Disney World on list of lowest-paying jobs

[WDSearcher]

Say what you want,it's still below poverty wages!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

DW is making there money without a doubt.But the trickledown pay scale don't reach the CM's at all....

And every single CM knows that going in. If they choose to take the job, then they have made that decision with all cards on the table.

Every single company out there pays its entry-level unskilled workers the lowest they possibly can. Disney didn't suddenly invent low-paying jobs.

 

[Lewisc]

If Disney was so serious about not tipping mousekeepers - and with the industry standard that tipping is acceptable, Disney would have instructions left in the room for each of us detailing their tipping guidelines so there would be absolutely no misunderstanding.

So far, I haven't found a document reminding me that tipping is forbidden, have you?


.....

A few years ago one of the FAQ brochures given to guests at check in had complete tipping guidelines. Waiter, bartender, bell services and valet Housekeeping wasn't listed.

Last time I checked the resort specific brochure given to guests at checkin specified gratuity not included when they listed services performed by CMs who work in a "tipped" positions; specifically bell services and valet. NO such mention is made in the section describing services provided by housekeeping.

It's considered appropriate to tip the desk clerk in cities like Las Vegas. Customers hope to get a complimentary room upgrade. Front desk clerks at Disney hotels aren't allowed to accept tips. Disney doesn't have a sign telling us not tip the CM who checks us in yet most of us have no doubt desk clerks aren't allowed to accept tips.

You have it backwards. Disney tells us which employees should be "tipped". There is no reason to give us a complete list of employees who don't work in a "tipped" position.

Most of the CMs we encounter don't get paid very much. Housekeepers (at Disney) aren't considered "tipped" employees. They're not paid very much, but most of the CMs we encounter aren't paid much either.

 

[nytimez]

A few years ago one of the FAQ brochures given to guests at check in had complete tipping guidelines. Waiter, bartender, bell services and valet Housekeeping wasn't listed.

Last time I checked the resort specific brochure given to guests at checkin specified gratuity not included when they listed services performed by CMs who work in a "tipped" positions; specifically bell services and valet. NO such mention is made in the section describing services provided by housekeeping.

Just because it's not singled out as a tipped position doesn't mean tipping is forbidden. I'd be more convinced if it said, "other employees are not allowed to accept gratuities."

 

[Ryansdad0727]

Disney is in a tough place with wages for general (not skilled) workers. Many general workers are college students or retired persons. Both categories recieve less pay from almost every business in america. Lets use a grocery store for comparison. A sacker will make minimum wage and if they want more money there are expected to learn and move up to cashier or stocker then move into produce or dairy and them into management. Each step makes them more money. Disney can't be expected to pay general workers who are between the ages of 25 to 50 more than college age or retirement age just because they are in thier prime earning age. Those CM's who start out in college certainly have the opportunity to move up.

 

[Lewisc]

Just because it's not singled out as a tipped position doesn't mean tipping is forbidden. I'd be more convinced if it said, "other employees are not allowed to accept gratuities."

My main point is housekeeping isn't a "tipped" position. Guests who chose not to tip housekeepers don't have any reason to justify their actions nor do they need to provide an excuse. There are some ignorant posters in this thread who try to equate stiffing a waiter/bellhop with not tipping a Disney housekeeper.

I have no idea which CMs are required to refuse a tip or which CMs are required to turn in their tips. A couple of credible posters were told by hotel managers that housekeepers are suppose to refuse tips.

There are a lot of CMS who don't get paid much more then minimum wage and who make our trip "magical". I don't see any reason why one CM who doesn't work in a "tipped" position is more entitled then a different CM also working in a position that' not "tipped". In other words why tip the person cleaning my room and not tip the person who clean the bathroom in a park.

People are certainly entitled to at least offer tips to employees not working in a "tipped" position including housekeepers and front desk clerks. They're not entitled to attack those posters/guests who limit their tips to CMs working in "tipped" positions.

 

[Lewisc]

A few years ago the NYTimes had an article comparing COSTCO and WalMart. Costco pays their employees almost 3X as much as Wal Mart. COSTCO offers health insurance. As another poster pointed out WalMarts health insurance is telling most of their employees to apply for medicaid. Service is better at COSTCO.

