DAS Approval/Denial with New DAS Guidelines START 5/20 WDW & 6/18 DL

[lanejudy]

I give @carlyannek the benefit of the doubt that her recounting that the CM pushed her to give a diagnosis is accurate.

I never discounted that it wasn’t! My original posts on the matter clarified neurological and cognitive are different because the poster indicated the terms are interchangeable and others suggested her meaning should have been obvious by context - of which we know nothing. Wow, what some folks will read into a post!

 

[nalababybear]

All of my responses on this topic have been in response to what the PP shared regarding being pressed to *give* a diagnosis, which has been discussed at length here is not what the process is supposed to be.


The PP shared in a further post that the CM stated they could only give DAS for autism, which is also incorrect and inconsistent information coming from the CM.

I would think we can all agree that these responses from the CM are not reflective of what the DAS process has been or is supposed to be, as it's always supposed to have been about need, NOT diagnosis.

It's the narrow threading the needle Disney is looking for....saying autism or equivalent without saying autism.

People need to remember that the tier 1 CMs
probably early level CMs appearing following a flowsheet. They are certainly allowing the time and space for the requestor to get there, but they need the caller to get there....otherwise the DAS denial and other accommodations are offered.

Will there develop some magic word spreadsheet and get disseminated? Probably. It is inevitable as folk have pointed out over again the incentive to lie/cheat/beg for a free superior product is high reward, low risk at this time.

DAS advocates have made enough inroads to get direct callbacks from d 'amaro office this week.

How this will settle out by the fall will be interesting to see.

Remember for those calling, write down your talking points on the why remaining in a standard queue cannot be accomplished and be ready to give examples of why and how you've tried to deploy support systems and how those cannot mitigate successfully issues preventing you to remain in a standard.queue

CM will give.you the space and time. Just get to your points.

 

[Angel Ariel]

I never discounted that it wasn’t! My original posts on the matter clarified neurological and cognitive are different because the poster indicated the terms are interchangeable and others suggested her meaning should have been obvious by context - of which we know nothing. Wow, what some folks will read into a post!

I'm honestly going to say I'm baffled and also feel you've read a lot into my posts that wasn't there.

Clearly we both feel the other isn't understanding, so I'm sorry for that.

 

[voxparse]

Got through immediately today for WDW. Was declined pretty quickly. What I found interesting was she was pushing for diagnosis information. I said, “can you ask me for my diagnosis?” And she said “over chat, no, because that is recorded, but over the zoom I can ask you whatever I want.” I described my issues in great detail, but ultimately she was hung up on my use of the word neurological instead of cognitive. I said I use them interchangeably, but she said, nope, have a magical day.

Obviously I wasn’t on your call but man that gives me vibes like she was trying to help you find a way to get approved by trying to get you to use different words. Not being able to ask in chat isn’t a nefarious thing, it’s legal. If you write down your diagnosis where it is stored on their system they now have to manage protected medical data. If you say it in a video that isn’t recorded they have no stewardship concerns. That said you are within your rights to share what you are comfortable sharing but the CM might have felt a diagnosis would help her guide you better.

If the CM was just going to reject it no matter what I can’t imagine they would bother with more than the standard questions. They ask clarifying questions when the need is unclear or they think the issue is borderline and they are trying to figure out which way it will land. My CM didn’t ask any clarifying questions and outright said it wasn’t being granted and I suspect this will happen to anyone that is applying without any cognitive impairments.

Again I wasn’t there and I’m sorry it didn’t work out but if she said something like “do you mean cognitive?” I think she might have been trying to lead you. Next time, and I would absolutely call back after you have enough time to reflect, use the words she gave you. She was telling you how to be approved. And if they ask why you are calling back you just explain that you don’t feel you represented your issues well and would appreciate a further discussion (even if you did represent them well self humility goes a long way with customer service). The odds are against you but if it is important and you can’t manage a trip without DAS I would expect it is worth it.

Though I was rejected, my CM was clearly and in detail laying out ways I could receive DAS like accommodations without DAS. She didn’t come out and say it because she can’t but it was clear what she was telling me. I won’t go into detail for obvious reasons but I assure you these conversations have a lot of subtext.

