Change Happens

[NiceBlue]

A while ago I wrote, as part of a criticism of the way the Magic Kingdom presents people of color, “In the Jungle Cruise there are Africans hidden back in the Jungle with their faces covered and threatening with spears or climbing a pole after being chased by a Rhino and at the end of the ride there is the man with a pot belly selling shrunken heads, what is that about?” I also wrote that it was taking Disney a long time to open the Tiana’s Bayou Adventure ride and I praised the “It’s a Small World” ride due to the diversity of the nations presented in it. Well, since then the threatening natives, the nativies chased by a Rhino and Trader Sam, the pot belly man selling shrunken heads were removed from the Jungle Cruise ride, the Tiana’s Bayou Adventure ride opened and “It’s a Small World” with its children from diverse nation and its message that all people have the same desires and feelings is still there. This shows that while it may take time, change does happen, even though some people may not want change to happen.

Tom,

 

[Dan Murphy]

A while ago I wrote, as part of a criticism of the way the Magic Kingdom presents people of color, “In the Jungle Cruise there are Africans hidden back in the Jungle with their faces covered and threatening with spears or climbing a pole after being chased by a Rhino and at the end of the ride there is the man with a pot belly selling shrunken heads, what is that about?” I also wrote that it was taking Disney a long time to open the Tiana’s Bayou Adventure ride and I praised the “It’s a Small World” ride due to the diversity of the nations presented in it. Well, since then the threatening natives, the nativies chased by a Rhino and Trader Sam, the pot belly man selling shrunken heads were removed from the Jungle Cruise ride, the Tiana’s Bayou Adventure ride opened and “It’s a Small World” with its children from diverse nation and its message that all people have the same desires and feelings is still there. This shows that while it may take time, change does happen, even though some people may not want change to happen.

Tom,

How about the refurbished Peter Pan?

https://www.wdwmagic.com/attraction...e-american-village-scene-at-magic-kingdom.htm

 

[tvguy]

I often wonder if these situations are missed opportunities to use these examples as teaching situations. You are kind of covering up the past.

 

[Genie+]

I often wonder if these situations are missed opportunities to use these examples as teaching situations. You are kind of covering up the past.

I don’t think that aspect outweighs the normalization of negative stereotypes. There are plenty of places to learn about the past. It’s not like the past is being hidden or hard to access. I see from my own childhood how negative stereotypes left their mark on me.

 

[georgina]

Yes, glad to see Peter Pan get an update.

So many were upset at the change in Pirates where they stopped auctioning off women.

Not showing derogatory scenes in Disney World attractions is not covering up the past. Changing textbooks to omit negative historical events is an example of covering up the past.

 

[tvguy]

I don’t think that aspect outweighs the normalization of negative stereotypes. There are plenty of places to learn about the past. It’s not like the past is being hidden or hard to access. I see from my own childhood how negative stereotypes left their mark on me.

I subscribe to the train of thought "Those who ignore history are doomed to repeat it"
I just think erasing signs of the past increase the risk that those mistakes will be repeated.
Been a huge topic in my community where the community wants to erase people like John Sutter and Charles Goethe from the names of schools, and parks and counties. These people shaped our community in many positive ways, while in reality being people who may have not been so good.
And on the national level, the last of John F. Kennedy's Presidential papers were set to be released in November 2013 as outlined by law that says Presidential papers can be sealed for 50 years after a President's death. But President Obama, then President Trump and then President Biden all issued executive orders that they remain sealed. What is in those papers that is so scandalous that they have to remain sealed?

 

[Smugpugmug]

I subscribe to the train of thought "Those who ignore history are doomed to repeat it"
I just think erasing signs of the past increase the risk that those mistakes will be repeated.
Been a huge topic in my community where the community wants to erase people like John Sutter and Charles Goethe from the names of schools, and parks and counties. These people shaped our community in many positive ways, while in reality being people who may have not been so good.
And on the national level, the last of John F. Kennedy's Presidential papers were set to be released in November 2013 as outlined by law that says Presidential papers can be sealed for 50 years after a President's death. But President Obama, then President Trump and then President Biden all issued executive orders that they remain sealed. What is in those papers that is so scandalous that they have to remain sealed?

You're aware this thread is about theme park attractions, correct? It's not that serious.

 

[tvguy]

You're aware this thread is about theme park attractions, correct? It's not that serious.

I am, but Disney has had this issue for decades. Just look at Song of the South, if you can find it.

 

[Smugpugmug]

I am, but Disney has had this issue for decades. Just look at Song of the South, if you can find it.

Okay but revamping the Jungle Cruise or removing the redhead from Pirates do not correlate with keeping confidential documents surrounding a former US president sealed.

Also Song of the South is an extremely easy movie to find thanks to the internet.

 

[princesscinderella]

I like the evolution of the rides, they should not be offensive culturally or sexist. Times change and when you know better you do better.

 

[neverlandsky]

Change has such a negative connotation to it since people don't like change. I prefer growing since growing is to become greater over time. We learn and grow from history.

