Dad being scammed - long - sorry

[DadScam]

I am posting this under a new name because my user name would allow an internet search to identify me and under the circumstances that isn’t wise.

My dad is almost 80. He appears to be fully competent in most ways but this one. He is located in New Mexico and was contacted by an old “friend” who had a third party on the line we will call JM. His old “friend” said the new person, JM, needed business advice. The old friend then dropped off and left JM and my dad on the line alone. In the end JM asked my dad for a loan of several thousand dollars for a business venture.

JM talks to my dad on an almost daily basis and my dad has become part of his “business” which is manufacturing parts for a big company involved in racing. The stories didn’t add up. Through review on the internet JM was found to have committed theft by deception in addition to other things including battery. (there are other irregularities but this is long enough) Additionally, this person provided a “contract” to my dad between this big company and JM. I contacted the company and sent a copy of the contract. Their legal team contacted me and said the contract was fake. They advised that my dad should contact law enforcement. The big company’s legal area will issue a cease and desist but won’t pursue legally as they are not out any money. The big company will speak to law enforcement or provide an affidavit that the contract was falsified.

I contacted my dad and advised the contract false etc. At first my dad believed this was a scam, but then contacted JM and JM explained it all away by saying he (JM) didn’t know how to explain how the business worked. JM said no contract ever existed (despite the fact that he sent a copy to my dad, which I have a copy of). My dad has given just under a hundred grand to this person. My dad fully believes this is legitimate. Additionally my dad wanted me to go up (we are within 6 hours of JM) to oversee things for a cut of the “profit”. I said no. I think it is dangerous to let JM know who I am etc. JM has a lot of money riding on this, and knows that I contacted the big company and found out that the contract was fake. I don’t care about the money (my dad has never shared his money with me and as I see it, it is his to spend) but it is a barrier in our relationship because my dad believes I don’t want to help him. Besides that, JM is stealing from him. My dad thinks he will make millions on this deal…

So question – should I just let it drop? Is there some place I could report it on my own for investigation even though I am not the victim? My dad is not incompetent so I can’t pursue anything like a Power of Attorney. I am so frustrated by this situation but honestly don’t think anything will convince my dad that this is a scam.

 

[Mermaid02]

I am posting this under a new name because my user name would allow an internet search to identify me and under the circumstances that isn’t wise.

My dad is almost 80. He appears to be fully competent in most ways but this one. He is located in New Mexico and was contacted by an old “friend” who had a third party on the line we will call JM. His old “friend” said the new person, JM, needed business advice. The old friend then dropped off and left JM and my dad on the line alone. In the end JM asked my dad for a loan of several thousand dollars for a business venture.

JM talks to my dad on an almost daily basis and my dad has become part of his “business” which is manufacturing parts for a big company involved in racing. The stories didn’t add up. Through review on the internet JM was found to have committed theft by deception in addition to other things including battery. (there are other irregularities but this is long enough) Additionally, this person provided a “contract” to my dad between this big company and JM. I contacted the company and sent a copy of the contract. Their legal team contacted me and said the contract was fake. They advised that my dad should contact law enforcement. The big company’s legal area will issue a cease and desist but won’t pursue legally as they are not out any money. The big company will speak to law enforcement or provide an affidavit that the contract was falsified.

I contacted my dad and advised the contract false etc. At first my dad believed this was a scam, but then contacted JM and JM explained it all away by saying he (JM) didn’t know how to explain how the business worked. JM said no contract ever existed (despite the fact that he sent a copy to my dad, which I have a copy of). My dad has given just under a hundred grand to this person. My dad fully believes this is legitimate. Additionally my dad wanted me to go up (we are within 6 hours of JM) to oversee things for a cut of the “profit”. I said no. I think it is dangerous to let JM know who I am etc. JM has a lot of money riding on this, and knows that I contacted the big company and found out that the contract was fake. I don’t care about the money (my dad has never shared his money with me and as I see it, it is his to spend) but it is a barrier in our relationship because my dad believes I don’t want to help him. Besides that, JM is stealing from him. My dad thinks he will make millions on this deal…

So question – should I just let it drop? Is there some place I could report it on my own for investigation even though I am not the victim? My dad is not incompetent so I can’t pursue anything like a Power of Attorney. I am so frustrated by this situation but honestly don’t think anything will convince my dad that this is a scam.

I would indeed pursue it or pretty soon your Dad will have nothing left. I would also contact the original "old friend" and give him a piece of my mind.

 

[DadScam]

But i don't know how - I thought when I got confirmation from the company that my dad would stop his involvement and pursue action but it didn't work.

