Speaking other languages in public in the U.S.

[shortbun]

I once escorted a group of Americans through Holland, Belgium, bits of Germany and Maastricht. One of the women walked up to me and whispered, "I know they all speak English, they just are being mean!" She was in Belgium where most were speaking French or German. She thought there was a conspiracy to make her uncomfortable because she was American. I had to work very hard not to show my amusement. Some Americans really think the whole world should speak English and pay in dollars.

 

[Keli]

I think it is very rude to speak a language in front of someone that you know they cannot understand. And it is also rude to talk about person, in front of that person, in any language. Don't do either of those two things and I'm ok with it.

 

[ols386]

I have no problem with people speaking another language when out in public, especially if they are speaking with family, friends, etc. Those are private conversations and don't involve me.

I do think if you are an employe of a company here in the U.S., and deal with the public, you need to be able to speak English at least at a level where I can understand you.

 

[Sgt Mickey]

Threads like this show how as Americans we want other to accept us but we can accept anything else.
I think it is interesting when other people come into the store I work at and speak other languages. Like someone else said I am jealous I wish I spoke more then english. If anyone remember me posting back a while ago and my struggles in spanish class
I don't see why we all have to be the same. I agree that lady was rude.

 

[A_Princess'_Daddy]

The difference is that they were embracing their new country and trying to assimilate. The ones now aren't so much. They want others to assimilate to them and even take care of them with all the government programs.

Again, I'm sorry but that is simply incorrect. It is an opinion driven by your preconceptions of the past and the present and is not an accurate representation of reality, then or now. You are expecting today's immigrants to assimilate instantly, which is functionally impossible to do on a universal scale and is not what happened, again for the most part, historically. You can cling to your opinions all you want, but that is not what happened in the past nor what is happening in the present according to the totality of the data.

Think of assimilation as an oak tree growing from an acorn. You cannot track it day by day, month by month or even year by year, but in 50 years, you're going to have a big tree and an assimilated culture. You must also keep in mind that assimilation does not mean wholesale adoption of our culture. The immigrants of history who assimilated also injected their cultures and histories into America's evolving culture. If not, we'd all still be Puritans and we certainly wouldn't have the diverse culture that we have now. So assimilation of the "new" immigrant cultures (and they're not actually new, as this country has been exchanging immigrants with Mexico and other Latin American countries for generations) will mean an evolution of American culture, and therefore I'd suggest you get used to that reality, even if you don't choose to like it.

 

[PrincessKsMom]

I'm curious how many of you speak Madarin? If we're going to get all upset that we're not accomodating and bilingual, why not require all Americans to learn Mandarin? It is the mostly widely spoken language in the world. If we are to be a truly open society and world market, shouldn't we be able to speak to the most populus nation in the world and not just accomodate our neighbors?

 

[A_Princess'_Daddy]

Admittedly, it's been awhile (12 years or so) since I've been to Brazil, but my experience working in the country was actually that Spanish speaking people were looked down upon by many because there was an inherent distrust of those from other South American countries. I don't know if it came from being the only non-Spanish speaking country in the region or what, but I was told by a number of people to make a point of not speaking Spanish to a native Brazilian or they might think you're Argentinian, Chilean, etc.

Like I said, I've never been to Brazil, so my entire knowledge of that country's use of English and Spanish in public announcements draws from having a Brazilian roommate/friend in college. That having been said, I don't doubt that they look down upon Spanish speakers, my point was more that despite having a legal language, they supposedly still make announcements in other languages. But I could be wrong, as nearly the totality of the Brazilian component of my argument is drawn from having essentially this same conversation multiple times while in college, which was a few more than twelve years ago and proves again that this isn't a new argument.

 

[violetrose]

I didn't say it would be easy. But many think Americans are arrogant for traveling the world and not bothering to learn enough passable language for the country they are visiting. And that's just on vacation. But people want to move here, live here, work here and function here and not learn the language or expect everything to be offered in their language and we're the ones with the problem?

My opinion, unpopular as it is.

Not unpopular with me, I completely agree.

 

[Gumbo4x4]

I

And that is a problem because??

It's a step backwards.

And yes, there is a movement within the Latino community to deliberately NOT assimilate. I have no idea of the percentage it is compared to the community at large.

My German ancestors came to my hometown almost 200 years ago as part of an attempt to create a German "utopia" here in the US. My great-great grandfather even sent a propaganda book back to Germany and was largely credited with recruiting many German immigrants to this area. Ultimately, their utopia was unsuccessful, and they assimilated after a period as outcasts.

 

[Gumbo4x4]

I'm curious how many of you speak Madarin? If we're going to get all upset that we're not accomodating and bilingual, why not require all Americans to learn Mandarin? It is the mostly widely spoken language in the world. If we are to be a truly open society and world market, shouldn't we be able to speak to the most populus nation in the world and not just accomodate our neighbors?

Not quite. More people speak Mandarin, but its not nearly as "widely" spoken as English. Even where English is not the first language, it is often the second language. And it's the language of international business and travel (international pilots speak English).

 

[Lorelei Lee]

I work for an international insurance company.

A coworker of mine got a great temporary assignment a few months ago. Two weeks in Italy, at the company's expense, helping our Italian branch clear up a backlog of claims. She had to prove her fluency in Italian in order to qualify for the assignment.

Not a problem for her. She lived in Italy once and is fluent in the language. It probably came easy to her, she's also fluent in Portuguese, as she is the child of Portuguese immigrants and has spent a good deal of time visiting her grandparents in Portugal.

I have to admit I am jealous. I used to have a small degree of fluency in Spanish after many classes in high school and college, but I have forgotten a lot of what I used to know.

