AP sales…

[Maistre Gracey]

Yeh the deal was great. We travelled on free dining and discounted accommodation for years prior to buying DVC as it didn't really make much financial sense to do so at the time. Now the situation has changed a bit.

But it isnt stupid and it does make sense. Most Americans get a week of annual leave. Disney wants to get the most out of you guys in the short time you have. The UK get longer vacations and Disney wants them to stay longer, on site, and spend. It is not unusual to find UK guests staying 2-3 weeks at a time. The average American doesn't do that. To ensure the guest remains at Disney these deals are offered to UK guests. Captive audience.

Wow…. What are they teaching you folks over there??

 

[Madame]

In general most UK families traveled in August when attendance was lower (southern states had gone back to school & face of the sun heat). I’m not sure about their patterns since Covid, but Disney was using that ticket & free dining to fill rooms & parks during a traditionally slow period.

 

[kmorlock]

Everyone has a threshold that they will accept Disney’s “changes” until said threshold is reached and they feel the impact on their own vacation experience. What happens when that threshold or line in the sand is crossed? No longer can Disney tout being so family friendly when they strip Magical Express, take away dining plans, charge top dollar for a 3 year old, take fast pass away and institute a system you have to leave to chance until 7AM every day in vacation and the last straw is the possibility of AP’s becoming obsolete?!!! Clearly the
Cheapek,/D’Amaro regime is out to gut everything that made Disney a top vacation choice especially for families and attach a hefty price tag to anything and everything they can. I’m no expert but, while that might bring in short term revenue especially since ppl are excited to travel, long term, guests will burn out and choose other vacation options. The post Covid closure surge in attendance and spending will wane eventually.

The parks have been encouraging us for years to get out and explore the world. Maybe it’s time we listen?

 

[cheryl.UK]

Most Brits tend to stick to school holidays because of the fines for taking your kids out of school. These aren't being imposed as rigorously at the moment but no doubt that will end in September. Our school holidays are 2 weeks at Christmas, 2 weeks at Easter and 6 in the summer + 3 half term holidays of 1 week. Summer is usually the cheapest option for us with our children going back around the 1st September, although this year a lot of children are going back on the 5th. In 2019 when our friends last went, they had 2 weeks in August in the CBR with free dining and a 4 x 2 week passes and flying coach. It cost them £10,000 which in dollars at the time was $13.650. I'm not sure how that stacks up against what you guys could have got during a free dining offer.

 

[Ms Bibbidi]

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[Madame]

Well, the UK 14 day sale for 499 gbp I posted was for the period of October 25th through December 31, 2022. So those guests are busy booking the holiday season right now. Prime time!

Yes, but it’s a sale for a reason. Covid has skewed everything and I’m sure that if travel patterns don’t return to normal, that Disney will react accordingly wrt ultimate tickets.

We haven’t seen a Canadian offer in ages (not that they were ever fabulous since free dining went away) & our dollar is almost always 20-30 cents less. The offers were always for periods Canadians typically traveled and were quieter times at Disney, like mid to late Aug.

 

[Ms Bibbidi]

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[Madame]

Yes, but it has become very, very clear to us that Disney hates locals at the same time. They are so focused on filling those 40,000 hotel rooms and making revenue deals for extended park hours with nearby non-Disney owned resort hotels. Chapek clearly makes management decisions to block locals from attending. Disney World has become a hotel chain with theme parks attached. We cannot even get a decent AP!

The topic of discussion this morning over coffee on the lanai is moving away from the tourist traffic, noise, resort area prices for food, housing, gas, the Florida heat and all things Disney brings with it that we put up with. Cash it out and find someplace better for retirement. Not paying for any more trips for kids, grands and others either. Early discussions, but occurring nonetheless.

They’re definitely being short-sighted. They think treating the locals who would potentially see them through the next economic downturn like disposable trash will never come back to haunt them…. I think they’re mistaken, but being forward-thinking is not a valued trait in present-day late-stage terminal capitalism….

 

[Ms Bibbidi]

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[redboat45]

I think everyone comprehends that they decided to give UK guests better ticket options. It's just many of us believe it's stupid and makes no sense. I mean they're getting discounted tickets, along with discounted room and many years free dining to top it in off.

Meanwhile a few years ago my family was going for 2 week trips in higher cost rooms, paying for all of our TS meals with more expensive tickets and fewer park days. But those UK people are more valuable in spite of our spending more to get less.

exactly. I know why Disney does it and don't agree with it. I think it's very stupid and short sighted for Disney to do it. But that's like all their decisions lately.

