DVC has stopped returning borrowed points to original use year

[Megster67]

Personally, I think that DVC should come up with a solution that reflects the fact that we are all owners and that effects us all evenly - and not disproportionately impact the people who happened to make reservations during this time. One possibility (although I don’t know if this is feasible under the contract) would be to return all the points affected by the closure - current, banked, and borrowed, to the members’ first use year beginning after the closure is over. In addition, all owners should then lose 1/360th of one years worth of points for each day the resorts are closed in their first use year after the closure is over. That way the points would not be out of balance and we would all, as owners, be impacted equally.

 

[Sandisw]

Personally, I think that DVC should come up with a solution that reflects the fact that we are all owners and that effects us all evenly - and not disproportionately impact the people who happened to make reservations during this time. One possibility (although I don’t know if this is feasible under the contract) would be to return all the points affected by the closure - current, banked, and borrowed, to the members’ first use year beginning after the closure is over. In addition, all owners should then lose 1/360th of one years worth of points for each day the resorts are closed in their first use year after the closure is over. That way the points would not be out of balance and we would all, as owners, be impacted equally.

I think the fact that the newest notice says they are discussing the banked points situation and that of expiring points, leads me to believe they are working behind the scenes to figure out a legal way to help out as many members as they can without crippling the system, making it impossible for owners going forward!,

 

[KAT4DISNEY]

There's a lot of assumptions that the system can't handle all the points but with banking and borrowing there's never a definite number of points in any particular year. As it

Also just got off with member services. My dates are April 11-13. They advised that since "at this time" the resort is not closed for those dates they would be returned to current use year, not the year they were borrowed from. Basically, if they resort isn't closed for your dates, normal rules apply (except for the holding maybe?). No harm in waiting until they officially close and then hope we can get them moved back to the original use year.

Correct - the holding is waived for April cancellations also. Online it still will show a message that the points will go into holding but the system is set up so they will not.

 

[bobbiwoz]

With FL restaurants being take out only through May 8, I think DVC, WDW should be updating their “closed” time so people can make informed choices about their reservations. I have about 300 points in early May reservations, mostly borrowed. That’s a lot of points to have to be used this UY since I already have summer, fall and December plans booked. I will probably be losing some points this year even without having to deal with the rental situation.

My son thinks I should just cancel the May reservations and deal with it, regardless if the parks are opened. That’s what I think I will be doing today. It’s probably too far away for DVC to feel these cancellations are virus related, but thats definitely why I will be canceling. We have elders and immune problems.

 

[Novakm]

Personally, I think that DVC should come up with a solution that reflects the fact that we are all owners and that effects us all evenly - and not disproportionately impact the people who happened to make reservations during this time. One possibility (although I don’t know if this is feasible under the contract) would be to return all the points affected by the closure - current, banked, and borrowed, to the members’ first use year beginning after the closure is over. In addition, all owners should then lose 1/360th of one years worth of points for each day the resorts are closed in their first use year after the closure is over. That way the points would not be out of balance and we would all, as owners, be impacted equally.

I Agree!

What we have here is a situation where there are more points in the system than rooms. It’s as simple as that. Regardless of the reason, you can’t have a solution that impacts only a few owners.

 

[Sandisw]

With FL restaurants being take out only through May 8, I think DVC, WDW should be updating their “closed” time so people can make informed choices about their reservations. I have about 300 points in early May reservations, mostly borrowed. That’s a lot of points to have to be used this UY since I already have summer, fall and December plans booked. I will probably be losing some points this year even without having to deal with the rental situation.

My son thinks I should just cancel the May reservations and deal with it, regardless if the parks are opened. That’s what I think I will be doing today. It’s probably too far away for DVC to feel these cancellations are virus related, but thats definitely why I will be canceling. We have elders and immune problems.

I agree. I have a mid May trip scheduled and not feeling too confident it’s a go,

If the date for restaurants is May 8th, there really is no way for the theme parks open back up. And, I can’t imagine the resort restaurants being able to handle take out only.

 

[Cyberc1978]

With FL restaurants being take out only through May 8, I think DVC, WDW should be updating their “closed” time so people can make informed choices about their reservations. I have about 300 points in early May reservations, mostly borrowed. That’s a lot of points to have to be used this UY since I already have summer, fall and December plans booked. I will probably be losing some points this year even without having to deal with the rental situation.

My son thinks I should just cancel the May reservations and deal with it, regardless if the parks are opened. That’s what I think I will be doing today. It’s probably too far away for DVC to feel these cancellations are virus related, but thats definitely why I will be canceling. We have elders and immune problems.

