Disney/Universal - competing technologies?

[wtg2000]

I've noticed over the years how similar style attractions pop up at Disney and Universal around the same time. For example, each has flight simulators, 4-D movies, shooters (Buzz/Black) and moving vehicles that do all sorts of things (Indy/Spidey).

What I'm leading to is do you think that Disney Imagineers had the ability to make a Spiderman all along? It's a fanstastic ride and very well executed but I'm wondering if the cleverness lies in the technology or in the combination of technologies. I don't know exactly how it works, but it seems to me it's an Indy Jones type ride system combined with 3-D screens and other effects. Maybe there's more to it.

Anyway, years ago when trying to dream up news rides we'd like to see at Disney I suggested a car that runs along a roller coaster track and has the scenes projected on the inside of the windshield and side windows- essentially a travelling flight simulator. Thus, I would imagine that someone at Imagineering thought up an idea similar to Spiderman but got beaten to the punch. Do you think Disney would come out with a smililar ride technology-wise or is it something Universal would patent, or would Disney not want to admit they were beaten to the punch?

 

[HB2K]

Anyway, years ago when trying to dream up news rides we'd like to see at Disney I suggested a car that runs along a roller coaster track and has the scenes projected on the inside of the windshield and side windows- essentially a travelling flight simulator. Thus, I would imagine that someone at Imagineering thought up an idea similar to Spiderman but got beaten to the punch. Do you think Disney would come out with a smililar ride technology-wise or is it something Universal would patent, or would Disney not want to admit they were beaten to the punch?

It was drempt up by Imagineers. They just were laid off and went to work for Universal.

I think Disney has about as much a chance of getting something like this off the flatboard and into their parks as the carosel of progress has of opening full time again.

It ain't going to happen.

A ride like spidey is very intricate and VERY custom work...i.e. you can't just go buy one from the Premier Rides Catalog. Disney seems very UN-inclined to make these kinds of R&D investments anymore.

Here's an idea as well....have any of the imagineers thought about forming their own company (ala the creators of Lilo & Stitch)?

 

[bbchurch]

Don't forget that Spiderman took well over $100 million to build. I seriously doubt that Disney would be willing to put that kind of money into a single attration that everyone would say was a copycat of Universal.

 

[HauntedMansionFan]

Originally posted by HB2K
It was drempt up by Imagineers. They just were laid off and went to work for Universal.

Actually that is a common mis-conception. The only ride that the laid off Imagineers took to Universal was Dueling Dragons which was originally supposed to go into Animal Kingdom.

 

[pheneix]

The Spiderman scoop is a patented ride system from Universal Creative. Some Landmark Entertainment people actually conceptualized the ride system, but Universal Creative actually produced the ride system.

While the scoop is a moving simulator in the vein of the EMV, how it goes about making those movements is entirely different. Remember that the scoop has the ability to spin 360 degrees on an axis, something that the EMV lacks.

But while we're on the subject, a growing number of people from Imagineering are defecting to Universal Creative. In all honesty, if they ever want to use their imagination and create unique experiences for the 21st century Universal is rapidly becoming the only game in town.

 

[HauntedMansionFan]

Originally posted by pheneix
But while we're on the subject, a growing number of people from Imagineering are defecting to Universal Creative. In all honesty, if they ever want to use their imagination and create unique experiences for the 21st century Universal is rapidly becoming the only game in town.

I'll give you that much.

I read a book about a year back, the name escapes me. "Behind The Magic, Downfall of the Mouse" I think was the name, but I think I might be waaaaaay off. It talks about the shift of imagineers from Disney to Universal around the time that Animal Kingdom was on the drawing boards. It goes into detail about the ideas for Dueling Dragons and other things that were brought over to Universal Creative. Quite an interesting read, I will have to double check on the title.

 

[Bob O]

I do think disney could create a ride as good as Spiderman if they had the will to do so. But now they are much more concerned with money then creating anything unqiue for their theme parks that they have to pay for!!!
So they willjust rest on their laurels and let others create unique theme park attractions, of course they will throw us a spining ride or a cloned cosaster every now and then to try and be relevant.

 

[OnWithTheShow]

Frankly as much as I love Spiderman I think Indy is a much better attraction. The 3D effects are nice but I prefer the realism of Indy.

 

[Peter Pirate]

My daughter (13 year old) agrees with you Show. So not everyone thinks Spidey is the epitome. She thinks they're very close but prefers Indy by a smidge...

 

[YoHo]

Indy has an atvantage, because it's based on real people from the beginning. Spidey is a comicbook character only recently made a live action film. Plus, the dangers presented in Indy are realistic in a bizarre sort of way.

 

[Dznefreek]

Indy has an atvantage, because it's based on real people from the beginning

Uh, I hate to tell you but he is a character created by George Lucas.

 

[YoHo]

I'm going to assume that you are just needling me to be funny, but I'll explain for the others who maybe don't get what I'm saying.

