Do Windows matter if you buy a lot of points?

[CaliAdventurer]

Based on all that you just shared, here are my thoughts:

1. How do the fixed-week's work? What if you wanted to trade, are you guaranteed that week somewhere else? Do the points trade even up? Can you trade for any week, meaning, you don't have to always go at that time?

2. Since you like Saratoga, I would probably buy some there. It's the best value, cheapest maintenance, etc.. What if you did this: 200-400 points at SS. You would go there once a year, or possibly trade to another resort when there was availability. Then, you could also buy a smaller contract at VGF so that you know you could stay there every year or two. Even if it was only like 120 points or something (or the 200 point fixed week you mentioned), you could go every other year using more points on nicer rooms.

My understanding is that its either or- Either you take the week OR you use the points. I don't really see a downside to it.

I think you're right. The airfare will be egregious and the parks will be capacity BUT it would be magic! I'd love to do that every couple years. I may pitch that and then see how it goes the first using them on another week or resort before making the decision to add on at another resort, Get the lay of the land.

I'm feeling a decision coming on! THANKS!!

 

[dsnydaddy]

You guys are genius! I know that my husband will let me pull the trigger once he knows all the research "I" (wink wink) have done. Thank you! Here is my scenario and thought process based on your collective remarks and some insight into what our motivations are:

1) because large contracts are harder to move, would then we be in a better negotiating position with both the seller and Disney ROFR? We're buyers who never resell anything, even when we justify a purchase by saying we could resell it. A largeish contract doesn't really worry.

I've seen a 700 point contract at SSR on the Timeshare Store for quite a while now. Even though it is at a rock bottom price. The total price is over $43,000! It's not really going anywhere and I'm sure the sellers would love to finally get rid of it. Disney could ROFR it, but they'd also be taking on a huge number of points in a resort that only just sold out a few years ago. IMO, if you can afford it, a large contract gives you a lot of leverage.

2) That said, we are looking at this for the long haul. The shelf life of the resort matters to me. I'm a Disneyland kid born and raised and I intend to see that through for my kids and theirs. I'm even hoping that my name comes up for Club 33 before my daughter turns 16 so I can have her Bday there. Shes 3. : )

3) Right now, we'd probably be booking one bedrooms or much larger if we bring quests. Perhaps 2 one bedrooms? If we bring grandparents or host clients? I dont imagine that changing too much over time.

I've read a lot on the boards that the order of sell outs is such: Studios, 2 bedrooms, Grand villas (sometimes the last two are swapped) and then 1 bedrooms. If you're happy in a 1 bedroom then you should find it easier to book wherever you like. Of course the Standard views also book early so you'd have to pay for a room with a view and that's where your large contract comes in.

4) While our kids are in school, we'll need the third week of October annually and or Easter week, or Xmas Vacay (like everyone else ha!)

Again, having a large pool of points would be a great boon during the peak seasons. As you may need them to book the higher end rooms as the standard rooms sell out. Unless you are booking in your home resort. October, I've been hearing, is becoming a very popular time to visit as well.

5) We are open to using the points at Aulani

Aulani is absolutely wonderful! I plan on spending more than a few points to stay there.

6) We are looking for value as in bang for the buck and not just whats cheapest.

I've heard others state "buy where you want to stay. And frankly didn't really understand what they were saying. After all I can use my points anywhere, right? Well, true. (unless you are in peak season) However, I've been learning that the 11 month window helps you get the coveted standard room (which makes your points go farther!) and if you swap out of your home resort, you'll probably be spending a lot more points to do so.

7) Location isnt a big deal. Right now our kids love AK and MK but I live for epcot as does our 19YO son. My husband only cares about golf, and maybe like 2 other thngs as a life rule : )

8) My husband is a bit of a status personality. He likes to buy the best thing once and keep it for its useful life. HOWEVER, we just stayed 9 nights in a 1 bedroom at SSR and loved it. At first it was a bit disappointing as its a bit less polished in the units (our first DVC prop stay) but by a couple days in, we loved it! Its on a golf course and close to DTD. We would not be bummed if that's all we could book some years. BUT I was meant to be a radical Victorian or maybe I was once : ) And I walk into the GF and feel like I'm Jane Seymour in Somewhere in Time and I'm actually giddy.

