Marvel coming to WDW???!!!!

[lockedoutlogic]

I'm not sure why anyone would want Disney to get Marvel back for WDW. What would they really do with it? Probably just an Iron Man M&G in Tomorrowland and a Captain America one in Liberty Square. They have the rights to use Marvel at every other Disney park in the world (except maybe Tokyo, I'm not sure how the rights work with Universal Studios Japan having the Spider-Man ride) and have pretty much done nothing with it outside of announce a Star Tours clone for Iron Man in Hong Kong, which is still over a year away from opening.

I love me some Disney, but I don't trust the current theme park people to take this property and do it on the epic scale it deserves. Spider-Man is my favorite ride of all time, so I'd rather it remain at IOA. MSHI needs an overhaul though and there are rumors it is getting one. Starting with a big Hulk refurb as soon as this fall.

I think the reason that this whole discussion comes up...mind numbingly...for five years is that it's started from the wrong mindset.

I think the simple take is "Disney paid that money...they HAVE to build something with it, right?"

No...and the vocal minority (like me) has done a bad job of explaining why because frustration always sets in/takes over.

What they have done with marvel - in essence has ramped up the movie production - which is profitable and in turn ramped up the licensing take off of beloved characters while not having to break a sweat... Which is even more profitable.

That is a home run. 10 movies (and rising) that triple their budget (at least) in box office take...a successful TV series...more worldwide exposure in highly populated developing markets...an expansion of the dedicated fan subculture on an unimaginable level from 20 years ago (think comic con)...and the same type of market saturation in walmart, toysrus, and amazon that allowed George Lucas to walk away from his property no strings attached...for a discounted 4 billion... Which he gave away the minute the deal was signed.

I'm not complaining...just attempting (again...and probably failing) to explain that it is incorrect to think that the stock laden management and board of TWDC doesn't think that that's "enough".

Of course it is. The same with Pixar...

Star Wars is a little more interesting...but ultimately the same case.

Why is james Cameron (deal undisclosed) working so hard at animal kingdom right now?...the argument can be made that he is delaying his movie franchise in spite of itself to do this?
Because the IP didnt have legs and it NEEDS something like this...

Avengers and the Return of the Jedi do not.

The reality is that when the iron man movies started taking in a billion worldwide...that building rides in Orlando was permanently off the table. They had already passed the finish line.

This isn't the 1980's (well...alot of the bad parts of the 80's have returned...but I digress)...building expensive rides laden with overhead is NOT how your gonna make max profits...at least not In southwest Orlando at the corner of orange and Osceola...

Tinkering and "add ons" is... And that - is what you're seeing.

Ask yourself this: what if avatar hadnt happened and the rest of the current construction was going on as is?
There would be a culpable, distaste for the strategic plan/philosophy at wdw by a much higher percentage of the traveling public right now...

But the one thing bob Iger gets complete credit for is working deals with outsiders that have insulated his core management approach...no doubt. Credit where credit is due.

 

[Josh Hendy]

I think the simple take is "Disney paid that money...they HAVE to build something with it, right?"

No...and the vocal minority (like me) has done a bad job of explaining why because frustration always sets in/takes over.

I think you've done a good job of explaining.

To try to restate the message ...

This company owns and operates the world's largest theme park resort and also owns most of the world's hottest children's entertainment franchises. Given their extremely large size and the number of ways that they can invest money profitably, it is against their financial interest to turn this particular theme park resort into a flagship or beacon for their entertainment franchises. Except in the most minimal way with the most low-cost construction leading to the lowest possible long-term operating expenses. Hence, Midway Mania copy-paste, new video screens in Norway, and Star Wars weekends.

They get away with this because, besides the fact that they can more profitably invest in live-action prequels and condo conversions, they also have the world's largest captive theme park audience. This audience is enchanted by pixie dust but is also located 500 to 1000 miles away from the theme parks and usually only visit the parks occasionally, often only once in their lives. The high-on-pixie-dust captive audience is unable to make a well-informed calculation of value for money. In other words they won't figure out that it was pretty ridiculous to have reserved a single 3 minute ride on the Mine Train 2 months before their $8000 family vacation until the vacation is over. And even then, the lingering excitement from meeting princesses and watching fireworks shows probably overpowers any disappointment in the scale and scope of the actual rides.

For the rest of us, that's where the frustration sets in ...

 

[lockedoutlogic]

http://m.orlandoweekly.com/Blogs/ar...-and-universals-messy-joint-custody-of-marvel

 

[DanBoris]

http://m.orlandoweekly.com/Blogs/ar...-and-universals-messy-joint-custody-of-marvel

Good article, it provides a good balanced view of where things currently stand.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

Good article, it provides a good balanced view of where things currently stand.