The question is if Disney guests (who pay $$$ for tickets,rooms and food) would get the level of service they're paying for if Disney either paid more or had more employees. Many posters have commented on a reduction in the level of service.

A poster in the transportation thread was staying at the POLY. Wanted to know if he should walk over the TTC and take the bus to DHS or if he should take the bus from the POLY to DHS. A poster works for the monorail. He insisted training told them there is no bus from any of the monorail resorts to DHS. No excuse for a trainer giving employees bad information. I don't know if paying more would lead to lower turnover and better service.

I agree with the previous posters. Employees agreed to work at that pay scale. The question is if pay scale is resulting in higher turnover and poor service.

 

[dvcblt93]

No offense to anyone on the College Program, cuz there are some great kids out there, but you cant expect excellent service with a staff who keeps turning over every 6 months!

And Disney is pushing for even more College kids and less FT employees!

I agree, ya get what ya pay for!

 

[nytimez]

People are certainly entitled to at least offer tips to employees not working in a "tipped" position including housekeepers and front desk clerks. They're not entitled to attack those posters/guests who limit their tips to CMs working in "tipped" positions.

I certainly agree there.

Not that this would happen at Disney, but in a lot of places I've traveled (other countries) a hotel tip is a silent bribe to keep people from stealing your stuff (and it doesn't always work). So I'm kind of in the habit.

I agree with the previous posters. Employees agreed to work at that pay scale. The question is if pay scale is resulting in higher turnover and poor service.

I agree here too. People signed up for it, they know what they're getting. However, when a company becomes as big as Disney, they can to a certain extent set the standard -- giving people fewer opportunities to seek better-paying jobs elsewhere (and many of those places also follow the "leader" when setting their own standards).

Also, we all agree we love Disney parks and the experience. Most of us do anyway. And many of us have had a few rotten experience here or there, and I think some of it could be avoided if more money was spent to attract a better quality of employee in some positions.

 

[skier_pete]

Here's my 2 cents:

Disney wages: Yes, the wage is barely above minimum wage, but the wage IS about the industry standard. Should Disney probably pay its employees above Industry standard...you could argue yes. But (1) you can pay people buckets of money and it doesn't make them good employees...I work in a union shop where people with little education make $50K base pay and into 6 figures with overtime...it doesn't stop them from griping and moaning about their jobs every chance they get...and from some of them being lousy workers...(2) if you raise everyone's pay significantly larger - prices rise, making it more expensive for everyone and the basis of a living wage goes up, so MAYBE you could argue that wages at Disney should be 10 % more than they are now, but even that wouldn't bring it above a low-paying job.

Employee treatment by the Company: I have no doubt that employees are treated worse at WDW now more than 10 years ago. This is standard across big business right now...treat employees with little regard for how it affects moral or productivity. Bad mistake IMO, but I am not going to these business schools that must be training management that staff moral is not important. My belief is that you should treat your employees very well, not necessarily via monetary compensation, but if you make employees like working at your company...you can then afford to NOT be the top wage payer...for example.

Tipping: While I'm not going to Tip every person I see...certain staff that are traditionally tipped (baggage people / housekeeping) I am going to tip and recommend anyone else to tip them. We stay value / mod and I typically tip $2-3 per night. Maybe not a lot, but I figure if everyone did that, these ladies would have a pretty good wage. Again, IMO if you are staying at a $200-400 a night room and use ANY excuse to decide that someone making $8.50 / hour doesn't rate being tipped, whether it's "I can't afford it" or "They're not a tipped position." you are without a doubt a rat-******* scumbag. Most of those people will NEVER be able to afford the vacation that you are currently enjoying...if you can't chip in a couple of bucks a day...well...I have no other words for you.

 

[Lewisc]

use ANY excuse to decide that someone making $8.50 / hour doesn't rate being tipped, whether it's "I can't afford it" or "They're not a tipped position." you are without a doubt a rat-******* scumbag. Most of those people will NEVER be able to afford the vacation that you are currently enjoying...if you can't chip in a couple of bucks a day...well...I have no other words for you.

Wow--That borders on a personal attack. I won't report it. I understand your post is based on ignorance not malice.

A "tipped" position has legal significance. An employer is allowed to pay a "tipped" employee a lower salary (sometimes lower the minimum wage). There are rules. Disney has decided not to categorize housekeeping as a tipped position.

