Why do people associate budget with cheap or poor?

[MrsPete]

DW had the same thing. In the early 90s, she worked retail. On payday, many of her coworkers would rush out at lunchtime to cash their checks so they could afford to eat lunch that day. She, on the other hand, had direct deposit and didn't even know that it was payday because it simply didn't matter to her.

The same coworkers bought sodas from the vending machine in the break room once or twice each day for $.75 each. DW, on the other hand, brought a can of store brand soda ($.10 each) from home. The coworkers ate out every day, spending $5 or more on fast food. DW packed lunch from home for $2 or less. She was making no more than them. We weren't married yet and I was still in school, so I wasn't making much either. They just didn't get that you can't spend every penny you earn as soon as you earn it.

Hey, I think your wife and I used to work together! I came to the conclusion that some people just can't see past this week, and they don't understand that you cannot spend every penny you earn.

My husband and I were just married at that point, and I was still in college and was working just in the afternoons. We were VERY poor, having just spend almost every penny on our wedding and the downpayment on our house. We watched every penny carefully -- my grocery budget was $35/week for two people, and that was in 1990. Yet we put my every-other paycheck into the bank because we didn't yet have an emergency fund, and that was a priority for us. Some of my co-workers knew that we did this, and they thought my husband must've been rich (yeah, right, he was just out of school). They never noticed that we shared one car, I didn't have new clothes often, that I brought my lunch and sodas in a little cooler, and that I didn't go shopping every day at lunch for junk.

 

[MrsPete]

The problem is the TRANSITION. I can see how that would be an issue. They would get their regular weekly pay and then when it's time to transition they have to last two weeks for their next one. After the initial transition - no problem.

I don't know. I think people who literally live paycheck to paycheck are used to going through the occasional NO MONEY WHATSOEVER period -- essentially the same thing as the transition period you're describing.

I mean, at some point, we all need a new transmission or a new refrigerator. If you don't have savings, that money has to come from somewhere. I'd assume that people with no resources to fall back upon just do without during those weeks: they scrounge around in the cabinets and cook that old box of mac-and-cheese, they eat at their mom's house, and they just plain do without things.

I think the longer period between paychecks would be a greater problem than the one-time transition period. People who can't /don't budget have more trouble with longer periods between paychecks.

Personally, for most of my life I've been paid once a month. It's great. You get all your money at one time, and all your bills are due at the same time. Where's the problem? You pay all the bills, and what's left is yours. No need to save X amount towards the car payment that isn't due until next week.

 

[ducklite]

And -- on another track -- I've seen too many kids build up expensive spending habits because even a minimum wage job (and no one actually pays minimum around here -- even fast food pays a couple dollars over minimum) is a good bit of money when you're living at home with mom and dad. Too many of these kids get into the habit of buying new clothes, music, etc. on a regular basis. These expensive tastes'll make it more difficult once they're out on their own and are really paying their own bills.

This is so true. My son had a summer job when he was 16 and put over $1400 into his savings account from it. One of his job duties was sweeping the warehouse, and he would usually find $2-5 in coins becaue his lazy co-workers couldn't be bothered to pick up their dropped change! He "lived" off of that. I think he spent the equivelent of two paychecks all summer, and banked the rest! His friend worked at the same place, and was broke at the end of the summer. Instead of taking lunch to work he'd go out every day, and spend every weekend at the mall spending, spending, spending.

Anne

 

[jeankeri]

This is almost impossible to do. I was a scout leader for many years. On our weekend trips the boys had to bring money for friday and sunday fast food stops. Invariably most of the kids would have spent their money before sunday's stop. The troop leaders became a pseudo bank. At a committee meeting ( scouters will know what this means) I proposed that we stop lending money on sunday evening. This was met with a ton of resistance from most of the adults. Much discussion about how parents would feel if their kids didn't eat. Shucks...they would be home in less than an hour sometimes and many (including me) could have afforded to miss a meal or three. Anyway, after persistence and my reminding them that a scout is thrifty we got it through. The look on the kids faces was almost shock(even though it was announced at least 3 times at meetings). "What do you mean I cann't get my whopper." You would not have believed the reaction from the parents. We heard very vocal opposition to this. How we were torturing (really that word was used) the kids. We also heard some very good praise. Which as a volunteer leader you very rarely hear. The emotions on both sides was about as high as we ever had for an issue with our troop.

Wayne

Hey bluehen! Welcome to the Dis! Glad our thread prompted you to post your first post!
When I was a scout leader bringing Cubs to camp we had a limit of $5 that the scout could bring to spend at the trading post for the week. The post had frozen candy bars and slushies and other really necessary things that the boys copuld have easily spent $5 a day on if given the opportunity. The parents were very supportive of this, the boys grumbled a bit. The camp had great meals and the boys got a popsicle treat every night after supper, so the extras wern't necessary. As a pack we also had campfires with s'mores, etc.After the second day all boys were fine with it and realized they were not missing out on anything.

