Disneyland Hong Kong Details (kinda of)

[Another Voice]

Disney has launched a mini-website for the Disneyland Hong Kong project at http://www.disney.com.hk/hkdisneyland . For the first time, they’ve admitted the unique small-scale aspect of the plans. According to the rumors I’ve heard, a lot of people inside the Company are already calling this model the Disney’s Disney Adventure concept and it will serve as the blueprint for the future regional parks currently in the Company’s plan.

Please consider the following to be rumors at this point. The plans for HKD are still in flux and given all the problems with the company at the moment, anything can happen. But these rumors, if true, do give a great insight into The Company’s current thinking.

The entire park will have only four lands – Main Street, Adventureland, Fantasyland and Tomorrowland. There will be a heavy emphasis on shopping and dining. The attractions in the park will be for the most part off-the-shelf ride systems decorated to resemble Disney attractions for the stateside parks. The park is being modeled after Disneyland in terms of size and scale (even the castle will be a duplicate of Disneyland's Sleeping Beauty). Hong Kong is also planned to have two adjacent hotels and a “Downtown Disney” development very similar to the one at Disneyland.

Main Street will be a modified version of Disneyland’s turn of the 20th century version. The biggest difference here is that all the shops and restaurants along the street are rumored to be leased out to major international brands – The Gap, Rainforest Café, Addias, etc. Only the facades will maintain the 1910 appearance, once inside they will be a typical chain store. Many of the rumored brands already have a significant prescence in Hong Kong so there’s some debate about how well this ‘Rodeo Drive U.S.A.’ concept of Main Street is going to work.

Adventureland will be based on ‘Lion King’, ‘Aladdin’ and ‘Tarzan’ with different areas reflecting Africa, Arabia and Asia. The ‘Jungle Cruise’ will be an off-the-shelf rapids-style raft ride with limited show pieces along the banks. It is intended to be a thrill-ride along the lines of the ‘Kali River Rapids’ attraction at Animal Kingdom rather than the narrated boat ride. ‘Aladdin’s Flying Carpet’, ‘Tarzan’s Treehouse’ and water play area will round out the attractions. The emphasis will be on the Disney movies mentioned, not on trying to recreate the sense-of-place that the American parks attempt.

Fantasyland will be based on Disneyland’s medieval faire design behind a replica of Disneyland’s castle. Instead of the current medieval village look, the rides will be housed in “tents” (actually buildings draped in sheet metal). Some of the familiar dark rides will be represented – ‘Snow White’, ‘Pooh’, and ‘Pinocchio, but the rides will use identical technology (but the individual cars will be decorated differently) very similar to Disneyland’s ‘Superstar Limo’/’Pooh’ system. A merry-go-round and a large character meet-n-greet are also planned. Apparently a clone of ‘It’s A Small World’ has recently been cancelled.

Tomorrowland will feature a ‘Space Mountain’ that the rumors say will be catalog-purchased coaster housed in the familiar white cone. A separate rumor says that if a decision is made to buy a ‘Rock’n Rollercoaster’ for California Adventure, a second coaster will be purchased for Hong Kong as their ‘Space Mountain’. A ‘Buzz Lightyear’ ride using the new dark ride system, the AstroOribter Jets and a film attraction are also planned. There’s a good chance that a ‘Playhouse Disney’ area will be included to tie in to a Disney program currently shown on Chinese state television.

And that’s pretty much it. The focus of the development is to leverage “the brand” as much as possible while limiting investment as much as possible. Thus, rides will have the name of their famous counterparts, but will not be the same rides in reality. Instead of creating a park that has its own identity, the emphasis will be on promoting Disney entertainment products and consumer products. Someone said the philosophy is more akin to a giant Nike Town than it is to a Disney theme park. And like California Adventure, there will be no audio-animatronic figures in the park.

There are even more rumors that budget cuts on the project are mounting and the park may open without the Tomorrowland area. They’ve already pushed back the opening date more than six months. And there are even whisperings that Disney would love nothing more than for the entire project to be cancelled outright. With the fading fortunes of Hong Kong, the failure of Disney’s last two parks and the other demands for the limited capital Disney is putting up – The Mouse wants to spend the money elsewhere.

