Pilot- Career benefits? Cost of education?

TheRatPack

Under penalty of law this tag not to be removed
Joined
Sep 1, 2003
I am branching this off the other Pilot thread asking about personal benefits such a extra tickets...etc. I want to know more about your work benefits, insurance, salary...etc. You don't have to be specific...just gathering some information for my oldest son who has said he might be interested in something like this as his career choice. He's inching closer to having to make that decision and so I'm trying to get him where he needs to be through Dual Enrollment.

So if you or someone you're close to is a pilot, what are some of the benefits of such a job? Downfalls? Was it a lengthy educational process? Is it a pretty steady job, is there a lot of competition? What would make a new pilot stand out in the job search and what kind of pilots license would be most beneficial.

He's also mentioned going in the army and being a pilot...he knows that means helicopters most likely. So any information you have on that front would be much appreciated too. We're not a rich family, we have 5 children and live within our means....so finding out as much as possible will help us to save and hopefully not throw our money away making mistakes when choosing schools, classes...etc.

Thanks!!!
 
My husband was a Navy Pilot (flew P3 Orion). He went through Aviation Officer Candidate School out of college. To be a pilot in the military you have to be eligible to be an officer. I believe that means either a college degree (4 years or more) and Officer Candidate School or ROTC or going to one of the military universities.

He got out of the military with all his flying experience and thought he would get a commercial pilot position. No go. They were hard to get unless you wanted to work for a small airline making little money. I doubt that has changed much.
 
We have a friend who is a pilot. The job isn't what it used to be. After 20+ years with the same airline, he still works holidays. (Christmas this year)
 
My main worry is that we homeschool....I know that a lot of government agencies aren't really in to hiring homeschoolers. Not sure what the army thinks of it though. My uncle flew for a smaller airline, still a 'brand' one though but the smaller planes that would fly shuttle type flights back and forth to the different larger airports.

Wonder why your husband wouldn't be what the larger airlines were looking for....I would think that they'd love to have a pilot with that kind of experience.
 


I know 2 pilots, one is doing well working for a major airline, but the schedule is rough on a family. The other worked for jet blue and had his hours cut so much that he had to take a leave of absence and took a contracting job overseas polluting planes carrying equipment for reconstruction of war torn areas. He makes GREAT money but is gone for months at a time and it seems sort of dangerous.
 
I have a nephew who was interested in being a pilot. He completed a college degree, did flight school and paid for many hours of private lessons. He took a job as a flight instructor with a flight school to build up his hours, which is pretty common for people interested in piloting as a career. The things he saw working for the flight school soured him on the whole shebang. It is very competitive, given what has gone on in the airline industry.

To get an overview of the education, job prospects and earnings, see the entry in the Occupational Outlook Handbook http://www.bls.gov/oco/ocos107.htm.
 
DF was in ROTC in college, was a Navy pilot for 7 years and got hired with his present employer 19 years ago. He also flew P3's in the Navy. It took him about 6 months to get hired and he flew MD-80's, then A-300's, B-737, B-757, and B-767's. While it is true that it's impossible to get every holiday off, as you gain seniority you get your pick of schedules each month. You can also fly 'reserve' where you are paid a minimum number of flying hours (approx 80 to 85 in his case) that month but you only fly if you are called in. He does that if there are a lot of household projects to be done. He has great health insurance but his pilot union agreed to certain cutbacks in pay a few years ago in order to assist the airline with avoiding bankruptcy so they are still trying to get some of those bennies back.
 


Wow, it really doesn't sound like a great job for most people. Hmm, might have to see what else sparks his interest. He wants action, fast paced...etc. He's always wanted to race cars or fly something LOL But he doesn't want to sit around in a classroom for years at a time...what teen boy does LOL Hmm, I'll definitely relay some of your information to him when he gets home from work...might give him a different perspective :)
 
I'm a travel agent, and according to people I know at the airlines, the major airlines tend to hire ex-military pilots. The only other way to break in is to either log in a lot of hours with delivery companies (UPS, FedEx, and I have no idea where they recruit pilots from) or start out with a regional airline flying the little planes. I know it can take a VERY long time to work your way up from the regional carriers though, and a lot of pilots never make it as the regionals don't tend to pay a whole lot, most quit to find better paying employment long before they have enough experiance and seniority to be "called up to the majors".

In short, the "easiest" way to be a pilot with a major US carrier is to have military experiance.
 
