Just Back/Finger ID a Scam?

[jimmybop]

We used different turnstiles on different ends of the gates. So the biometric scanner recognizes all tickets used while entering at a certain time and can match those with tickets used together at different times on different days?

This response is nothing official, just something that seems to make sense (to me anyways) when applying my response above to this question.

Often when I personally have went to enter a park, I have seen families split themselves between two turnstiles right next to each other. So maybe the programmers realized this and have set to associate tickets at all turnstiles to each other, and then narrow it down each time the ticket is used (along with when the tickets were bought and other factors)?

That would be my guess for what happens... but to be honest, i really do not know. But I'm sure before the system was put into place they studied all of these possibilities and have tried to account for them, and have since tweeked the system since then.

 

[WDW2000]

I think the purpose of finger scan is more of a "Big Brother" type thing than anything else. More and more places are using the "BioScan" technique for security reasons - especially after 911. So in a sense it is a scam because Disney is leading you to believe it is for one thing, but in reality it's just another form of the government interferring with your privacy.

 

[Mulan82]

my DBF swears when we were in WDW 2 weeks ago that Disney is saving all those fingerprints and then selling them on the black market.

 

[iwaseeyore]

Then the scan must not work at US/IOA either. We had to scan our fingers on old tickets on our October trip.

 

[PolyPal]

I hate the finger scan. All it does is create long lines at the turnstiles and frustrate "guests" (and a frustrated guest spends less once inside the gate).

I understand that the tickets are non-transferable, but I believe the vast majority of people who go to WDW are honest, paying customers who are not trying to get into the park with somebody elses passes they bought on e-bay!

C'mon Disney - DUMP THE FINGER SCAN! Get more guests into the parks more quickly so they have more time to buy food and souveniers! (And then fire the bean counter who came up with the whole finger scam - I mean scan -idea!)

 

[kelisshopping]

I hate the finger scan system. I don't agree with it at all. We just got back late last night from our first trip and the only thing slowing up the lines was the scanners. They won't work, then they do, then they don't. My daughter and stepmother had a card that didn't work when we wen't to Epcot. They pulled us out of line and wasted more of our time. My SM was issued a new one and we were told to get a new one from Pop century for my daughter since hers wasn't working. It was the machine, not her card. That card worked everywhere else just fine. I was peeved because I get up early, wait in line, then can't get in for 20 minutes because of this system. We weren't far back in line either.

I knew of the finger scan system before we went but for the first couple of days never had to do it because they turned them off at opening. Epcot was the one that did them at opening both times we were there. It was very irritating! I don't like my time wasted when I work so hard to get there. Don't even get me started on their road signs, lol.

 

[Auggiedaugie]

I haven't read everyone's comments (I apologize) but here is what happened to us this past October:

My DH's right index finger is fused at the joint so he cannot straighten it. The first day we entered the MK he put in his 3rd and fourth fingers into the scan....no problem, we went in. The next day as we were entering AK he was holding something in his right hand so he slid his left hand index and middle fingers into the scan. Guess what.....no problem.

Since then I have wondered if those things really work.

 

[JerJan]

PolyPal says:C'mon Disney - DUMP THE FINGER SCAN! Get more guests into the parks more quickly so they have more time to buy food and souveniers! (And then fire the bean counter who came up with the whole finger scam - I mean scan -idea!)

I LOVE IT!!!!!! The TAG FAIRY should use that line for you!

 

[seashoreCM]

IOA either. We had to scan our fingers on old tickets on our October trip.

As of approximately May 2005 finger scans were being added to old tickets that never used to use finger scans. The next person to use the ticket has his finger dimensions recorded.

I wasted a days admission using my mothers MYW ticket in error one busy Sunday morning. I never realized it until I tried to use' my Annual Pass to get a Fast Pass and it said my ticket was not used for entry into the park!

DD and I have APs and her pass is constantly demagnetizing, !!!

Another overpowering reason to put your name on your ticket.

Is the pass that is always demagnetizing positioned so its magnetic stripe touches another ticket magnetic stripe?

 

[faeflora]

My major problem with the finger scan is that for the elderly population like my mom that has difficulty with their hands/fingers the scan is a very difficulty operation to do. We stood in line and watched four set of elderly couples struggle with the ability to get their fingers in the scan machine. It was sad, and they seemed really frustrated.

 

[DebbieB]

Stayed at Pop May 25-29, I'll post my trip report later. But for now... I think the finger id is a total scam more than ever! Three things make me think that. I know that Disney says they use it to try and protect people from buying bogas tickets from other people and so that people can't steal your ticket. But I really think it's so that they can make more $$ by having you buy a ticket and not handing them off to your friends and family.

