Disney's Dark Kingdom (Complete list on pg 24)

[OldsDr]

Disney doesn't really care if your kids outgrow WDW and move to US or BG as long as more younger kids take their place.

I've posted the following comment in every "5th Park" thread. Disney will build a fifth park when ...

• They can get families to take longer vacations, not the trend these days.
  
• They can make a week 8 days, requires they figure out how to manipulate the space time continuum.

Right now Disney knows that a family of 2 parents and 2.1 kids spend 6 days at WDW and 70% have never been to WDW and a for a certain percentage this will be there only trip. How can you expect them to fit a fifth park into their plans?

Adding a 5th park for everyone thats been there done that is just not required for Disney to keep making money. In fact if a new park just shifts people away from the existing parks WDW loses money.

All valid points to add one the thining of the the workforce. People are already saying that customer sevice in decline. add another park you have to hire more people to work there. I would think they have already hired the best who have applied.

Plus as previously stated, there is a lot that can be done to the existing 4 parks to draw in more locals and repeat customers with a much less expensive investment.

my bet is the next Disney Themepark after Shanghi will be in India. or additions to Shanghi and Hong Kong


If they were ever to build a 5th major gate, my vote if I had one would be to resurect all the popular closed rides from throught the years.

 

[fannatic]

Sorry, but the reason Disney closes older attractions is because they weren't popular enough with guests. They try to find something new to replace them. Also, when Americans give the excuse that people don't have 8 days to spend at WDW, they're not thinking about International guests. I've seen posts from people in England who come to America just for WDW. They spend their whole vacation on Disney grounds. They were complaining that there isn't enough to do at WDW. They wished there were more parks to visit. Disney World relies on International tourism the way that Disneyland relies on Californians. They are an important demographic for the parks.

 

[chartle]

Also, when Americans give the excuse that people don't have 8 days to spend at WDW, they're not thinking about International guests. I've seen posts from people in England who come to America just for WDW. They spend their whole vacation on Disney grounds. They were complaining that there isn't enough to do at WDW. They wished there were more parks to visit. Disney World relies on International tourism the way that Disneyland relies on Californians. They are an important demographic for the parks.

While an important segment of the guests I don't think there are enough 6+ day guests to justify spending 1 Billion+ dollars for a park for them.

As posted above its more cost effective to just give them more to do in the existing parks.

Hey if they are mostly from Europe it would be easier to just add another park to Disneyland Paris and expand that market. much easier to get on a train In the UK and get to Paris in I don't know 5 hours (?).

I would call the Orlando Theme Park market mature as in not much room for growth.

 

[anthony2k7]

While an important segment of the guests I don't think there are enough 6+ day guests to justify spending 1 Billion+ dollars for a park for them.

As posted above its more cost effective to just give them more to do in the existing parks.

Hey if they are mostly from Europe it would be easier to just add another park to Disneyland Paris and expand that market. much easier to get on a train In the UK and get to Paris in I don't know 5 hours (?).

I would call the Orlando Theme Park market mature as in not much room for growth.

Sorry, but you don't appear to know a whole lot about why Europeans visit WDW.

Besides, adding another park to DLRP isn't the solution because (as I'm sure you know) DLRP has ever since it opened struggled with its debt. Not due to unpopularity these days, but due to several mistakes made in the early days which resulted in the debt getting so large. Being forced into building the 2nd park there too soon made the issue a whole lot worse.

(its around a 2hr train journey incidentally - not 5, and yet we still prefer WDW )

 

[The Expert]

... not to mention the exchange rate for pounds-to-dollars is typically much more favorable than pounds-to-euro.

 

[anthony2k7]

Right now Disney knows that a family of 2 parents and 2.1 kids spend 6 days at WDW and 70% have never been to WDW and a for a certain percentage this will be their only trip. How can you expect them to fit a fifth park into their plans?

do you have a good source for those numbers? I was under the impression disney didnt release details like that?

There are a whole lot of other interesting stats that need to be considered before any of us "experts" can judge if Disney should be building another park. Such as, % of repeat visitors over 1, 2, 5 and 10 years, length of stay on return visits vs first visit, % of time spent offsite for return visitors, % of visitors per nationality, average length of stay per nationality, impact of potterland on length of stay, expected impact of legoland on length of stay, etc etc.

If for example disney were to look at the number of return visitors and saw it was rising, but that the time they were spending onsite was falling (just a hunch, but I think that may well be the case), then disney might decide they should be doing something to lock in those guests to spend more time on site.

but then again, in my personal opinion, they should just finish off DHS and AK first anyway

 

[anthony2k7]

... not to mention the exchange rate for pounds-to-dollars is typically much more favorable than pounds-to-euro.

very much so!!!!

 

[OldsDr]

Sorry, but the reason Disney closes older attractions is because they weren't popular enough with guests. They try to find something new to replace them. Also, when Americans give the excuse that people don't have 8 days to spend at WDW, they're not thinking about International guests. I've seen posts from people in England who come to America just for WDW. They spend their whole vacation on Disney grounds. They were complaining that there isn't enough to do at WDW. They wished there were more parks to visit. Disney World relies on International tourism the way that Disneyland relies on Californians. They are an important demographic for the parks.

Wow??? Appology accepted, but no need to be sorry. I did not think it would happen. I said if I had my vote, like I actually have one. I am the one who is sorry if anyone thought my comment was in any way a glimmer of what i thought would actually happen.


