Breakage Pullback No Longer A Thing?

[Girlstar30]

And then if they dont sell it or dont anticipate to sell it they can spit it back to us whenever?

 

[Sandisw]

How s

How soon is reasonable for people to ask if it is possible to recall back?

Again, it’s not really a thing you can ask for. You can always call if looking for last minute availability and ask if there is anything available that isnt showing on the website.

With breakage, yes, Disney can move all rooms that owners have not booked 60 days and offer them for cash…

Now, we know that they don’t move every single one or there would never be last minute rooms showing up.

But our contract allows for rooms not booked to be sold for cash to create breakage income and DVC gets to oversee that. As I mentioned, they can even anticipate it and pull earlier.

Remember, just because you see it for cash, doesn’t mean it’s there because it was open during the breakage period. It could be there because it was booked with DVCs points…just like any other owner…or there because it was pulled to pay for a trade.

That is why there is no set policy that those cash rooms will be given back and I would say 99% of the time they will or do not…

 

[Girlstar30]

Thanks for explaining Miss Sandi!

Again, it’s not really a thing you can ask for. You can always call if looking for last minute availability and ask if there is anything available that isnt showing on the website.

With breakage, yes, Disney can move all rooms that owners have not booked 60 days and offer them for cash…

Now, we know that they don’t move every single one or there would never be last minute rooms showing up.

But our contract allows for rooms not booked to be sold for cash to create breakage income and DVC gets to oversee that. As I mentioned, they can even anticipate it and pull earlier.

Remember, just because you see it for cash, doesn’t mean it’s there because it was open during the breakage period. It could be there because it was booked with DVCs points…just like any other owner…or there because it was pulled to pay for a trade.

That is why there is no set policy that those cash rooms will be given back and I would say 99% of the time they will or do not…

 

[Girlstar30]

Sorry I have one more question, is the 2.5% how many rooms they can take back of what's left of dvc or they can take back as many rooms as they want during the 60-90 days and the 2.5% is just the amount of profit that goes to dvc sorry I was confused and its very interesting to me

 

[Novatrix]

Sorry I have one more question, is the 2.5% how many rooms they can take back of what's left of dvc or they can take back as many rooms as they want during the 60-90 days and the 2.5% is just the amount of profit that goes to dvc sorry I was confused and its very interesting to me

Think of the cash rooms listed by DVC in 3 categories.

A. Rooms DVC books with the developer points that DVD is required to own (typically 2 to 4% of the total points.)

B. Rooms DVC books due to needing cash for member exchanges (cruises, adventures by Disney, ect.) that member book with points that are not directly controlled by DVC.

C. Breakage rooms, which I think Sandi did a good job explaining when and how they occur. Of income generated via breakage, up to 2.5% of the operating budget of the resort is revenue for DVC, which in turn reduces dues for members. Any income beyond that is kept by Disney, I don't know whether it's by DVD or a different division. I haven't paid attention since Covid, but prior there was never a case where breakage income didn't exceed the cap (and they have never revealed data by how much.) Theoretically, there's no cap on the number of rooms they can take for breakage, but in practice it hasnt been too egregious.

It didn't used to be a problem to ask about breakage availability, and as I mentioned I've been able to book those rooms in the past, but it's been a while, and it wouldn't be the first policy DVC has changed over the years. Anything not explicit in the contract is not guaranteed. (A good point for new members to remember regarding decor, point charts, non-listed amenities, member perks ect.)

 

[Girlstar30]

Got it! Thank you so much!

Think of the cash rooms listed by DVC in 3 categories.

A. Rooms DVC books with the developer points that DVD is required to own (typically 2 to 4% of the total points.)

B. Rooms DVC books due to needing cash for member exchanges (cruises, adventures by Disney, ect.) that member book with points that are not directly controlled by DVC.

C. Breakage rooms, which I think Sandi did a good job explaining when and how they occur. Of income generated via breakage, up to 2.5% of the operating budget of the resort is revenue for DVC, which in turn reduces dues for members. Any income beyond that is kept by Disney, I don't know whether it's by DVD or a different division. I haven't paid attention since Covid, but prior there was never a case where breakage income didn't exceed the cap (and they have never revealed data by how much.) Theoretically, there's no cap on the number of rooms they can take for breakage, but in practice it hasnt been too egregious.

