Life Choices

[Christine]

Ok so I will be very honest right now. I haven't told a lot of people my life experiences but I have been "better" for 4 years now and I honestly owe a great deal of that to Disney.. oddly enough. I was in a very bad place from the time I was 21 until I was 26.. very bad. Intervention (the show) multiplied by 10. I grew up normal, went to university and then I had a horrible thing happen to me and I could deal with it so I turned to substances and then "work" to support those substances. Fast forward to the end of my other life.. My parents held an intervention but I wasn't ready. I had to hit rock bottom.. I know people say this all the time and not everyones rock bottom is the same but for me rock bottom was not being able to support my habit, being sick all the time, etc. My family cut me off, not from love, but from things that enabled my addiction. So one day I woke up and I said I can't live like this and I got better. Clearly these two situations are different but a lot of people will use what they can to get what they want. Maybe your sister needs to hit her rock bottom. Its ok to be angry. I would hope that you would be but you need to stop helping her if you are. You need to support her emotionally, listen to her but no money, no place to stay. Shes a big girl she will figure it out fast. After I was clean for a year I took my first trip to Disney in 5 years.. and that was it.. that gave me so much MORE. I keep myself busy planning my next trip, I love being at Disney.. its everything to me. I know it sounds so silly but no sillier than the stuff I was doing prior to that. Don't abandon your sister all together.. she needs you but she needs to figure out why she is self destructing. Maybe some financial counselling? It will be a tough sell but make a deal with her.. you will take in your niece and she goes to a couple sessions? Never under estimate the power of negotiation. Maybe she just needs to find her "Disney" Don't give up hope hun, you are in my prayers.

This is a great story and example.

OP, your sister is in a similar place as this poster. Not for drugs, but for personal responsibility. It is very easy to be self-centered and wrapped up in your destructive behaviors. Having family or friends there to bail you out all the only enables the behavior and, in fact, causes resentment in everyone, including the one being enabled.

Your mom is correct in that family never turns it's back. But I think that saying only applies to family who are in a tight spot due to situations beyond their control. Of course, you wouldn't turn your back. Your sister has 100% caused each and every problem she has today and, her family (the safety net), has encouraged that even though that wasn't the intention.

It is time to stop and let her hit her rock bottom. Otherwise she will never better herself and get that sense of pride that comes from being mature and self-sufficient.

What would I do? I would probably cut most contact with her but tell her that you love her and are there for her when she's ready to become a partner in her financial recovery. As long as she continues to be the victim and make poor choices you will have to stay away because her poor choices are affecting people beyond her immediate family and are hurting your mother's retirement/livelihood.

 

[The Mystery Machine]

I think my main issue is my serious need to disengage. There is a middle sister (I am the oldest) who has an equally dysfunctional life. There is so much enablement and toxicity that I can't handle it any more and I feel guilty for feeling that way. My son was recently diagnosed with type 1 diabetes that has been difficult to control. I have some other stressors as well, as we all do, but I have spent the past three weeks consumed with my sister's issue.

I don't do holidays with my family now, it is all too much for me. We don't communicate outside of holidays, aside from my niece joining us on summer vacation. I told my mom I need to disengage and she told me that family never turns their back. How much is too much though? I can't fix anything and I just don't want to see this any more.

So what you are saying is that you are ruminating and worrying about your sister but at the same time you don't speak to your sisters outside of holidays?

That leads me to conclude that you are getting all this info from your mother, correct?

So then the answer here is you have to learn how to set up boundaries with your mother. She is the source of your anxiety with this situation.

 

[mommanne]

Thank you all for sharing your thoughts and perspectives. I believe that this is rock bottom for my sister and it is difficult to watch from afar. I have told her that I love her, no matter what. I told her I am here to help in any way I can but am not in a financial position to help with money.

The feeling associated with this are helplessness and anger. When her house was sold I was at WDW. My mom didn't want to tell me what was going on but my uncle mentioned it because he assumed I knew about it. I spent the last two days of vacation worried to distraction. I was angry about her situation ruining the end of my vacation and felt selfish for feeling that way. I felt guilty for being on vacation while my sister was going through this terrible thing. Then I felt angry again for all of it. Things didn't have to be this way and she has nobody to blame but herself. I have to keep reminding myself of this.

