Please Put Epcot Out Of Its Misery!

[bigdaddy511]

I kind of get what you're saying though. Epcot was my favorite park by far but it's really taken a nosedive for me. I still love Spaceship Earth and World Showcase but otherwise I could by pass it nowadays. We will just spend a day now where we used to go for about three days.

Agreed. Epcot needs a real coaster (not just test track) and some other additions as well. Even WS, which I love, could use a new land with a decent attraction added in. But in this economy, it's not going to happen any time soon.

 

[kaligal]

I love Ellen and Figment.

But I have to agree that they ought to do more with Future World. Innocent ions needs help. The Wonder of Life pavilion is just sad. They took out Some of the street entertainment. Nemo is a snoozer. EO just needs to go.

 

[Hunclemarco]

The reason no one can think of a good alternate name for "Future World" is because FW has lost its focus. It no longer knows what it is, so how can we be expected to know?

FW used to be all about learning. It was the world's first educational theme park. It cracks me up when people write, "Who wants to learn about X at Disney World?" or "No one wants to be taught lessons while on vacation!" Teaching lessons and learning used to be the whole point of FW.

Here are the FW attractions of the early 1990's and what we learned:

Spaceship Earth: we learned about how advancements in human communication have helped to create our world.

Innoventions: we learned all sorts of stuff on a wide variety of science and technology related subjects.

Horizons: we learned how technology might develop and what the future might be like.

Journey Into Imagination: we learned about the human imagination and how to use it.

The Living Seas: we learned about the ocean and undersea life and the future of ocean exploration by taking a trip to 'Sea Base Alpha'.

World of Motion: we learned about the history and achievements in transportation, from cavemen to the first automobiles.

The Land: we learned how we can use the land for our benefit, and how we might destroy it if we're not careful.

Universe of Energy: we learned about energy sources (without comedy), then took a ride through a primeval diorama with dinosaurs to learn about the origins of fossil fuels.

Wonders of Life: we learned about how the human body works, and sometimes doesn't work.

Back then every single attraction at FW was clearly all about education, teaching us about science and technology and the world around us.

Today? The two most popular attractions at FW today are Soarin’, in which we learn...umm...what parts of California look like from the air, and Test Track, in which we learn what it's like to ride in a car.

I, for one, wish Disney would stop being embarrassed by the idea of an educational theme park, and return FW to its roots.

A new name? How about "Discovery Land."

I totally agree with the above comments. I loved the educational aspect of each of the rides. I would have loved to see Habit Heroes, and i think it would have been an improvement.
Other than the financial dilemma that Disney will or will not take responsibility for in updating or creating rides, some of the public today seem to get uptight as to where or how they want to be educated. We saw this happen with Habit Heroes, and may also be a reason for the closure of Wonders of Life. For all of the institutions pushing for higher learning and better success in education, there seems to be a continual dumbing down of the values necessary to provide for learning. It seems that some only want to be entertained, and that's it. We can see this through entertainment in all its forms, not just at Disney.
With that thought in mind, i believe there is only so much that Disney can do when creating new attractions...the creativity is already squashed by the thought of "who's gonna find fault with this attraction?" and "Do we want to spend x amount of dollars on something we may have to back out on?"
I don't mean to get all philosophical with this, it just seems that the generation we live in today makes it difficult to allow for the attractions we once had 10-20 years ago...especially where healthcare is concerned.
EPCOT does need some tweaking, just not sure how they will do it.

 

[WDW1]

Agreed. Epcot needs a real coaster (not just test track) and some other additions as well. Even WS, which I love, could use a new land with a decent attraction added in. But in this economy, it's not going to happen any time soon.

What part of Experimental Prototype Community of Tomorrow screams Roller Coaster?

I feel like the OP has lost sight of what EPCOT is supposed to be. It was never meant to be a park like MK or US. Who cares if they have Harry Potter. I feel like comparing US to EPCOT doesn't make sense. If you want to compare US, you need to compare it to HS.

Sure some things in EPCOT are dated and could use a facelift, but it doesn't need to be a park with all the thrills. There are 3 other parks with plenty of thrills. That was not Walt's vision for EPCOT

 

[Robo]

There are 3 other parks with plenty of thrills. That was not Walt's vision for EPCOT

Well, if you want to bring THAT into it-

None of Epcot is anything at all like Walt's vision for EPCOT.