I don't think they have ever denied that is the reason for the finger scan. They started the scan on non-AP's the same time as they revamped the ticket price system. Two 5 day tickets are far more expensive than one 10 day. If 2 people could share a 10 day (separate trips) rather than each buying a 5 day, Disney would lose alot of money. They made the 10 day cheap so that people would stay longer or come back for another trip to use it, not for multiple people to use it.

I've found at park opening they turn it off to speed up the lines. But you never know when it's going to be turned on.

 

[makinorlando]

duplicate - darned server busy error!

 

[makinorlando]

As of approximately May 2005 finger scans were being added to old tickets that never used to use finger scans. The next person to use the ticket has his finger dimensions recorded.


Another overpowering reason to put your name on your ticket.

Is the pass that is always demagnetizing positioned so its magnetic stripe touches another ticket magnetic stripe?

My name IS on my ticket - it's an AP. I forgot I still have my mother's ticket w/same picture in my holder from her visit, and in my haste to get into the park on a busy (EE soft opening) Sunday morning to get to an ADR I didn't even look at the back!! I admitted I was stupid -in the least careless, but it would have been one of those times that the system working would have helped me. I never would assume that it was not working, and try and use another ticket - I have no reason with an AP!!!

Magnetic strips never touch - this is the first set of her passes that we have had issues with. I have always kept them together in the same pass holder. I'm trying something new now!!!

 

[brivers222]

My DW and I switched up tickets 3 times at different parks and was able to get into each and every one no problem. There was one time at MK where I went through and my DW stuck her ticket into the machine and before she could even get her fingers in the machine the CM said, that you very much have a great day!

I think they are more in a HUGE line creater than protection.

Maybe after Disney finds the the Terrorist missing two(2) fingers they can go back to just searching bags and taking our tickets.

 

[TSR6]

WOWOWOW!

Maybe i can explain a little bit of these worries..

Finger Prints vs. Bioscan vs. Biometrics - The turnstyle machines have absolutely no capability to record your fingerprints. Have you ever even had your finger prints taken? They always wipe the sweat off your fingers first - if Disney truly did FINGER PRINTS - they would be so inaccurate that they would be of no use to the government, or any other "black market" there may be for finger prints. DOOO DEEE DOOO DOOO.... DOOO DEEE DOO DOOO.... :rolleyes

What the "Finger thing" does is measures sizes of your fingers, and assigns a "number" to the size that is recorded. This "number" is NOT 100% unique, and very possibly could match another person in WDW at any given time, assuming your bone structure is that similar to someone else. What BioMetrics DOES do is makes sure that the same person uses the ticket by keeping "random Joe" from buying "black market tickets" - ones used by someone else previously.

But I swapped tickets with my (insert person here - Generally speaking, there are a couple possibilities here.

• You may have purchased your tickets within the same transaction and/or used them within a close period of time. I'm not 100% sure on how exactly the linking works, but I do know for a fact that the Biometrics DOES take into account groups of people, and that people often don't sign their cards. Meaning yes, you can theoretically switch tickets with another member of your group and still get into the parks. The system is not designed to penalize people for grabbing the wrong ticket from mom, the group leader, or who-ever you are traveling with that happens to be holding the tickets. It is designed to stem the illegal re-sale of used tickets.
  
  
• Another possiblity is that Bio's are shut off due to a large line. Sometimes they shut them off temporarily to increase the flow into the parks during peak times. Other times CM's will just override the bio request by the touch of a button. It's actually quite simple.

But my passes keep demagnatizing from the aliens trying to read my biometrics - I assure you that your tickets demagnetizing are probably due to something a lot more simple that you may realize. Tickets becoming demagnetized are often due to them rubbing together, rubbing together with credit cards, magnetic strips from it and something else touching, being in close proximity to a cell phone, pager, or other electronic device with a magnetic field, even a phone that is off via the magnet in the phone's speaker, a purse magnet that keeps the purse closed, or so many other possiblities.

They checked my 30 year old ID for my AP, but my 20 year old friend just walked right in - This could be the CM's descretion, but is most likely due to something that the turnstile said. Sometimes the CM may be just overriding the Biometrics, or the CM could be overriding a demagnatized card. One reason requires and ID, the other just the press of a button. No big deal, they probably don't care about your age, how pissed off you look in your DMV photo, or any of that. They are just complying with what the turnstile screen on their side says.