Years ago I offered to help her budget. I don't make a lot of money but I make my money work. I have a child away at college and one at home with a new diabetes diagnosis. I have a lot of things going on and a lot of my own stress. In the interest of self preservation I have to distance myself from this. My mom isn't trying to make this my problem in any way. I am the one asking for information and I am going to stop asking. We are planning a trip to Hawaii in August and I can't feel guilty about that. I have worked for everything I have.

The hardest thing is, this isn't my sister's nature. There is no substance abuse involved. She is one of the sweetest and kindest people I know. It's just like she gave up on life and nobody can fix that. I can only try to support my niece in any way possible and protect myself. The stress and negative feelings are impacting my mental and physical health. I am a "fixer" by nature and I can't fix this.

 

[jodifla]

It's so hard to watch a family member struggle like this. I went through it, and during the time where this family member was running his life into the ground, I just had to disconnect. His life, not mine. It was hard at first not to worry, but it was best for me to remove myself from the situation.

Several years later, this family member reached rock bottom and was ready to gratefully receive help. I was in a position to help, so I did. It all worked out in the long run, but there was no sparing this person their downward spiral. It's just something they had to experience.

 

[ZephyrHawk]

The niece is 18. You don't ask her mom for permission for anything. You offer the daughter help as an adult. She very well may be sick and tired of her parent's antics and want out. If not, and she says no, you wash your hands.

 

[mommanne]

My sister and niece are very close, actually enmeshed. It's not a healthy relationship. Unless it is my sister's wish for my niece to live with me, the mere suggestion would cause a war. Even then I doubt my niece would leave my sister because she would feel like she was abandoning her parents. My niece is a commuter student and the school is 40 miles away from me, which would be difficult, as well. Of course if my sister requested this, I would find a way to make it work.

 

[saraschoening]

My sister and niece are very close, actually enmeshed. It's not a healthy relationship. Unless it is my sister's wish for my niece to live with me, the mere suggestion would cause a war. Even then I doubt my niece would leave my sister because she would feel like she was abandoning her parents. My niece is a commuter student and the school is 40 miles away from me, which would be difficult, as well. Of course if my sister requested this, I would find a way to make it work.

To me.. you sound like an amazing woman. You are compassionate and strong.. we need more people in the world like you. You care and thats so important. I know what you are going through and it is hard. For myself I felt so helpless when I was in my situation. Not only have I been the cause of family pain but I have also had other family members cause pain. Currently I have a sister in law who has no desire to work and DH parents pay for everything. I was also in a relationship where he was self destructing and I enabled him so much and I thought that if I just showed him how much I loved him he would get better.. but he didn't. There is nothing wrong with being a "fixer" and there is certainly nothing wrong with wanting to help people especially your family, that is a great quality that you have. I don't know your relationship in detail but I think that deep down you know what you have to do. As you said, you think that this is her rock bottom so remember this is going to be the hardest part. I know that your sister and my personal situation are different in the sense that I was a drug addict but we both are trying to hurt ourselves.. is there any underlying issues that you can think of that would be causing her to do this? (I am not asking you to share them, just trying to get to the root of the problem) As for feeling guilty I wish that I could offer up some advice to make this go away but I don't think that it will.. not with your personality, your kind and caring, you put other people first so you will always feel others peoples pain resulting in guilt even though you know that you worked so hard for what you have and made wonderful choices. Just hang in there and be strong.

 

[mommanne]

Thank you Sara. You are very kind and an inspiration to anyone that wants to make the conscious choice to save their own life. I applaud you and wish you the best of everything life has to offer.

I don't feel amazing. I feel selfish and angry. I am strong because of many difficulties I have overcome in life. Because of this I come across as harsh and unfeeling. I have a problem with people who don't feel responsible for their own choices. I feel things very deeply, to the detriment of my own health and well being. This is why I really need to separate myself and save my energy for the things where I can have a positive impact.

I know my mother's enablement came from a good place. But I feel like if she had tried some tough love this would have turned out differently. I feel like I should have tried harder to knock some sense into my sister. So I am just angry! Anger will eat you alive if you let it. I have to let it go and hope for the best. I am not a controlling person by nature but I wish I had done more. If she had just listened to me she would have been okay. Now she has dug herself into a hole that will take years to climb out of, and she doesn't appear to have the will to do it. I feel weak because I am not strong enough to witness this any longer.

Thanks everyone, for your input and understanding. Somehow I guess things always turn out the way they are supposed to. Right now I feel like I need to protect myself from the situation and the negative emotions of all of it.

