Should we join?

Discussion in 'Purchasing DVC' started by mrtoad2, Apr 16, 2004.

  1. mrtoad2

    mrtoad2 Earning My Ears

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    Regular visitors of Disney.

    We usally hit the annual passholder rates & do vacations every year sometimes twice.

    Getting pressure to buyin to SSR by May 9th before increase.

    If you don't have the cash to buy-in with enough points for family of 5, how long does it take to beat the price of financing & maintainance fees if you are accustomed to staying at the nicer hotels for under 200 per night.

    Any help would be appreciated.
     
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  3. jmminarik

    jmminarik Curmudgeon in Training.

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    Most folks seem to feel they'll break even in 5-10 years...most I've read say 7-8. It depends on how you add up the numbers when you sit down and figure out how it applies to your unique sitiation and how you account for inflation, highly discounted rates of rack rates, how you plan to finance. etc.

    -joe
     
  4. dianeschlicht

    dianeschlicht <font color=blue>DVC-Trivia Contest, Apr-2006: Hon

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    We did a home equity loan for ours so the interest rate was lower and so we could claim the deduction. We figure we broke even after about 4-5 years, but we bought our contracts in 1997 adn 1998. The accommodations are so much nicer than the deluxes we were staying in before. Our OKW home is plenty large enough for us. We are only 2 of us but our grown children and sometimes friends usually come with us, so we usually get a 2 bedroom at OKW two different trips a year. This year we are doing three on our current APs. We tried staying at AKL for a night last year, and while it was great fun to have the animals right outside our door, we really missed the size of our OKW 1 bedroom even for that one night.

    I would think you were perfect candidates for DVC. Look into resales for more points for less money.
     
  5. The Prophet

    The Prophet Mouseketeer

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    Unless you are already a DVC member, the price increase went into effect on April 4.

    The Prophet
     
  6. laceemouse

    laceemouse DIS Veteran

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    The deciding factor for us was that we have 4 kids. We would always need 2 hotel rooms anyway, and the 2 bedroom villa is WAY nicer than 2 hotel rooms, so it was a pretty easy decision for us. Do you usually all stay in one room? How old are you kids? As the kids get older that is WAY TOO MUCH togetherness for most families. If you will continue to go pretty often I think you would benefit from DVC. Have you looked into resales??? Lacee
     
  7. laceemouse

    laceemouse DIS Veteran

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    Also mrtoad....WELCOME TO THE DIS!!! But watch out, it is habit forming. Where are you? We lived in Normal for one year before moving up here, but we are really southerners.
     
  8. calypso*a*go-go

    calypso*a*go-go <a href="http://www.wdwinfo.com/dis-sponsor/" targ

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    Why SSR? Is that the resort you fell in love with or is it the only option you thought you had? At this point, you would be paying a premium price to buy into SSR (even with the extra 12 years). Make sure that's what you really want before you sign on the dotted line. As far as being a good candidate -- if you go to WDW every year, you need to seriously consider a membership. Take your time deciding as it's a pretty big step. Good Luck!!!
     
  9. OneMoreTry

    OneMoreTry <br><img src="http://www.wdwinfo.com/dis-sponsor/i

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    My first advice: Don't fall prey to a deadline! then the seller is at an advantage. You can always buy resale and SSR resales will be showing up in a couple of years. You can continue to do what you've been doing for a while.

    When I looked at DVC I compared 2BR cash versus 2BR points and came up with break-even at 6 to 10 years depending on the resort and how much we used points for Fri and Sat nights. I did not figure in the future value of money / investment potential of the money I spent. Neither did I account for the huge hotel tax I'm saving.

    I didn't do the comparison of studio DVC versus deluxe hotel because if I could have used a hotel room I would have preferred to stay at a deluxe. (I need a 2BR for my family to fit.)

    If you are paying less than $200 per night I think it would take a long time to break even.


    PS. I LOVE MY DVC!!
     
  10. pumpkinboy

    pumpkinboy <a href="http://www.wdwinfo.com/dis-sponsor/" targ

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    Well said, Prophet.

    The price increase is already there, but they might do some discounting on SSR and when they do, be there. Either that or you can buy in via resale.

    As for a breakeven point, my calculations put that at 6-7 years for us when comparing all DVC costs to just the cost of accomodation (Moderates and Deluxe on sale). When I did the same looking at the time value of money (if I had used that $$ to pay down my mortgage instead), plus the same cost of accomodation, I came out with about 12 years; so when we have owned DVC for 12 years we will be ahead of where we would have been pre-paying the mortgage by the amount we paid. Plus we'll have vacation lodgings covered until 2042.

