DVC plans to target commercial renters

[Genie+]

 

[Chuck S]

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Either way, with limited availablility rooms, the odds of getting a value studio would be extremely low and there would still be a LOT of home resort owners disappointed, just as there are now. And if they were able to somehow thwart the Commercial Renters by another means, those rooms would still be extremely difficult to book, even during the priority window.

 

[Sandisw]

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Thanks for sharing this…so, since this exists, should DVC consider instituting it for those hard to get rooms like BWV SV and AKV Value and CL that have high levels of demand, walking, and confirmed reservations for rent?

Plenty of owners will still be shut out but would it be a fairer way to handle it for owners?

 

[Genie+]

Thanks for sharing this…so, since this exists, should DVC consider instituting it for those hard to get rooms like BWV SV and AKV Value and CL that have high levels of demand, walking, and confirmed reservations for rent?

Plenty of owners will still be shut out but would it be a fairer way to handle it for owners?

Somebody was stretching scare tactics alluding to losing home priority so figured it would for sure be useful there. Quite a bit of a distortion really, which is not serving any of us well.

 

[Genie+]

You know it really is messed up for moderators to be twisting things.

 

[Chuck S]

You know it really is messed up for moderators to be twisting things.

Remember, I've owned since OKW was the ONLY resort, and the version in our paper word did not include the one month priority for the lottery at that time. Just that everyone had the same chance. And the point is still the same, the "cure" can easily be worse than what we have now.

 

[Sandisw]

You know it really is messed up for moderators to be twisting things.

I don’t think anyone was doing that…I think it’s being honest with the reality of too much demand and not enough rooms…

AKV CL is a prime example…it never shows back up because walking or not, those that get it keep the rooms.

So, the question comes back to whether or not a lottery system or this list would be a good move for DvC since it already exists?

How would some feel about losing their 4 month priority and end up with one? Would those owners feel it is a fair trade off to stop owners from renting or walking those rooms?

 

[Genie+]

So, the question comes back to whether or not a lottery system or this list would be a good move for DvC since it already exists?

I guess ask Chuck. He’s the one who brought up the lottery system with distorted facts.

 

[Sandisw]

I guess ask Chuck. He’s the one who brought up the lottery system with distorted facts.

Actually, I bought it up previously….but let’s not assume adverse motives to anyone here…things change all the time and sometimes the changes are not widely known.

My opinion is that this would be a good thing for DVC to do because it might mean that changes to other booking rules and modifications can be simplified.

 

[Chuck S]

It would certainly be the easiest to implement, as the rules are already published and the lottery had been implemented previously.

 

[Genie+]

The reason that BWV standard and AKV value are frequently mentioned is usually not because are misguided enough to think those categories would not be hard under any circumstance, rather that they make very clear examples at how egregious the effect of spec rentals can be. When as many as 14+ value studios show up for ONE date, and there are 20 or less of that room… it’s a concise example.

 

[Sandisw]

The reason that BWV standard and AKV value are frequently mentioned is usually not because are misguided enough to think those categories would not be hard under any circumstance, rather that they make very clear examples at how egregious the effect of spec rentals can be. When as many as 14+ value studios show up for ONE date, and there are 20 or less of that room… it’s a concise example.

Sure, but who gets them doesn’t matter when we are talking about demand for them.

Spec rentals or not, those rooms would not be meaningfully easier to get for the majority of owners who want them if that stopped.

You’d still have them sold out at seconds after 8 am much of the year…

When there are only a small number of a specific rooms and thousands of owners want them, it’s still going to be highly competitive.

So, these don’t get brought up simply because of commercial renting…they come up because they are low cost rooms that are in high demand by owners at those resorts.

ETA: I started having trouble getting SV studios at BWV in 2016 ish at 11 months when neither spec renting nor walking were a “thing”…

It’s one of the reasons we sold and bought RiV because we were having to take pool/garden all the time.

Obviously it’s worse now, but the issue with getting those cheap rooms started a long time ago.

 

[Genie+]

Sure, but who gets them doesn’t matter when we are talking about demand for them.

Spec rentals or not, those rooms would not be meaningfully easier to get for the majority of owners who want them if that stopped.

You’d still have them sold out at seconds after 8 am much of the year…

When there are only a small number of a specific rooms and thousands of owners want them, it’s still going to be highly competitive.

So, these don’t get brought up simply because of commercial renting…they come up because they are low cost rooms that are in high demand by owners at those resorts.

