other people joining in the same union?

Not too sure what you are saying Micca?

 

[Micca]

I'm sayin' it's all good. No problem, live & let live, c'est la vie, viva la vida,
three caballeros, etc.

 

[DVC~OKW~96]

Ah. Thanks.

 

[dwheatl]

How really is it that any two people who marry affect any other two people who are married? I can't get my mind around that one. How is it exactly that two people marrying threaten the sanctity of any other marriage (that is allowed to be dissolved in divorce, that is allowed to last for no more than ohhhhh, 54 hours, that is allowed to be repeated unlimitless times)? How is it that the sanctity of those types of unions are violated by any two other people joining in the same union?

Just popping back in to say that I really do believe that two people marrying does affect other married people. When you see a couple who has stuck it out for fifty years or more, and your own spouse is making you nuts, you can be inspired to hang in there too. When divorces are common, some don't take a lifetime commitment as seriously, and are therefore more likely to divorce. But to me, that is one more argument for equal marriage. IMHO, if a couple is marrying out of love and devotion, not just because it's what is expected of them (or because it's the thing to do when you're drunk and in Vegas, God forbid), then they have the potential to inspire my marriage, regardless of whether that couple consists of two men, two women, or a man and a woman.

 

[DVC~OKW~96]

Inspiration is one thing, and that can be found in many aspects of life. That we can respect and perhaps even revere long term marriages is one thing, but I do not agree that that particular marriage directly effects one's own.

Their marriage has no bearing on another. We can choose to emulate, or allow ourselves to be disheartened by divorce after divorce, but our own marriage is a matter of our own hard work and dedication.

Subtle difference in what each of us is saying, perhaps but as one half of a same gendered couple who have stayed together for years, we've done the work ourselves. We have no real role models because marriage between same gendered couples has not been allowed long enough for there to be any!

Are there opposite gendered couples? Sure. My parents for example, but to me that is not the same thing at all. The factors that keep them together do not apply across the board to those factors that keep us together (or make it very hard in some ways for us to stay together- I'm talking about social pressures, not relational ones).

So, all that to say that although I agree with your concept of inspiration, I do not take that far enough to call it a direct effect on any other relationship.

Interesting conversation, eh?

 

[DVC~OKW~96]

Sometimes, things do work out well. This is an example of how being involved and voicing your displeasure at hate based lies being used as propaganda can result in those lies being quashed, at least on one level. This from an HRC email this morning:


Michigan Television Station Pulls Misleading AFA Program Following Announcement of National Action Alert By Human Rights Campaign
Station manager releases statement: "The Offer is now off the table."

WASHINGTON – The Human Rights Campaign, the nation's largest lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender civil rights organization, today issued a national action alert against the American Family Association's (AFA) one-hour television special called "Speechless: Silencing Christians," which is promoted to "reveal the truth about the radical homosexual agenda and its impact on the family, the nation and religious freedom." Within an hour of that action alert announcement, the Grand Rapids, MI station which had planned to air the deceptive programming rescinded that offer.

WOOD-TV General Manager Diane Kniowski posted the following announcement just before 4 p.m. saying it would not run the AFA paid 60-minute program on Saturday as planned:

"We made a gesture of the 2-3 p.m. Saturday time period. It's been 24 hours and we had no response," Kniowski said. "Our station is being bombarded with calls and messages, and we find ourselves in the middle of someone else's fight. Ours was a fair offer and we are removing ourselves from this matter."

The HRC alert urged members to contact the station and ask that they pull the scheduled program and instead air a fair discussion or debate on both the issues and pending legislation.

"I am so proud of our members who answered the lies and distortions of the AFA and stopped this campaign of hate and deception," said Human Rights Campaign President Joe Solmonese. "Our community stood up and would not let those lies stand."

"This should be our wake up call. We are poised to make real progress, for the first time, for millions of LGBT Americans. We know it and so do our opponents," added Solmonese. "We must stand guard and not allow them to stop these overdue, basic protections by rolling out the same, tired script albeit in new packaging. Today's action proves we have the voices and the power to demand a fair fight and a fair debate.".

The AFA program which is still viewable online and may run in other markets, is hosted by controversial talk show host Janet Parshall, who in 2006, suggested Matthew Shepard's lifestyle was responsible for his murder and called gay adoption "state-sanctioned child abuse." (CNN's Larry King Live, Jan. 17, 2006) In the new AFA program, the AFA and its allies purposely promote lies and distortions.

The Human Rights Campaign Foundation is America's largest civil rights organization working to achieve lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender equality. By inspiring and engaging all Americans, HRC strives to end discrimination against LGBT citizens and realize a nation that achieves fundamental fairness and equality for all.