I think it's all coffee
House speculation...more or less..until the talk of the potential breakup cost...

Long story short - the universal clientele should rest assured that marvel isn't going anywhere

 

[Planogirl]

I think it's all coffee
House speculation...more or less..until the talk of the potential breakup cost...

Long story short - the universal clientele should rest assured that marvel isn't going anywhere

I think that the likely cost will be enough to keep Disney at bay, at least for now. At least I hope so because neither Nintendo or Star Trek in that area do much for me.

 

[Yellowstonetim]

It is interesting to note that the author does not dismiss out of hand the idea of Marvel leaving Universal. And I would LOVE Star Trek at Universal!!!! But Star Trek is Paramount and Paramount has used Star Trek in other places. Has something changed? I haven't paid attention to ST stuff in a while.

Edit: OK, I went and read up on Paramount & Star Trek: Paramount sold the theme park business in 2008 (Or somewhere around then) and Star Trek Experience in Las Vegas closed a short time afterwards to move somewhere but never reopened. There is no Star Trek in any parks that I could find. This would be perfect for Universal!

 

[Milla4Prez63]

There has been rumors of Star Trek in Universal Orlando, but nothing concrete. I can't see where it goes, unless it's just a new overlay for the Shrek building. KidZone is going to be taken over by Nintendo in the near future. It sounds like Disaster may be making way for a Fast & Furious attraction. Twister is going to be replaced by something for The Tonight Show/Jimmy Fallon. Maybe it can take over Men in Black, but I don't see how that makes any sense.

I don't see place for it in IOA either. It would feel so out of place there. I just think Star Trek was a potential IP target for Universal that is unlikely to get much legs going forward.

 

[DDLand]

Ok...

Roadwork to world drive and buena vista drive?
New entrance plazas?
Rearranged parking lots/parking garage construction?
Conversion of studios facilities to service buildings or destruction for new guest space?
New utility trunk lines?
Construction of new retention pounds and perhaps alterations to crescent lake?

All those things could be necessary...
Think good times, stock swinging Bob really is up for that?

Absolutely. Why? Because he's approved large projects in the past. Projects that have been properly thought out, and have been found to be major successes. I'd say in many ways DHS is lower risk than his bold plans in China. Amazing movie and brand tie in coupled with the potential to turn DHS into a true sister park with MK. Imagine even the cross branding they could do with Disneyland.

Commercials for Disney Parks will show Images of the two MKs and the two Disney (place name here) Adventure Parks. Is it any coincidence that DCA and DHA will share many attributes such as a theatre as an icon, and will have focus on the movies and even share many attractions. ToT, TSMM, Muppets(supposing it comes back), etc. When people think of Disney Parks they think of the two MKs. Imagine if instead they thought of the two MKs and Disney Adventure Parks. That would be big.

 

[DDLand]

But the more forgiving fans say stuff like, "Wait til the pedestrian bridge at Disney Springs is finished then I'm pretty sure you're going to see something big announced." LOL

Lol that is funny. Who's said that? Or are you taking everything I'm saying out of context? I mean either one of those is a possibility...

 

[lockedoutlogic]

Lol that is funny. Who's said that? Or are you taking everything I'm saying out of context? I mean either one of those is a possibility...

I think it's more a general quip about what amounts to crosswalks getting pub as being "significant"...

That's not you...but it had popped up around here

 

[lockedoutlogic]

Absolutely. Why? Because he's approved large projects in the past. Projects that have been properly thought out, and have been found to be major successes. I'd say in many ways DHS is lower risk than his bold plans in China. Amazing movie and brand tie in coupled with the potential to turn DHS into a true sister park with MK. Imagine even the cross branding they could do with Disneyland.

Commercials for Disney Parks will show Images of the two MKs and the two Disney (place name here) Adventure Parks. Is it any coincidence that DCA and DHA will share many attributes such as a theatre as an icon, and will have focus on the movies and even share many attractions. ToT, TSMM, Muppets(supposing it comes back), etc. When people think of Disney Parks they think of the two MKs. Imagine if instead they thought of the two MKs and Disney Adventure Parks. That would be big.

You're not giving the type of plan you're proposing at studios enough gravitas...

It represents a "pure expense" infrastructure cost that has not been authorized at a domestic park since 1998 - and not in Orlando since 1993..

Who was running the show then? Roy Disney was still a voting member for those, for gods sake...