Maybe I just got a cool CM and yours sucked, totally possible but don’t ever give up advocating for yourself.

 

[Angel Ariel]

DAS advocates have made enough inroads to get direct callbacks from d 'amaro office this week.

That's interesting to know - but probably more for the other thread

 

[carlyannek]

Wow, what some folks will read into a post!

Totally. Like inferring what someone’s doctor meant, or presuming that someone believes that cognitive is a synonym for neuro based off a quick recap shared on here meant to help others.

Thank you to those of you who have showed me kindness today. I am removing myself from this conversation because it has actually caused more distress defending myself than it seemingly has helped others, which was my intent.

P.s. is there a way to delete my account on here? I don’t think this is the forum for me.

 

[carlyannek]

Obviously I wasn’t on your call but man that gives me vibes like she was trying to help you find a way to get approved by trying to get you to use different words. Not being able to ask in chat isn’t a nefarious thing, it’s legal. If you write down your diagnosis where it is stored on their system they now have to manage protected medical data. If you say it in a video that isn’t recorded they have no stewardship concerns. That said you are within your rights to share what you are comfortable sharing but the CM might have felt a diagnosis would help her guide you better.

If the CM was just going to reject it no matter what I can’t imagine they would bother with more than the standard questions. They ask clarifying questions when the need is unclear or they think the issue is borderline and they are trying to figure out which way it will land. My CM didn’t ask any clarifying questions and outright said it wasn’t being granted and I suspect this will happen to anyone that is applying without any cognitive impairments.

Again I wasn’t there and I’m sorry it didn’t work out but if she said something like “do you mean cognitive?” I think she might have been trying to lead you. Next time, and I would absolutely call back after you have enough time to reflect, use the words she gave you. She was telling you how to be approved. And if they ask why you are calling back you just explain that you don’t feel you represented your issues well and would appreciate a further discussion (even if you did represent them well self humility goes a long way with customer service). The odds are against you but if it is important and you can’t manage a trip without DAS I would expect it is worth it.

Though I was rejected, my CM was clearly and in detail laying out ways I could receive DAS like accommodations without DAS. She didn’t come out and say it because she can’t but it was clear what she was telling me. I won’t go into detail for obvious reasons but I assure you these conversations have a lot of subtext.

Maybe I just got a cool CM and yours sucked, totally possible but don’t ever give up advocating for yourself.

She did not ask clarifying questions. She declined me and said it’s for autism only. She asked me what my diagnosis was, and I questioned if she could ask that. I repeated what I said at the beginning of the call stating what kind of disability it was, and she stopped me when I said neurological and developmental, stating it needed to be cognitive. I clarified that to ME, I use them interchangeably.

 

[voxparse]

She did not ask clarifying questions. She declined me and said it’s for autism only. She asked me what my diagnosis was, and I questioned if she could ask that. I repeated what I said at the beginning of the call stating what kind of disability it was, and she stopped me when I said neurological and developmental, stating it needed to be cognitive. I clarified that to ME, I use them interchangeably.

Fair enough.

 

[stenickar]

Well after almost 11 hours of waiting to get a Disneyland CM, my kiddo is going to bed, so I am throwing in the towel. I think we may just wait and try in person.

I had to do that also, my 8 year old can’t stay up past 8, she gets up anywhere between 4 -5:30 AM. She is done by 7pm.

 

[stenickar]

She did not ask clarifying questions. She declined me and said it’s for autism only. She asked me what my diagnosis was, and I questioned if she could ask that. I repeated what I said at the beginning of the call stating what kind of disability it was, and she stopped me when I said neurological and developmental, stating it needed to be cognitive. I clarified that to ME, I use them interchangeably.