I'm pissed off because it took me 20 minutes to get into the park after I chewed on my pass - I'm not going to lie on this one - a lot of times delays caused due to faulty tickets are more than likely your fault. These tickets have to be treated as a credit card, but also as something fragile. Although these tickets are VERY durable compared to the alternatives, having them near any magnetic source kills the code on the strip. Putting them in your mouth ( WHICH IS VERY...VERY DISGUSTING. The poor CM that has to touch your ticket, and 20 thousand other tickets feels the same way. Trust me, keep them OUT of your mouth, bra, or anywhere wet, sweaty, or smelly PLEASE! ), pockets, ect can kill them too. If the paper wrinkles, sometimes that can lose part of the code on the ticket, causing it to scan improperly. That, among many things can delay your park entrance. Keep them in a SAFE place in your wallet away from other cards, or keep them in the little sleeves disney gives you.


Did i miss anything?

 

[LilyWDW]

Oh great... now I am terrified that I won't know what to do and the machine will mess up because I am trying my darndest to get out of the way for everyone.

I hope no one gets mad... I will try my best I promise!!!!

 

[jmommy]

Interesting that this topic is being discussed--just returned yesterday (5/29) from 9 days at Disney. We had 4 tickets--3 adult and 1 child. Each of our tickets had our names on them as they were our resort keys as well, so there was no way to get tickets mixed up. We still had problems atleast 6 of the 9 days of our trip. Seems like one or more of our finger scans would come up access denied. It was a real pain. Most times the CM would pass on on through, but we did go to guest services to get new cards in case they had become demagnitized.....didn't help. We park hopped every day and sometime we would pass through one park turnstile without problems only to be denied at another park. We went to Animal Kingdom four times and each time the finger scan was "turned off" Not sure what they are really hoping to accomplish, but sure am glad that I won't be fighting the crowds this summer with all of these problems.

 

[kaytieeldr]

8 of us were there in April, and 7 of us had tickets (baby under 3 didn't need one). One of us held on to all of the tickets in her pack, and each morning when she handed out our tickets before entering, none of us had any problems getting in. I find it hard to believe that in the 6 days that we were there, each time we happened to get the same ticket back each day.

From the http://allearsnet.com/pl/ticket.htm#credpass ticket FAQ
"I don't think this finger scan thing works at all. My family of four used whatever ticket I handed to them to get into the parks and it wasn't always their own. We were never stopped from entering."

"That's because Disney had you covered. MYW tickets that are purchased together will also have their finger scans recorded together as a group in the computer system. As long as any one of those scans matched the ticket that was being used, you were admitted to the park. If none of them matched, the ticket would have been flagged by the turnstile for the CM to check for ID."

The last day of our trip we will be going to Epcot to the Akershus for breakfast then right back out to catch ME to the airport(airline changed our flight to an early one )...Do we need to use a ticket for that day?

Yes, you absolutely each have to use up a day on your ticket to enter any park, even just for a meal.

And what happens to our tickets if we have days left over? Can we combine the days left over from the 7 tickets onto 1 ticket? Then what if we do that and the person whose ticket it was originally doesn't go the next time??

No, you cannot combine tickets - plus, if you don't purchase the non-expiration option for each ticket, they will all expire fourteen days after first use.

Its measuring the distance between fingers? How exactly does it do that? If everyone slides their hand in the machine and presses their fingers up against the guides that are there, won't the distance be exactly the same for everyone.

It's taking a biometric "picture" of the measurements of your fingers. While not as unique as a fingerprint, the measurements are individual enough to generally connect that ticket with that person's measurements.

So in a sense it is a scam because Disney is leading you to believe it is for one thing, but in reality it's just another form of the government interferring with your privacy.

 

[DrTomorrow]

[...]The scan is a complete joke. I'm sure there is a very good reason behind it, but right now its nothing more than a nuisance.

For the record, I'm not picking on JMD - it was just an easy post to quote!

I believe that the biometric system is working quite well; you just have to understand its true purpose. Disney isn't really worried about DM using DD's extra day - they are concerned about a surprisingly larger resale market for used Tickets (eBay and others). The mere fact that there are the biometric scanners which probably will be turned on and might not let you in will act as a strong deterrent for the vast majority of people.

For those of you who think the finger scanners are a scam or a joke - let me ask you this: Even given how you feel, would you be comfortable spending 100s of dollars buying used tickets on-line, given the current biometric system?

Be well!

 

[jimmybop]

My brother (He works for an intrest group in DC for security companies) sent me this good news article a couple months ago about this topic and I just refound the article. Sadly the link he gave me did not work (you have to pay to see the whole article) but luckly I found it on another site (wahoo for mickeynews.com).

Its a good read about this topic:
http://www.mickeynews.com/News/DisplayPressRelease.asp_Q_id_E_346Gates