 

[bicker]

Unfortunately, the diatribe was broadcast here in Boston yesterday. I saw a few seconds of it as I was rifling through the channels. (I didn't know what it was at the time.)

 

[DVC~OKW~96]

Good heavens! One place gets a sudden burst of social responsibility and the one place you'd expect to not have to worry about lets it air.

Thanks for letting us know that Bicker.

 

[bicker]

Take heart... if I recall correctly, it was on one of those new-fangled digital sub-channels. Like channel 68-4 or something like that. Still, it was broadcast, and because it was digital, not snowy at all.

 

[DVC~OKW~96]

I find it interesting. I wonder how many other places had it broadcast?

I'm a total dunce when it comes to air time/channels, etc. so your statement doesn't really mean anything to me. Sorry! LOL. (Regarding the channel on which the show was broadcast).

 

[bicker]

I find it interesting. I wonder how many other places had it broadcast?

I'm a total dunce when it comes to air time/channels, etc. so your statement doesn't really mean anything to me. Sorry! LOL. (Regarding the channel on which the show was broadcast).

This is part of the new, digital reality (the fruition of which was just delayed until June 12). Rather than cluttering this thread with an explanation, I have posted an explanation in a more relevant thread. Here's a link:

http://www.disboards.com/showpost.php?p=30244807&postcount=2

 

[PeterPan09]

Sometimes, things do work out well. This is an example of how being involved and voicing your displeasure at hate based lies being used as propaganda can result in those lies being quashed, at least on one level. This from an HRC email this morning:


Michigan Television Station Pulls Misleading AFA Program Following Announcement of National Action Alert By Human Rights Campaign
Station manager releases statement: "The Offer is now off the table."

WASHINGTON – The Human Rights Campaign, the nation's largest lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender civil rights organization, today issued a national action alert against the American Family Association's (AFA) one-hour television special called "Speechless: Silencing Christians," which is promoted to "reveal the truth about the radical homosexual agenda and its impact on the family, the nation and religious freedom." Within an hour of that action alert announcement, the Grand Rapids, MI station which had planned to air the deceptive programming rescinded that offer.

WOOD-TV General Manager Diane Kniowski posted the following announcement just before 4 p.m. saying it would not run the AFA paid 60-minute program on Saturday as planned:

"We made a gesture of the 2-3 p.m. Saturday time period. It's been 24 hours and we had no response," Kniowski said. "Our station is being bombarded with calls and messages, and we find ourselves in the middle of someone else's fight. Ours was a fair offer and we are removing ourselves from this matter."

The HRC alert urged members to contact the station and ask that they pull the scheduled program and instead air a fair discussion or debate on both the issues and pending legislation.

"I am so proud of our members who answered the lies and distortions of the AFA and stopped this campaign of hate and deception," said Human Rights Campaign President Joe Solmonese. "Our community stood up and would not let those lies stand."

"This should be our wake up call. We are poised to make real progress, for the first time, for millions of LGBT Americans. We know it and so do our opponents," added Solmonese. "We must stand guard and not allow them to stop these overdue, basic protections by rolling out the same, tired script albeit in new packaging. Today's action proves we have the voices and the power to demand a fair fight and a fair debate.".

The AFA program which is still viewable online and may run in other markets, is hosted by controversial talk show host Janet Parshall, who in 2006, suggested Matthew Shepard's lifestyle was responsible for his murder and called gay adoption "state-sanctioned child abuse." (CNN's Larry King Live, Jan. 17, 2006) In the new AFA program, the AFA and its allies purposely promote lies and distortions.

The Human Rights Campaign Foundation is America's largest civil rights organization working to achieve lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender equality. By inspiring and engaging all Americans, HRC strives to end discrimination against LGBT citizens and realize a nation that achieves fundamental fairness and equality for all.

COOL. I got the email about that yesterday and forwarded it to my nearest and dearest.

It's nice to see that it worked at least in one market. The fact that some station still showed it is just a reminder that we still have work to do.

 

[DVC~OKW~96]

Good point! Just because there was success in one area, does not mean that the entire "project" was successful. Keep on, one step at a time, eh?

Thanks Bicker. I'll have a look.

 

[PeterPan09]

Good point! Just because there was success in one area, does not mean that the entire "project" was successful. Keep on, one step at a time, eh?

Thanks Bicker. I'll have a look.

You'll have to forgive my relentless optimism. I just saw "Milk" recently and my passion for the fight for justice has been re-ignited.