SO- here are some current listings that intrigue me. -

There's a GF $145 fixed XMAS week in a studio. 206 pts or something. Nice to have the option maybe every other year. Also seems like it would be highly rentable? Not that I see us ever doing that but I have to cover all my basis when I make a final proposal. This and maybe another 2-300 pt contract at a cheaper resort Like SSR, BLT? or a mix?

This is a personal observation, I would hate a fixed week. I love flexibility!

Theres also a Grand Villa fixed week NYE! at Aulani 1400 pts. For like $80 a pt! (are they just hoping Disney buys it back?) But would my points be useless at WDW? Could I rent the ones I dont use? We could always use with clients too.

This is an excellent price for Aulani. but it might be at risk for ROFR at that price. Problem is, at that price the bottom line is $112,000! (And at the usual going rate the price tag would be nearly $150,000! Sheesh! That's more than a lot of people's houses are worth!) That's a huge chunk of change that not a lot of people will qualify for. Plus the Annual will be over $9000. If you can afford it, then the flexibility options are unlimited and renting out points will go a long way for paying off your annual dues. Here's my issue with you and the Aulani, It sounds like you'd use your points at WDW a goodly portion of the time. Currently the Aulani does not book up as much as Disney would like. As a result, it's not hard to get a room here (from what I have heard) So, that makes your 11 month advantage really only good for getting standard rooms. But it gives you 7 months everywhere else. This could be a problem for you with the times that you want to do WDW during peak.

I would like to stay at GF at least sometimes. For the next 12 years, we're stuck at peek times. Before little kids we always went in Jan. So we'd prob do that again.

GF does sound like it's a place where your heart is. Your husband probably won't care much where you are as long as he's comfortable and your kids will more than likely love anywhere where you are happiest (that's how it is with my kids. When Mom's happy everyone is happy.)

Sorry for the wordiness. Its quite complex! Ultimately, if DH knows I've crossed all my T's and I'm thrilled, he'll let me do it, prob in January. He's already gone from silence on the subject to I'm not saying not to do it, to-you can do it if you want to but what about... I'm turning the corner to the homestretch : )

My comments in RED

And for what it's worth, it's only my gut opinion based upon my own research and not much on experience.

 

[CaliAdventurer]

My comments in RED

And for what it's worth, it's only my gut opinion based upon my own research and not much on experience.

I like how you think! So much to consider but I hadn't thought about the views. I really cant shake that having more points HAS to have its advantages. Instead of squeezing the life out of them, we'd be more flexible, wherever we land. As far as I'm concerned, its FORTUNE to stay in reg rooms at Disney as it is. We have this Oct booked at BC CL Deluxe room and the room is $1300 for the Friday alone. AND those rooms are now sold out! We also stay at the GC a couple times a year but for $500 a night, ,we'd be saving way more at WDW. Same with Aulani I'd think. SO you are all right. WDW, some points for access and many and /or varied points for flexibility.

Its so exciting!!

 

[disneynutz]

My comments in RED

And for what it's worth, it's only my gut opinion based upon my own research and not much on experience.

Fixed weeks guarantee you an automatic guaranteed reservation each year at the same time. We bought a VGF fixed week for a lake view in December. We will always get that reservation even though there are only 17 one bedrooms.

If you don't care when or where you stay then buy anywhere, play the "check availability daily" or the "waitlist game" but if you want the best possible chances of staying when you want, where you want, then buy where you love to stay.

Each year 7 month availability is becoming more competitive and uncertain.

Bill

 

[dsnydaddy]

Fixed weeks guarantee you an automatic guaranteed reservation each year at the same time. We bought a VGF fixed week for a lake view in December. We will always get that reservation even though there are only 17 one bedrooms.

If you don't care when or where you stay then buy anywhere, play the "check availability daily" or the "waitlist game" but if you want the best possible chances of staying when you want, where you want, then buy where you love to stay.

Each year 7 month availability is becoming more competitive and uncertain.

Bill

I had just heard about fixed weeks at DVC. Didn't know they existed so I had just done some research. Kinda nice if you know that you'll be going to WDW on (lets say) Thanksgiving most years. Takes the hassle out of wondering if you're going to get that reservation or not.