 

[monsterkitty]

OP, we are in this position with my DH's oldest sister. Her husband passed away in 1998 leaving her and 3 daughters, ages 6, 9, and 13. She blew through his life insurance money by making very poor choices. She would find a job and then either quit because they didn't pay her what she was worth (her words) or they would fire her "because she is a widow." Yup, people fire you because you lost your spouse xx amount of years ago. Then my MIL passed away from breast cancer and 7 months later my FIL had a heart attack and passed away. This gave her new reasons of why she couldn't hold a job.

8 years ago SIL called us at midnight because she was having a really bad panic attack. She asked DH to come and help. He told her he would leave in the morning but in the meantime to go to the ER. She called back every hour for the rest of the night asking where he was. We lived 2 hours away. 7 years ago she decided to move back here and try to start all over again. At that time my youngest niece was a junior in high school. Niece lasted one semester at the new school and then went back to her old city 2 hours away to live with her oldest sister's in-laws and finish school there. That was the best decision of my niece's life - she got away from her mother and got to see what a "normal" family looks like. I know that sounds awful, but if you knew my SIL you would understand.

In the past 7 years, SIL had to sell her house because she couldn't pay the mortgage. Many of us had already paid several thousands of dollars to help her keep the house, pay for electricity, gas, water, etc. but she couldn't manage her money. She decided to go live with middle DD and her family in Texas. That lasted 3 months because the two of them are like a pack of Mentos and bottle of Diet Coke. We got her moved back here and moved in with her oldest brother and his family. The deal was she wouldn't pay rent, would take 3 or 4 months to get the mental help she needs and then start transitioning back into the working world. I could write a novel on how that went. The day she moved out of BIL's house she sent all 3 of her siblings a text that said, "Sorry to have been a pain. You will never have to worry about me again." DH and I left work, we're both teachers, to go and find her as well all thought she was going to commit suicide. Nope, in her mind it was a "hey, I'm leaving this house because you won't let me eat McDonalds 3 meals a day and you want me to save money so I can get on my feet."

She moves from place to place, telling her new providers how terrible we all are. She then wears out her welcome there and has to find a new place to live. Her 3 DDs will not speak to her and she isn't allowed to see her grandchildren unless she follows a few guidelines. She will find a job and lose it within a few weeks. Many times she has been told not to come back after lunch on her first day of the job. She needs help but refuses to see she has problems because everything is caused because she's a widow and because her parents died.

We no longer give her money. We will not let her live here as will no other family member. We have her under our cell phone plan but if she doesn't pay the bill we turn the phone off until she pays. She's driving a car that probably cost $30k and we have no idea how she got the car nor do we care that she will probably have it reposed. We've tried to help. She's hit rock bottom several times but when someone helps her up she drives them away after she's used them. We cannot help anymore because of the toll it has taken on all of us - her siblings, children, aunts, uncles, cousins, friends - she's driven all of us away.

It's hard but for your own sanity and family you are doing the right things.

 

[mommanne]

Monster kitty that is an horrendous story. I am so sorry for you and your nieces. It is so difficult when you can't protect people from themselves. It appears that even tough love didn't help your SIL. Now that my sister is lashing out in anger I fear that she faces a similar future. I don't understand what makes people self destruct like this and I feel like if I could understand it, I could help. That must have been so difficult for you all

I am glad your nieces were able to separate themselves from that situation.

 

[donac]

It is a very hard situation and one that is very hard for you to live through. We are going through something like this with 2 of dh's sisters. His father passed away in Feb and we have come to learn that his mother has been sending money to 2 of his sisters not just once a month but sometimes weekly. Another sister is in charge of the estate and is on her mother's case about doing this anymore since there is now less income coming in.My dh tried to tell his sister that mom will probably continue to do this since she can't say no to her children.

Cases like these are very difficult to live through but do what you can to help your mother and your son. PS don't forget yourseldf.

 

[lauradis]

Here is how I handle toxic family.

1. stop being the one to initiate the communication or visits, if they call me fine.
2. my core family comes first DH and child every one else second
3. When asked for money, or a favor I say I will get back to you.
4. If they do call and start drama or abuse I tell them so and then tell them they are more then welcome to call back when acting rational. hang up.

I had to ask myself over the years "if this person wasn't blood related would I have a relationship with them?" and if that answer is no then I dont have contact with them or try to limit my contact as much as possible.

It may sound selfish, but my life is to short, to solve your problems, deal with your uselessness drama, GTFU.

Stop feeling guilty it will not help your sister nor your mother and its really bad for your health.

