End of paper fps on jan 22 nd?

[pilferk]

Talked to three different cms in the parks today. All 3 said Epcot and dhs eliminate paper/ legacy fastpasses on jan 22nd. Anyone else hear this?

 

[morethananyonex]

Haven't seen a specific date yet, but did read somewhere that Epcot and DHS were expected to eliminate FP- by the end of the month.

Can't tell you whether it's true or not, but it is very believable.

 

[Fire14]

Figures day I check in! I'm fine with it but just bummed at sametime.

 

[DRDISNEYMD]

Talked to three different cms in the parks today. All 3 said Epcot and dhs eliminate paper/ legacy fastpasses on jan 22nd. Anyone else hear this?

~Great news! This is the first time I've ever heard this. For me, the sooner the better!

~We're commandos who are among the first to arrive at the parks and almost the last to leave! We used ridemax, touring plans, and pulled a lot of FP's to maximize our touring.

~We don't miss Legacy FP one bit. We haven't park hopped in years because we would run around all day from fastpass machine to fastpass machine until all of the fastpasses ran out around noon. Then we redeemed some of those FP's much later the evening and gave our unused fp's away -- so park hopping made no sense for us. I'm so glad we don't have to do that anymore.

~For us, it's so much easier to tour the parks now and we accomplish way more than we used to. And, I'm seriously thinking about park hopping once again. We can't wait to get back to Disney and I'm having so much fun planning our next vacation at Disney World!

 

[pilferk]

Figures day I check in! I'm fine with it but just bummed at sametime.

Before you worry...I'd wait for confirmation. Could just be the rumor du jour...that's why I asked if anyone else has heard those dates.

 

[taterheads]

Talked to three different cms in the parks today. All 3 said Epcot and dhs eliminate paper/ legacy fastpasses on jan 22nd. Anyone else hear this?

I hadn't heard those date but I have heard by the end of January.

 

[quest4dl]

I hope it's soon. I don't like this in-between phase of not knowing what the system will look like. We arrive in late March and hopefully one system will be in place for a couple of weeks.

 

[rteetz]

I've been hearing a lot of rumors that at least by jan 31st legacy FP would be done in all parks.

 

[ToyStoryMania1]

I for one am not really going to miss the paper machines. They were a bit of a nuisance. My only fear is since resort guests will get to reserve months in advance, does that mean out of resort guests might not have the option for same-day reservations on the more popular rides like Space Mountain, Soarin, Test Track, Toy Story Mania (my favorite) and Peter Pan's Flight?

My hope is that with the new system it may cut down on wait times and redistribute people to other places of the park. It would be nice to have slightly shorter wait times without need for fast passes.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

My only fear is since resort guests will get to reserve months in advance, does that mean out of resort guests might not have the option for same-day reservations on the more popular rides like Space Mountain, Soarin, Test Track, Toy Story Mania (my favorite) and Peter Pan's Flight?

My instinct is that's EXACTLY what it means...
Which means you'll have to book a very overpriced room or be eliminated.

The reason? Because you are giving them "all" your money.

Don't think they'll try it, do ya?

 

[lockedoutlogic]

I'm really Having a hard time processing this...


Are they seriously going to go to a Max 3 system... Some parks "tiered"...after 15 years of fastpass with no real rollout?

During busy times this will be utter chaos...it would be resetting the clock to 1998... With basically the same amounts of attractions...after 16 years of statistical increases in traffic?

What on earth is that gonna look like? People that are used to minimal lines are going to accept mandatory 20-30 minute waits for dark rides that are decades old because the crowds will be squeezed outward from the e-tickets? And everybody will be paying more for these now ( much more)? And that will put them in a "better" mood to shop?

That's the goal...this plan works? I keep waiting for the other shoe to drop...the part that pulls the whole initiative together and makes sense...but it's not happening...

Is the corporate idea to force you to book a room and details 6 months in advance... But actually give you less for what you pay?

There has to be something else... Right? The stock price is strong enough for this... But the parks are not. Wdw hadn't been Invested in enough during Iger's tenure. No way. Fools.

Wdw customers are spineless...but even this might break the golden damn.

I'm very confused.

 

[ToyStoryMania1]

So I am going in April. Unfortunately being a teacher I have the same breaks and availability to go as the rest of the nations youth. I will see how it stands up then.

Lucky for me I have a friend who has a vacation home in Celebration I use when I'm down there. But being that I don't stay at resorts it is troublesome.

 

[mcd2745]

I'm really Having a hard time processing this...


Are they seriously going to go to a Max 3 system... Some parks "tiered"...after 15 years of fastpass with no real rollout?

During busy times this will be utter chaos...it would be resetting the clock to 1998... With basically the same amounts of attractions...after 16 years of statistical increases in traffic?

What on earth is that gonna look like? People that are used to minimal lines are going to accept mandatory 20-30 minute waits for dark rides that are decades old because the crowds will be squeezed outward from the e-tickets? And everybody will be paying more for these now ( much more)? And that will put them in a "better" mood to shop?

