DSLR owners - Has this happened to anyone else?

[MICKEY88]

If that is the case I agree, the organization should step up and clear people out. I think the original post said the photographer was the one doing the clearing - which I think would cause more problems than if a league official made the request.

if he was smart he would have asked someone else to do it, less chance of a confrontation with parents, and saying something that would hurt your business...

 

[tinksdad]

I've read a fair amount about this lately.

In the case of the organization hiring a professional, or exclusive photographer for events etc., the language of the contract is between the organization and the photographer. It is in essence protecting the photographer from the organization hiring another professional. These contracts are between these two parties (organization and pro), and have nothing to do with you. The professional will often have an issue because, as someone pointed out above, they make a living off the pictures they sell, and therefore want to increase their sales.

From what I understand the only time you would be obligated (not getting into site release / model release issues) to not take pictures is if when you registered your child for the event / sport / etc., a stipulation of the registration is no "pro-level" equipment.

From a practical standpoint, if the pro is using optical flash triggers, there might be a very real reason they don't want you taking pictures - the flash from your camera could trigger their strobes at an unwanted time.

I have always asked the pros if I could take a few pictures - they have almost always said it wasn't a problem, but told me to wait until they directed me to do so.

Please take the above contract stuff in context - I'm not a lawyer and don't pretend to be one.

Great points! The flash thing was something that crossed my mind.

 

[Anewman]

A) I would never shoot over the shoulder of the hired photographer, if he sets up the shot. IMO it becomes his shot, when I want my own shots I will set them up.

B) Dodger stadium has a rule about PRO equipment, the rule is "NO lenses longer than 4 inches". Not a perfect rule, but it is not like all screeners would be able to tell what is pro or not. The rule simplifies it for them.

 

[Belle0101]

I have a PnS (Panasonic DMC...). My sister got camera envy, she always has to one up me, and bought a DSLR (Canon something or other).

My pictures, so far, have always come out better than hers. She just hasn't mastered good skills yet. Not that you'll find my pictures on the cover of any magazines but I'm really pleased with what I've learned. Her having a Pro camera, in and of itself, hasn't guaranteed better pictures. So someone saying that she couldn't take the shot with her DSLR while I could with my PnS would be pointless.

On the few occassions I have taken pictures near a photographer, and it hasn't been often, they've only ever asked me to wait until they're done. And, they've been very pleasant about it.

 

[ducklite]

this would apply for regular events, but if it was a planned photo shoot only, and a contract existed with the photog. then the organization, would be responsible for clearing out people with cameras or losing their photog, yet having to pay if the contract is written properly..

Agreed! I usually carry my DiMage as well if I think there's even a chance that I'll run into this type of a problem.

Anne

 

[ducklite]

the real problem is how do you define professional camera.. on reality very few DSLRs are truely classified as professional.

then you get into another grey area,, there are people with true professional cameras, who take amateur photos, and will tell you they are amateurs..

and there are professionals, who shoot with cameras that are not classified as professional cameras, so in reality the way of dealing with this situation was bizarre

In this case "professional camera" generally means "detachable lens."

Anne

 

[MICKEY88]

In this case "professional camera" generally means "detachable lens."

Anne

that would never stand in a court of law, almost all beginners photography courses recomend an slr with manual settings, does that mean all beginner photographers are professionals....

 

[ducklite]

that would never stand in a court of law, almost all beginners photography courses recomend an slr with manual settings, does that mean all beginner photographers are professionals....

I'm just telling you what most sports/concert venues use as the rule of thumb. Frankly it's their call to let cameras in at all or not, so people should just be happy being able to bring in a camera at all.

In a court of law anyone who tried to sue a venue for not being allowed to bring in a camera would lose.

House of Blues forbids even disposables and will confiscate any found in the venue.

Anne

 

[Ratpack]

I could handle no camera allowed amd have no problems with no lens over X" long allowed. Just don't single out a certain style and label it professional.

Usually professional means something is earning money and I can assure you my camera is not earning any money. Spending money is more like it!!

 

[ducklite]

I could handle no camera allowed amd have no problems with no lens over X" long allowed. Just don't single out a certain style and label it professional.

Personally I have no problem with that classification as far as bringing cameras into venues. There's no way that you can train every goon who collects tickets and does a bag search to diffierentiate otherwise, nor do you want to hold up the lines of 20,000 people trying to get into a venue. It's completely logical.

Anne (Who is off to shoot some band at House of Blues, so night everyone!)

 

[boBQuincy]

It's stupidity. Somone who knows nothing about cameras (or much else) sets up the rules. When asked what defines a "professional" camera they reply "you know, one of those fancy ones".

The "4 inch or less" rule, yet another piece of stupidity. Canon's 70-300 DO is less than 4" (retracted) yet has the reach of a full size 300 mm.

"Detachable lens", same deal.

Don't like it? Stop going to events that are run by stupid people, then write to the organizers and let them know why. If they lose enough business and get enough letters they will come around.

While we are on this subject, WDW's new rule about no photography in the Nemo show may be the start of their limiting photography in the parks. They tried it on the cruise ships a few years ago and heard from a lot of unhappy people.