 

[maxiesmom]

What part of Experimental Prototype Community of Tomorrow screams Roller Coaster?

I feel like the OP has lost sight of what EPCOT is supposed to be. It was never meant to be a park like MK or US. Who cares if they have Harry Potter. I feel like comparing US to EPCOT doesn't make sense. If you want to compare US, you need to compare it to HS.

Sure some things in EPCOT are dated and could use a facelift, but it doesn't need to be a park with all the thrills. There are 3 other parks with plenty of thrills. That was not Walt's vision for EPCOT

THANK YOU!!!! Not every park needs to have a bunch of roller coasters or thrill rides in it.


Also, so many posters are complaining about the lack of money being spent on the parks? Are the kidding? Maybe that was true a few years ago, but it is not true now. The whole of Fantasyland is being redone, Space Mountain was just done, Star Tours too. And they tried to bring in new stuff to Epcot, only to be shot down because people no longer want to be informed while on vacation.

I especially love we have people complaining about test track being closed for a re-do, and then people complaining about the lack of money being spent on the parks.

I love Epcot. And for those of you who hate or disdain it, please head over to the Disney Studios. You can have my place in line there!

 

[WDW1]

Well, if you want to bring THAT into it-

None of Epcot is anything at all like Walt's vision for EPCOT.

Yes and no.

Sure it is not a live-in community like he planned, but is it not a showcase of future technologies and innovation? The idea was all about the world of tomorrow. Epcot has a whole area dedicated to the future. So I would argue that there are parts of it that are shaped after his vision

 

[Robo]

Yes and no.

Sure it is not a live-in community like he planned, but is it not a showcase of future technologies and innovation?

1- The idea was all about the world of tomorrow.

2- Epcot has a whole area dedicated to the future. So I would argue that there are parts of it that are shaped after his vision

1- That was somebody's idea.

2- That used to be the case.
That used to be the idea about Tomorrowland, too.
(Which WAS Walt's vision.)
But, practical realities intervened at Disneyland, too.
Such as corporations concerns about revealing proprietary research secrets
and the lack of entertainment value in most REAL-world "things to come"
(which looked more like "plastic car parts" than "flying cars.")

Nowadays, it gets even less exciting to talk about realistic future products,
as we are much more focused on "personal" innovations.
"Hey, look Edna, in the future they're gonna make a smaller iPhone and a larger iPad!!"

Someone mentioned NASA.
What's NASA?
(And, I mean that in the sense that NASA today, sadly, is not the NASA we once knew.)

Even in the 1980's nearly all of FW attractions featured a shot of the
Space Shuttle as it was THE principle example of
"the future" that we could all recognize.

But now, the shuttles are all grounded, along with most hopes
of practical (meaning "affordable" AND "useful") trips into space.
Who actually expects that we'll send a shuttle to Mars in the foreseeable future?
Our fiscal budgets can't even afford to maintain something as mundane as urban mass transit in most major cities. (Except, for the exceptions we can count using only one hand's fingers.)

Solar power? Wind power?
Bankruptcy anyone?
(I'm even depressing myself!)

And really, it's no secret that Walt had no vision for EPCOT to be built as the Epcot we know.

 

[WDW1]

1- That was somebody's idea.

2- That used to be the case.
That used to be the idea about Tomorrowland, too.
(Which WAS Walt's vision.)
But, practical realities intervened at Disneyland, too.
Such as corporations concerns about revealing proprietary research secrets
and the lack of entertainment value in most REAL-world "things to come"
(which looked more like "plastic car parts" than "flying cars.")

Nowadays, it gets even less exciting to talk about realistic future products,
as we are much more focused on "personal" innovations.
"Hey, look Edna, in the future they're gonna make a smaller iPhone and a larger iPad!!"

Someone mentioned NASA.
What's NASA?
(And, I mean that in the sense that NASA today, sadly, is not the NASA we once knew.)

Even in the 1980's nearly all of FW attractions featured a shot of the
Space Shuttle as it was THE principle example of
"the future" that we could all recognize.