 

[CaliAdventurer]

Fixed weeks guarantee you an automatic guaranteed reservation each year at the same time. We bought a VGF fixed week for a lake view in December. We will always get that reservation even though there are only 17 one bedrooms.

If you don't care when or where you stay then buy anywhere, play the "check availability daily" or the "waitlist game" but if you want the best possible chances of staying when you want, where you want, then buy where you love to stay.

Each year 7 month availability is becoming more competitive and uncertain.

Bill

this is what my gut was telling me the other day but then there are so many factors!! I think I'm gonna press for this or something like it at VGF and then see what happens with it and add more as we need to. Its much more expensive obviously but they are so many intangibles that you cant quantify.

 

[disneynutz]

I had just heard about fixed weeks at DVC. Didn't know they existed so I had just done some research. Kinda nice if you know that you'll be going to WDW on (lets say) Thanksgiving most years. Takes the hassle out of wondering if you're going to get that reservation or not.

Aulani and VGF offer a limited number of fixed week contracts. My guess is that they will offer them on all new resorts going forward. We always go to WDW in December so it works well for us.

Bill

 

[DenLo]

Based on all that you just shared, here are my thoughts:

1. How do the fixed-week's work? What if you wanted to trade, are you guaranteed that week somewhere else? Do the points trade even up? Can you trade for any week, meaning, you don't have to always go at that time?

A fixed week contract forces the buyer to purchase more points for that week than they would need if they didn't have a fixed week. In 2014 for week 49, beginning with December 7, for a Lake View 1BR if you just reserved the room with DVC points it would cost 296 points, however to purchase the fixed week contract for this week, DVC requires the member in 2013/2014 to purchase 326 points, roughly 10% more. However the fixed week owner really owns the 326 points so if the owner decides they will not be using their fixed week, they are given 326 points to use or bank, if they are still within the banking period. So for the life of their contract they own 326 points. But that fixed week owner always knows that they have a 1 BR lake view for the 49th week of each year. The week always begins and ends on a Sunday. As far as I know they only need to cancel it over thirty days before. At 30 days or less the points end up in holding if the fixed week owner cancels. Then their use year comes into play and the standard rules for Holding Points apply.

BTW, if a reallocation of the point charts occurs raising the number of points required to book this 1BR to be even higher than what the fixed week owner has, it does not matter. The fixed owner owns that week. The rest of us would have to pay the higher cost. Of course the opposite could be true, if a reallocation of points lowered the cost per week for a reservation, the fixed week owner continues to give up the 326 points to keep the fixed week reservation while the rest of us use even less points to book the room.

 

[ontheuptick]

this is what my gut was telling me the other day but then there are so many factors!! I think I'm gonna press for this or something like it at VGF and then see what happens with it and add more as we need to. Its much more expensive obviously but they are so many intangibles that you cant quantify.

After commenting earlier, reading more of your thoughts, and thinking - I've changed my opinion on what I would do if I were you:

I would buy the 700 pt SS contract, trying to get it down from $62 to 55ish per point. That would give you a load of points, for cheap, with the cheapest maintenance fees.

Then, your worst case is staying at SS (which you've already said you like). Because you've bought so cheap and have dues so cheap, maybe you end up staying in nicer rooms at SS (Grand Villa instead of 2BR, or 1BR instead of Studio, etc.). Or, you can use your massive amount of points to switch at the 7 month mark. Find a GV at Aulani, and book it. Try out AKV. Try out BWV. Try out BLT. Etc. With that many points, you'll be able to upgrade to bigger rooms if necessary to get the availability. Go with 2 1BR rooms instead of a 2BR. etc.

Then, if you really want to add 100-250 points at VGF, go ahead. Your total point cost is so low that you can splurge there.

That's what I would do. Tons of points, really cheaply, and most importantly with the cheapest mgmt fees. So much flexibility, and worst case is you stay in nice rooms at a resort that you like. Win Win.

Good luck!

 

[chalee94]

I've seen a 700 point contract at SSR on the Timeshare Store for quite a while now. Even though it is at a rock bottom price. The total price is over $43,000! It's not really going anywhere and I'm sure the sellers would love to finally get rid of it. Disney could ROFR it, but they'd also be taking on a huge number of points in a resort that only just sold out a few years ago. IMO, if you can afford it, a large contract gives you a lot of leverage.

not a huge number of pts for Disney if they ROFR it, actually. after they reacquire the pts, disney can break it down and resell it as 50-100 pt contracts...