 

[mabas9395]

Don't like it? Stop going to events that are run by stupid people, then write to the organizers and let them know why. If they lose enough business and get enough letters they will come around.

That idea may work for some events (concerts, shows, etc), but where we see this a lot is with youth events like sports. I'd hate to be sort of dad who didn't let my kids participate in a soccer tourneyment or a gymnastics meet because I didn't agree with their definition of "professional camera".

 

[Groucho]

Don't like it? Stop going to events that are run by stupid people, then write to the organizers and let them know why. If they lose enough business and get enough letters they will come around.

Well, unfortunately, I doubt there'll ever be enough to effect such a change.

While we are on this subject, WDW's new rule about no photography in the Nemo show may be the start of their limiting photography in the parks. They tried it on the cruise ships a few years ago and heard from a lot of unhappy people.

I'm not too sure that that is what's going on. The Nemo show is the closest thing to a Broadway show that I've seen on Disney property. (I was just a little kid when they were doing the Broadway shows at the top of the Contemporary!) Broadway shows certainly don't allow any photography - when we saw The Lion King locally, a kid near us got queried because he was playing his Gameboy Advance!

The Carousel of Progress thing (total ban on photos/video) is a real mystery, though. I really don't think that WDW will start banning cameras outright, though. Banning flash is already not that uncommon and I doubt that anyone breaking the rule (unless it's many times during a live show) ever hears any complaints about it, so banning cameras entirely from some attractions will probably have the same effect.

I'm generally a liberal, but I do believe in the death penalty for people taking flash pictures on PotC or Haunted Mansion.

 

[ukcatfan]

I'm generally a liberal, but I do believe in the death penalty for people taking flash pictures on PotC or Haunted Mansion.

I'm generally a conservative, but would not condone the death penalty for flash photos on those rides. Why take away my pleasure of publicly embarrassing them with my overly vocal objections?

Kevin

 

[MICKEY88]

I'm just telling you what most sports/concert venues use as the rule of thumb. Frankly it's their call to let cameras in at all or not, so people should just be happy being able to bring in a camera at all.

this I agree with

In a court of law anyone who tried to sue a venue for not being allowed to bring in a camera would lose.this I respectfully disagree with, if someone had the time and money, they could win, selective enforcement, especially based on such loose , and inaccurate definition of professional equipment, would not be justifiable..

House of Blues forbids even disposables and will confiscate any found in the venue.
Anne

that is the safe way to prohibit cameras

 

[Anewman]

If their "selective, loose and inaacurate" definitions are clearly posted I doubt anyone could win. And if they did win, what exactly would be the damages?????

A private(or even public) venue could choose to ban BLUE and PINK cameras, we dont have to agree with the rational but we are subject to enforcement. Anyone that does not agree with the rule can choose not to enter.

 

[Pixeldust Fairy]

Reading this thread is really wild. I have a dslr camera and I can take good photos. But take for instance my husband gets a hold of it. Then you have a totaly different situation. I don't understand how they can say you have a professional camera and you cant take pictures. I thought the professional was the person using the camera, not the actual equipment. Some people just have expensive toys. They may or may not know how to use them properly. I know when my husband gets my camera, he just points and shoots.

They are assuming that if you have an expensive toy you are a professional. I know if I would have been me, I would have made a stink about it. Hey thats my daughter up there and I have every right to photo her. Oh yea there would have been something said.

 

[jann1033]

i have a question about buildings due to them being mentioned a few posts back. i occasionally take photos of unusual marble etc in old buildings ( husband uses them to duplicate for faux finishes) or sometimes just the architecture..no one has ever approached me but would you normally ask someone first ( and who) or just go ahead and do it unless someone complains

 

[boBQuincy]

Well, unfortunately, I doubt there'll ever be enough to effect such a change.

I agree, most people will just accept it and continue to patronize the events, rewarding bad behavior.

I'm generally a liberal, but I do believe in the death penalty for people taking flash pictures on PotC or Haunted Mansion.

Or maybe some punishment that fits the crime, like a flogging on PotC or buried alive in HM!

 

[ducklite]

Don't like it? Stop going to events that are run by stupid people, then write to the organizers and let them know why. If they lose enough business and get enough letters they will come around.

Generally the venue is simply enforcing the talent's rules.

I was at the Red Hot Chili Peppers the other night, I'm a credentialed member of the media and was approved to bring professional gear by the City of Orlando (their venue) and the bands management. BUT, after the third song in the photopit, I was escorted outside and had to lock my gear in my trunk if I wanted to use my ticket to come back in and watch the show (which of course I did.)

Had I also brought along my P&S, I would have been allowed back in with that. But my pro gear had to stay in my car. It's the same rules at pretty much every concert venue in the country. Pro gear is not allowed in without pre-aproved credentials. You can choose to not attend the show if you don't like it, but you'll never win that lawsuit if you decide to try an sue.

And trust me, they sold 17,000 tickets--sold out. If you think for one minute that if 30 people decided to boycott shows at the Amway Arena or by the RHCP over not being able to bring their cameras, you'll be met with a "Don't let the door hit ya" response.

Anne