petition in favor of banning nativity

[Uncle Remus]

I would say it is almost as silly as the idea that every public display requires a counterpoint.

This is why political correctness has always seemed so silly and hateful to me.

No one says it "requires" a counter point. We are pointing out the hypocrisy in wanting Christian displays while denying non-Christian ones.

Hypocritical to those Americans who want to be free FROM religious domination...the heathens.

 

[luvsJack]

You need to research just why Dec 25 was chosen as Christmas and you need to realize that Christmas in not the only (nor is it the original) holiday celebrated in late Dec.
If the city will not take the nativity scene down, they need to put up symbols to celebrate all holidays celebrated this time of year. by only displaying a Christan holiday display, the city government is in fact sponsoring the Christian religion.

It doesn't matter "why" it was chosen. The fact of the matter is the reason Christmas is celebrated today (regardless of what the Pagens did back "in the day") is because we are celebrating the birth of Jesus Christ. That is just the fact of it regardless of the whys of the day chosen. If someone is celebrating the Pagen winter holiday (I apoligize, I do not know the name of it) then do so--just don't call it Christmas and tell me that you celebrate Christmas "for other reasons" because Christmas is the celebration of the birth of Jesus Christ.

I never said Christmas was the only day celebrated in December. I never said I had a problem with other relegious holiday symbols being put up. Thats what I find continually amusing. No one ever has a problem with the other symbols, either. Only the Christian ones.

 

[themarquis]

Some public universities — the University of Michigan, for example — are spending public funds to install foot baths in public areas so Muslim students can practice religious cleansing prior to prayers. Prayers, incidentally, that take place in university-provided prayer rooms, at taxpayers' expense.

I'm curious, are those who believe in an absolute separation of church and state equally opposed to such practices by government-funded universities?

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2007/aug/29/school-to-provide32muslim-students32with-foot-bath/

I think that was actually Eastern Michigan University, unless I was mistaken. But they didn't put foot baths in "so Muslim students can practice religious cleansing ...". They put them in because Muslim students were using sinks to wash their feet and making a big mess in the bathrooms! It was purely a practical decision for the purpose of bathroom cleanliness/mantenence. The media took up the story and ran with it !

And I've never heard of those "university-provided prayer rooms" you describe, although I know most universities have a non-denominational chapel or worship space for anyone who wants to use it.

 

[Soarin08]

It doesn't matter "why" it was chosen. The fact of the matter is the reason Christmas is celebrated today (regardless of what the Pagens did back "in the day") is because we are celebrating the birth of Jesus Christ. That is just the fact of it regardless of the whys of the day chosen. If someone is celebrating the Pagen winter holiday (I apoligize, I do not know the name of it) then do so--just don't call it Christmas and tell me that you celebrate Christmas "for other reasons" because Christmas is the celebration of the birth of Jesus Christ.

I never said Christmas was the only day celebrated in December. I never said I had a problem with other relegious holiday symbols being put up. Thats what I find continually amusing. No one ever has a problem with the other symbols, either. Only the Christian ones.

I haven't exactly seen an uproar over Santa and snowmen being displayed anywhere. I guess since they don't relate to Jesus Christ in any way, they're ok.

 

[ilisao]

But it sounds like to me the minority wants to suppress the majority. More people in the US celebrate Christmas than those who don't.

And as for the whole Jews having a menorah thing.... my whole family is Baptist but my cousin had a bat mitzvah. We have Jewish roots. I think I might add a menorah to my Christmas decorations....

Oh goody. More Christian persecution. Give me a break. The minority wants to suppress the majority by asking that no religious symbols be placed on public property? How does that translate to suppression?

Did your cousin's Bat Mitzvah consist of receiving Aliyah and reading from the Torah ? Did she wear a talit?

 

[Uncle Remus]

I haven't exactly seen an uproar over Santa and snowmen being displayed anywhere. I guess since they don't relate to Jesus Christ in any way, they're ok.

Santa 'n Frosty are religious symbols now?

 

[luvsJack]

It is only "tired" to those in the Xtain majority who feel it is their God given right to cram their religion down the throats of us heathens

Since you see no problem with the city allowing religious displays one would assume you would have not problem if a pentagram, wheel of the yr, a scene showing the rebith of the Sun God from Mother earth etc was displayed beside the nativity.
Somehow I doubt you would be ok with that.

