Why do the changing tip policies . . .

[extechie rbd/wdt]

Then again, I have already booked and paid for a cruise in 2013. Disney gets to use my money for various investments in the company far in advance of providing me with any service. Yet, they are finding ways to increase my out-of-pocket expenses in excess of my original budget. So, it is not really practical to say that I can "make a choice" at this point especially since we are staying is a suite with a nonrefundable deposit. With that being said, I have no issue with paying more, my issue is with the flavor of the experience. The whole process just is a bit unseemly to me.

Again, I do not begrudge Disney from trying to make money, but you cannot honestly tell me that you think these tip changes enhance the experience of the guests. It is simply a process for them to be more profitable.

As a business owner as well, we also have increasing expenses annually (i.e. malpractice premiums, insurance plan premiums, etc.). However, I do not feel that I personally have to increase my annual level of total compensation at the expense of others that work for me. Disney, however, does have to make more PROFIT every year to satisfy shareholders and, therefore, has to squeeze even more money out of each passenger beyond any increases in their expenses.

DWF

DWF,

Only in regard to the Auto Grat on suggested tips:

Unless you know more than your saying, the only benefit to DCL with the Auto Grat policy is fewer Guest's queuing at GS, and happier Guests due to shorter queues.
Better for the Guest's, and the only benefit I can see is that once the policy is in full effect and is common knowledge to Guests cruising, is that they may not need say 1 less a CM on the GS desk at peak times so removing a few hours.
If the queues continue to be long and problematic, then they should address that.
I don't think DCL are alone in trying to keep costs to them as minimal as possible, but I also don't think there are many people who cruise on the high class lines that visit here to offer a comparison of how they are trimming their sail either?

I'm trying to stay on the fence with this one!

Ex Techie


Edit to add:
As only an ex CM, and no experience of booking, were you required to pay the full fare in advance or were you able to wait until the 75 day mark?

 

[disneywonderfun]

DWF,

Only in regard to the Auto Grat on suggested tips:

Unless you know more than your saying, the only benefit to DCL with the Auto Grat policy is fewer Guest's queuing at GS, and happier Guests due to shorter queues.
Better for the Guest's, and the only benefit I can see is that once the policy is in full effect and is common knowledge to Guests cruising, is that they may not need say 1 less a CM on the GS desk at peak times so removing a few hours.
If the queues continue to be long and problematic, then they should address that.
I don't think DCL are alone in trying to keep costs to them as minimal as possible, but I also don't think there are many people who cruise on the high class lines that visit here to offer a comparison of how they are trimming their sail either?

I'm trying to stay on the fence with this one!

Ex Techie

Yes, I probably am simply smelling a conspiracy that is not really there! It just seems to me to be a slippery slope. Will DCL follow suit and include a blurb in future contracts about West Texas crude being over $70 that then allows them to charge you an extra $10 per day per passenger? I would rather simply have my bottom line price in place and make the judgment on whether to go based on that information. By modifying passenger expenses after the fact, DCL is engaging in a disservice to its passengers. My cruise expense for next year is over 20K for a week on the Fantasy. Spending a few more bucks with a few more expenses than I planned is largely irrelevant. Nevertheless, I do like to know about all my expected expenses before I book a trip.

DWF

P.S. Again, I think if Disney preserves the wages to its crew and is not lowering them, then the auto-tip is likely a good benefit to passengers. However, if they lower the puny salaries even further to crew members like they did reportedly to the concierge staff when they added their tip envelope, then I think the situation is suboptimal.

 

[FJS961]

P.S. Again, I think if Disney preserves the wages to its crew and is not lowering them, then the auto-tip is likely a good benefit to passengers. However, if they lower the puny salaries even further to crew members like they did reportedly to the concierge staff when they added their tip envelope, then I think the situation is suboptimal.

I agree that would be sleazy

 

[extechie rbd/wdt]

My "Crystal Ball" has been put away (Ref. another thread ) so I guess time will have to tell as none of us will know or be able to accurately predict what DCL may or may not do in the future.

Let's all keep our fingers crossed that there are no changes in the future that mean Guests have to pay more than when they book.