Good luck honey been there its not easy to let go..

 

[lauradis]

One thing I forgot to add about letting them call you if you have a iphone it will allow you to set individual contacts on a dont call time frame. Like they can call but your phone make no noise.

 

[Disney845]

Ok so I will be very honest right now. I haven't told a lot of people my life experiences but I have been "better" for 4 years now and I honestly owe a great deal of that to Disney.. oddly enough. I was in a very bad place from the time I was 21 until I was 26.. very bad. Intervention (the show) multiplied by 10. I grew up normal, went to university and then I had a horrible thing happen to me and I could deal with it so I turned to substances and then "work" to support those substances. Fast forward to the end of my other life.. My parents held an intervention but I wasn't ready. I had to hit rock bottom.. I know people say this all the time and not everyones rock bottom is the same but for me rock bottom was not being able to support my habit, being sick all the time, etc. My family cut me off, not from love, but from things that enabled my addiction. So one day I woke up and I said I can't live like this and I got better. Clearly these two situations are different but a lot of people will use what they can to get what they want. Maybe your sister needs to hit her rock bottom. Its ok to be angry. I would hope that you would be but you need to stop helping her if you are. You need to support her emotionally, listen to her but no money, no place to stay. Shes a big girl she will figure it out fast. After I was clean for a year I took my first trip to Disney in 5 years.. and that was it.. that gave me so much MORE. I keep myself busy planning my next trip, I love being at Disney.. its everything to me. I know it sounds so silly but no sillier than the stuff I was doing prior to that. Don't abandon your sister all together.. she needs you but she needs to figure out why she is self destructing. Maybe some financial counselling? It will be a tough sell but make a deal with her.. you will take in your niece and she goes to a couple sessions? Never under estimate the power of negotiation. Maybe she just needs to find her "Disney" Don't give up hope hun, you are in my prayers.

Sara please don't take this response in a negative way. It is always brave to share past struggles and your story may be an inspiration to others finding themselves going down a similar path.

That said, I don't know if your screen name is your real name nor if your avatar is your real picture. But you did just recently post about job interviews and named "specific" store locations. I just wanted to offer a friendly heads up that in these days of so much social media it isn't unusual for potential employers to scan the internet for info on candidates before offering them a position. I can speak from experience and say that I will Google someone's name, their email address, phone number, or any other identifiable info off their resume before even considering bringing that person in to interview at my office. In this manner I detected a potential candidate who was badmouthing a previous employer (different company, same field as ours) on the internet and was able to move right on by him down the line.

 

[saraschoening]

Sara please don't take this response in a negative way. It is always brave to share past struggles and your story may be an inspiration to others finding themselves going down a similar path.

That said, I don't know if your screen name is your real name nor if your avatar is your real picture. But you did just recently post about job interviews and named "specific" store locations. I just wanted to offer a friendly heads up that in these days of so much social media it isn't unusual for potential employers to scan the internet for info on candidates before offering them a position. I can speak from experience and say that I will Google someone's name, their email address, phone number, or any other identifiable info off their resume before even considering bringing that person in to interview at my office. In this manner I detected a potential candidate who was badmouthing a previous employer (different company, same field as ours) on the internet and was able to move right on by him down the line.

Well since I volunteer educating people around my community and volunteer speaking at schools in the community I think that it would be pretty easy to find out about my past. I live in a small town. I am not ashamed of my past because I overcame it which is very hard. I do appreciate what you have to say and maybe for someone who has just gotten their life back together.. discretion is good but for me its been awhile and I also just can't omit 5 years of my life. I have tired that.. I have tried to pretend that it never happened and it doesn't work so in my case honesty is best. I am one of the strongest people that I know and most of it is because of what I went through. I don't know many people that would be strong enough to go through anything like I did.. especially the incident that caused the whole "downturn" in my life. I wouldn't wish what happened to me upon my worst enemy.. upon anyone actually and there are a lot of rotten people in this world.. what happened to me should never happen to anyone and I suffered for a for years because of it and not because I didn't want to get better.. when it started I was just trying deal with the stress and then it got worse and when I realized that I had a problem I went and spoke to someone but at that time I worked during the day and the only free help where I live is during the day so unless you have lost everything you cant get help ( ones of the things I am now trying to change) Anyways won't ramble.. but I get what you are saying but I did enough lying in those 5 years to last me a lifetime. If I can't be accepted for who I am and what I have gone through then I am not meant to be there.

 

[arminnie]

Block them on your phone and force her to grow up.