My cousin is pilot - started with Continental and now flies for UPS (or maybe FedEx...)

Anyhow, he says that while he was flying for Continental that he eventually felt like he had become a glorified bus driver. Just something to put that "adventure" your son is looking for into perspective. Based on that, I would think the army or navy would be the way to go.
 
I'm a flight attendant for the BEST airline in the US. I love my job and the flexibility. While pilots certainly make more money, I currently make about as much as an RN per hr. Obviously we don't work the same number of hours a week however. I have a college degree, but they are not required. It's a fun job with great travel benefits. I also have wonderful health insurance and a 401K match of 9.2%. Granted to start out he would be on reserve and working holidays. I have been with the company just over ten years, and can't imagine doing anything else. I am home much more than an average full time employee, but our airline doesn't require a minimum number of hours flown per month. I am home on average 18-20 days per month. You can however work six days a week if you chose. Best of luck in whatever he decideds. I just thought I'd mention this because there are several pilots at our airline that were flight attendants while they earned there flight hours.
 
Do you listen to CarTalk on NPR? There was a call this week from a pilot. She was inquiring about the best kind of VW to buy to live in in the airport parking lot. She said she couldn't afford to buy a house at the airport she was assigned to, and was planning to live in the employee parking lot. She said a few times that it isn't the same job it used to be. She said her pilot joke is "What is the difference between and airline pilot and a pizza?" A pizza can feed a family of 4.
 
In short, the "easiest" way to be a pilot with a major US carrier is to have military experiance.

The one pilot I know said it is nearly impossible to log enough flight hours for commercial air outside of serving as a pilot in the military first.
 
WOW.....thanks for all the input everyone. This has really shined a different light on the subject. I feel confident that he'll choose the right career path in the end...but I remember being where he is and not knowing where to turn. I know a lot of careers are glorified on TV or in other ways and so it's nice to get first hand knowledge of such positions :) to help make an informed decision.

Thank you again...I appreciate the honesty :)
 
He should aim for his degree first and enroll in a college that offers ROTC. Then talk to Navy recruiters about flight school. Even then, if aviation no longer interests him, he has opened up a world of opportunity for himself. He should also research which state colleges and universities offer aviation programs. Being a pilot can be lucrative if you work your way up to captain on a major, or even f.o. on a larger plane. But you have to do the groundwork and pay your dues. There are few, if any, shortcuts in life.

WOW.....thanks for all the input everyone. This has really shined a different light on the subject. I feel confident that he'll choose the right career path in the end...but I remember being where he is and not knowing where to turn. I know a lot of careers are glorified on TV or in other ways and so it's nice to get first hand knowledge of such positions :) to help make an informed decision.

Thank you again...I appreciate the honesty :)
 
As the wife of a 16 year regional captain, I'd say, don't do this to your future daughter-in-law and grandchildren! ;)

Airline hiring is very cyclical. It has been very depressed for the last several years. With the first round of the new age 65 retirees coming, expect some movement in 2012. This is however subject to economic pressures and the cost of oil. The cost is already getting to a point that airlines will start struggling again. Most of these costs are not passed on to the passengers in the way of higher fares , although some do charge fuel surcharges, but are actually carried on the backs of employees in the form of wage cutbacks, hour cutbacks, increased workloads etc.

It is not common for pilots to have 18-20 days off. At the airline my husband works the newest hires that sit on reserve are currently only getting 10 days off per month. After 16 years my husband sometimes gets 18 days off monthly. Pilots are generally only paid from the time the door closes until the time the door opens again. They spend twice as much time as that on duty though. Pilots at the regional level, which is where he would start out if he went the civilian route for his education and training, start at around 22,000 dollars a year. Some perhaps pay slightly more or less. Layovers are really short, barely enough time to sleep, the pilots are definitely flying very fatigued every day! So much for the glamorous life of a pilot!

Go the military route if possible, then if he is unable to get a job when he gets out, as hiring is very competitive because there are thousands of highly qualified pilots currently on furlough, he can stay in the military while waiting for the tide to turn. Then he also won't have the debt of his education and training hanging over his head. Very few airlines (FedEx is one) offer a pension plan any longer, most were gutted in bankruptcy courts over the last few years. Most now offer defined contribution plans and the amount of company match can vary widely amongst the airlines.