Ex Techie

 

[Bear3412]

......... I do not feel that I personally have to increase my annual level of total compensation at the expense of others..........

This is refreshing to hear. I'm glad I'm not alone. However, obviously are companies are not publically traded.

I also concur with your thoughts.

 

[extechie rbd/wdt]

DWF, from my edit:

As only an ex CM, and no experience of booking, were you required to pay the full fare in advance or were you able to wait until the 75 day mark?

Ex Techie

 

[kcashner]

DWF, from my edit:

As only an ex CM, and no experience of booking, were you required to pay the full fare in advance or were you able to wait until the 75 day mark?

Ex Techie

"Normal" guests pay a deposit upon booking (20% of cost), with the balance due usually at the 75 day mark. It is 120 days on European and some specialty cruises. However, you cannot book any reservations until you are paid in full. Thus, most platinum guests will pay by that time in order to do their bookings, golds by 105 days, and silvers by 90. Still, it is not required.

Some bookings--VGT/OGT/IGT, some standby rates require full payment at the time of booking.

 

[extechie rbd/wdt]

"Normal" guests pay a deposit upon booking (20% of cost), with the balance due usually at the 75 day mark. It is 120 days on European and some specialty cruises. However, you cannot book any reservations until you are paid in full. Thus, most platinum guests will pay by that time in order to do their bookings, golds by 105 days, and silvers by 90. Still, it is not required.

Some bookings--VGT/OGT/IGT, some standby rates require full payment at the time of booking.

So I would guess that saying:
"I have already booked and paid for a cruise in 2013. Disney gets to use my money for various investments in the company far in advance of providing me with any service. Yet, they are finding ways to increase my out-of-pocket expenses in excess of my original budget."

When not required to, isn't really a good reason for worrying about non existent increases in your cruise fair, non existent increases in suggested Gratuities, or having thoughts of increases that you speculate on Palo or Remy suggesting Gratuities, when you have the choice of investing that money yourself until your due date and then paying it, when you chose to pay it early?

I'm really really confused now?!?

Ex Techie

 

[healeylvr]

We have been on 8 DCL cruises and are aware of the tiping policy for housekeeping,servers,etc.Any other services such as Palo spas drinks and room service are seperate and given for the service recieved. DCL is a premium cruise line and the services are exceptional as well as the price.I do not quibble about "extras" on a first class trip as long as I am aware of them.The CM's are entitled to the tips they earn and should not be shorted for the outstanding service they provide.DCL prices have risen year to year and are quite expensive compared to other cruise lines but I still think that even with tips this is still the best place to spend my money.Bottom line when the cruise is over how much did you enjoy it and how much you want to do it again.

 

[justmestace]

So I would guess that saying:
"I have already booked and paid for a cruise in 2013. Disney gets to use my money for various investments in the company far in advance of providing me with any service. Yet, they are finding ways to increase my out-of-pocket expenses in excess of my original budget."

When not required to, isn't really a good reason for worrying about non existent increases in your cruise fair, non existent increases in suggested Gratuities, or having thoughts of increases that you speculate on Palo or Remy suggesting Gratuities, when you have the choice of investing that money yourself until your due date and then paying it, when you chose to pay it early?

I'm really really confused now?!?

Ex Techie

You're right. Although he didn't answer you, he didn't HAVE to pay in full a year in advance. DCL allows you to make payments, and that way, they wouldn't have use of his money for so long a period of time.

And if he hadn't chosen to sail in a suite, he'd still be able to cancel and get 100% of his money back. He's nowhere near the excursion booking dates that KCashner was talking about, nor is he VGT/OGT/IGT.

 

[justmestace]

Again, I do not begrudge Disney from trying to make money, but you cannot honestly tell me that you think these tip changes enhance the experience of the guests. It is simply a process for them to be more profitable.

As a business owner as well, we also have increasing expenses annually (i.e. malpractice premiums, insurance plan premiums, etc.). However, I do not feel that I personally have to increase my annual level of total compensation at the expense of others that work for me. Disney, however, does have to make more PROFIT every year to satisfy shareholders and, therefore, has to squeeze even more money out of each passenger beyond any increases in their expenses.