 

[bluehen]

Hey bluehen! Welcome to the Dis! Glad our thread prompted you to post your first post!
When I was a scout leader bringing Cubs to camp we had a limit of $5 that the scout could bring to spend at the trading post for the week. The post had frozen candy bars and slushies and other really necessary things that the boys copuld have easily spent $5 a day on if given the opportunity. The parents were very supportive of this, the boys grumbled a bit. The camp had great meals and the boys got a popsicle treat every night after supper, so the extras wern't necessary. As a pack we also had campfires with s'mores, etc.After the second day all boys were fine with it and realized they were not missing out on anything.

Thank you for the kind words. I knew scouts that spent 10 bucks a day on that stuff. They were older though. I saw more sugar highs than I ever wanted to. On a high adventure ski trip I actually saw 1 kid eat a dozen donuts by himself. Complained he was not feeling well a couple hours later. The car stopped but there was no sympathy from the peanut gallery. This was my main reason for not wanting to lend money. The kids would spend it all on junk. I felt we were doing a great disservice to them by subsidizing their horrible eating habits.

To the girl scout leader that didn't know what her girls spent there money on in the gas stations. If it were our guys it was definitely candy and junk food. We had a common stop on our trips that had a gas station right next to it. I think less than half of our guys went into McDonalds first. I really think they had a signup sheet to limit the checkout lines.

Wayne

 

[disykat]

This is so true. My son had a summer job when he was 16 and put over $1400 into his savings account from it. One of his job duties was sweeping the warehouse, and he would usually find $2-5 in coins becaue his lazy co-workers couldn't be bothered to pick up their dropped change! He "lived" off of that. I think he spent the equivelent of two paychecks all summer, and banked the rest! His friend worked at the same place, and was broke at the end of the summer. Instead of taking lunch to work he'd go out every day, and spend every weekend at the mall spending, spending, spending.

Anne

I can't even imagine spending all the money from a part time job as a kid. I don't think it ever occured to me or my siblings to try. We were saving for college!

 

[me again]

This is almost impossible to do. I was a scout leader for many years. On our weekend trips the boys had to bring money for friday and sunday fast food stops. Invariably most of the kids would have spent their money before sunday's stop. The troop leaders became a pseudo bank. At a committee meeting ( scouters will know what this means) I proposed that we stop lending money on sunday evening. This was met with a ton of resistance from most of the adults. Much discussion about how parents would feel if their kids didn't eat. Shucks...they would be home in less than an hour sometimes and many (including me) could have afforded to miss a meal or three. Anyway, after persistence and my reminding them that a scout is thrifty we got it through. The look on the kids faces was almost shock(even though it was announced at least 3 times at meetings). "What do you mean I cann't get my whopper." You would not have believed the reaction from the parents. We heard very vocal opposition to this. How we were torturing (really that word was used) the kids. We also heard some very good praise. Which as a volunteer leader you very rarely hear. The emotions on both sides was about as high as we ever had for an issue with our troop.

Wayne

Oh I do know what you mean!

something similar just happened with us. DS went on a day-trip with some friends. We gave him an emergency $5 bill, just to be used if something came up, not to be spent. We told ds we expected to get it back at the end of the trip. Well, we never saw that $5. He said he "lost it" in the car on the way there. Put us in an awkward position, to ask the friends who took him for our $5 back! Obviiously we didn't do that. He probably spent it on soda, candy machines, etc. From now on we give emergency money to the adult in charge, not the kid. I don't know what type of emergency, I just feel better if the kid has a few bucks on them, you never know. But the idea of emergency cash really isn't as important now with instant communication via cell phones, etc.

 

[me again]

This is almost impossible to do. I was a scout leader for many years. On our weekend trips the boys had to bring money for friday and sunday fast food stops. Invariably most of the kids would have spent their money before sunday's stop. The troop leaders became a pseudo bank. At a committee meeting ( scouters will know what this means) I proposed that we stop lending money on sunday evening. This was met with a ton of resistance from most of the adults. Much discussion about how parents would feel if their kids didn't eat. Shucks...they would be home in less than an hour sometimes and many (including me) could have afforded to miss a meal or three. Anyway, after persistence and my reminding them that a scout is thrifty we got it through. The look on the kids faces was almost shock(even though it was announced at least 3 times at meetings). "What do you mean I cann't get my whopper." You would not have believed the reaction from the parents. We heard very vocal opposition to this. How we were torturing (really that word was used) the kids. We also heard some very good praise. Which as a volunteer leader you very rarely hear. The emotions on both sides was about as high as we ever had for an issue with our troop.