Pilots can travel free on most other airlines on their jumpseat. This depends on the airline that you work for and the reciprocal agreements that they have with other airlines. Spouses/domestic partners, parents and children get pass benefits, which can be free or at a very reduced rate, but they are on a space available basis only. This means that you only go if a seat is available, not so easy to do anymore. When my family flies, we buy tickets like everyone else!

He could possibly get hired at a few regionals without a college degree, but I can't think of a major that would hire him without one. The cost of his ratings will run very high and then he will have to gain enough hours to be competitive for interviews/hiring. This usually comes through flight instructing, but there are a few other avenues to gain those hours. The feds are in the process of raising minimum hour requirements for hiring too so it will take even longer to get those hours. Also soon, first officers will have to have their ATP license as well to get hired.

The lifestyle is very hard on families, especially at the regionals because the hours are long the pay is low and families are apart for long stretches at a time. Usually these are families that are young and just starting out so this is more stressful. Divorce rates are high in this career choice. It takes a strong and independent wife/husband to be able to stand this lifestyle. It takes a toll on kids as their other parent is often missing birthdays, holidays and important school events.

It starts out exciting but after a while it turns into just a job for most pilots. Don't get me wrong, they all love what they do, and even when complaining, most wouldn't change what they do. There are some advantages in this career, but you have to be able to stick out the really tough parts to get to them and be able to enjoy them.

Remember, this is my perspective, the wife of a regional guy, but if it tells you anything, my husband is 45 and is already talking about how hard it will be for him to make it until 60 let alone 65. Plenty of guys medical out for health reasons all the time. We are saving like crazy and trying to get our house paid for so he can "retire" the airlines at 60.

Have him do a search for airline pilot forums on the internet. It can be an interesting look at life from a pilots perspective. It can also give him an idea of the qualifications he will need and what it takes to get hired and what hope he has of making it to the majors. He is young and if the timing, which is just about everything, is right he will make it.

Pretty long winded, but it gives you some idea of what it is like. Sounds positively delightful, doesn't it? It certainly is not the career it was 20 years ago. As for me, well that was cheaper than therapy! Good luck to him in whatever he chooses!
 
Just thought I'd pipe in since the OP mentioned the army and helicopter pilots.

My DB is a pilot. He earned his rotors through provate flight school, then taught to build flight hours to get to 1,000 hours. Then he got the only job that he could get with limited hours, which was to fly for oil companies in the Gulf of Mexico. Very dangerous flying, with landing sometimes occuring on mushroom platform that were narrower than his rotor span. He then flew tourism flights for the Grand Canyon and Las vegas and then construction. He's been laid off so oftern it is insane. He has to move a lot to get to where the next job is. He's now flying in Kentucky for lower pay working for a utility company flying power lines.

The economy has really hurt helicopter jobs due to cororations flying less and cutting costs. He also has said there are only two kinds of helicopter pilots - those who have never crashed a chopper and those that are dead.
 
How does he feel about boats and how well does he swim? If he's an adrenaline-junkie type, the USCG is a fairly good career path (and yes, there are pilots in the USCG; mostly helicopter, like the Army.)

Coasties are a bit unique in the military in that they tend to be given greater decision-making responsibility at lower command levels, which means skills that translate a bit better in the commercial world.

I know a USCG veteran, a navigator, who subsequently became a harbor pilot. THAT is a high-paying job, but one that is really difficult to break into. It's kind of unique among professions in that you deal with people from all over the world and have to master a wide range of technical skills, but it is an inherant factor of the job that once you make it you end up staying in one place.
 
I am not a pilot, but my DH and mom both work in aviation and my brother trained to be a pilot.
Something to be aware of is that unless you are military you have to pay for your flight hours. Now often, trainees get a job as a flight instructor to log hours and help defer the cost, but the job itself doesn't pay super well. And once you do get enough hours to be hired at an airline, it will generally be a very small regional airline with odd hours and very little pay. Basically you are working to build your logged hours, not for any kind of a decent salary. It takes years to get to a major carrier.
As I mentioned, my DH and mom are both in aviation and they work with many former pilots who just couldn't afford to live on a beginning pilot's salary and decided to take a different route. My brother, for example, now works as an insurance agent. That's tens of thousands of dollars of flight time down the tube. Also, my DH talks to pilots all day every day, and many of them are bored with their jobs. It's not really high thrills; think how exciting it would be to take the same road trip every single working day.
 

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