That's the goal...this plan works? I keep waiting for the other shoe to drop...the part that pulls the whole initiative together and makes sense...but it's not happening...

Is the corporate idea to force you to book a room and details 6 months in advance... But actually give you less for what you pay?

There has to be something else... Right? The stock price is strong enough for this... But the parks are not. Wdw hadn't been Invested in enough during Iger's tenure. No way. Fools.

Wdw customers are spineless...but even this might break the golden damn.

I'm very confused.

Yeah...it doesn't quite add up for me either.

Everyone generally agrees that the whole idea of all this is to extract as much money as possible from every guest. I don't have a problem with that. It's up to me to make the choices that let that happen or not.

However, clearly they're not going to extract more money than they used to at the snack carts and gifts shops, etc. if guests are waiting in lines more than they used to. Even the emptiest of empty suits had to know this.

Still seems like something's missing from the equation. Hopefully, it starts to gain more clarity after legacy FP is gone completely and only the new system is in place.

 

[Neesy228]

I'm really Having a hard time processing this... Are they seriously going to go to a Max 3 system... Some parks "tiered"...after 15 years of fastpass with no real rollout? During busy times this will be utter chaos...it would be resetting the clock to 1998... With basically the same amounts of attractions...after 16 years of statistical increases in traffic? What on earth is that gonna look like? People that are used to minimal lines are going to accept mandatory 20-30 minute waits for dark rides that are decades old because the crowds will be squeezed outward from the e-tickets? And everybody will be paying more for these now ( much more)? And that will put them in a "better" mood to shop? That's the goal...this plan works? I keep waiting for the other shoe to drop...the part that pulls the whole initiative together and makes sense...but it's not happening... Is the corporate idea to force you to book a room and details 6 months in advance... But actually give you less for what you pay? There has to be something else... Right? The stock price is strong enough for this... But the parks are not. Wdw hadn't been Invested in enough during Iger's tenure. No way. Fools. Wdw customers are spineless...but even this might break the golden damn. I'm very confused.

I hear ya, and totally agree. This is all very disappointing to me, and quite frankly, makes me a little sad. Unless things evolve, my trip for the Princess Half Marathon (next month) will be my last for quite a while.

And so we can move the thread back to the original question: yes, I've heard that all legacy FP machines will be gone by "the end of January" according to my TA.

 

[usnuzuloose]

It sounds like the longer the lines, the more it pushes others to shop and eat more. I believe that is their goal. With the bands they know where you are and how much you are spending, That is also their goal. They don't want you to go any where else. They want your money, and the band is the way to achieve this and you may not realize how much you spent.

It would not surprise me at some point they won't allow people to bring in any type of foods or snacks. But that is a whole different thread. I have only been to WDW once. But their costs force me not to be able to afford it. I live on the west coast. And no , I will not visit DL.

 

[Borishack]

I'm really Having a hard time processing this...


Are they seriously going to go to a Max 3 system... Some parks "tiered"...after 15 years of fastpass with no real rollout?

During busy times this will be utter chaos...it would be resetting the clock to 1998... With basically the same amounts of attractions...after 16 years of statistical increases in traffic?

What on earth is that gonna look like? People that are used to minimal lines are going to accept mandatory 20-30 minute waits for dark rides that are decades old because the crowds will be squeezed outward from the e-tickets? And everybody will be paying more for these now ( much more)? And that will put them in a "better" mood to shop?

That's the goal...this plan works? I keep waiting for the other shoe to drop...the part that pulls the whole initiative together and makes sense...but it's not happening...

Is the corporate idea to force you to book a room and details 6 months in advance... But actually give you less for what you pay?

There has to be something else... Right? The stock price is strong enough for this... But the parks are not. Wdw hadn't been Invested in enough during Iger's tenure. No way. Fools.

Wdw customers are spineless...but even this might break the golden damn.

I'm very confused.

No, you're not confused and make excellent points. As you put, Magic+ -- which is being touted by Disney and certain sheep as the second coming of customer centricity is boiling down to pay more, get less.

 

[rteetz]

Just saw it reported by several sources on twitter that DHS will turn to FP+ on January 20th. Epcot is also supposed to be this week as well meaning everyone will be on fp+ legacy fp will be a thing of the past.

 

[tjkraz]

IMy only fear is since resort guests will get to reserve months in advance, does that mean out of resort guests might not have the option for same-day reservations on the more popular rides like Space Mountain, Soarin, Test Track, Toy Story Mania (my favorite) and Peter Pan's Flight?

In most cases, yes, same-day reservations will be very do-able. That's why the tiers exist--at least at Epcot and DHS. Attractions like Toy Story Mania, Test Track and Soarin don't have the daily rider capacity for all guests to be able to ride. The tiers force guests to choose between those--and several other options--most often leaving each at less than full capacity.

Are they seriously going to go to a Max 3 system... Some parks "tiered"...after 15 years of fastpass with no real rollout?

During busy times this will be utter chaos...

Busy times already ARE utter chaos. Try to get a FastPass after noon on a busy day and for many attractions are either out of FPs or the return times are 6-8 hours away. With FP+, before even arriving you can lock-in 3 attractions at times of your choice without having to run around grabbing paper tickets.