DWF

I don't see how the auto-grat system profits DCL...other than to lessen the lines at Guest Services when tip time rolls around....and that should make the passengers happy.

Also, while prices of the cruises may be going up, due to the higher cost of absolutely everything these days, where does the auto-grat come into the picture of DCL "increasing their annual level of total compensation at the expense of their employees" ???

I applaud you for NOT doing this. In order for us to not lower our employees wages, or to avoid having to let one of them go, my husband and I both took MAJOR pay cuts this past year, and have yet to raise our salaries back up again. Maybe we never will....we're doing just fine with less. No more suites for us, but who cares? They aren't that big of a deal in the first place.

 

[Tower]

I saw this on my travel agent's FB page to first let me know of the tipping change. Carnival did this on our last (horrid) cruise. I did then what I'm going to do on our upcoming Magic cruise which is remove that 'auto-tip' and tip each person as I have done in the past on all of my cruises. Disney cannot mandate tipping and I prefer to tip directly, look the person in the face and say "Hey, you did a great job with my family. I appreciate all your hard work"

 

[mmouse37]

I saw this on my travel agent's FB page to first let me know of the tipping change. Carnival did this on our last (horrid) cruise. I did then what I'm going to do on our upcoming Magic cruise which is remove that 'auto-tip' and tip each person as I have done in the past on all of my cruises. Disney cannot mandate tipping and I prefer to tip directly, look the person in the face and say "Hey, you did a great job with my family. I appreciate all your hard work"

You can still do this...as far as I know. Won't we still get tip envelopes to hand to the servers/room stewards...with the vouchers?

They may bill it automatically but you will still be personally handing out the tip envelopes...at least that is my understanding of the new policy.

I always add more and have never felt the need to tip less in 24 DCL cruises...so this new policy is great for me. I can add my additional tip amount in cash and it is one less thing to do while I am board (charging my tips at GS)..it will be done for me. If I do ever feel the need to reduce my tips I will then go to GS...no big deal.

MJ

 

[kcashner]

I saw this on my travel agent's FB page to first let me know of the tipping change. Carnival did this on our last (horrid) cruise. I did then what I'm going to do on our upcoming Magic cruise which is remove that 'auto-tip' and tip each person as I have done in the past on all of my cruises. Disney cannot mandate tipping and I prefer to tip directly, look the person in the face and say "Hey, you did a great job with my family. I appreciate all your hard work"

You will still get the tip envelopes and coupons in the cabin--you place the coupon in the envelope and hand it to the person. If you wish to increase the standard tip,you can do it by either adding cash to the envelope or going to GS and increasing the amount you are charging.

I have done at least 2 cruises on the Magic with the automatic charge to your KTTW account. The ONLY thing that changed for us is that I had to go to GS to increase my tips rather than filling out the form and dropping it in the box to charge the tips in the first place. Same process, so essentially no change. And the service on those cruises was AMAZING. Of course on one, we did request a server.

I think people are making too big a deal out of this. The only change is that if you do nothing, your team gets the suggested tips. You are still fully in control and can go to GS to increase or decrease the amount. You can decrease it to zero and pay in cash. I suspect there will be those people who never read any of what comes to their cabin (YOU DO get a letter explaining this charged tips delivered to the cabin), and those people might end up tipping twice (charged and cash) because they choose to not read while on vacation.

 

[ThePhantomsGirl]

I pre-paid on my last cruise, and other than DCL's normal "we love to mess up anything to do with two unrelated adults traveling together" scenarios, it was so easy. I just added cash to the envelopes to those I wanted to tip higher amounts.

 

[ranidayz]

. . . all seem to point to one thing, Disney is trying to cut their fixed costs as much as possible.

1) The new auto-tip policy - presumably it will likely increase the amount each tipped crew member receives since it seems less likely they will get "stiffed" by a guest when the tip system is already built-in. I guess I just wonder if Disney pursued the policy as a mechanism to even further lower the salary they offer tipped crew members (i.e. "we are lowering your salary from $50 to $20 a month but our internal research shows that you will likely garner an extra $200 a month from tips based on the experience of the Magic")

2) The concierge tip - in what used to be a non tipped position, Disney started giving concierge guests an envelope for them as well a couple years ago. I have heard (presuming true) that Disney decreased the compensation they provided to the concierge staff when they instituted the tip envelopes.