I am no insider, but you can not tell me Journey into Imagination was not popular. I remember waiting in line to get on this. Every iteration since then is pretty much walk on.

MR. Toads was extremely popular.

Extra Terrorestrial Alen encounter always had a line.

It is not populatrity that is driving closure it is either contractual obligations for change or marketing of other things.

Mission to mars, that one prbably would not do well after a year of nostalga wore off. But there are a lot of closed popular rides

Even the Skyway could be reopened if they had additioanl saftey features that would be really easy to install in todays day and age.


I still say there will be a park in India long befor a 5th gate in Florida. Unless of course the Bubble Park at the bottom of Bay Lake comes through.


What is the percentage of spend at WDW from International Vs. U.S. guests? I can see Canadian, Brazillian and UK guests driving it up.

 

[anthony2k7]

What is the percentage of spend at WDW from International Vs. U.S. guests? I can see Canadian, Brazillian and UK guests driving it up.

no idea of actual figures, but it wouldn't surprise me if U.S. visitors on average made up less than 50%

 

[Figment632]

NO new park will be built in WDW for the next 20 years!

 

[fannatic]

I'm going to laugh so hard when the 5th park they're working on opens before the end of the decade. - I'm still waiting on the one who started this thread. Where did you hear the Dark Kingdom rumor, or did you just make it up?

 

[Figment632]

I'm going to laugh so hard when the 5th park they're working on opens before the end of the decade. - I'm still waiting on the one who started this thread. Where did you hear the Dark Kingdom rumor, or did you just make it up?

You are going to be waiting along time because they aren't working on a 5th park!!

Also there is 100% no need for a 5th park!

 

[DC7800]

Also there is 100% no nerd for a 5th park!

So, they are building a 5th park, but absolutely no nerds will be admitted?

 

[Figment632]

So, they are building a 5th park, but absolutely no nerds will be admitted?

Yup!

I don't understand the obsession of a 5th gate when there is no need! It would do more harm to WDW than good.

 

[Oglet]

Yup!

I don't understand the obsession of a 5th gate when there is no need! It would do more harm to WDW than good.

Yup, I agree.

Anyway why build a new park when you can just add to what you have

 

[OldsDr]

Yup!

I don't understand the obsession of a 5th gate when there is no need! It would do more harm to WDW than good.

exactly. India here they come.



except of course for the underwater park to be built in a bubble under seven seas lagoon.

 

[Figment632]

Yup, I agree.

Anyway why build a new park when you can just add to what you have

Agreed but besides that they can't even keep the four parks they have up to Disney standards!

 

[fannatic]

A lot of people don't like visiting the same parks 100 times. I have friends who won't go to WDW until they start making major additions. The Magic Kingdom will always be busy, but kids are growing up faster these days. Some kids are only interested in WDW until they're about 7. I would hope that Disney realizes this and begins to make major additions. But for some, new E-tickets to existing parks will not be enough to get them to make the pilgrimage to Florida again. Sure, Disney will continue to make about the same profit that they did last year or maybe a little more, but I don't buy that the Orlando market has "matured". That's corporate America's excuse to keep nickel and diming us. I noticed how afraid Iger was at the shareholders' meeting when a little girl asked him if there was anything else planned for WDW beyond Fantasyland. He made sure that the conservative shareholders and Wall Street analysts knew that there was, but nothing had been approved yet. Yet, even Al Lutz will admit that there is a lot planned for WDW. And, I stand by my prediction of the 5th by or before 2018 - ha, ha!

 

[Figment632]

Again there is no 5th gate planned and it would be a negative not a positive!

 

[anthony2k7]

A lot of people don't like visiting the same parks 100 times. I have friends who won't go to WDW until they start making major additions. The Magic Kingdom will always be busy, but kids are growing up faster these days. Some kids are only interested in WDW until they're about 7. I would hope that Disney realizes this and begins to make major additions. But for some, new E-tickets to existing parks will not be enough to get them to make the pilgrimage to Florida again. Sure, Disney will continue to make about the same profit that they did last year or maybe a little more, but I don't buy that the Orlando market has "matured". That's corporate America's excuse to keep nickel and diming us. I noticed how afraid Iger was at the shareholders' meeting when a little girl asked him if there was anything else planned for WDW beyond Fantasyland. He made sure that the conservative shareholders and Wall Street analysts knew that there was, but nothing had been approved yet. Yet, even Al Lutz will admit that there is a lot planned for WDW. And, I stand by my prediction of the 5th by or before 2018 - ha, ha!

i think the amount of people avoiding florida entirely due to lack of WDW new attractions is minimal.

The concern of people going to orlando but spending time offsite has always got to be the primary concern. If people are spending all that money to get to orlando and then not spending as much time at Disney as Disney would like then thats a clear sign Disney arent doing enough.

I think your comment on people not wanting to visit the same park 100s of times probably wont ever apply to the 4 main disney parks. It may apply to the water parks, and also DTD. What may apply is that people spend half their time there compared to their first visit - so MK 2 days down to 1, same with Epcot, and DHS and AK down to half day from 1 day. The remained of the time may be spent off site giving universal/seaworld/KSC/busch/legoland/malls/etc their money instead. With U.S. visitors that may mean Disney are only losing 2 days money per guest, but for international visitors spending maybe 4 days on site and 10 off site - thats a LOT of money Disney is losing.