Can an irrevocable trust be broken?

[thumpersfriend]

Wondered if anyone with some legal knowledge could help me. My mother has been married to my step dad for 10 years, prior to that they got a divorce after being married another 10 years or so. (They have been married twice). My step father made out an irrevocable trust disinheriting her because she is not the mother of his children. The problem I have with this is that he has quite a bit of money. Mostly because they split their expenses 50/50. With his retirement pension and SS he is able to put away over 1,000 a month, which is going into this trust. My mother will not be provided for whatsoever on his death. Doesn't it seem that the income they have, even his retirement should be for both of them and not just him? My mother only makes about 1/4 of what he does and still pays 1/2 of the expenses. She is just going to let this happen because she is so hurt he would do that to her. He is 83 and she is 75. Any opinions on this? I don't want a penny of it someday but I think she should be provided for until her death. She would have to rely on her family because she couldn't afford to live on her own.

 

[KristiKelly]

My MIL got remarried 2 years ago, she has her will set up (even though were not talking alot of money) into thirds. New husband gets 1/3, DH 1/3 & SIL 1/3.

Sorry, I don't really have any advice, but I think it's VERY wrong!!!

 

[The Mystery Machine]

My guess would be no it cannot. She has full knowledge of her situation and accepts it, right? I am not an attorney however.

My mom is in a bind with my dad as he spent all their money and she HAS to live with him to make ends meet. On his death she will be in a bind.
Sucks to know that my mom knows her issues but doesn't fix it. I hear ya' loud and clear!

 

[thumpersfriend]

No my mom doesn't agree with it at all, he did it behind her back. It does bother me that she doesn't have enough guts to tell him he is wrong. I wonder if I talked with an attorney it would be okay, don't want to see that I am meddeling. I just don't think my mom quite has it together anymore. It sure did show me that if something happened to my husband I sure would not remarry. She is basically staying to have her health insurance. How sad. Other women make out like bandits and she will be poor.

 

[EsmeraldaX]

Please no flames here but...

I am single and intend to stay that way for life (and no, I'm not as young as I "look").

When I am older, I intend to take care of myself and live off whatever savings I have. Otherwise, I am out of luck. I won't have a husband to depend on.

I think whatever an individual person says they want in their will should be respected, unless it is proven by medical professionals that they were not in their "right mind" when they made the will.

I'm not saying your mother deserves to be treated like she's nothing BUT I don't think being married to someone, for however long, should entitle you to their money when they die.

 

[thumpersfriend]

I only think that she should be provided for though. When they got married he begged her to retire at 52 saying he would pay most of the expenses. Well, he never did. They are living in the house my husband and I bought for retirement just so she has a decent place to live. He refused to get a decent home . She is collecting botttles and cans from us so she can have a liitle spending money and he is putting away l,000 a month to give his kids. Still think it is wrong.

 

[gina2000]

That's a pretty sad story.

They've been married for over 20 years and he's saving money while she's saving bottles.

If they'd been married a few years and living a life style beyond her means, you would think he would pick up a few bills to make her more comfortable. Knowing that she would have no money at his death would mean that he should have at least offered to pay her half of the bills so she could save for her life after his death (assuming he predeceased her). This just sounds like a stingy old man who wants a companion.

 

[eeyore45]

I had a very good friend fall in love with a doctor, he built an office and I think a 4 plex that had 4 attatched town homes, large nice homes too... and he owned the property etc. He had a nasty divorce and married my friend... (my friend had been divorced and had been in an abusive relationship... we were thrilled with this man)

Well 3 months after they married, he had kidney problems... he was in and out of hospitals, he then decided he better make an appointment to change his will - he never made it, he died before he could, his ex got everything, and my friend nothing, and than included things she brought into the marraige, and yes they went to court etc, it was ugly. He had thought he was at least providing for her when h e built that townhouse and doctor's office, yet he hadnt put anything in her name...

 

[newmousecateer]

To answer you simply, no, an irrevocable trust cannot be changed by anyone.

 

[thumpersfriend]

Thanks for all your opinions everyone. It is a sad state of affairs and yes he is a stingy old man and always was. I told her I thought she would do alot better divorcing him when he treats her miserably. He golfs 2-3 times a week and she doesn't have the money to rent a video. She refuses to take money from us so I will take groceries up to her to help with the burden, trouble is it just leaves him more money to squirrel away for his kids. Thanks again everyone. Don't let yourselves get into this mess.

 

[The Mystery Machine]

If she divorced him now she might be better off??? Perhaps she could get a settlement?