 

[redboat45]

Most Brits tend to stick to school holidays because of the fines for taking your kids out of school. These aren't being imposed as rigorously at the moment but no doubt that will end in September. Our school holidays are 2 weeks at Christmas, 2 weeks at Easter and 6 in the summer + 3 half term holidays of 1 week. Summer is usually the cheapest option for us with our children going back around the 1st September, although this year a lot of children are going back on the 5th. In 2019 when our friends last went, they had 2 weeks in August in the CBR with free dining and a 4 x 2 week passes and flying coach. It cost them £10,000 which in dollars at the time was $13.650. I'm not sure how that stacks up against what you guys could have got during a free dining offer.

they fine your for taking your kids out of school?! CRAZY!

 

[Ms Bibbidi]

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[Ms Bibbidi]

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[babydoll65]

Does anybody recall Disney ever offering US based guests a free dining offer? I do not think I have ever seen that.

Actually Disney offered free dining for US guests for many years. I think I got free dining every September for 10 years in a row.

 

[Ms Bibbidi]

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[cheryl.UK]

they fine your for taking your kids out of school?! CRAZY!

Yep. If I remember rightly it's £60 per child per parent per week. Two parents taking 2 kids out of school for 2 weeks costs £480 or $600 but this doubles if you don't pay within 21 days.

 

[Sandisw]

Hmmm. Learn something new everyday. I guess I was not watching the on-site packages. Thank you.

I got it in 2006 for the first time and did it every year until we become DVC owners.

The last year it was offered was 2019..so it was a good long run for US residents and only stopped with Covid.

Prior to that we did some great deals..pay 4 nights and tickets and get everything for 7 nights. It was great

So, over the years, they have definitely offered things.

Offering overseas residents something different makes sense to me I guess. As I said, no different than all the other specialty groups that get something.

Even the Sorderer pass is for a select group and plenty of cash guests who spend as much if not more for trips over time.

Of course I would never turn down an opportunity to save money but I can’t be upset that they offer specials to target audiences either, especially those overseas.

 

[RoseGold]

I never go to WDW on weekends, it’s too crowded for me. I think it would be nice if the Tuesday ticket were cheaper than the Saturday ticket. That totally makes sense to me — and maybe someone who travels like me could see a decrease in ticket prices?

If Disney gets rid of the APs, they’re going to have to fill the low volume days somehow, and that’s a way to do it. Plenty of people would plan around the cheap Tuesday tickets.

 

[Ms Bibbidi]

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[john7994]

Maybe it is. After 70+ years of Disney being my first choice, I think they are right. But if we make this mega expensive decision to liquidate our Florida home with those transaction costs, my new choices will not be branded Disney. Being on the receiving end of hatred from a commercial company for just being a local who bought an annual pass they created is a very significant emotional experience. After my close look at the annual passes with such restricted number of park reservation holds and the sneaky Pete management tool of park reservations with their unilaterally controlled buckets to add unavailability days, it is as clear as a bell that Disney despises local guests. From a corporation!

Treating your viewpoint with the respect it deserves, and I believe loyalty is important as well, I wonder if the locals in FLA from the AP experience weren't just "collateral damage" (please forgive the expression) due to changing business circumstances in implementing (static) dynamic daily pricing, holding over the park reservation system and unanticipated surged demand. I think there is agreement across the board that current Disney Leadership over amplified an opportunistic strategy in revenue recovery - in context of earnings calls - there is an expectation from analysts on understanding their recovery plan post pandemic that can't go unanswered either. Nonetheless, lots of unforced errors - on that score.

Given that Disney re-introduced all APs in September 2021 and quickly rescinded all but the FLA Pixie Pass months later presumably due to unexpected levels of demand, might suggest less of a targeting of locals and perhaps an "oh-***" moment about the future demand on the park itself. Had Disney done the reverse and kept only the out of state option (which I suppose locals could still buy), it might have been a clearer message as described. Subsequently and separately, I think the litigation (December?) in Disneyland played a behind the scenes role at WDW no doubt in a similar timeframe.

Forced with finite park reservations available (of their own decision/design) and guest type economics, I think Disney went with the natural position of targeting more lucrative customers (supported in public commentary by Leadership as we discussed). Again, I don't think this was to express hatred of locals in the mix, but an expedient approach to maximize recovery. As a destination, WDW draws more non-locals (than perhaps Disneyland) with the infrastructure to support longer on-property stays. Yes, it's opportunistic and seems disloyal, but if I were a business owner, I would have to weigh heavily the opportunity presented.

In any case and to reiterate - not saying the current situation is what it should be or minimizing the loyalty of local park supporters through the years. The park reservation is a primary culprit as we talked about, and it's created a significantly larger problem for Disney than I think they anticipated on a going forward basis by deciding to keep it. Park demand (at least for now), is a significant culprit as well and only exacerbates the issue. Thus, spurring the top to bottom revamp of whatever APs may or may not be in the future. I still anticipate a local component - simply because it's in their best interest to do so.