ETA: I started having trouble getting SV studios at BWV in 2016 ish at 11 months when neither spec renting nor walking were a “thing”…

It’s one of the reasons we sold and bought RiV because we were having to take pool/garden all the time.

Obviously it’s worse now, but the issue with getting those cheap rooms started a long time ago.

I should’ve been more clear… when people bring them up in context of a thread like this discussing commercial renting. It is hard to conclusively prove exactly how commercial and spec rentals impact the membership, though we can see how they target the cream in the system. At least public posting can be counted among these categories to calculate how lopsided for-profit pulls such a high ratio.

 

[Sandisw]

I should’ve been more clear… when people bring them up in context of a thread like this discussing commercial renting. It is hard to conclusively prove exactly how commercial and spec rentals impact the membership, though we can see how they target the cream in the system. At least public posting can be counted among these categories to calculate how lopsided for-profit pulls such a high ratio.

Got it….so, in that regard, wouldn’t a lottery type system or special list help if these are high value rentals?

Even if they stop those owners who are renting a lot, what is going to stop other owners who rent just one reservation a year from grabbing them?

 

[Genie+]

Got it….so, in that regard, wouldn’t a lottery type system or special list help if these are high value rentals?

Even if they stop those owners who are renting a lot, what is going to stop other owners who rent just one reservation a year from grabbing them?

Go for it. Bring on the lottery It’s still in our contract wording so why not.

I’d rather DVC address spec and commercial renting on the whole, where it is quite a different pattern of use and advantages than typical personal use owners.

 

[nalababybear]

Go for it. Bring on the lottery It’s still in our contract wording so why not.

I’d rather DVC address spec and commercial renting on the whole, where it is quite a different pattern of use and advantages than typical personal use owners.

The lottery simply gives everyone an opportunity to rent so it doesn't get monopolized by a few highly motivated professional rentors.
Like queue it for D23.

 

[Sandisw]

Go for it. Bring on the lottery It’s still in our contract wording so why not.

I’d rather DVC address spec and commercial renting on the whole, where it is quite a different pattern of use and advantages than typical personal use owners.

It will be interesting if they add something that prevents owners from confirmed vs on demand renting when an owner is renting occasionally.

I still have my doubts they would or can because prior to CFW, there is language that says the rules should be reasonable, whatever that means.

 

[Sandisw]

The lottery simply gives everyone an opportunity to rent so it doesn't get monopolized by a few highly motivated professional rentors.
Like queue it for D23.

If you read that clause and what DVC could do, it appears you will be given confirmed reservation for the dates you requested and my guess is that you won’t be allowed to change the names, which would eliminate those rooms from becoming rentals.

If you can’t use it, it gets canceled…and those dates go back to someone on the list.

 

[Disfamwa]

I don’t think the special dates will be enough to curtail the problem.

I think certain patterns of rental behavior are obvious (anyone with eyes can easily identify the big offenders on Facebook, so I’m sure DVC could easily see the rental patterns if they wanted to). Normal members occasionally renting out points (whether it’s all their points or lower percentage) likely have rental reservations that look very different from the ones commerical spec renters have.

I encourage people to slowly infiltrate the Facebook groups and screen shot examples of egregious commercial spec rentals by the same group of people and send them to DVC. These low point times/rooms and desirable date spec rentals devalue the program for the rest of us. The argument that they would be booked either way is ridiculous in my mind. Obviously, they would get booked either way, but some unfair advantage is currently being used to book these rooms when the same “impossible to get” room type seem to be easily booked by this group of commercial renters over and over.

 

[Cyberc1978]

I still think we risk a change that will be more in line with cracking a nut with a sledgehammer.

When have Disney ever made a change that was in benefits of the members - I know they say it is, but is it really?

I do however agree that if we can avoid the mega renters, then its a good thing, but if a member rents 5-10 reservations a year, I dont really see that as problem.

And for walking, the system is build on FCFS and if I as a regular member can book BWV standard view and value rooms, so can everyone else. Yes you might need to try more than once, but its doable. Sorry to say but members just have to stop whining and suck it up.

Even if or when Disney introduces a new way or doing things to crack down on mega renters, it wont change the fact that standard views and value rooms will still be hard to get for the majority of time for all members. Members would still be whining because they can't book the hard to get rooms.

If they introduces the lottery for ie christmas week, it wont matter for the majority of owners, because they still wont get the rooms anyway - is it more fair? maybe. With this lottery you can do absolutely nothing to increase your winning chances. If you try to book yourself you can at least increase your chances every time you try to book - you might still fail but your odds are higher than with the lottery.