It isn’t just for autism ( or cognitive impairment, as the website claims) , as my daughter has both and was denied

 

[Goldelpack]

There's been a lot of statements on this important topic across the internet lately. It seems that some forums and discussions (posters) are 100% positive that "only autism" qualifies. However others have clearly said they were approved based on their very specific needs and autism wasn't a part of it. For the unfortunate guests who've gotten unprofessional and inappropriate treatment on this, by all means you should document in writing with the name, time and method of contact.
On the other hand, it's a good idea to make as many contingency plans for your own specific needs. As a travel destination for millions of visitors it's really not surprising that everyone's specific needs aren't always met.
When it became obvious that thousands of those million visitors were abusing a system, it's little surprise it was reformatted. It's also important for us to consider that Disney is still offering options although perhaps not the same. And again it's up to us as vacationers to come up with contingency plans.
For myself, I adjust particular meds before my trip that are useful for me in mitigation of some issues. I add some meds and otc aids. I stop in a restroom before every attraction whether or not I need to. I use a scooter 95% of my time there... Which causes other issues. So I bring 2 wrist/thumb braces to try to prevent stuck joints among other durable medical things.

And we all should know that people can and do misinterpret things.

 

[SueM in MN]

Definitely one to write a complaint about...
Telling you that she cannot type that question because it is recorded, but she can when it is not recorded. Huge huge red flag.
And if she cannot handle people using their own words and not the terminology she is trained on second red flag….

The bolded point isn’t a red flag.
Anything written in the text chat is permanently part of that guest’s chat.
Any other CMs who have access to the Chat function in the Disney app can see & read anything that was written in chat.
Anyone who has access to your account (like friend/family logged into your account) can also see the information.
Guests requesting DAS via video chat have always been told NOT to type any medical information into the text chat.
The ‘I can ask whatever I want in the Zoom’ likely wasn’t stated well and was understood differently than it was meant.

She was giving Roz from Monsters Inc. Blank stare, monotone, I felt like my presence was an inconvenience to her. I began by stating that I get overwhelmed discussing my needs and if it was ok I was going to read a statement about my needs prepared by myself and my doctor. She did not respond and just stared at me, eventually nodding once.

The underlined was probably a red flag for the CM and she didn’t know how to respond.
There has been a lot of discussion on some Facebook pages where people discussed plans to include a doctor letter (or even have their doctor on the call) to intimidate the CM or use as the start of a lawsuit if they are not given DAS.
I AM NOT suggesting that you intended to do this, but it may have been interpreted by the CM that way.

Except Disney's wording does not use the word cognitive.

"DAS is one of the programs offered at Walt Disney World Resort theme parks intended to accommodate those Guests who, due to a developmental disability like autism are unable to wait in a conventional queue for an extended period of time."

Developmental disabilities can be neurological but not cognitive. They can also be cognitive but not neurological. They can also be both cognitive and neurological.

Disney needs to be consistent with its own application of its policy. If Disney intends to mean a person needs to have an intellectual disability to qualify, then that needs to be clear - but developmental and cognitive aren't interchangeable either, and Disney chose to use developmental.

I think Disney used those words as examples, not as absolutes. If a CM is being very obtuse about the words used, that might be a CM issue or more like what @voxparse wrote

If she knew your doc helped draft the statement (which you told her at the outset), I can see why she instantly denied. The doc, who should be an expert on explaining needs, did not reference anything that she was in a position to approve. So, it was a denial.

I would not bother calling back until you have visited the parks and used the alternate accommodations - you are unlikely to get a different answer. However, if you feel you were not treated correctly on the call, I would inform Disney of that aspect of the interaction in advance of your park visit.

That’s possible in addition to what I wrote above.
People have reported trying the alternative suggestions, kept track of what worked and didn’t work and then called back to discuss

 

[gottalovepluto]

My jaw dropped when she asked me. I said “i don’t think you can ask me that” and that was her response. I was gobsmacked. Said they would only approve for autism, and because I had not said the word autism she would not approve me.

In this case I would not be afraid to call back and talk to a different CM as you did not have a proper interview.

 

[lanejudy]

REPOSTING AGAIN

Correct. Please take speculative posts to another thread. Such discussions are not helpful to folks trying to find real information about the current DAS situation.

Thank you.

Further discussion about speculation of future changes will be removed.