Indiana Jones from initial conception was played by a live human being, specifically Harison Ford. Spiderman started out as a comic book character, and was only later played by a human actor (multiple human actors, but none the less, its primary association is in comicbook form.) The fact that Indy is from the beginning a live person makes it easier to suspend reality on the ride. Thus, Indiana Jones has an advantage.

 

[#1MMFan]

In case you hadn't noticed, *some* of Disney's money has probably gone to creating Disney's Calfornia Adventure, the Walt Disney Studios, Tokyo Disney Sea and the future Hong Kong Disneyland.

I wouldn't knock the fact that they haven't spent more money on unique rides. What about Mission: Space, Test Track, Rock'n'roller, a revamp of Tower of Terror and a potentially more elaborate version in DCA, the future E-ticket attaction just announced on WDWMagic for Animal Kingdom.

I think it'll take a while before Universal comes close to Disney. You can't do that much without the land either, somewhere you'll plateau off.

Also, I agree with one of the previous posters; Universal CMs are WAY behind Disney. I always get the feeling Universal is simply out to make money, but regardless of the actual truth I never feel that at Disney.

JMHO

#1MMFan

 

[YoHo]

but regardless of the actual truth I never feel that at Disney.

Give it some time.

 

[Bob O]

Their is nothing unique at all about RNRC, its a clone of a similiar coaster that vekoma built for Six Flags parks. The only thing different is that it is inside az biulding which again is nothing new, now Dueling Dragons was a first, inverted racing coasters and so was the Hulk due to its unique launch system for the ride.
And if what i read is true isnt the version in DCA of TOT a more dumb-downed version and not a new and improved version of TOT???

 

[HauntedMansionFan]

Originally posted by Bob O
now Dueling Dragons was a first, inverted racing coasters and so was the Hulk due to its unique launch system for the ride.

Both are one trick ponies. After the launch on Hulk it is your standard coaster found at any Six Flags, same with Dueling Dragons, besides the elaborately themed que line and the "duel", it is another off the shelf Six Flags coaster. And no, Dueling Dragons weren't the first actual "dueling" coasters as Universal would like you to believe.

Universal CMs are WAY behind Disney

Amen to that, learn to smile and look interested when asked a question for goodness sakes!

And if what i read is true isnt the version in DCA of TOT a more dumb-downed version and not a new and improved version of TOT???

I wouldn't say dumbed down, just different. They are removing the 5th dimention area and replacing that with a new disappearing special effect in the drop shaft. But compare either version of TOT to what Universal has: Dr. Doom? Oh boy an off the shelf launch ride that only hits 150 feet, a few feet taller then TOT, but WAY smaller then anything at a Six Flags park.

Their is nothing unique at all about RNRC, its a clone of a similiar coaster that vekoma built for Six Flags parks.

While we are on the subject, Superman: The Ride is a clone of RNRC, not the other way around. Imagineering worked closely with Vekoma on the layout, car design, and launching techniques.

 

[pheneix]

>>>While we are on the subject, Superman: The Ride is a clone of RNRC<<<

No, its not. RnRC is a standard catalog coaster that Imagineering "dressed up like a Christmas tree," as AV likes to put it.

And it is a total shame that Burbank would not allow Disney to work with a better company, because Vekoma is total trash.

 

[space42]

Originally posted by pheneix
>>>While we are on the subject, Superman: The Ride is a clone of RNRC<<<

No, its not. RnRC is a standard catalog coaster that Imagineering "dressed up like a Christmas tree," as AV likes to put it.

And it is a total shame that Burbank would not allow Disney to work with a better company, because Vekoma is total trash.

Even with these 'problems', *I* still feel RnRC is a better *attraction* than any of the IOA coasters. They may have bought better coasters but there was no attempt the theme them other than the queue.

 

[EUROPA]

Originally posted by HauntedMansionFan
Both are one trick ponies. After the launch on Hulk it is your standard coaster found at any Six Flags, same with Dueling Dragons, besides the elaborately themed que line and the "duel", it is another off the shelf Six Flags coaster. And no, Dueling Dragons weren't the first actual "dueling" coasters as Universal would like you to believe.

Bet you can't find one coaster with the same layout as the Hulk. Go ahead check every Six Flags out there.

Dueling Dragons was the first " Dueling Inverted Coaster" Go ahead check every Six Falgs out there again. try to find the same layout as Dueling Dragons.


See that is the difference. With the Disney Coasters you can find the exact same ride, layout and launch at Six Flags. You can't do that with Hulk or DD. With Disney you get a nice big building around it with neon signs.

 

[HauntedMansionFan]

Originally posted by pheneix
No, its not. RnRC is a standard catalog coaster that Imagineering "dressed up like a Christmas tree," as AV likes to put it.

A "standard" that will still the first in its class for Vekoma and made its debut at MGM Studios.

And it is a total shame that Burbank would not allow Disney to work with a better company, because Vekoma is total trash.

Total trash? Wow... who would have thought that Space Mountain at DLP was total trash. I hope that Vekoma's new work on Space Mountain at Hong Kong Disneyland doesn't suffer the same fate.

As far as I'm concerned, Vekoma along with Arrow have always been leaders in roller coaster design and technology.