 

[DisneyKidds]

Hey, look at it this way. If this ends up being the kind of c**p that Disney produces for future theme parks everyone will appreciate the current WDW offerings a whole lot more - even if they never add anything and just maintain what is there.

What you describe truely sounds pathetic. One can only hope that that does not really become the Disney model for the future . Any pearls on who approved such a concept. Was it ME? Was it a Pressler thing? Let's hope that the new chairman of Walt Disney Parks and Resorts (Mr. R) had nothing to do with it and doesn't buy in. Wishful thinking probably.

Thanks for the info. AV.

 

[wdw4us2]

If this is the wave of the future for Disney Theme Parks, than this is sad news, indeed.

Hasn't Disney and Ei$ner learned that doing things "on the cheap" is not what the public wants? Case in point: Tokyo DisneySea vs. Disney's California Adventure.

AV, I hope that in this instance, these rumors prove to be untrue.

 

[larry_poppins]

Just think of the money you will save because you will never have to visit this pathetic park. For the same money you can go to Tokyo Disney. I would imagine that a lot of people from Hong Kong will skip their park in favor of Tokyo Disney.

AV why is Hong Kong having financial troubles? WHat are you alluding too?

Larry

 

[Testtrack321]

That's sad enough to depress Testtrack....

 

[DC7800]

Outright cancellation of this project would probably be the best thing that could happen. Were no lessons at all learned in the fallout over the wonder that is Disney's California Adventure?

Originally posted by Another Voice
According to the rumors I’ve heard, a lot of people inside the Company are already calling this model the Disney’s Disney Adventure concept and it will serve as the blueprint for the future regional parks currently in the Company’s plan.

Now I'm curious (maybe scared). Are we talking regional as in the U.S. / North America, or "world" regions such as America, Europe, Asia, etc. Wouldn't this effectively undermine Disney's existing parks (California, Florida)?

 

[Another Voice]

The big problem is with Hong Kong’s economy. Since the area was returned to Chinese control HK has lost a lot of the uniqueness that drove their economy. No longer as open to the rest of the world, yet still closed off from the rest of China, they’re stuck in a grey area. And many other economic development areas in southern China – which are moe trusted by the central government – are now just as open as HK. All of the state funding is going to those regions and most of the foreign investment as well. So instead of a rocking free market economy and a major tourist destination, Hong Kong is slowly ebbing away as the tourists and businesses go elsewhere.

As for the Disney’s Disney Adventure bit – one of the great goals of Eisner has always been to franchise the brand. He saw The Disney Stores as a great model for everything that Disney could “accomplish” and has tried to expand Disney’s physical presence in the U.S. and international. Sadly for him, but to the great benefit of the company in my opinion, all those plans have failed quickly and dramatically. But the guy keeps trying.

There was the chain of restaurants that were to open with every Disney Store. Only two were built and were closed quickly. Then there were plans for DVC clubs in New York, Texas, Colorado, Los Angeles, Anaheim, Seattle, London, Paris, Mexico, and on. The failures of the clubs in Hilton Head and Vero Beach ended those plans. Then there was the Disney Quests, the Disney Playhouses, ESPN Zones (the only concept to be of even moderate success) and other “regional entertainment centers”. They all flopped or failed to achieve goals. You might notice a pattern here, the one a really bad player follows at a blackjack table – if you lose you double your bet to “make up” for what you’ve lost.

So now we’re up to the concept of “franchising” the parks. California Adventure was in some circles considered a prototype for a low investment, sponsor heavy, regional “parks”. There were some dreams to place about a dozen of these around the country. There were supposed to be more “hip and edgy” than a regular Disney park and to relay of vast hordes of rich yuppies dropping bucks for Wolfgang Puck Pizzas and shopping at a trendy “Downtown” complex. Think of a Touchstone version of a Disney theme park.