A sort of simple solution is to allow people to move the points to RCI even with a shorter timeframe than normal.

Those with eligible points can move them to the concierge collection to book regular Disney resorts.

Or they could create a new membership magic option for those eligible.

That way all owner at least have 1 option to use and some members have more options.

 

[Sandisw]

A sort of simple solution is to allow people to move the points to RCI even with a shorter timeframe than normal.

Those with eligible points can move them to the concierge collection to book regular Disney resorts.

Or they could create a new membership magic option for those eligible.

That way all owner at least have 1 option to use and some members have more options.

I would imagine the executives are running Plan B, C, D, etc, based on how long this lasts,

The newest update gives me hope that they are working on a plan for expiring points. I too think allowing all members to use points for Disney collection...waiving the $95 fee.,.would be a great option.

Yes, those charts are high, but better than losing. And since that is an agreement between DVC and Disney resorts division, it would seem it would be an easy solution to get more inventory without violating any timeshare laws,

 

[Cyberc1978]

I Agree!

What we have here is a situation where there are more points in the system than rooms. It’s as simple as that. Regardless of the reason, you can’t have a solution that impacts only a few owners.

That’s also why I think it’s best to keep the policies as they are. Borrowed points keeps being borrowed. If you haven’t banked then too bad. Points in holding or not does not really matters.

That way everyone is treated the same. Owners could have gotten the Disney travelers insurance (don’t know if it even covers this situation)

You can always argue the fairness (or call it something else) if one owner gets an exception today to unborrow points will I get the same 2 years from now if I need to cancel a reservation?

 

[Canadian Girl]

No one could have foreseen a pandemic. This is not the usual cancellation given things are shut down so arguing people should have bought insurance is not helpful. My trip was over Canadian March break, this last week. I can rebook next March but am already wondering if it will be safe even then. I did cancel my Greek cruise in June on the PIF date with a flight penalty. Wondering if I should cancel my November 8 th cruise as well. My 15 year old has lost her enthusiasm for cruising and is refusing to go.

 

[starry_solo]

With FL restaurants being take out only through May 8, I think DVC, WDW should be updating their “closed” time so people can make informed choices about their reservations. I have about 300 points in early May reservations, mostly borrowed. That’s a lot of points to have to be used this UY since I already have summer, fall and December plans booked. I will probably be losing some points this year even without having to deal with the rental situation.

My son thinks I should just cancel the May reservations and deal with it, regardless if the parks are opened. That’s what I think I will be doing today. It’s probably too far away for DVC to feel these cancellations are virus related, but thats definitely why I will be canceling. We have elders and immune problems.

maybe they will let you switch out the points and then bank the newer points?

 

[Cyberc1978]

No one could have foreseen a pandemic. This is not the usual cancellation given things are shut down so arguing people should have bought insurance is not helpful. My trip was over Canadian March break, this last week. I can rebook next March but am already wondering if it will be safe even then. I did cancel my Greek cruise in June on the PIF date with a flight penalty. Wondering if I should cancel my November 8 th cruise as well. My 15 year old has lost her enthusiasm for cruising and is refusing to go.

I agree no one could have foreseen it but nonetheless you get insurance to be covered for the unexpected. Same with your house you get insurance and don’t expect it burn but still some do.

 

[Sandisw]

I agree no one could have foreseen it but nonetheless you get insurance to be covered for the unexpected. Same with your house you get insurance and don’t expect it burn but still some do.

Under normal circumstance, yes, but there are people who have indicated they have insurance, including CFAR insurance but it is still not covering a pandemic.

So, it’s not as simple as that in this situation when a renter did what was advised and is still out. What do we say to them?

But, not really topic of this thread,

 

[Novakm]

That’s also why I think it’s best to keep the policies as they are. Borrowed points keeps being borrowed. If you haven’t banked then too bad. Points in holding or not does not really matters.

So, let me restate what you are proposing:

1) People with reservations this week and April thru July use year lose all thier points, banked, borrowed, and current. And don’t get their vacation.

2) Other people with reservations this week don’t vacation, but get thier points back.

4) People without reservations this week are not affected at all.

There are 2 problems with this. The very small number of owner in group 1 are expected to fix the imbalance while other owners don’t.

The second problem is there are not enough people in group 1 to fix the point imbalance, so DVC will still need to do something else to fix it.

That’s a little like saying only the owners who are at the resort when a hurricane hits are responsible for all the repairs. There’s just not enough people in that group to fix the problem, so why should they take a larger share than others?