I am not trying to cram my relegion down the throat of anyone. Believe what you want. It is those who do not believe who seem to want to cram their beliefs down everyones throats. I did not say the actuality of the seperation of church and state was tired, it is the terms use by the few to control the many that is tired.

 

[Mr Man]

No one says it "requires" a counter point. We are pointing out the hypocrisy in wanting Christian displays while denying non-Christian ones.

I do not see anything hypocritical about having Christian displays for a Christian holiday.......a holiday that everyone is free to celebrate.....or not.....

I fail to see that a Nativity scene (for example) is exclusionary just by being displayed. It is a symbol of Christmas.......as such, it makes sense that it has something to do with Christmas.

As far as these other religions. Please show me the days we should celebrate them, what we will be celebrating and let's talk.

 

[Zippa D Doodah]

I haven't exactly seen an uproar over Santa and snowmen being displayed anywhere. I guess since they don't relate to Jesus Christ in any way, they're ok.

I wonder what the reaction to this Santa would be.

 

[Uncle Remus]

I am not trying to cram my relegion down the throat of anyone. Believe what you want. It is those who do not believe who seem to want to cram their beliefs down everyones throats. I did not say the actuality of the seperation of church and state was tired, it is the terms use by the few to control the many that is tired.

Kinda like America is a Christian nation?

 

[Soarin08]

Santa 'n Frosty are religious symbols now?

No, but it just seems that the religious symbols are the ones everyone doesn't want displayed, but they seem to not mind the secular ones like Santa and Frosty.

 

[Soarin08]

I wonder what the reaction to this Santa would be.

I know.

 

[Uncle Remus]

I wonder what the reaction to this Santa would be.

Christians tryin' to capitalize on Santa again.

 

[Uncle Remus]

No, but it just seems that the religious symbols are the ones everyone doesn't want displayed, but they seem to not mind the secular ones like Santa and Frosty.

Why can't religious folks keep their religion in their churches, synagogues 'n mosques where they belong?

 

[Goofyluver]

It doesn't matter "why" it was chosen. The fact of the matter is the reason Christmas is celebrated today (regardless of what the Pagens did back "in the day") is because we are celebrating the birth of Jesus Christ. That is just the fact of it regardless of the whys of the day chosen. If someone is celebrating the Pagen winter holiday (I apoligize, I do not know the name of it) then do so--just don't call it Christmas and tell me that you celebrate Christmas "for other reasons" because Christmas is the celebration of the birth of Jesus Christ.

I never said Christmas was the only day celebrated in December. I never said I had a problem with other relegious holiday symbols being put up. Thats what I find continually amusing. No one ever has a problem with the other symbols, either. Only the Christian ones.

That's 100% false. And if you've read while posting, you would know that statement is false.

My own statements earlier in this thread concerning ALL religious symbols can be used as an example.

Is the reason you see this as an anti-Christian movement because you are Christian? A large portion of the people speaking of their belief in the separation of church and state are in fact, Christian.

 

[Charade]

I young man came by yesterday wanting me to sign a petition to ban our town's nativity display.
I asked the young man to let me think about it.
When he came back this morning I signed it.
I decided that even though I am a christian.
There is a church one block down, I figured the nativity can be moved there.

( I do not believe he will get enough signatures, started kinda late if you ask me. )

Hmm... were you just watching "Charlie Wilson's War" by chance? That (almost) exact scenario was in the movie.

 

[mirmartinez]

I wonder what the reaction to this Santa would be.

I own a similiar figurine and it is displayed in my home.
It is one of my favorite Christmas belongings.
My grandmother purchased it for me when I was a child.

I would also sign a petition in favor of removing it from our town's display.
However, I would contribute to have it displayed at my church.

 

[Goofyluver]

Why can't religious folks keep their religion in their churches, synagogues 'n mosques where they belong?

That's the million dollar question.

 

[mirmartinez]

Hmm... were you just watching "Charlie Wilson's War" by chance? That (almost) exact scenario was in the movie.

no, but now I am off to google it

Google done

The preview seems to be about the cold war and a hot tub?
wrong movie?

 

[beattyfamily]

I wonder how many who would sign this petition would also sign one to get rid of the federal holiday on December 25.

It's a federal holiday. I see nothing wrong with showing that this Federal holiday is coming with some decorations.

Our town has a nativity next to a Star of David and a Menorah and that's just fine with me.

I think the Separation of Chuch and State letter Jefferson wrote and the estabishment clause are sometimes taken too far these days.