3) The new official blurb noted on this board that Palo and Remy now include wording that additional tips are recommended for great service. Again, I question if Disney lowered the salary of the Palo and Remy staff by saying to those crew members that they will make more through the extra tips than they were before.

I hate to sound like a skeptic, but it just seems like all these moves go in only one direction, the guest has a greater financial burden to bare as Disney cuts expenses. I certainly will continue to practice my usual tipping policy (i.e. more for my stateroom crew member than recommended), however, just think HOW AWESOME IT WOULD HAVE BEEN IF DISNEY WENT IN THE OPPOSITE DIRECTION! Big announcement by Disney stating all tips are now included in your fare!!!! People would be having parties before their cruises to celebrate.

I just hate to feel that I am squeezed at every corner. No, Disney is not there yet, but will tip envelopes for the kids club crew members be far off? If the current trends continue, I guess I should just plan for another few bucks on our next Disney cruise in 2013. I just worry that the magical experiences we have had will be clouded in the future by all of the tips, surcharges, etc. that Disney feels compelled to include.

Any opinions?

DWF

While I'm not thrilled with the change, I understand why they are doing it. I am confused as to whether they are charging it as soon as you walk on the ship or toward the end.

I know there are a lot of people who are either suprised that there is a request for 'tipping' at all, forget to do it or just stiff the workers. That is whom I believe this is intended for. What I am thankful for is the ability to alter the amounts - whether up or down - depending on the service. Last year our stateroom host was not too wonderful, but our servers were fantastical. We tipped accordingly. As long as we still have control if we want it, that's fine with me.

 

[GoofyTwinDad]

If I'm correct, it seems the majority of posters on DIS tip in excess of the recommendations by DCL for exceptional service. I don't feel this new policy will in anyway change the tipping habits by those who have cruised before. This policy will only help to improve service by ensuring tips from first time cruisers and those from societies that do not understand tipping procedures when traveling abroad. Great job DCL for looking out for your employees that make the cruises worth every penny spent.

Is this new policy troubling to some due to loss of control?

 

[carpenta]

if i'm correct, it seems the majority of posters on dis tip in excess of the recommendations by dcl for exceptional service. I don't feel this new policy will in anyway change the tipping habits by those who have cruised before. This policy will only help to improve service by ensuring tips from first time cruisers and those from societies that do not understand tipping procedures when traveling abroad. Great job dcl for looking out for your employees that make the cruises worth every penny spent.

Is this new policy troubling to some due to loss of control?

bravo!!!! Dad......

 

[kcashner]

Loss of control--maybe that is what people are having an emotional reaction to, but in reality there is no loss of control.

The guest can still go to Guest Services and alter the tips in any way they choose. The difference is only in the "default." Previously, the default was that DCL would do nothing (I had to complete the GS form and drop it off to charge tips). Now the default is that the suggested tip will be charged to the account (if you want to charge a different amount or not charge at all, you must complete the form).

 

[ilovetexas]

Loss of control--maybe that is what people are having an emotional reaction to, but in reality there is no loss of control.

The guest can still go to Guest Services and alter the tips in any way they choose. The difference is only in the "default." Previously, the default was that DCL would do nothing (I had to complete the GS form and drop it off to charge tips). Now the default is that the suggested tip will be charged to the account (if you want to charge a different amount or not charge at all, you must complete the form).

I agree with you about the reality and disagree with pp that it is loss of control. I think that there are a frightening amount of people who brag about the thousands of dollars they pay to cruise DCL, brag that DCL has superior service to other cruise lines, then are too "budget minded" (if I say cheap, I'm gonna get in trouble) to pony up $84 a week for the men and women who wait on them hand and foot for seven days.

Seriously, it's not unusual for us to end up tipping over $20 for a meal when our family of 5 goes out....and that's to a chain restaurant like Chili's, nothing expensive. The thought that people are THIS upset that they have to tip their servers is mind boggling.