 

[Novakm]

You can always argue the fairness (or call it something else) if one owner gets an exception today to unborrow points will I get the same 2 years from now if I need to cancel a reservation?

You should get an exception 2 years from now IF DVC cancels your reservation at the last minute without your permission. If you change your mind, then no.

 

[Sandisw]

So, let me restate what you are proposing:

1) People with reservations this week and April thru July use year lose all thier points, banked, borrowed, and current. And don’t get their vacation.

2) Other people with reservations this week don’t vacation, but get thier points back.

4) People without reservations this week are not affected at all.

There are 2 problems with this. The very small number of owner in group 1 are expected to fix the imbalance while other owners don’t.

The second problem is there are not enough people in group 1 to fix the point imbalance, so DVC will still need to do something else to fix it.

That’s a little like saying only the owners who are at the resort when a hurricane hits are responsible for all the repairs. There’s just not enough people in that group to fix the problem, so why should they take a larger share than others?

Not the same as damage and that being shared, In terms of changes, it goes to the contract, IMO.

The fairest way to have handled this IS to follow the rules and not change them at all other than holding,

Remember, fair isn’t equal. Why should someone whose reason for canceling is happening during this be treated any different than a member who has had another emergency in the past?

We can argue that it’s different because it’s wide spread, but it still comes down to the same thing,

Now, the fact the DVCM has decided to make exception, that was a decision made in the best interest of the members who are wing effected,

The only drawback is that depending on what happens ultimately, if this is long terms, will effect all members, and I guarantee there will be complaints because people will lose points later,

Ive benefited from the change in rules. I may benefit again in May. But honestly, I have concerns that being generous now is going to be a hardship later,

IMO, it could end up a mess for all of us.

 

[Cyberc1978]

So, let me restate what you are proposing:

1) People with reservations this week and April thru July use year lose all thier points, banked, borrowed, and current. And don’t get their vacation.

2) Other people with reservations this week don’t vacation, but get thier points back.

4) People without reservations this week are not affected at all.

There are 2 problems with this. The very small number of owner in group 1 are expected to fix the imbalance while other owners don’t.

The second problem is there are not enough people in group 1 to fix the point imbalance, so DVC will still need to do something else to fix it.

That’s a little like saying only the owners who are at the resort when a hurricane hits are responsible for all the repairs. There’s just not enough people in that group to fix the problem, so why should they take a larger share than others?

1. If people with reservations in April, May or June feel their vacation is in jeopardy that can cancel today and some might be able to bank others might not. I’ll be in this group with a rental reservation in May and points expiring end of May

2. True that’s why I think DVC should keep their current policy in place so everyone is equal.

3. Some will always be impacted while others won’t. When a hurricane hits I don’t think you get to unborrow points but points still don’t go into holding. I will give you while a hurricane will impact for a few days (not accounting for repairs) the virus will most likely impact for weeks or maybe months.

All owners are equal they have the option to get points insurance (assuming they cover this) even if they don’t cover, the virus could last for up to 18 months (that’s maybe a bit overkill) but then people can bank their points NOW. People have the choice, they can’t have the cake and eat it too.

Those that travel at the end of their use year have made a choice doing so. They had additional months and months to use the points but chose not to. Had they planned to use points in the beginning of their UY they would have ample time to still use them.

Whatever DVC decides as a long term solution I hope it won’t put any additional strain on the inventory

 

[LaurenT]

Yes, we heard many reports about that this started Monday. I was successful Friday..though borrowed them back when I booked August.

Maybe, they decided to stop it because they knew it would be overwhelming to the system if it lasts long but are working behind the scenes to come up options that are legally possible?

I just called today. Canceled my April 23 - 30 trip. They returned my points that were borrowed from my Oct 2020 UY and then booked me for Oct 23 - 30 ...
She did need to partner with someone and I sat on hold for a while, but she was great and got it done.

 

[Sandisw]

I just called today. Canceled my April 23 - 30 trip. They returned my points that were borrowed from my Oct 2020 UY and then booked me for Oct 23 - 30 ...
She did need to partner with someone and I sat on hold for a while, but she was great and got it done.

If they are doing this now for late April, I’d say they may have an idea things will stay closed longer.

I am glad it worked out for you!

 

[Cyberc1978]

If they are doing this now for late April, I’d say they may have an idea things will stay closed longer.

I am glad it worked out for you!

maybe CM’ have been told to unborrow until further notice and then maybe all reservations are game.