Your comment is applicable to people who decide not to tip an employee in a "tipped" position such as a waiter.
You're out of line with respect to housekeeping. Disney has made it clear housekeeping is not a service for which guests are expected to tip for service.

There are some posters who said housekeepers are suppose to refuse tips if offered. I'm not sure if that's the policy.

Most of the CMs who serve us aren't paid a living wage. That includes housekeeping. It also includes the CM who serve us in a CS restaurant. It includes the CMs who clean the parks and public areas of the hotels. It probably includes the front desk clerk who checks us in. It probably includes the CMs who assist in the portrayal of various characters. There are numerous employees, in non tipped positions that might be worthy of a tip. No reason to single out housekeeping.

How dare you insult guests who follow Disney guidelines regarding tipping and not Pete's guidelines. You don't decide pay scale. You don't get to decide which positions are "tipped". You certainly don't get to insult guests who don't follow a policy you made up.

Disney made the decision not to consider housekeeping a tipped position.It's that simple.

I'm not sure if the hotels in California have the same policy. My point is limited to the Disney run hotels in the Orlando area.

 

[DizneeNutt]

Don't forget all the College Program kids making minimum wage! My daughter was one last year and took home about $200 a week.

 

[skier_pete]

Your comment is applicable to people who decide not to tip an employee in a "tipped" position such as a waiter.
You're out of line with respect to housekeeping. Disney has made it clear housekeeping is not a service for which guests are expected to tip for service.

There are some posters who said housekeepers are suppose to refuse tips if offered. I'm not sure if that's the policy.

First off it is not ignorance so perhaps it is malice (though personal it is not). I do understand the distinction in what Disney calls it, and I don't think that should make one inch of difference....a CM at Crystal Palace makes $3.50 an hour wage yet takes home $70- $100 thousand a year, thanks to tipping. A housekeeper at the Grand Floridian takes home about $18,000 a year in their non-tipped position (if no-one tips them). Disney DOES allow housekeeping personnel to accept tips, I know this as fact. Many positions are NOT allowed (guest services, transportation, ME), but this one is.

If I am someone that can afford a $5000-$10000 a week vacations at a Deluxe resort (which, I personally can't) and I think someone that makes $18,000 a year doesn't deserve a tip working a job that is normally considerd a tipped position throughout the industry, because corporate Disney says they don't? These same employees that make towel animals on their free time or do things like this below (in our room window last trip) to give pleasure to guests above and beyond their jobs?

I apologize if you think my words are too harsh or they are a personal attack (personal attacks are directed at specific person or persons, which I was not intending at anyone specifically). I did not direct my comments at any individual. Anyone can tip or not, that is their choice, but I am also allowed to think poorly of folks who clearly can afford to but don't using semantics as their reason.

I also apologize to all those reading this thread, as I should know enough to hold my electronic tongue else turn this thread into something its not supposed to be. I will stay out of this thread from now on, as I have stated my case twice now and have nothing further to add.

 

[Lewisc]

First off it is not ignorance so perhaps it is malice (though personal it is not). I do understand the distinction in what Disney calls it, and I don't think that should make one inch of difference....a CM at Crystal Palace makes $3.50 an hour wage yet takes home $70- $100 thousand a year, thanks to tipping. A housekeeper at the Grand Floridian takes home about $18,000 a year in their non-tipped position (if no-one tips them). Disney DOES allow housekeeping personnel to accept tips, I know this as fact. Many positions are NOT allowed (guest services, transportation, ME), but this one is.

If I am someone that can afford a $5000-$10000 a week vacations at a Deluxe resort (which, I personally can't) and I think someone that makes $18,000 a year doesn't deserve a tip working a job that is normally considerd a tipped position throughout the industry, because corporate Disney says they don't? These same employees that make towel animals on their free time or do things like this below (in our room window last trip) to give pleasure to guests above and beyond their jobs?


I apologize if you think my words are too harsh or they are a personal attack (personal attacks are directed at specific person or persons, which I was not intending at anyone specifically). I did not direct my comments at any individual. Anyone can tip or not, that is their choice, but I am also allowed to think poorly of folks who clearly can afford to but don't using semantics as their reason.

I also apologize to all those reading this thread, as I should know enough to hold my electronic tongue else turn this thread into something its not supposed to be. I will stay out of this thread from now on, as I have stated my case twice now and have nothing further to add.