Wayne

See if I was a kid and was given x amount of dollars for spending for a weekend trip I'd automatically put aside a portion of it for my precious bank account. I really loved that account, watching it grow, the feeling of satisfaction just knowing I had it, guess I was just weird! Every saturday My mother would give me $1 for the movies, I'd manage to save at least ten cents, usually by getting the unbuttered popcorn, ten cents less than buttered Well, that dime went into a little box on my dresser, when I had enough I'd trot it to the bank. Its amazing how it added up. And that bank account bailed me out of some of life's emergencies later on down the road. But I really don't think my kids will have the same feeling towards savings as I did, at least I will give it a try, just to introduce them to the whole concept, the mechanics, etc.

 

[me again]

I can't even imagine spending all the money from a part time job as a kid. I don't think it ever occured to me or my siblings to try. We were saving for college!

I wold figure if I spent all the money I was working for nothing if I had nothing left over to show for my work. Guess most kids just feel its the moment, spend it, let Mom & Dad take care of the big expenses.

Actually, we have a college savings account for each of our kids, but its just a plain savings account (yes, I know all about the college savings programs, we decided not to go for them). The account's in our name, if we decide our kids are doing their part by knuckling down and studying we will pay for their education, but I'm not putting money away for a 4-year party!

 

[MrsPete]

To the girl scout leader that didn't know what her girls spent there money on in the gas stations. If it were our guys it was definitely candy and junk food.

I know she had a red rose and a jewelry box. Your guess about candy and junk food is probably right -- and rather foolish because the troop was paying for three good meals a day!

 

[MrsPete]

I can't even imagine spending all the money from a part time job as a kid. I don't think it ever occured to me or my siblings to try. We were saving for college!

On the other hand, SAVING doesn't occur to most kids today! MANY high school kids are working so that they can have cell phones, ipods, meals out with friends . . . and for the girls, it's acrylic nails, tanning, highlights in their hair.

We did a survey on how the senior class spends money a year or so ago -- it tied into class, but I won't get into how -- and the majority of the seniors responded that their money is just 100% fun, discretionary money. A good number reported buying their own school items: yearbooks, prom tickets, SAT fees. (Senior year can be very, very expensive!) A few reported saving for a short-term goal such as beach trip after graduation or the downpayment on a car. Not one single person in our survey said he was saving for college.

It could be that the college-savers just didn't answer the survey, but I think it's an indication that saving is really, really a low priority amongst teens. They've been taught that either your parents pay for college, or you borrow for college. I don't think they see that a thousand dollars paid today could at least reduce their indebtedness a little in the future.

 

[disykat]

On the other hand, SAVING doesn't occur to most kids today! MANY high school kids are working so that they can have cell phones, ipods, meals out with friends . . . and for the girls, it's acrylic nails, tanning, highlights in their hair.

We did a survey on how the senior class spends money a year or so ago -- it tied into class, but I won't get into how -- and the majority of the seniors responded that their money is just 100% fun, discretionary money. A good number reported buying their own school items: yearbooks, prom tickets, SAT fees. (Senior year can be very, very expensive!) A few reported saving for a short-term goal such as beach trip after graduation or the downpayment on a car. Not one single person in our survey said he was saving for college.

It could be that the college-savers just didn't answer the survey, but I think it's an indication that saving is really, really a low priority amongst teens. They've been taught that either your parents pay for college, or you borrow for college. I don't think they see that a thousand dollars paid today could at least reduce their indebtedness a little in the future.

Bad parenting does that to a kid. My kids have had savings accounts for years. One is a saver, and one is a spender. We just have to work a little harder to teach our spender about the value of money (he's 12 now). At this point we FORCE him to put part of his money in savings. We'll keep doing that, if necessary, as long as we're involved in his finances. Spending it all simply isn't an option as long as we have the ability to make his life miserable.

That said, if you asked my kids what they spend their money on - they'd tell you about things and not even mention their savings account.

 

[me again]

Bad parenting does that to a kid. My kids have had savings accounts for years. One is a saver, and one is a spender. We just have to work a little harder to teach our spender about the value of money (he's 12 now). At this point we FORCE him to put part of his money in savings. We'll keep doing that, if necessary, as long as we're involved in his finances. Spending it all simply isn't an option as long as we have the ability to make his life miserable.

That said, if you asked my kids what they spend their money on - they'd tell you about things and not even mention their savings account.