I don't know my dad's old friend. My parents divorced and he moved away. This old friend was someone he knew in another state before he moved to NM. But I agree - he was not a friend...

 

[Mermaid02]

Go to the police with any info you have- I'm sure this isnt' the first time this guy has done this.

 

[Lintasare]

You say he is in NM? I would contact the NM Attorney General's office and possibly his congressman.

 

[a1tinkfans]

this is a sad situation. Likely ending in the loss of your dads finances, self esteem (he will eventually learn he was taken and think how he could have been so trusting), and lets hope he will keep his home/place he lives, without being totally wiped out.

Law enforcement will take a report and perhaps persue it, at least making a "call on" your dad and perhaps telling him to get out (maybe he could be implicated in their scheme if not out of it???).
Scarier to me is that they know where he is, have his account info now (unless he gave cash) and such.
You getting involved ....further puts you/your family at risk...so that may be a consideration for you, if you are a family, I would be sure to discuss this with your partner.
I am so saddened to hear when anyone is taken advantage of, more so, the elderly who have worked and saved and are then left penniless, very very sad
I will pray for you all, best of luck in this!
so many scams out there, we are in economic desperate times, and thieves prey on elderly, trusting people.......

 

[a1tinkfans]

Go to the police with any info you have- I'm sure this isnt' the first time this guy has done this.

 

[wdwmom0f3]

Do you think that you could get someone from the large company to send him a certified letter or something that explains this to him? Even if you offer to pay for the cost? I would also see if you could find other victims, they may be willing to call him. Possibly get the police to visit him? I really don't know, but I would do anything that I could to try to protect your dad. You are doing the right thing here. Hopefully you can find a way to get through to him, but this needs to be done ASAP, since the guy knows that you are on to him.

The next thing I would do would be to contact the friend and give him a piece of my mind. Who knows, he may even be involved in some way.

I don't know what it is with older people sometimes. I don't think that that understand how mean and cruel these crooks are these days. They are to trusting.

 

[MrsToad]

Is there an elder care or family services department in your father's town? Maybe a representative of that department could visit your father with the local police to take his statement. The social services person could get a better handle on whether your father is really handling his affairs in a safe way.

My DM had to take over her DMIL's finances when it was discovered she was donating so much money each month that she didn't have enough for her own bills. It's a difficult situation, but maybe having an outside opinion would offer relief that all else is okay? We, of course, don't know your father's financial well being, but could this financial activity result in him needing financial assistance for his own care down the road?

 

[walden]

It sounds very fishy indeed -- and these scams targeting seniors are becoming increasingly common. I used to work for Adult Protective services in another state and we frequently worked inconjunction with t AG's Office and local DAs. So, please notify the police and give the Attorney General's Office a call ASAP. Be clear to whoever you speak with that you suspect both Financial Exploitation of Vulnerable Adult by someone known personally to the senior (his old "friend") and a scam of a senior by a stranger (the other party) in progress.

Here are two numbers: the Medicaid Fraud and Elder Abuse Division of the New Mexico Attorney General’s Office: 1-800-525-6519.

Adult Protective Services can be contacted at 1-8866-654-3219, or local Albuquerque Hotline for Adult Protective Services: 841-6100.

All of these places should be able to advise you on next steps.

 

[DadScam]

Thanks everyone - this is all very helpful. I just put together an email with the information to the Attorney General's Office (elderabuse section). I will send it to both states (where my Dad is and where JM is) (thanks for the information waldon on what to note)

I am hopeful that the Attorney General's Office from one of the states will get involved and can spin it from the large company's perspective. If my dad thinks I did this he will be very very angry. While I can deal with his anger if he stops talking to me then I don't know what is going on.

My dad is very frugal and has money invested in the stock market. According to him he has made more in the stock market in the last year then he provided to JM. That said, I don't know how much he might give JM in the long run.

thanks - I was worried that I should butt out because he is an adult. I feel better that others would stay involved if they were me.

 

[njmom47]

thanks - I was worried that I should butt out because he is an adult. I feel better that others would stay involved if they were me.

I would not feel bad intervening! I have access to my mom's bank accounts and monitor her money, and although she is very frugal with her funds, I feel better knowing.

I was also going to suggest the "Elder Care" department of NM.
Good luck, and I hope this is resolved quickly!

 

[Jewel1310]

NJMom - Good of you to take care of your mom. Parents can find that type of thing hard, but sometimes it has to be done.

 

[tiggger1]

my neighbor had the same thing happen to her mom who lives in California Let me asked her how they handled it. I know the cops were involved...