    If you're gonna finance thru DVD, then wait for them to offer you a really good discount, and if they offer to buy-back the first year's points, that may be another good option (but then you might have to skip a year :eek:, but it would boost your downpayment). If you can finance it thru your home equity line, then resale may become an option, and you can save up front (tho the contract term would be 12 yrs shorter). My guess is that with interest costs, your breakeven point will be 12-13 years, considering time-value of money, if you can get a price of around $85 a point.

    Since we have a severely disabled child, and WDW is sooooo wheelchair friendly (and DS loves it) we didn't mind committing to 39 more years at WDW (38 now, but 50 if SSR). A no-brainer for us, once we did the math (even with conservative assumptions).
     
  11. mrtoad2

    mrtoad2 Earning My Ears

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    We are going to Disney in Sept & already paid in full for tickets & hotel. This year would definitely be a year to sell back the points. We did visit disney institute before they remodelled and the property looked nice. However, we might plan to use the points to stay at Poly or Contemp or even take a cruise. I really hesitate to buy at SSR because we heard rumor that the Garden Wing of Contemp is being torn down for DVC expansion.

    Does SSR have adjoining Studios. My kinderfolk are 9,5,4 & I hate buying two rooms because they still all crash on airbeds, cots, couches, etc.

    Does anyone know how Disney finances? Terms & interest rates?


    If they offer to buy the points back for the first year, does that mean I don't pay maintainence for calander year 2004?

    How has your experience been with booking room reservations. Do you need 6-12 mos. advance?

    Thanks for the help.
     
  12. DrTomorrow

    DrTomorrow Your Disney friend from the Future!<br><font color

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    Please don't let the rumors of a DVC Resort at the CR sway you - there's nothing official out there about it. Plus, SSR has years left in it, and then there's the already-planned Eagle Pines DVC Resort.
     
  13. tjkraz

    tjkraz <img src="http://www.wdwinfo.com/images/silver.jpg

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    A Two Bedroom at OKW in September is 22 points per night (weekday). With annual dues of $3.68 per point, the variable cost for that room is about $81 per night.

    You can plug in the initial investment and figure out how long it would take to break-even on those costs. I'm not going to do all of your homework for you. :p

    And that's for a room that, quite frankly, blows-away anything at a WDW deluxe resort--full kitchen, two bedrooms and a living room, two bathrooms (one with whirlpool tub), balcony that seats four, in room washer and dryer, etc.

    If you're married to the Poly or the CR, then so be it. I doubt WDW will stop taking the fistfulls of cash you throw at them every year. But with 5 DVC resorts on property, I think they each have a lot to offer and I can't wait to try them all.

    And keep hoping that those AP holder rates don't disappear (or get substantially reduced) someday...
     
  14. OneMoreTry

    OneMoreTry <br><img src="http://www.wdwinfo.com/dis-sponsor/i

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    This is one of the reasons we're doing a lot of WDW now. Our youngest has severe epilepsy. I had always planned on skiing, hiking, whitewater, backpacking with the family. For now a lot of that is on hold. WDW is a place we can all enjoy together and not stress too much with our sick one.
     
  15. Lisa P.

    Lisa P. DIS Veteran

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    Regular visitors of Disney... do vacations every year sometimes twice.

    Worth considering DVC. Compare the cost of DVC with other acceptable alternative options, whether they are comparable or not. Then see whether the price difference is worth the value (to you) of what you would get with DVC.

    ...family of 5, how long does it take to beat the price of financing & maintainance fees if you are accustomed to staying at the nicer hotels for under 200 per night.

    You are used to a Disney deluxe hotel room at $200/night and this is an acceptable alternative (to you) vs. DVC. As your children grow, you may find the single bathroom less appealing. You also may find that you are unable to take vacations during school session. But for now, let's compare what you are able to do ($200/night) with what you could do with DVC.

    With DVC, you must assume a 2BR is required for your family of 5.

    ...Sept...

    You haven't mentioned your travel days... how may weekend nights (Fri/Sat nts) and how many weeknights (Sun-Thu nts) you are planning. So I'll assume it's a regular 7-night week in a 2BR.

    Points required would be 218-270 depending on resort chosen.
    Purchase price would be ~$16,000-$24,000 depending on home resort and source. Annual maint fees would be ~$800-$1,200. Consider a portion of your purchase price (10%?) and interest payments (if financing) plus your annual dues when looking at your total costs with DVC.

    If you continued (at least for a few more years) as you have been, a week's accommodations would cost you ~$1,400. With DVC, it could cost you between $960-$3,000 for a week's accommodations. A lot depends on whether you buy at a resort with low maint fees and whether you buy a resale or get an exceptional incentive offer. It could easily cost you MORE to buy DVC than to continue as you are.

    It's important to consider whether the probable increase in your costs is worth doing for you, for the added space, amenities and comfort of DVC.

    ...we might plan to use the points to stay at Poly or Contemp or even take a cruise.