 

[barkley]

it's interesting-a couple of months ago we recorded the history channel show 'how disney built america' and are just watching them now. last night we watched the episode on the creation of disneyland and it spoke in detail about how walt went against conventional amusement park ride structuring b/c he wanted each ride to be an opportunity to put the riders IN the cartoon it was based on. he wanted it to emulate the live action mixed with animation world he pioneered with his 'alice's wonderland' short films in the early 1920's.

walt wanted to put riders in the tea cups, ride like timothy on dumbo's back and walk through the castle they had seen in his movies. with peter pan he wanted the rider to fly through the sky and see/experience exactly what wendy/the boys/peter did flying over england and on to neverland as it was depicted in his movie.

i agree that offensive and hurtful aspects of rides are appropriate to be removed but the disney company seems to just react when they are publicly pushed to do so, not out of any real concern. if it were out of concern it would be done quietly and absent media fanfare enticing customers to come and experience their newest 'appropraite' ride renovation.

 

[BrianL]

The issue of representation is a real one, and while I don't necessarily see every depiction that has gotten called out as offensive, I also get why they would change stuff, and I am generally okay with it. In some cases they have done so more successfully than others. I generally like what has been done with the Jungle Cruise, though I don't think that Sam needed to be eliminated completely - redesigned though for sure. The new scene is fun too though. I like Pirate Redd a lot, but I don't love the scene and the audio. "We Want the rum!" just doesn't have the same zing to it. I would have had them call for "the redhead" and then she would shoot at them! But, whatever - I can roll with the changes for the most part, and it's all good.

 

[john7994]

Okay but revamping the Jungle Cruise or removing the redhead from Pirates do not correlate with keeping confidential documents surrounding a former US president sealed.

Also Song of the South is an extremely easy movie to find thanks to the internet

What‘s this Internet you speak of?

 

[fla4fun]

i agree that offensive and hurtful aspects of rides are appropriate to be removed but the disney company seems to just react when they are publicly pushed to do so, not out of any real concern. if it were out of concern it would be done quietly and absent media fanfare enticing customers to come and experience their newest 'appropraite' ride renovation.

It seems like the Peter Pan changes occurred without a lot of fanfare on the part of Disney. It’s been the vloggers and bloggers who have put most of the news out about it. I don’t recall any huge controversy or big push by the public for the change either, although there have been people who have discussed in the past that the scene could be handled with more sensitivity. I don’t recall hearing a word from either side before the latest refurbishment, either pushing for or against it. Comparing the way a makeover like PotC was handled in the media by Disney vs how the Peter Pan change was handled by them, it appears to me that a quieter correction was made by them because they felt it was the right thing to do, at least in this case. Perhaps they are improving their procedures. . .

 

[barkley]

I like Pirate Redd a lot, but I don't love the scene and the audio. "We Want the rum!" just doesn't have the same zing to it. I would have had them call for "the redhead" and then she would shoot at them!

as a little girl who was horribly teased about having red hair i absolutly LOVED the pirates yelling 'we want the redhead'. prior to little mermaid being released well into my adulthood the only other depiction of a redhead in disney stuff was one of the ugly stepsisters

 

[Diznygrl]

The issue of representation is a real one, and while I don't necessarily see every depiction that has gotten called out as offensive, I also get why they would change stuff, and I am generally okay with it. In some cases they have done so more successfully than others. I generally like what has been done with the Jungle Cruise, though I don't think that Sam needed to be eliminated completely - redesigned though for sure. The new scene is fun too though. I like Pirate Redd a lot, but I don't love the scene and the audio. "We Want the rum!" just doesn't have the same zing to it. I would have had them call for "the redhead" and then she would shoot at them! But, whatever - I can roll with the changes for the most part, and it's all good.

I believe she actually does this in the Disneyland Paris version of the ride. They changed their bride auction scene to look like ours, but in their version the redhead is blessedly SILENT and just glares around looking like a bad(butt), and will shoot at the other pirates when they catcall her. I wish they would have done that here because her dialogue and voice is just AWFUL and completely ruins the scene.

 

[BrianL]

I believe she actually does this in the Disneyland Paris version of the ride. They changed their bride auction scene to look like ours, but in their version the redhead is blessedly SILENT and just glares around looking like a bad(butt), and will shoot at the other pirates when they catcall her. I wish they would have done that here because her dialogue and voice is just AWFUL and completely ruins the scene.

Wait, really? That's exactly how I envision it!

 

[NiceBlue]

First off, thanks to everyone for commenting and for viewing. I have liked Disneyland since it opened in 1955 when I was seven. But I also like change when it is happening in the direction where people are treated more equally, no matter how they were born or what they believe in. In the past I not only wrote about the Jungle Cruise, the Tiama ride and It’s a Small World, but about other things in the Magic Kingdom. The problem was that the things I wrote about were considered political and religious, even though they were only about the Magic Kingdom and some posts were deleted. Now, I may post in the controversial topics.

Dan thank you for mentioning the refurbished Peter Pan, I like Tinkerbell and now she is shown doing a fancy shawl dance a native american tradition.

Barkley, the redhead is still there only now she is in charge as a pirate, She also is a character in the park (see video here, 4 mins:

, no one will tease her) and I understand she inspired the character Scarlett in the Pirates of the Caribbean movies.

Tom,