Hong Kong Disneyland is the version they want to build internationally. Cheap, light, paid for by others, the perfect international franchise to drop into South America, all over Asia, Australia or wherever someone would write a check. Not really a full park, but a brand experience center. It’s a Hard Rock Café with rides.

These plans are basically drawn out of desperation to increase revenues. Conventional wisdom is that the U.S. parks have hit their attendance limits, a mature market. Growth can now only come from opening up additional parks in new markets. Since they are only meant to be money machines, all of these projects have been created with economics in mind. That means small, mass produced, limited investment, “proven” concepts.

Of course, California Adventure is a complete disaster, Disney Studio Paris is quickly shaping up to be one to, and people are getting cold feet about Hong Kong. What happens to this concept (especially when Eisner is buried) is still completely unknown.

 

[Bstanley]

Interesting how this reminds me of the discussion that's been going around here about how the public is no longer willing to pay the price for a 'Walt' level of detail, uniqueness and quality - and so to be successful you have to 'cheapen' what is offered.

Obviously Toyota has wasted tons of money on Lexus, offering cups of anything other than basic java doomed Starbucks to destruction years ago, and somebody should really tell all the homebuilders to stop wasting their money by putting in those split brick floors and whirlpool tubs...

OK - there have been what - 6 new major theme parks opened in the last 5 years worldwide? A couple have been real duds, several are paying their own way, and just ONE has been wildly (reviewers), massively (attendance), commercially ($$$) successful ... curiously enough it's the ONE that has the highest level of detail, uniqueness and quality ... and dare I say it? ... it's the ONE that was conceived by Disney Imagineering unfettered by boundary conditions placed on them by people who have lost their clue.

I wonder what color the sky is on The Big MEs planet?

 

[WDWHound]

This is so sad in so many ways.

Almost no rides, light theming, emphisis on shopping and dining, NO ANIMATRONICS at all!

(Sigh)

 

[space42]

I wonder if it will even have a train around the park?

With all the talk on this board about the philosophical difference in the way that the "new Disney" does things , this has to be the best example yet of that new philosophy.

No Jungle Cruise, Tiki Room, Pirates, Mansion, Splash, Thunder, Country Bears or Small World! Might as well call the place Eisnerland Hong Kong becuase this definitely isn't Disneyland!

 

[caseymaureen]

I've heard around here that many foreign visitors visit WDW despite the new parks in their backyards because they don't think the new parks are "real Disney." At first I thought this was silly, but if this is how they build, and plan on continuing to build, our international parks I agree with them, "That's not real Disney!" The execs at the top have to remember what this company was built on, I know I've heard Walt quotes along the lines of "Without risk there is no such thing as success..." You can't build on the Disney name without some risk, alot of investment, hard work, and Disney magic. And, sadly, these plans seem to lack all of the above.

 

[wdw4us2]

AV -- If Hong Kongs' economy is so bad, wouldn't it be a better idea to put off building the park until things look a little better?

I feel badly for the people who live in the countries where these sub-standard parks will be built, especially if they can't afford to come to the U.S. to see the real thing. Imagine if they think their park is on the same par as the U.S. parks. I think it will definitely give the wrong impression as to what the U.S. parks are all about.

I wish Ei$ner would just leave before the company goes completely into the toilet.

 

[vernon]

Imagine if they think their park is on the same par as the U.S. parks. I think it will definitely give the wrong impression as to what the U.S. parks are all about.

Unfortunately that is exactly the problem, not only will the parks in other countries struggle to attract visitors it will hit the main US parks in 2 ways.
1) It will allow those parents (usually dads) that are not keen on spending that much money on what is basically a holiday for kids. "oh honey why go to America when we can take the kids out for the day here"
2) The overseas parks won't be good enough that they leave people wanting more. IMHO IF Disney insisits on having a number of franchised "taster" parks around the world they would be better served in having fewer rides but making sure they are all top of the range, leaving guests wanting more. It's obvious that small parks are not going to be able to offer as much as the WDW development, giving people a day that leaves them thinking "what a great day can you imagine the fun that 4 different parks all bigger than this one would be"

Unfortunately it seems to me that all that will happen at the moment is a watering down of the Disney name to such a degree that all the themepark areas and resorts are going to lose a lot of their allure. To me it seems like a suicidal business plan.