 

[BriarfoxinWA]

It sounds very fishy indeed -- and these scams targeting seniors are becoming increasingly common. I used to work for Adult Protective services in another state and we frequently worked inconjunction with t AG's Office and local DAs. So, please notify the police and give the Attorney General's Office a call ASAP. Be clear to whoever you speak with that you suspect both Financial Exploitation of Vulnerable Adult by someone known personally to the senior (his old "friend") and a scam of a senior by a stranger (the other party) in progress.

Here are two numbers: the Medicaid Fraud and Elder Abuse Division of the New Mexico Attorney General’s Office: 1-800-525-6519.

Adult Protective Services can be contacted at 1-8866-654-3219, or local Albuquerque Hotline for Adult Protective Services: 841-6100.

All of these places should be able to advise you on next steps.

I'm not shy about contacting Elder Abuse services when I think any of my older Bank clients are being defrauded. They are very good about keeping the identity of the reporting person confidential. They will also keep in contact with you and let you know the outcome of their visits.

 

[FlyingDumbo]

Call the police! I am sure this guy prob is wanted somewhere. And you say your dad is competent, well you might be able to prove otherwise with this whole mess just to save him from going for broke.

What you KNOW your dad gave this guy is prob just the tip of the iceberg.

 

[antsss]

If this was happening to our parents or in-laws I know DH and I would feel bad about potentially insulting our loved ones, but I think the need to help protect them would motivate us to do what you are doing. The best thing is to contact the authorities and try to derail this scheme. Good luck.

 

[DadScam]

Thanks again for the responses. I sent an email tonight and will call elderabuse tomorrow. I really appreciate the support in a situation that I thought would never happen to us and wasn't confident I was taking the right course of action.

I doubt my dad will get the money back but if JM could be stopped and my dad prevented from any more loss it would be good enough. I agree with one of the posters that I worry about his mental outlook when he finds out. The brief day or so that he seemed to believe what I told him he seemed to want to put his efforts in to catching JM. I am hoping if he feels part of that process that he will come out better.

 

[walden]

Thanks everyone - this is all very helpful. I just put together an email with the information to the Attorney General's Office (elderabuse section). I will send it to both states (where my Dad is and where JM is) (thanks for the information waldon on what to note)

I am hopeful that the Attorney General's Office from one of the states will get involved and can spin it from the large company's perspective. If my dad thinks I did this he will be very very angry. While I can deal with his anger if he stops talking to me then I don't know what is going on.

My dad is very frugal and has money invested in the stock market. According to him he has made more in the stock market in the last year then he provided to JM. That said, I don't know how much he might give JM in the long run.

thanks - I was worried that I should butt out because he is an adult. I feel better that others would stay involved if they were me.

I'm quoting the OP, but the truth is that every single one of us might also experience the same thing with our senior vulnerable parent. And all of us could be vulnerable to a scam, senior or not.

My kudos to the OP, because she is respecting her elder parent's competency and his right to make mistakes, even as she wants to protect him. Her ability to intervene, and law enforcement and APS's ability to intervene does also relate to the competency of "Dad."

So, with that in mind, this has implications for all of us.

The OP is describing a situation that is just appalling and, sadly, all too common. Her Dad is in a situation where his nest-egg could be taken away forever and leave him without resources. She also says that her Dad is apparently competent, and that does limit intervention.

I suggested an all points intervention, above. Too my mind "Dad" has been targeted by "friend" (who might also be a victim) and by a very real con/scam artist.

It is Federal law that every state has an Elder Abuse (and/or vulnerable adult) Statute. Each state has different methods and protocols for protecting their seniors. In my state we have a (rather artificial) division between Financial Exploitation by a friend or family member, and Financial Exploitation by a stranger (scam). The first is dealt with by APS with law enforcement involved as necessary. The second is dealt with by law enforcement only. That said, APS and law enforcement try to work together because the division is not always that easy or obvious.

My state works cooperatively so that in a case like this, the AG, DA, police, Executive Office of Consumer Affairs (all of whom probably have an Elder section) and APS all have input. Who deals with what and when? That depends on the situation.

So, IMO, the responsible thing to do here is to alert everyone. On the internet, I can only give the OP general advice and hope it plays out right for her dad.

I wish the OP the best of luck. Please everyone, listen and learn on this situation. It is so sad. I hope it works out well for the OP and her Dad.

 

[DadScam]

thanks Walden for explaining the process. I never would have expected this in a million years. My dad is very smart. He still seems competent. He is computer literate.

I will remember to discuss both avenues - the friend introduction and the stranger aspect. I really appreciate you taking the time to inform me, and all of us, of what could happen. Sad these interventions are needed but I am very glad they exist.

thanks again