They are doing similar work at downtown - but a third party leased retail projects has much more cost/revenue certainty than simply redoing a park that doesn't have attendance issues.

 

[DDLand]

I think it's more a general quip about what amounts to crosswalks getting pub as being "significant"...

That's not you...but it had popped up around here

Nah, I've said that the stars are aligning for major construction to commence with the next year or two. Disney Springs was one of the major projects drawing down labor in Orlando I mentioned. I wouldn't put it past him. Though you're exactly right that I may have misinterpreted that. If so @Josh Hendy apologies.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

Nah, I've said that the stars are aligning for major construction to commence with the next year or two. Disney Springs was one of the major projects drawing down labor in Orlando I mentioned. I wouldn't put it past him. Though you're exactly right that I may have misinterpreted that. If so @Josh Hendy apologies.

Ok...what on earth in recent memory leads you to believe that "major construction" is a year or two away?

Not a spec of dirt moved on the "partnership" avatar build for almost 4 years

 

[DDLand]

You're not giving the type of plan you're proposing at studios enough gravitas...

It represents a "pure expense" infrastructure cost that has not been authorized at a domestic park since 1998 - and not in Orlando since 1993..

Who was running the show then? Roy Disney was still a voting member for those, for gods sake...

They are doing similar work at downtown - but a third party leased retail projects has much more cost/revenue certainty than simply redoing a park that doesn't have attendance issues.

However, the decision makers are the same people who authorized HK. They're the same people who authorized DCA. They're the same people who authorized DLP. They're pretty bold.

For better or for worse they don't look at the other differently from WDW. They look at them from the perspective of 1) Can more money be made longterm outweighing short term CapEx 2) Is the money needed immediately

I don't think they've all collectively said to themselves WDW is good enough. That's not how business works. They look at whether they're maximizing their profits. I'd say DHS expansion provides a place where they have upward area to grow. That's something Burbank will sniff out and capitalize on.

 

[DDLand]

Ok...what on earth in recent memory leads you to believe that "major construction" is a year or two away?

Not a spec or dirt moved on the "partnership" avatar build for almost 4 years

Every project is wrapping up in 2017 at the latest. These are the same people that love to draw projects out for years so people will have something to look forward to. Not one. We got word of Avatar years before they got to work and are opening it. They've got to get to work fast or they'll have nothing in the pipeline. Also due to the wrap up multiple projects it frees up a lot of labor. Labor that can be used for something else...

That being a new Disney land or maybe Universal's new theme park.

 

[Josh Hendy]

Lol that is funny. Who's said that? Or are you taking everything I'm saying out of context? I mean either one of those is a possibility...

Nothing personal against anyone. Except for one or two members who have distinctive styles and signatures, I barely notice who's posting what and I'm not trying get in digs at anyone or ridicule them. I was trying to make a point (which I don't remember any more) about the kind of comments I've seen re: things not happening anytime soon because of other things happening ... in either a humorous or sarcastic way ... take your pick.

 

[DDLand]

Nothing personal against anyone. Except for one or two members who have distinctive styles and signatures, I barely notice who's posting what and I'm not trying get in digs at anyone or ridicule them. I was trying to make a point (which I don't remember any more) about the kind of comments I've seen re: things not happening anytime soon because of other things happening ... in either a humorous or sarcastic way ... take your pick.

Understood. Sorry if I misunderstood your message. I think I'm grumpy because I'm putting together this shelf and it's a pain in the neck.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

Every project is wrapping up in 2017 at the latest. These are the same people that love to draw projects out for years so people will have something to look forward to. Not one. We got word of Avatar years before they got to work and are opening it. They've got to get to work fast or they'll have nothing in the pipeline. Also due to the wrap up multiple projects it frees up a lot of labor. Labor that can be used for something else...

That being a new Disney land or maybe Universal's new theme park.

I agree... We're just not seeing it.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

However, the decision makers are the same people who authorized HK. They're the same people who authorized DCA. They're the same people who authorized DLP. They're pretty bold.

For better or for worse they don't look at the other differently from WDW. They look at them from the perspective of 1) Can more money be made longterm outweighing short term CapEx 2) Is the money needed immediately

I don't think they've all collectively said to themselves WDW is good enough. That's not how business works. They look at whether they're maximizing their profits. I'd say DHS expansion provides a place where they have upward area to grow. That's something Burbank will sniff out and capitalize on.

Ok...but attendance is rising and they are increasing prices dramatically for a solid 10 years...

Isn't that how to maximize profits? Why spend capex when the market/ customer base isn't forcing it?