It's not semantics. Disney doesn't consider housekeeping tipped position. There isn't any reason why a guest has to tip housekeeping. It's rude to attack a person who doesn't follow a policy that you made up. It's beyond rude to attack people who don't follow your rules considering the fact that you know your opinion doesn't coincide with the tipping policy Disney communicates with guests.

You were responding to my post, only logical I'd interpret that as a personal attack.

Disney doesn't follow industry custom in many area. CMs who check us in aren't suppose to accept tips. Tipping those employees is common in other cities. I've never stayed in concierge level but my understanding is those employees aren't suppose to accept tips. Concierge in other hotels are definitely tipped.

DME bus drivers are allowed to accept tips.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

That is not true. They are given to the housekeeper if they are under $25 but even then I know of instances where they were given regardless. The handbook may say something else, but this is how it has been the last 10 years. At the front desk, it is another story...tips have to be turned in - but many times the managers will just let the CM keep them. But, under no circumstances is any CM - whether tipped or otherwise allowed to solicit tips.

You said it yourself..."it might not be in the handbook"

the rejection of tips is in the company policies unless in a specific job classification.

Housekeepers get tipped all the time...and i have no problem with it. But disney's official policy is that they should not accept them.

the official policy is no tips...the unofficial is different. i'm not disagreeing here.

but it is difficult when people talk about wages or tipping guidelines...because disney's policies are - in many ways - against common sense or reality.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

Don't forget all the College Program kids making minimum wage! My daughter was one last year and took home about $200 a week.

Not for nothing....but the college program is a sham...always has been.

In few cases is it anything close to "internship"-type work and they pay them nothing with heavy federal subsidies.

And then they put these 18-25 (with international programs) into outsourced party compounds and deduct rent from them. And they tend to end up being introduced to a 3 month party that often looks like an episode of girls gone wild.

Most "alumni" won't admit to it....but that is EXACTLY what it is. Kinda a vacation...which is fine as long as everybody knows that and accepts no illusions.

 

[faneuil]

Not for nothing....but the college program is a sham...always has been.

I call it the slave labor program. I talk to a lot of CPers every trip, and they're all the same, exhausted and ready to go home.

I don't tip mousekeeping. Why? Because they do very little for me. I make my own bed. I reuse towels. I bring my own plates and cups, so there's nothing to replenish or clean. About the only thing they do is empty my trash, and I even have that bundled and ready to go for them. I make their lives as easy as possible, because I know how some guests are.

 

[LisaxMarie]

Ah, wow. But I heard Disney is one of the top happiest employees..At least they love their jobs.

 

[skiingfast]

No offense to anyone on the College Program, cuz there are some great kids out there, but you cant expect excellent service with a staff who keeps turning over every 6 months!

And Disney is pushing for even more College kids and less FT employees!

I agree, ya get what ya pay for!

I worked at a place that had a 90% seasonal work force. Winter and Summer. The problem was especially pronounced in winter. You get your new emplyees, train them into the holidays by the time the rush is done your are almost finished with the training periods. Then you keep them hanging on for the rest of the season.

This left months open where the trained employees have to find another job and aren't likely to need a job when we started the next season. The idea came up to get foreign students to work there. From the southern hemisphere in the winter, northern in the summer. When they weren't at school. Those employees since they were going back to school were much more likely to come back the next year, stalling the training problems.

Full time employees could solve the problem but the company couldn't pay them the whole year.

Disney has seasons too. CPs are a way to manage thier employment issues as well.

 

[ConcKahuna]

I worked for the mouse for nearly 11 years. When I left the company, I was working resort operations/club level concierge and making $12.85 an hour.

And remember, that's with almost 11 years of company time (Disney wages are only based off of job classification and company time). Because i was in Concierge, I got paid more than regular front desk CMs, and they get paid quite a bit more than the folks in the parks.

So remember that when you get on the next attraction. The folks who are responsible for your safety make next to nothing

 

[nytimez]

Ah, wow. But I heard Disney is one of the top happiest employees..At least they love their jobs.

Where did you hear that? They didn't make the Fortune Top 100 -- I don't think they ever have.

http://money.cnn.com/magazines/fortune/bestcompanies/2010/full_list/