 

[saraschoening]

Sara please don't take this response in a negative way. It is always brave to share past struggles and your story may be an inspiration to others finding themselves going down a similar path.

That said, I don't know if your screen name is your real name nor if your avatar is your real picture. But you did just recently post about job interviews and named "specific" store locations. I just wanted to offer a friendly heads up that in these days of so much social media it isn't unusual for potential employers to scan the internet for info on candidates before offering them a position. I can speak from experience and say that I will Google someone's name, their email address, phone number, or any other identifiable info off their resume before even considering bringing that person in to interview at my office. In this manner I detected a potential candidate who was badmouthing a previous employer (different company, same field as ours) on the internet and was able to move right on by him down the line.

So I just reread my response to you and I came off sort of defensive and I didn't mean to be at all. You were being kind and speaking from a place of concern and I appreciate that, I really do. You obviously have life experience that you were willing to share with me and I will take it! But from my perspective I just have to be honest, you know what I mean. I have held two jobs since I gave up that life and the first one I just couldn't talk to anyone at all. I had to avoid all social outing and any conversation and in my last position I omitted my past which didn't work because its hard to do. So now I face the fact that I fell down but I got back up.. one of the very few actually. I feel that who I am now, my strength, my willpower and just how hard I work on a daily basis comes from my life experiences. But thank you.. I appreciate your words of wisdom!

 

[lauradis]

So I just reread my response to you and I came off sort of defensive and I didn't mean to be at all. You were being kind and speaking from a place of concern and I appreciate that, I really do. You obviously have life experience that you were willing to share with me and I will take it! But from my perspective I just have to be honest, you know what I mean. I have held two jobs since I gave up that life and the first one I just couldn't talk to anyone at all. I had to avoid all social outing and any conversation and in my last position I omitted my past which didn't work because its hard to do. So now I face the fact that I fell down but I got back up.. one of the very few actually. I feel that who I am now, my strength, my willpower and just how hard I work on a daily basis comes from my life experiences. But thank you.. I appreciate your words of wisdom!

What you did was learn from your mistake and bettered your self. The other pp is right you have to be careful.

 

[FlightlessDuck]

Tonight will be the third time this week I will volunteering at a homeless shelter. It's not my call to judge how the people got there. My main desire is to make sure they are fed and kept warm. One of the other volunteers is an homeless advocate who helps with looking for employment, contacting social services, etc.

My basic reaction to this would be to help them find somewhere else to live that they could afford and help my sister find work. If I had the room in my home, I would offer them a place to stay.

 

[bdcp]

Tonight will be the third time this week I will volunteering at a homeless shelter. It's not my call to judge how the people got there. My main desire is to make sure they are fed and kept warm. One of the other volunteers is an homeless advocate who helps with looking for employment, contacting social services, etc.

My basic reaction to this would be to help them find somewhere else to live that they could afford and help my sister find work. If I had the room in my home, I would offer them a place to stay.

I've known a couple of people like the op's sister and honestly she doesn't want help finding a job. She wants other people to give her money and stuff and support her financially. I worked with a woman who in her entire life barely was able to support herself even though she had a good paying job. She should have been fired multiple times but was a gov employee and it was just easier to wait til she moved on which is required every 2-3 years. She adopted a child while living overseas which was honestly the only way she could. She should not be raising anyone. She lost a home, two cars (managed to get another one, don't ask me how) and left an apartment without paying rent for several months all over the course of the two years I knew her. She blamed everything on the fact she was a "single" mother. Well, gee, you chose that and I know several single moms living on the salary she had. She blew through any money she had on fast food, and just junk. She didn't want help, was forced to go to financial and personal counseling which she bailed on, complained about most of her family and whined a lot. She said multiple times "I wish I had someone to buy me xyz". To which most of us would respond, no one bought this for us, we bought it ourselves. She ended up retiring on an early out program at age 48, making about 1/5th of what she did while employed and moved in with her parents out of state and last I heard isn't working and is living off her folks and blowing all her income. My point is, there are people who don't want help, they want everyone else to give them everything. I've also known a couple of friends who have taken in and tried to help homeless women. They all ended the same, with the person not putting any effort in, taking what was given and then leaving to live on the streets or in shelters again, because they have issues with any rules, authority, responsibility, etc. As my DH says "you can't push a rope".

OP, I would let her figure it out for herself as she has shown you over and over again who she is. Even your niece, is an adult and a bit of reality may be what she needs also.