 

[dsnydaddy]

not a huge number of pts for Disney if they ROFR it, actually. after they reacquire the pts, disney can break it down and resell it as 50-100 pt contracts...

You are right, Disney can do whatever it wants. But I'm not seeing them pick up a lot of SSR and from what I've heard it doesn't sell well at Disney's inflated prices. I'm sure that Disney would break it up but they'd still have to pay to support the points until they sold. Currently Disney is selling "sold out" resorts at about $130 pp. However, I'm seeing two 30 point contracts and one 50 point contract priced at about $88-90 pp. They aren't selling as well as I thought that they would.

 

[skier_pete]

1) because large contracts are harder to move, would then we be in a better negotiating position with both the seller and Disney ROFR? We're buyers who never resell anything, even when we justify a purchase by saying we could resell it. A largeish contract doesn't really worry.

I didn't go through all your arguments - but your first one already isn't really right. While you may get a bit of leverage on larger contracts (I am assuming we are talking 400+ points) Disney can take a large contract and split it up, so you do NOT have leverage with ROFR, in fact just the opposite.

While there's a pretty significant expense between a 50 point and a 150 point contract, I don't think you would see more than a few dollars difference between a 150 contract and a 500 point contract. Even if you really lowball it, Disney would probably snatch it up anyways, because as I said they can take that 500 point contract and turn it into ten 50 point contracts.

And even as a BUYER - I don't think there is a great advantage to buying large contracts, even if you can afford to. Remember, even if it saves you $5 a point, you spread that over 40 years of the life of the contract, it's actually a very small amount of the money you'll be paying. And the advantages of multiple smaller contracts are vast. I would much rather have 3 - 160 pt contracts at say BWV, WLV, and BLT than a single 480 pt contract at one location. Sure you have to pay a little more in closing costs, but again the expense of a few dollars more on the buy-in is nothing. To have the flexibility of booking 11-months at a wider variety of resorts (through bank and borrow) and in addition the flexibility that if I decide I want less points in the future I can sell a portion of them instead of being locked in 100 %....I don't think big contracts make any sense at all to buy.

 

[Msmithmd]

This gives me a lot of hope. We're pretty open to staying at any of the DVCs -so the strategy is about access, no? So the most difficult is, GF and of course VGC. At first we def wanted Cali because we already stay there a few times a year but signs seem to point to don't bother. Do you think 200pts at GC and 300 at GF makes sense for access or is that just a waste of money? Or forget GC and get more points in WDW cheaper pt resorts?

I'm able to travel at lower DVC demand times (WDW in early June, or February in California) so that helps a lot. I would not have the same degree of success were I vying for these properties in the late September through early January period. Also, I am rather compulsive about use of the availability tool, and about being online and all set to click through to the booking page at 0759 at my seven month window.

It really comes down to how hard you want to work at playing the seven month availability/booking aspect of membership. I rather enjoy it and see it as something of a game, and I have no problem at all staying at AKV or OKW in case I get shut out of something (thus far I've always stayed at my first choice, except when I had to modify a trip five months out due to kids' school snow day extension.)

If you have no problem spending the extra money, then yes I would buy at the two resorts you've suggested. Understanding that owning these will give you booking certainty but will also cost tens of thousands more even via resale, at the point totals you're discussing.

Essentially I think there isn't a wrong answer, it's just how much marginal cost you are willing to assume to gain the eleven month advantage, versus playing the game at seven months using less expensive points. Do the math to figure out what either scenario would cost, and decide based on an understanding that you can often, but not always, book top demand options seven months out.

There is certainly a value to booking and forgetting about it at eleven months. How many dollars that security is worth is in the eye of the beholder.

 

[Dean]

Y1) because large contracts are harder to move, would then we be in a better negotiating position with both the seller and Disney ROFR? We're buyers who never resell anything, even when we justify a purchase by saying we could resell it. A largeish contract doesn't really worry.