 

[denisenh]

Originally posted by thumpersfriend
I only think that she should be provided for though. When they got married he begged her to retire at 52 saying he would pay most of the expenses. Well, he never did. They are living in the house my husband and I bought for retirement just so she has a decent place to live. He refused to get a decent home . She is collecting botttles and cans from us so she can have a liitle spending money and he is putting away l,000 a month to give his kids. Still think it is wrong.

Can YOU do something, like charge rent?

If they split it half and half, take your step dads half, not your moms and give your mom his half for herself.
If you are already collecting rent maybe you could raise it and do the same thing.

And I would see about getting your mom to a lawyer to discuss her future and what, if anything, she can to do to protect herself in regards to finances.

It is hard to "save" someone who doesn't want to be "saved" though. Frustrating.

 

[Keli]

Wait a minute, what kind of state do they live in? I know that you cannot set up trusts to avoid financially taking care of a spouse in states where everything aquired during a marriage is divided 50/50. Have her talk to a lawyer now and find out her options. This trust may have been set up with funds that he aquired during their marriage and it may not be legal and therefore it would be breakable.

 

[ScarlettO]

Originally posted by newmousecateer
To answer you simply, no, an irrevocable trust cannot be changed by anyone.

Unfortunately , this is true. The former owner of The company I used to work for and his wife set up a trust that divided their assests among their kids-the 2 girls got $$ and the son got the buisness. Fast forward-Mom dies, son ruins buisness,,,sister and dad want to take company over and save it and can't....so 200 people I know were left unemployed.

 

[my3kids]

The trust holding the money he currently has will go to his children, if that is how it is set up. But, as his wife, she should be entitled to social security when he dies. It wouldn't be as much as what the trust would probably have provided, but it should be something. His children, provided they are adults, would not be able to collect his benefits.

I think the rent on the house is a great idea. Say you charge $1000 a month, which would be $500 each. Take his $500, nothing from your mom, and put his monthly payment into a retirement account for your mom.

 

[EsmeraldaX]

Originally posted by thumpersfriend
I only think that she should be provided for though. When they got married he begged her to retire at 52 saying he would pay most of the expenses. Well, he never did. They are living in the house my husband and I bought for retirement just so she has a decent place to live. He refused to get a decent home . She is collecting botttles and cans from us so she can have a liitle spending money and he is putting away l,000 a month to give his kids. Still think it is wrong.

Why would she choose to stay with a man like that? He sounds like he lied to her. That's awful

 

[thumpersfriend]

I think I should see a lawyer about this. As for charging rent, he will not pay anything because he has a tiny trailer in Florida that he would stay in all year instead of coming to Michigan so mom can see her family for the spring and summer. I personally can't fingure out why she stays with him except she says she doesn't want to be a burden to me. I always thought when you got married everything was 50/50. He didn't have anything when he married my mom and now he can save l.000 a month and be able to put it in a trust to keep from her. She has essential tremors where her head shakes uncontrollably but she takes care of him and all his problems. Thanks for all the advice.

 

[Toby'sFriend]

she should definately consult a lawyer. He has every right to set up a trust to protect pre marital assets. But assets and funds gained during the marriage are often considered joint property and he does not have the right to deposit them into that trust without her permission.

As for whether or not it can be broken, again she needs to consult an attorney experienced in the Laws of her particular state. Trusts can be broken if it is shown that they are set up in a fraudlent matter --- nobody on an internet bulletin board is qualified to say without looking at the particular details of the case.

 

[KristiKelly]

TheMysteryMachine wrote:

"If she divorced him now she might be better off??? Perhaps she could get a settlement?"


I believe this is true. In a divorce, I've heard that you are entitled 50%. A friend of mine who worked hard, put the max in her 401K while her husband stayed up all night drinking, slept til noon, worked finishing houses a few hours a day & still made it home to watch Jerry Springer by 5:00 p.m. When they divorced, he was entitled to 1/2 of her 401k that she had started 17 years prior & put had quite a bit in, 1/2 the house, etc. He got all that & still won't pay child support, doesn't think he should, since she has remarried & her husband makes plenty of money.

 

[thumpersfriend]

I wish she would divorce him, she is so unhappy, especially since she found out about the trust. He even wants his daughter to have the wedding ring she bought for him! I just can't help but think you can put all this money they have combined and put it away and disinherit your wife. Makes you wonder what kind of a man would do this to his mate. She is such a sweet woman and does not want to cause any trouble because it will make him mad. He has had a few affairs too and yet she keeps saying, the next time...... . I am so glad I asked this of all of you. My husband and I have to get to an attorney too because if something happens to my mom first, we don't want him squatting in our house, he loves to mooch off people and it just is not going to happen. He is the type that would really do this too.