But now, the shuttles are all grounded, along with most hopes
of practical (meaning "affordable" AND "useful") trips into space.
Who actually expects that we'll send a shuttle to Mars in the foreseeable future?
Our fiscal budgets can't even afford to maintain something as mundane as urban mass transit in most major cities. (Except, for the exceptions we can count using only one hand's fingers.)

Solar power? Wind power?
Bankruptcy anyone?
(I'm even depressing myself!)

And really, it's no secret that Walt had no vision for EPCOT to be built as the Epcot we know.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u9M3pKsrcc8

How are you going to say that it was not Walt's vision?

"It will never cease to be a living blueprint of the future"

 

[mousermerf]

You also can't forget that the Epcot we have today is not the same as the EPCOT Theme Center they intended to build nor the EPCOT Center they actually ended up building... nor is it even the EPCOT Center that we had a few years after Michael Eisner gutted the place because he thought it was an extravagant waste of money and thus wanted to be rid of it.

True story. He did almost everything in his power to destroy it internally. All the projects that were supposed to open in 83-84 didn't end up happening until 86-89 (and several NEVER happened - see most of World Showcase) because he pulled the funding.

There's just now starting to be little twinges of a renaissance to toward "Gee, this is what an EPCOT can be..?" internally within Disney. Interestingly enough, it's GM that has held most steadfast to the original vision.

But, to backtrack.. a lot of what we have now was eastablished in the early 90's overhauls. Essentially the 2nd generation overhauls. We're on the cusp of the third generation - hence why Test Track just closed. No one really knows where the heck that one is going.. we're all optimistic, but that's really is GM's own vision, not the park's vision. The rest of the park though can be swayed by public opinion - as it was the last go round.

Last time they hired in scores and scores of experts. Note this 1990 article: http://www.epcyclopedia.com/2011/12/27/consultant-in-1990-declares-where-epcot-center-went-wrong/

Essentially these experts in the 90's declared that the 1980's EPCOT Center education motif was a failure and needed to be abandoned. This is why the park switched to EPCOT94 branding and EPCOT 95 briefly, before just becoming "Epcot" in 96 - it was the advice of these experts and this feedback that the educational aspects were a failure.

Well.. if we provide new feedback now. Now in particular that the park is in a new cycle.. and they're looking for answers... Perhaps we'll get a different result.

So, send letters. Send feedback. Fill out surveys. Say you don't want a dumb park with cheap thrills, fart jokes, and lowest common denomenator entertainment. Maybe they'll push the park back up to its old standards.

 

[mousermerf]

And i know I type things out and apparently do something that causes people minds to short circuit or something.. like.. does not compute.. but the above is important.

So, if you don't understand, please ask, ok?

 

[WDW1]

You also can't forget that the Epcot we have today is not the same as the EPCOT Theme Center they intended to build nor the EPCOT Center they actually ended up building... nor is it even the EPCOT Center that we had a few years after Michael Eisner gutted the place because he thought it was an extravagant waste of money and thus wanted to be rid of it.

True story. He did almost everything in his power to destroy it internally. All the projects that were supposed to open in 83-84 didn't end up happening until 86-89 (and several NEVER happened - see most of World Showcase) because he pulled the funding.

There's just now starting to be little twinges of a renaissance to toward "Gee, this is what an EPCOT can be..?" internally within Disney. Interestingly enough, it's GM that has held most steadfast to the original vision.

But, to backtrack.. a lot of what we have now was eastablished in the early 90's overhauls. Essentially the 2nd generation overhauls. We're on the cusp of the third generation - hence why Test Track just closed. No one really knows where the heck that one is going.. we're all optimistic, but that's really is GM's own vision, not the park's vision. The rest of the park though can be swayed by public opinion - as it was the last go round.

Last time they hired in scores and scores of experts. Note this 1990 article: http://www.epcyclopedia.com/2011/12/27/consultant-in-1990-declares-where-epcot-center-went-wrong/

Essentially these experts in the 90's declared that the 1980's EPCOT Center education motif was a failure and needed to be abandoned. This is why the park switched to EPCOT94 branding and EPCOT 95 briefly, before just becoming "Epcot" in 96 - it was the advice of these experts and this feedback that the educational aspects were a failure.

Well.. if we provide new feedback now. Now in particular that the park is in a new cycle.. and they're looking for answers... Perhaps we'll get a different result.