Besides the usage itself, any savings on timeshares is made on the buy in related to home resort and other choices such as UY, contract size and buy in price. One should be able to get the best deal on a truly large contract along with the inherent risks if one wants to sell later. I remember 2 VB contracts, one of 1000 & one of 2000 points that sat around forever.

2) That said, we are looking at this for the long haul. The shelf life of the resort matters to me.

I would suggest one look at each of the variables objectively. The longer life of the RTU can be a benefit or a curse, none of us know for sure where things will be in 25-40 yrs. It's not automatic that a longer time is better or cheaper than a shorter time. Even for he 2042 resorts we still have almost 28 yrs. Even the youngest of couples will have a much different circumstance at the end of those RTU and worst case scenario is one could look at buying back in with a much better grasp of the info as it's applicable at that time in the future. Specifically I don't think the 3-6 yrs related to SSR and other resorts that end later is a variable that one can put on the positive side of the ledger, IMO it's neutral at best.

3) Right now, we'd probably be booking one bedrooms or much larger if we bring quests. Perhaps 2 one bedrooms? If we bring grandparents or host clients? I dont imagine that changing too much over time.

Realize there really isn't any possibility for business deductions using your timeshare in this manner if that matters.

4) While our kids are in school, we'll need the third week of October annually and or Easter week, or Xmas Vacay (like everyone else ha!)

That's important info and those are times you might get locked out of certain resorts at 7 months out.

5) We are open to using the points at Aulani

IMO that's not enough justification to own there unless you can get the price down in the range of what SSR would cost pp on a similar sized contract AND one can get a subsidized contract.

6) We are looking for value as in bang for the buck and not just whats cheapest

That becomes very subjective, you'll have to decide what adds value over just cost. For the 700 or so points you've referenced, it's likely 2 or 3 resorts with the majority at SSR. Likely best starting smaller and adding over time as you develop a better feel for your long term preferences. Ultimately you'll have to decide what that looks like for you and your family.

7) Location isnt a big deal. Right now our kids love AK and MK but I live for epcot as does our 19YO son. My husband only cares about golf, and maybe like 2 other thngs as a life rule : )

All of the on property resorts should satisfy this list technically. Even if you bought only SSR, OKW, etc; you should be able to satisfy all of these options long term with planning and use of the wait list.

8) My husband is a bit of a status personality. He likes to buy the best thing once and keep it for its useful life. HOWEVER, we just stayed 9 nights in a 1 bedroom at SSR and loved it. At first it was a bit disappointing as its a bit less polished in the units (our first DVC prop stay) but by a couple days in, we loved it! Its on a golf course and close to DTD. We would not be bummed if that's all we could book some years. BUT I was meant to be a radical Victorian or maybe I was once : ) And I walk into the GF and feel like I'm Jane Seymour in Somewhere in Time and I'm actually giddy.

IMO this line of thinking can be dangerous and expensive with DVC. It sometimes leads to buying the top end option without getting much or any real benefit. Just plan long enough to get over the emotions and make objective decisions.

SO- here are some current listings that intrigue me. -

There's a GF $145 fixed XMAS week in a studio. 206 pts or something. Nice to have the option maybe every other year. Also seems like it would be highly rentable? Not that I see us ever doing that but I have to cover all my basis when I make a final proposal. This and maybe another 2-300 pt contract at a cheaper resort Like SSR, BLT? or a mix?

Theres also a Grand Villa fixed week NYE! at Aulani 1400 pts. For like $80 a pt! (are they just hoping Disney buys it back?) But would my points be useless at WDW? Could I rent the ones I dont use? We could always use with clients too.

I like the fixed week options and feel that for many they add more potential value than the multiple smaller contract option does.

I'm picking up what you're throwing down.- So if they all had the same use year and I want to book VGF but I'm only holding 150 there, what is the advantage? (serious question, forgive me!) Just the ability to secure a studio 11 mos out for sure? It for access only. Am I following? And then what is the rationale for which other property you buy into? 1 goof value that you'd enjoy staying at and one cheap on to bulk up your options if you do a straight 7 mo booking? All one use year preferably?

The advantage to owning VGF as a smaller component of your overall points is that you can use the points there to book every 2-3 years and still take advantage of the lower buy in and dues of other resorts. You'll have to work out how many VGF points you need if you decide to buy there are part or all.