Question about using forward facing car seat with a reclining back seat...

mommy2paris

DIS Veteran
Joined
Dec 12, 2005
Hi! I was hoping someone here could help me... The second row of our Excursion allows all 3 seats to be reclined just like a front seat. Would it be safe / feasible to install a forward facing car seat with 5 point harness and then partially recline the entire second row seat so that the car seat / child was at a relaxed angle? We are driving to FLorida in January and have a 2 1/2 yr old and a 4 1/2 yr old. I was hoping there was a way they could get some sleep while riding.
I can remember using a folded towel under carseat base to level it out when it didn't fit well in another vehicle, would it help to put the towel underneath to fill the space?
No flames please, as I am looking for an honest opinion on whether or not this would be safe. If it is not safe, I would never dream of doing it, that is why I am asking. I also thought of asking our pediatrician or maybe the police dept?
Any suggestions or ideas?
TIA!
 
We have always had our car seat reclined, and use a pool noodle under the base. We get our seats inspected at the police station, and they have never said that we shouldn't reclined the seat. They were the one who suggested using a pool noodle instead of a towel.
 
I don't believe it will be safe but the only reliable source for an answer would be your carseat manufacturer. Take a look in your installation manual and give them a call.

My concern is that the carseat won't be sitting flush against the bottom of the car's seat and therefore won't be a rock-solid install. I'm anal when it comes to installing carseats and if it's not rock-solid, I'm not comfortable having my child sit in it.

We drive down to Disney every year from NJ and have found that having a small pillow to lay their head against or a neck pillow to keep their head from slouching is enough for them to nap comfortably. I also put a crate or box or some other form of luggage in front of their seat for them to rest their feet on. I've found that having some leg support adds to their comfort level - having your feet dangling for a long period of time can cause tingling or discomfort so give them a footrest of some sort.

Good luck and safe travels!

ETA from carseat.org ( http://www.carseat.org/Technical/tech_update.htm#angleFF )
(Bolding is mine, CR stands for "child restraint", certified means certified by the carseat's manufacturer to be safe in that position)
Angle of recline, forward-facing

The most common recommended orientation for a forward-facing CR is the most upright position. Many convertibles and some child seats have two or more choices of seating angle for forward-facing use, and each of these positions must be certified to FMVSS 213. Although the most upright position probably still provides the most effective overall restraint in terms of load distribution to appropriate bony structures, a certified reclined position may be used for a sleeping child or to make the CR match the angle of the vehicle seat for a tighter installation. It is a good idea, however, to try the most upright position first, because the upright geometry of the CR coupled with the angle of the vehicle seat cushion may sufficiently recline the child to be comfortable.

For children seated directly on the vehicle seat, in a backless booster, or in a booster with adjustable back, the normal seatback angle is about 20° to 30° from vertical. This comfort-angle range also applies to adults. If the seatback is tipped farther back than this, there is a danger of the occupant sliding under the safety belt, called submarining, during a crash. This is not a problem in a forward-facing CR, because the entire shell is reclined, not just the seatback, which reduces the likelihood of submarining. Submarining in a CR is also limited by the crotch strap holding the lap straps down on the thighs.

Potential injury from spinal loading, predicted in the early days of CR design, has not been shown to be a problem in actual crashes. One laboratory study in England found that a forward-facing CR had to be tipped more than 50° from vertical to generate harmful loading to the dummy, and this is more reclined than acceptable for forward- or rear-facing CR use. (9/07)
 
you should be ok, but the issue then becomes in an accident that the child can either:

a) slide under the harness somewhat, reducing the protection the 5-pt has on the chest area.

b) if the noodle or whatever flies forward, then the entire seat will rock forward, placing undue stress on your child.
 
First I'll just start out by saying that I am a certified tech. Now for your answers...

Never place anything under a forward facing carseat... it is not safe. The only exception... a thin, single layer towel is acceptable for protecting leather seats, but not needed in most cases.

Look under the safety section in your vehicle owners manual for child restraint installation. *Some* vehicles actually require you to recline the vehicle seat a specific distance before installing child restraints and *some* vehicles forbid you from reclining the seat at all.

It is safest for your forward facing children to be more upright. If your 2.5 year old is under the rear facing weight limit for your carseat (generally 30 - 35lbs... some go up to 40lbs now - read the labels/manual), it's actually safer and easier to have them rear facing. If they are under the weight limit, consider rear facing them for the trip for a better sleeping angle. Mine rear faced until 3.5 when they reached the weight limit... it made trips a lot easier. :D

Not all techs are trained equally... to find one in your area, the best advice I can give is to go to www.car-seat.org and ask on the boards for one in your area. Most fire stations/police stations do NOT have trained techs on staff and many of them will state they are techs when all they've taken is a basic 8 hr informational course that doesn't even begin to cover what a tech needs to know.
 
Thanks everyone!! I knew I would find the answers I needed here!! I will check both the seat manuals and the vehicle owners manual to see what is recommended for the correct seat recline, and to see if the younger of my girls can still rear face. I hadn't thought of that!

Good tip for placing something under their feet so they aren't dangling! Any suggestions for the best type of pillow or chin rest to use? Most pillows seem too fluffy... Maybe we can make something smaller and thinner ourselves.

Thanks again!
 
Don't place anything behind their head. A small bean bag type pillow between the side of the carseat and their head will help them not to slouch as much and will conform nicely to all the various curves/angles.

Quite honestly, I have one of the most upright carseats on the market and the kids just tilt their head to the side and rest it against the edge of the carseat. We don't use anything extra and they've been fine... we take four 12 hour (round trip) road trips home to Grandma and Grandpa's every year and they travel great. :)
 
we've tried all types of pillows for our kids.. their heads still flop to the side.

our DD got creative a few times by bending her legs up so her feet are on the thigh area of the seat, then she rests her arms on the knees and props her head up.
 

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