So, send letters. Send feedback. Fill out surveys. Say you don't want a dumb park with cheap thrills, fart jokes, and lowest common denomenator entertainment. Maybe they'll push the park back up to its old standards.

No one is forcing you to go. If you hate it so much you can stay at home and you won't be missed. There are plenty of people who still enjoy it the way it is. Sure it could use some upgrades, but saying "take it out of it's misery" is a bit extreme.

 

[FlightlessDuck]

I dislike Epcot with a passion, for all the reasons OP posted.

And, as for World Showcase? A glorified promenade with an international theme.

World Showcase has two rides (a log flume and a boat ride), three travelogues, one of them from 1979 (France), and an animatronic show about the USA. Besides that, what else is the appeal? Food and shopping. Granted, I like the food and the bevies, but that doesn't consitute half a theme park.

Meanwhile, "Future World" isn't about the future, it's about current science. Half the rides are old or lame, and the really good ride is closed at the moment.

We spend half a day, maybe a full day at max.

 

[Robo]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u9M3pKsrcc8

How are you going to say that it was not Walt's vision?

"It will never cease to be a living blueprint of the future"

No. I'll stop.

I'll let you go on record that Epcot IS Walt's vision of EPCOT.

 

[WDW1]

No. I'll stop.

I'll let you go on record that Epcot IS Walt's vision of EPCOT.

I'm not saying EPCOT now is how Walt wanted it. I am saying there are parts of it that are, but turning it into a thrill park would be going completely against the original plan. That is all I am saying.

 

[eliza61]

No one is forcing you to go. If you hate it so much you can stay at home and you won't be missed. There are plenty of people who still enjoy it the way it is. Sure it could use some upgrades, but saying "take it out of it's misery" is a bit extreme.

*** sighs*** why do we do this? It's called hyperbole. using and exaggeration as a figure of speech. I don't think op actually meant to close the park down or to go out and shoot it.

Anyhoo, I also don't think making a thought out criticism means some one hate some thing. I love wdw but there are many areas that could use some serious, serious help.

 

[carrie1626]

Build the 5th park Beastly Kingdom

When that opens, close down Future World and keep the WS open.

Put more international influences where FW now stands,
Rename: Disney's World Showcase

and do a FW ( for Futuristic attractions only) somewhere else- there's room
maybe a new land in MK.

unfortunately with SSE, TT and MS being so massive it would be cost-prohibitive to move them.................

 

[maxiesmom]

*** sighs*** why do we do this? It's called hyperbole. using and exaggeration as a figure of speech. I don't think op actually meant to close the park down or to go out and shoot it.

Well, the OP does state that they want Epcot put out of its misery. Is that not hyperbole? If that is how it starts, how can anyone be surprised when others post in a like manner?

 

[eliza61]

Well, the OP does state that they want Epcot put out of its misery. Is that not hyperbole? If that is how it starts, how can anyone be surprised when others post in a like manner?

Very true, very true. I guess I go with the general "tone" of a thread. I mean some of the criticism is very well deserved IMO, it's not like people were complaining of things that were crazy.
A film on the glories of France that was done in the 70's? really, Mickey can't afford to send one of his pals from DLP and take some recent pictures?
An Imax film that is dirty, some times skips? From a company that has film studios and tv studios?. A theme park that is supposed to represent the "future" and yet they pull out an out of date Michael Jackson monstrosity? Heck, at least go to redbox and get that release of his last tour. jeez.

So maybe the title is extreme but the tone of the thread has been on point.

 

[Missish]

I've considered Epcot to be my favourite park for as long as I can remember. I enjoy how open and spacious it is in comparison to the other 3 parks, and I like that it isn't just all about the rides - it's about experiences too. It feels a lot more relaxed than the other 3 parks.

Having said that, I do understand the OP's point. While the TT refurb and the replacement of HISTA with Captain EO shows that FW hasn't been forgotten, I agree with this completely:

Honestly, Future World has become very much like the last scene in Carousel of Progress...the one where it supposed to be futuristic for grandma to be playing video games.

I'd love for the Wonders of Life pavilion to be reinvented as something significant and worthwhile, and Innoventions to become more 'fun'. I used to love the hands on exhibits there but it always feels a bit empty when I go in there now. Oh, and put the Dreamfinder back where he belongs. Figment doesn't work without him.