Yep, I agree--kids need to be taught how to save! That's why I'm starting to teach mine to save this summer. Each has an ING account, seeded with $25. The great thing about ING is that it accepts small deposits and doesn't nickel and dime a small account to death. Both kids are currently earning money through surveys, and money we pay them for chores like lawn, etc. They're encouraged to put a portion of it in their savings account. We just started this, its a habit that will take time to grow, but if all a kid knows how to do with money is to spend it, then don't wonder if that's what he does! Kids need to be taught the mechanics of savings, as well as the habit.

 

[sk!mom]

I'm sure that a few students DO benefit from a part-time job, but I've seen SCADS who've built up poor work habits, who've taken easy classes so they could manage work + school, who've given up their chance to play high school sports and be in high school clubs . . . and they have nothing to show for it. The job and the paycheck become the focus of the students' lives, and it's to their detriment. I've seen too many kids coming to school with too little sleep, dropping honors math for regular (because they have to keep the grades up or else mom and dad'll make them quit their job!), and quitting activities that they used to enjoy so that they can work more hours. I've seen too many kids who were perfectly willing to skip school (sometimes even with parental permission) because they "had to" work that day.

It's kind of like some of the other posts on this thread right now, which talk about people who can't see that they're making themselves poor by spending money on vending machine food or cigarettes -- these high school students can't see that by putting so much of their energy into a part-time job, they're cheating themselves out of really throwing themselves into their high school careers, which are such a stepping stone into the real world.

And -- on another track -- I've seen too many kids build up expensive spending habits because even a minimum wage job (and no one actually pays minimum around here -- even fast food pays a couple dollars over minimum) is a good bit of money when you're living at home with mom and dad. Too many of these kids get into the habit of buying new clothes, music, etc. on a regular basis. These expensive tastes'll make it more difficult once they're out on their own and are really paying their own bills.

Nope, not a fan of part-time jobs for teens. A decade and a half in the classroom tells me that the students who benefit are far outnumered by those who are injured.

I totally agree with you. I have seen this in my niece and nephews who have worked. They took easier classes and gave up all extracurriculars for jobs.

My DS did not work but had many friends who quit band because they didn't have time for it due to a job or early morning practices were too difficult when you work until 11:00 pm.

DS did not work until after high school graduation. Summers were spent on mission trips, camps, family vacations, etc... He could have had a part time summer job but was never able to find one that would allow enough time off for the activities that he was involved in. He mowed lawns occasionally to make some extra cash.

We will follow the same plan with DD.

DH and I worked from about 14 and feel that we missed a lot because of it.

 

[me again]

I agree with the poster who said that pt jobs for teens gives them too much discresionary (sp?) income. all their income goes for luxuries, such as games, eating out, clothes, etc., then when they're actually living on their own and their earnings have to go for things like rent, utilities, etc., they can't make ends meet because they're so used to getting all the goodies first.

 

[jsbjeb]

I love this thread! I have been thinking of some of the replies when I am shopping ...has definately helped me save some money this week!!

 

[tonilea]

This would be us. Our "budget" is somehow wired into our brain. It isn't on paper. It is just an inate sense of how much is too much.

That amazes me. I wish it were so with us. We have just this year gotten a real hold on our finances and have a written budget. We have been married 18 years and money has always been a problem for us - until now. Now

If you want to confuse people - call your budget a "allocated spending plan".

I fall into the nerd catagory. I have auto calculating allocated spending worksheets through Feb. 08. I can tell you how every paycheck will be spent.

 

[neatokimmo]

Oh I like that

I have my "allocations" set through the end of 2008. I find that if I plan out 2 years at a time I'm able to keep an eye on the big picture better.

If you want to confuse people - call your budget a "allocated spending plan".

I fall into the nerd catagory. I have auto calculating allocated spending worksheets through Feb. 08. I can tell you how every paycheck will be spent.

 

[perd]

I agree with all that has been said.

I think for me, every single purchase is evaluated. From a soda at lunch (I can have water for free!) to what would be the best 1080P LCD 47" television for the money. It does not matter. And BECAUSE I had the water instead of the soda, I can buy a lot of things! Most people do not think about the money they spend, and they expect everyone to be like them.

We rarely buy alcoholic drinks when we go out for dinner. We usually drink water and figure if we want a drink we can have one when we get home at 1/4th the price.

 

[ducklite]

We rarely buy alcoholic drinks when we go out for dinner. We usually drink water and figure if we want a drink we can have one when we get home at 1/4th the price.

That's a budget buster for us, because we really enjoy pairing wine with dinner. We've stopped eating out as much rather than not having our wine. I'm sure I'll get flamed by someone telling me that alcohol shouldn't be a priority, but it's not the idea of "getting drunk" as opposed to the idea of the flavor of the wine enhancing the food.

Anne