 

[wdwmom3]

I think it is very rude to speak a language in front of someone that you know they cannot understand. And it is also rude to talk about person, in front of that person, in any language. Don't do either of those two things and I'm ok with it.

So I guess you would consider it rude for you to speak English while in another country? Or is that different somehow? I'm really curious how someone talking to someone other then yourself in another language is rude.

 

[PrincessKsMom]

So I guess you would consider it rude for you to speak English while in another country? Or is that different somehow? I'm really curious how someone talking to someone other then yourself in another language is rude.

There's a huge difference between visiting somewhere on vacation and actually living there for an extended period of time.

 

[wdwmom3]

The op mentioned they were in a store. Unless you know the person how would you know how long the person has been there? But really why does it matter. Why does it affect you if you not part of the conversation? I have several Spanish speaking friends. They can all speak English well but do find Spanish easier since its their first language. If 2 of my friends say something to each other in spanish simply because it's easier for them, why should i care?

 

[joviroxx]

It's a step backwards.

And yes, there is a movement within the Latino community to deliberately NOT assimilate. I have no idea of the percentage it is compared to the community at large.

My German ancestors came to my hometown almost 200 years ago as part of an attempt to create a German "utopia" here in the US. My great-great grandfather even sent a propaganda book back to Germany and was largely credited with recruiting many German immigrants to this area. Ultimately, their utopia was unsuccessful, and they assimilated after a period as outcasts.

I don't know why but the word Latino bugs me. I consider myself Hispanic, not Latina...

Anyway, while there might be a SMALL contingent of the community not assimilating, its a very small percentage. Besides, they can't live in a vacuum for long. Eventually, the older folks will pass on, the next generation will be speaking English as they went to school here.

And people speak of the hispanics being difficult, well, DH's grandmother came from Italy, YEARS ago. The woman spoke maybe 50 English words and couldn't communicate. She just didnt want to learn.

My son is very into Tae Kwon Do, I can tell you the Korean community down here also has a percentage of Koreans that do not speak English. Of course, many are older but that too will pass. Each group has a strong bond with their culture.

My point is that this is not exclusive to Hispanics. I was born here, my parents came over in the 50's. My family assimilated well. I don't have an accent. My kids, sadly, barely speak the language but understand it. While I do find it tiring to encounter Hispanics that just refuse to learn English, its not just a Hispanic situation. There just happens to be more of them and more noticeable.

There are little Italys, Korean Town, Little Havannas everywhere where the signs are in different languages and you can find people that don't speak English.

 

[ceemys]

Having others speak a different language, I have no issue. What I DO have an issue with is if you decide to live in the US, learn English. But the reverse is also true, if Americans move to another country, then learn that language. I went to Japan for 3 years and learned how to speak Japanese. I think it is the respectful thing to do.

 

[wdwmom3]

I don't think some people realize but some of the attitudes on here, like how it's rude to speak another language, is one of the reasons for this whole "ugly american" image that many other parts of the world have. And no I'm not agreeing with that label. But as a Canadian I find it very interesting that when traveling in another country you get a lot of attitude sometimes until they learn that I'm Canadian and not American. When they learn I'm Canadian all of a sudden people become so much more warm and friendly. There is a reason that many Canadians traveling overseas make sure to have a Canadian flag somewhere like on bags.

 

[Shmily1]

Again, I'm sorry but that is simply incorrect. It is an opinion driven by your preconceptions of the past and the present and is not an accurate representation of reality, then or now. You are expecting today's immigrants to assimilate instantly, which is functionally impossible to do on a universal scale and is not what happened, again for the most part, historically. You can cling to your opinions all you want, but that is not what happened in the past nor what is happening in the present according to the totality of the data.

Think of assimilation as an oak tree growing from an acorn. You cannot track it day by day, month by month or even year by year, but in 50 years, you're going to have a big tree and an assimilated culture. You must also keep in mind that assimilation does not mean wholesale adoption of our culture. The immigrants of history who assimilated also injected their cultures and histories into America's evolving culture. If not, we'd all still be Puritans and we certainly wouldn't have the diverse culture that we have now. So assimilation of the "new" immigrant cultures (and they're not actually new, as this country has been exchanging immigrants with Mexico and other Latin American countries for generations) will mean an evolution of American culture, and therefore I'd suggest you get used to that reality, even if you don't choose to like it.

And how are you saying I'm expecting it to be instant when you yourself said they've been coming here for "generations"? I didn't say instantly. You assumed that. I'm fine that we have immigrants (legally, of course) and that we adopt some of their cultures. I love diverse foods and without immigrants of the past, we wouldn't have that here. What I don't like is as Gumbo said, there are those that don't want to even try to assimilate and even like to put down this country. If they don't like it, find somewhere else. It's been working great for America for many generations now.

 

[PrincessKsMom]

I don't think some people realize but some of the attitudes on here, like how it's rude to speak another language, is one of the reasons for this whole "ugly american" image that many other parts of the world have. And no I'm not agreeing with that label. But as a Canadian I find it very interesting that when traveling in another country you get a lot of attitude sometimes until they learn that I'm Canadian and not American. When they learn I'm Canadian all of a sudden people become so much more warm and friendly. There is a reason that many Canadians traveling overseas make sure to have a Canadian flag somewhere like on bags.

So they're treating you poorly in other countries because you're speaking English? Thought it was a just an American thing?

 

[wdwmom3]

So they're treating you poorly in other countries because you're speaking English? Thought it was a just an American thing?

No you get treated poorly when they think you are American. When people learn I'm Canadian I get a lot more respect and hospitality.