    Lost my DVC vote there. These options would end up costing you more! The cheapest rooms at Poly are 33 points weeknights and 60 points Fri/Sat nights, for 285 points/week. The cheapest at Contemp are 26 & 47, for 224 points/week. That's for a hotel room. Better off paying cash with no ongoing commitment, IMHO. Cruises are usually just as bad a value.

    Does SSR have adjoining Studios.

    "Adjoining" just means that two completely separate rooms are located next door to one another. "Connecting" means that occupants may move between two adjoing rooms by way of an interior door connecting those rooms, without exiting to the outside or common corridor. I am guessing you meant connecting. There are no connecting studio rooms at any DVC resort.

    For connecting rooms, DVC only offers 2BR lockoffs - a 2BR made up of a studio connecting with a 1BR.

    My kinderfolk are 9,5,4 & I hate buying two rooms because they still all crash on airbeds, cots, couches, etc.

    There are a handful of dedicated studio rooms at BWV which have a very small, extra daybed, just large enough for either of your younger two children. However, in a couple of years, it would no longer fit and you would still end up needing a 2BR.

    Do you need 6-12 mos. advance?

    It's advisable. Adventure (cheapest) season is popular with folks who like to stretch points. Premier (Christmas/Easter) season is quickly booked as well. Other school breaks are next to fill up. If you are able to book more than 7 months ahead (preferably 11), then you will do the best. But if you are flexible, it may be possible to get later reservations. HTH!
     
  16. laceemouse

    laceemouse DIS Veteran

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    mrtoad, no, there are no connecting studios. For us, the points needed for a 2 BR are well worth it when you consider the extra space, the full kitchen, and my favorite, the washer and dryer!!!! As the kids get older they will want more space and privacy. Older boys do not want to share beds. We only bought 160 points at BCV and only travel when school is out so for now we will only go every 18 months or so, but we already have add-on fever after just one trip down.
     
  17. Doug Wolfe

    Doug Wolfe Beach Club Villas/DVC Owner Since 2002

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    Mr. Toad....I Loved Your Wild Ride

    Once you are spoiled by the rooms at DVC properties, you are not likely to want to stay at the regular resorts with the common folk.:p

    I don't know your financial situation, but you might very well be able to afford DVC. Ask DVC about financing options. If you are going every year, how much are you spending???? That money could easily be spent on payments.

    Finally, get yourself a free video at:

    www.disneyvacationclub.com ::MickeyMo
     
  18. steve and julie

    steve and julie Earning My Ears

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    this was my thought process

    I have reserved a price of $89 per point to purchase ssr.
    If I buy before May 9 they will drop the price to $84 a point and if I sell back my first years points they would offer it at $79 a point.

    If I take the $84 offer and sell my first years points on the rent/transfer sight for $10 to $12 point That would make my final cost around $72 to $74. close to a resale

    If I opt to sell 20 years from now I would think SSR would sell for alot more, due to the 2054 end date.

    unless they buy back my points for $10 each I would keep them and sell them on the rent/trade board.

    my understanding is that you will have the option to sell or transfer your first years points. With a new resort and your flexibility to sell or transfer your points should bring top dollar. may be 12 or 13 a point.

    Then next year you start taking your trips home!!!!

    If you take Disneys offer to buy back points you all responsible for the 3.80 per point in fees, but there are no closing cost if you buy new. There are with resales (about $450)

    if you put 10% down then the Disney rate is around 10.5%
    20% down and its around 9.5%


    Hope I was Helpful
    steve
     
  19. eileenfk

    eileenfk Mouseketeer

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    I kind of like my math. It makes me feel like I am making a good decision with my purchase.

    I had it all figured out, and then the password timed out, and it told me I wasn't logged on, and I gave up.
    I might have already posted this analysis, and maybe I just can't find the thread I posted it in.

    I will see if I can do this analysis again.
    Resale price for OKW Is $70 (a few lower, some higher).
    $70 per point over 38 years = $1.84
    Dues of $3.68 per point
    = $5.52 per point.

    One night in OKW studio during premier season
    15 points = 82.8
    The same studio, the same night without DVC = $369

    Difference = $286.2
    divide difference by the 15 points = $19.08 savings per point.

    At $70 dollars per point, it then takes between 3 and 4 years for the investment to pay off.

    Of course, the missing piece is the interest one is paying on other loans, this loan, or that once could get by having the money invested somewhere else. I added all of that in when I calculated this 8 years ago. The result was that I didn't buy. and I should have.

    Disney is all about a fantasy world anyway, why let little pieces of reality, that don't matter that much, interfere.


    Because the SSR has the ful 50 years, the investment price can be divided over the full 50 years, leading to an analysis that comes to about $5.6 per point. But the initial investment is more, therefore lost interest in more and such.
    But, as someone stated, resale value 10 years from now will be higher also.

    - Eileen
     

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