People that are used to minimal lines are going to accept mandatory 20-30 minute waits for dark rides that are decades old because the crowds will be squeezed outward from the e-tickets?

Not really sure what you're getting at here. Attraction capacities aren't changing. POTC and HM will still gobble-up 2500-3000 guests per hour. Space Mountain, Splash, Big Thunder...they'll still accommodate the same number of riders they always have.

If anything, I think there may be some modest increase in standby line usage due to the limit of 3 FPs per guest. But that increase will be largely offset by time saved not dashing around to collect FP tickets and time no longer spent criss-crossing parks as the day revolves around uncertain FP return times. And many attractions will likely distribute fewer FPs (due to the 3 per guest limit) which results in faster-moving standby lines.

And that will put them in a "better" mood to shop?

That's the goal...this plan works? I keep waiting for the other shoe to drop...the part that pulls the whole initiative together and makes sense...but it's not happening...

I agree...there does still seem to be some missing piece. With regard to shopping, we've all heard the line that FastPass was originally created to entice guests to spend more money by shopping or dining while waiting for ride times.

But I've often heard that this never really happened...that sales didn't spike after FP introduction...that guests mostly used those FP windows to ride other attractions via standby. Don't really know which version of that story is true though.

But consider this...one of the biggest complaints about the parks these days is that they are getting "more and more crowded." Well, one of the easiest ways to ease that crowding--or at least the appearance of it--is to get a few more people into the Standby lines. Crowds are something of an illusion because they're based upon what people see on park pathways and in shops. Consider what the original FP system was doing to "crowds" as people waited for their ride times. It creates more foot traffic (again, criss-crossing the parks to first grab the FP tickets and then to ride), you have more people sitting on benches, leaning against walls and camping-out at restaurant tables while waiting for their ride times. Shops were stuffed with browsers killing time.

We used FP+ last month and it worked exactly as advertised. We picked our rides about 2 weeks in advance. Ended up making a single loop around each park (used it at MK and DHS), hitting our scheduled rides and filling-in with others that had short waits.

Honestly FP+ is everything I hoped it would be. (Although I wouldn't mind them raising the daily limit to 4 or 5 FPs.) It allowed us to make more efficient use of our time. We did everything we wanted to do, but in less time than without FP.

That said, I do keep waiting for the other shoe to drop, and some clear means of monetizing the system to appear. Perhaps it will be more FPs for Disney hotel guests (higher occupancy, eventually higher rates.) Perhaps they will offer some paid tier with more than 3 FPs per day. Whatever the case, it does seem like there's still an element missing.

 

[Borishack]

That said, I do keep waiting for the other shoe to drop, and some clear means of monetizing the system to appear. Perhaps it will be more FPs for Disney hotel guests (higher occupancy, eventually higher rates.) Perhaps they will offer some paid tier with more than 3 FPs per day. Whatever the case, it does seem like there's still an element missing.

I can readily see the scenario:

Magic+ is planned, with an end phase that involves some form of pay for play. That will likely involve giving the most profitable guests -- read on site in deluxe and/or concierge level accomodations -- more attraction access. It's entirely possible this could be tiered, with "silver/gold/platinum" levels depending on just how proftable a given guest is.

It's also possible Disney may have decided -- as Universal does -- to allow a controlled number of people "off the street" to purchase diluted versions of upgraded access.

As the plans evolve, internal debates start up about when and how to roll out that end phase. Said debates revolve around how to best "soften the blow" that Disney is in essence canning Walt's original philiosophy that the parks would always be 100% egalitarian.

And as one almost always see in these situations in large, bureaucratic organizations, the resolution on that....is to procrastinate on making a decison for as long as possible. Disney will consequently wait until the absolute 11th hour before letting that other shoe drop.

And when they finally do, it will still end up being a P.R. disaster.

 

[tjkraz]

...Disney is in essence canning Walt's original philiosophy that the parks would always be 100% egalitarian.

Walt required guests to buy tickets for every attraction. More money = more tickets = more rides. The parks were more elitist in Walt's day, before the phase-out of ride tickets in the 80s.

As for the final form this will take...time will tell. I could spend all day theorizing the who / what / when / where / why / how. Not worth the effort.

And when they finally do, it will still end up being a P.R. disaster.

Depends on the audience. Die-hard park guests who have spent hundreds of hours reading guidebooks and websites to learn how to "game" the legacy FP system may not be happy. But over the years countless guests have walked out of the Disney parks, vowing never to return due to their inability to navigate the crowds.

On New Year's Eve we saw 4 hour standby times for Soarin and even hour-long waits for Haunted Mansion. It's commonplace for guests to line-up for Fantasmic or a parade 1-2 hours before the event. TSM FastPasses require guests to walk all the way to the rear of the park, wait in line 10...15...20 minutes, and they're often gone well before noon. Lines for character meets are often close to an hour, even on slow days.

I see tremendous value in a system which allows guests to GUARANTEE rides, shows or fireworks / parade viewing for 3 events per day--at a time of their choosing--before ever entering the park.