 

[el_tigre]

Originally posted by Another Voice
The big problem is with Hong Kong’s economy. Since the area was returned to Chinese control HK has lost a lot of the uniqueness that drove their economy. No longer as open to the rest of the world, yet still closed off from the rest of China, they’re stuck in a grey area. And many other economic development areas in southern China – which are moe trusted by the central government – are now just as open as HK. All of the state funding is going to those regions and most of the foreign investment as well. So instead of a rocking free market economy and a major tourist destination, Hong Kong is slowly ebbing away as the tourists and businesses go elsewhere.

Don't put too much stock in AV's description of Hong Kong's current economic situation. Sure, the city's economy has certainly seen better days. Many industries , like textiles, have all completely moved to other Southern Asian countries, where labor is much cheaper. Still, other industries, like electronics, where manufacturing technology isn't as easily transferable, are still doing quite well. It's not that Hong Kong is less open than it used to be; most successful Hong Kong companies have moved their factories into China for better prices on labor, which more accurately describes the growth in this region.

And despite a drop in tourism, Hong Kong is still the top Asian destination for international travel (albeit most of it is business related). Also, their population is nearly 7 million people, a nice base to support the park. If a quality park is built, it will do just as well as the other Magic Kingdom's around the world. Take a look at Japan; their economy is probably in worse shape than what you'll see in Hong Kong. Yet their Disney parks are continuing to thrive. The same would be the case in Hong Kong. Unfortunately, it doesn't appear Hong Kong will get that quality Disney product. If it fails, it will be because it is not up to true Disney standards, not because of problems with the economy.

 

[raidermatt]

Not up on HK's economy, so can't comment there.

However, vernon makes some excellent points that were brought up here quite awhile back:

Any foreign Disney park will decrease attendance at the domestic parks (particularly WDW) unless it manages to actually increase demand for more Disney.

Building obviously inferior parks IS HARMFUL TO THE DISNEY BRAND. Just as bulding or producing anything that doesn't live up to the Disney reputation is damaging to the brand (think direct to video sequels, parks, etc).

Of course, even with the best of intentions, mistakes will be made. But those can be overcome provided the intentions truly are "good", because there will be far more hits than misses.

Unfortunately, intentions are not very "good" right now, and the brand is being harmed to the long term detriment of all of the company.

 

[raidermatt]

My guess is that if Disney could have found an OLC willing to put up the bigger $'s in HK, they would have let them.

But I think AV's point is that Disney wants to spend as little as possible of their own money, and will let franchisees build under the same philosophy, if necessary. If somebody is willing to spend like OLC, certainly Disney will let them, but its apparently not a requirement.

Anyhow, for a poverty-stricken, communist, freedomless country, I'd say that HKDL sounds fine.

If your implied assumptions are true, does it make sense for Disney to build there at all? If you are BMW, do you build cars to a much lower standard to sell in China? Or would you be better off sticking to your core philosophy and only selling where you feel the market will support your product (or at least something very close to what you sell elsewhere)?

How is this park going to be priced?

 

[Cris]

Well interesting. Hopely it will never go through and it will be another lost project. Just a side note, the Gap only operates in six countries and Japan is the only Asian country.

 

[treesinger]

Abandon ship! Cheapening product to appeal to broader masses is almost always a sign of a company in a downward spiral.
Oddly, the thing that disgusts me most is Rodeo Drive USA. If I want to shop at the Gap, I'll go to the mall. And I never want to shop at the Gap.

 

[Mooobooks]

I've heard a very different story.
Disney is purposefully keeping the real extent of the park a closely-guarded secret and has many attractions planned which have not been disclosed. Only us Disney Geeks are jabbering about this now, and Disney couldn't care less about that.
You may be quite surprised when the Hong Kong Disneyland opens.

 

[space42]

Only us Disney Geeks are jabbering about this now, and Disney couldn't care less about that.

Then why would their website also reflect the same information as stated by AV and other 'insiders'?