 

[Just_another_figment]

Daughter was approved for DAS this morning. She did most of the talking herself, as she has to learn how to self-advocate, and she was able to explain her need for the DAS which is fairly unique so I won’t go into it here.
Developmental/Cognitive disability similar to autism.
Easy process, just like the last time, I didn’t even notice any new questions, but maybe my daughter answered them before they could be asked.

While being granted DAS, we also were sent info in quiet areas, rider swap, return to queue.

 

[Kooks and Bay Bay]

Except Disney's wording does not use the word cognitive.

"DAS is one of the programs offered at Walt Disney World Resort theme parks intended to accommodate those Guests who, due to a developmental disability like autism are unable to wait in a conventional queue for an extended period of time."

Developmental disabilities can be neurological but not cognitive. They can also be cognitive but not neurological. They can also be both cognitive and neurological.

Disney needs to be consistent with its own application of its policy. If Disney intends to mean a person needs to have an intellectual disability to qualify, then that needs to be clear - but developmental and cognitive aren't interchangeable either, and Disney chose to use developmental.

A developmental disability can also be PHYSICAL but they also don't seem to recognize that so yeah I agree they need to make themselves very clear in their wording if they are going to deny people that have developmental disabilities that do not fall under their very specific mindset.

 

[SueM in MN]

DS (adult) with developmental disorder/cognitive impairment has had DAS and its previous iterations since he was very young. He was approved today at DL under the new system. I have been through this process countless times, but I will admit being anxious and surprisingly nervous. I think I rambled, but it was all good. Not looking forward to doing it again in 120 days (or the next time we go after that).

My youngest daughter has been approved under both the 'old' program (GAC) and DAS for many years. But, each time, I've been anxious and nervous because I knew there was a chance of not being approved.

A developmental disability can also be PHYSICAL but they also don't seem to recognize that so yeah I agree they need to make themselves very clear in their wording if they are going to deny people that have developmental disabilities that do not fall under their very specific mindset.

This is a thread for experiences being approved and denied, not discussion about wording.
BUT, since it keeps getting brought up, I'm going to try to clarify with an example of one specific diagnosis/disability.

Disney's websites say:
"DAS is one of the programs offered at Walt Disney World Resort theme parks intended to accommodate those Guests who, due to a developmental disability like autism are unable to wait in a conventional queue for an extended period of time."

Cerebral Palsy (CP) is a developmental disability by any definition. When people think of CP, they usually think of the physical side of it.
1) For some people with CP, their major (or only) manifestation of CP is physical. One of the doctors who cared for my daughter in the past had CP. His caused weakness in one leg and he wore a brace/AFO to support that leg. I don't know if he used any other accommodations during surgery, but in general orthopedic surgeries are long and require a fair amount of strength and dexterity.
If someone with that type of CP involvement needed accommodation at Disney parks, it would most likely be to help with support and fatigue - a mobility device.

2) Some people with CP have varying levels of physical involvement, but also have cognitive issues associated with their CP.
That is the category my youngest daughter is in. Her CP type is mixed, predominantly spastic quad. That means she has a mixture of low tone (floppy like a rag doll) and spasticity (stiff like a Barbie doll) and she fluctuates between high and low tone. QUAD refers to involvement of all 4 extremities (or in her case, her entire body).
She is a full time wheelchair user because she can't stand or walk. If that was her only disability, we would just use her wheelchair without need for further accommodations since lines/attractions are accessible.
She also has cognitive involvement which affects her ability to wait n line; that is what we explain to the CMs when requesting DAS.

Disney isn't ignoring physical disabilities - they are saying that there are different ways outside of DAS that can be used to meet those needs. That is NOT a violation of the ADA; the ADA requires a lot of things like ramps, transfer devices, etc. to make environments physically accessible. Some people with disabilities that are mostly physical have been able to explain their additional needs and get DAS.
Just having a diagnosis of autism, developmental or cognitive disability doesn't mean automatic DAS approval. Guests still need to explain their needs/concerns with waiting in lines.

Now, back to reports of approval or denial

 

[Kooks and Bay Bay]

My youngest daughter has been approved under both the 'old' program (GAC) and DAS for many years. But, each time, I've been anxious and nervous because I knew there was a chance of not being approved.