It didn't used to be a problem to ask about breakage availability, and as I mentioned I've been able to book those rooms in the past, but it's been a while, and it wouldn't be the first policy DVC has changed over the years. Anything not explicit in the contract is not guaranteed. (A good point for new members to remember regarding decor, point charts, non-listed amenities, member perks ect.)

 

[Sandisw]

Think of the cash rooms listed by DVC in 3 categories.

A. Rooms DVC books with the developer points that DVD is required to own (typically 2 to 4% of the total points.)

B. Rooms DVC books due to needing cash for member exchanges (cruises, adventures by Disney, ect.) that member book with points that are not directly controlled by DVC.

C. Breakage rooms, which I think Sandi did a good job explaining when and how they occur. Of income generated via breakage, up to 2.5% of the operating budget of the resort is revenue for DVC, which in turn reduces dues for members. Any income beyond that is kept by Disney, I don't know whether it's by DVD or a different division. I haven't paid attention since Covid, but prior there was never a case where breakage income didn't exceed the cap (and they have never revealed data by how much.) Theoretically, there's no cap on the number of rooms they can take for breakage, but in practice it hasnt been too egregious.

It didn't used to be a problem to ask about breakage availability, and as I mentioned I've been able to book those rooms in the past, but it's been a while, and it wouldn't be the first policy DVC has changed over the years. Anything not explicit in the contract is not guaranteed. (A good point for new members to remember regarding decor, point charts, non-listed amenities, member perks ect.)

Since Covid, the breakage income we have gotten to offset dues has reached the maximum.

In terms of the money after that, it’s spelled out on the contract, but summarizing a bit, it goes to BVTC to help with funding that and then the rest to DVC/DVD.

 

[Cfabar1]

Since Covid, the breakage income we have gotten to offset dues has reached the maximum.

In terms of the money after that, it’s spelled out on the contract, but summarizing a bit, it goes to BVTC to help with funding that and then the rest to DVC/DVD.

Prior to COVID was that the norm? That it reached the 2.5% every year?

 

[Sandisw]

Prior to COVID was that the norm? That it reached the 2.5% every year?

Yes! I was just responding to the poster who said they were not sure.

That’s why, at least IMO, the pulling back of rooms is something that was more occasional.

Plus, when there was not a website, one would have not even known!

They make good money off breakage so don’t think they are in any rush to give up potential income.

 

[Girlstar30]

Now I find myself really trying to snag these reservations before the "breakage monster" comes next month

Yes! I was just responding to the poster who said they were not sure.

That’s why, at least IMO, the pulling back of rooms is something that was more occasional.

Plus, when there was not a website, one would have not even known!

They make good money off breakage so don’t think they are in any rush to give up potential income.

 

[Cfabar1]

I wonder at the beginning if the 2.5% was considered mutually good for both sides... seems like it should be a higher number for owners now...

 

[tjkraz]

Maybe splitting hairs but if OP specifically used the term "unsold breakage rooms", it may be the source of some confusion.

Historically the rooms that Member Services tends to "pull back" are cash rooms that ended up with CRO/WDTC due to member trades. They are rooms that are removed from member inventory 11+ months ahead of time. If they're still sitting unbooked a few months or weeks out, sometimes Member Services could arrange to recapture them.

Breakage inventory is something different.

But focusing on the cash rooms, in the past year DVC execs claim they've been more aggressive about reclaiming those for points reservations without having to be prompted by members. They didn't give any details about how the proverbial sausage is made. But if these cash rooms are automatically re-claimed, they may simply be popping up on the website or filling waitlists. As such, the old ad hoc process of calling and asking "can you try to do this for me" may no longer be feasible.

 

[Brian Noble]

I wonder at the beginning if the 2.5% was considered mutually good for both sides... seems like it should be a higher number for owners now...

I am certain that DVD/DVCMC knew what they were doing here. It would not be hard to have a pretty firm estimate of the ebb and flow of unused points---especially if some of the early DVC execs were from other timeshare developers.

It's Disney's sandbox; I just get to play in it.