This is a thread for experiences being approved and denied, not discussion about wording.
BUT, since it keeps getting brought up, I'm going to try to clarify with an example of one specific diagnosis/disability.

Disney's websites say:
"DAS is one of the programs offered at Walt Disney World Resort theme parks intended to accommodate those Guests who, due to a developmental disability like autism are unable to wait in a conventional queue for an extended period of time."

Cerebral Palsy (CP) is a developmental disability by any definition. When people think of CP, they usually think of the physical side of it.
1) For some people with CP, their major (or only) manifestation of CP is physical. One of the doctors who cared for my daughter in the past had CP. His caused weakness in one leg and he wore a brace/AFO to support that leg. I don't know if he used any other accommodations during surgery, but in general orthopedic surgeries are long and require a fair amount of strength and dexterity.
If someone with that type of CP involvement needed accommodation at Disney parks, it would most likely be to help with support and fatigue - a mobility device.

2) Some people with CP have varying levels of physical involvement, but also have cognitive issues associated with their CP.
That is the category my youngest daughter is in. Her CP type is mixed, predominantly spastic quad. That means she has a mixture of low tone (floppy like a rag doll) and spasticity (stiff like a Barbie doll) and she fluctuates between high and low tone. QUAD refers to involvement of all 4 extremities (or in her case, her entire body).
She is a full time wheelchair user because she can't stand or walk. If that was her only disability, we would just use her wheelchair without need for further accommodations since lines/attractions are accessible.
She also has cognitive involvement which affects her ability to wait n line; that is what we explain to the CMs when requesting DAS.

Disney isn't ignoring physical disabilities - they are saying that there are different ways outside of DAS that can be used to meet those needs. That is NOT a violation of the ADA; the ADA requires a lot of things like ramps, transfer devices, etc. to make environments physically accessible. Some people with disabilities that are mostly physical have been able to explain their additional needs and get DAS.
Just having a diagnosis of autism, developmental or cognitive disability doesn't mean automatic DAS approval. Guests still need to explain their needs/concerns with waiting in lines.

Now, back to reports of approval or denial

In one breath you say this is not the place and the next breath you still entertain the discussion.

Yes but as has been pointed out in the past there are physical developmental disabilities that a mobility device is not needed but waiting in the standby line may still be difficult.
Again if Disney wants to make DAS be for a very few specific persons then they need to elaborate and be very specific with their wording.
They should not use the word developmental. They should use the word cognitive if that is what they mean.

 

[lanejudy]

In one breath you say this is not the place and the next breath you still entertain the discussion.

Yes but as has been pointed out in the past there are physical developmental disabilities that a mobility device is not needed but waiting in the standby line may still be difficult.
Again if Disney wants to make DAS be for a very few specific persons then they need to elaborate and be very specific with their wording.
They should not use the word developmental. They should use the word cognitive if that is what they mean.

I took my response to the other thread:
https://www.disboards.com/threads/d...l-june-18-2024.3943880/page-432#post-65594856

 

[KPeterso]

So I took my mom to Disneyland yesterday. I had previously applied for das a couple weeks ago and was denied (as expected) but had chatted with the cast member and she thought mom would be approved. So we got there early and had a really nice cast member, I parked her in her wheelchair a few feet away and did all the talking and she was approved. The cast member was super nice and made sure I understood everything. He also told me that we could make use of location return times with the wheelchair. I said that kind of seemed like double dipping and he winked at me so i guess that was his way of saying it was ok?! So we are now good until 11/1. Asked about our wdw trip in September and the cast member said I would need to make the call but tell them we already have one at Disneyland and they should be able to see it and add to our wdw account. But my previous cast member had said different. Either way I will call in mid August about the trip.

One note of interest (that the cast member told me) about the long wait times for the video wait times at Disneyland was that they only have the set up and space for 8 cast members to be taking calls. Very much explains the insane waits. In person, we got there maybe 10-15 minutes before the parks opened and only waited about 20 or so minutes in the line.