Here it is - Announcement re More FP+ Beginning 4/28

[morethananyonex]

I get your point.

However, we don't know for sure that tiering is here to stay and that it is integral to FP+. Really, not being a jerk, but do you have official info that says tiering is here to stay? I haven't seen any.

Sure, the way things are now, it IS integral to FP+, but as we're seeing in this very announcement, FP+ is still changing. Teiring isn't a given, unless I missed something?

Dan

If you're looking for something official you won't find it. Disney barely acknowledges that tiering exists, after all, it's not really a "sexy" aspect of FP+ in the same way that booking your headliners before you arrive is.

Some very knowledgable people on here have actually done calculations on the numbers we know to be the capacity for those parks, and if I remember correctly calculated that a significant number of desirable attractions would have to be added to those two parks in order for it to make sense that Disney gets rid of tiers.

Ask yourself this, why would Disney let Soarin and TT run out long before the park opens? How does it align with their goals of FP+? They want the maximum number of people to lock in a ride they want (not just one they settled for) before they arrive so that they are less likely to go to a non Disney attraction in Orlando. Tiering is necessary if you understand what Disney is trying to do with the system, and you understand the capacity issues at DHS and Epcot.

 

[MOM POPPINS]

I am seeing lots of availability at 12:30 pm for everything that was once out even Toy Story Mania... It looks like checking on extra fast passes today at 12:30 would have been great but who knows what the future holds.

 

[OtherScott]

It's worse! Because people will be at the kiosks much longer than the old fastpass machines And if you finish your 4 FP+ by 12pm, you're not going to get any more. And people who book for fireworks will never get a 4th.

Wouldn't this be offset somewhat by the fact that you can book any FP from any kiosk? I'd think it would be worse if after 3 you had to go to each rides' location to see if additional FPs were available.

Or are you saying it's worse than allowing you to use smartphone?

 

[mom2rtk]

Wouldn't this be offset somewhat by the fact that you can book any FP from any kiosk? I'd think it would be worse if after 3 you had to go to each rides' location to see if additional FPs were available.

Or are you saying it's worse than allowing you to use smartphone?

It would take a lot to offset having people in front of you making decisions about which attraction and what time to select. With legacy FP you didn't get in line unless you liked what you saw on the sigh. Then you just put in the ticket and took what it spit out.

And besides, you could previously check FP distribution times and availability on an app so you didn't have to head over to that part of the park unless you liked what you saw there.

 

[Cals dad]

I do hope they plan on eventually allowing the extra selections to be done through the app. The kiosk lines are already long without over half the people already making plans before entering. Now everyone is to get in these lines to make an additional selection, and they have to do it over and over every time they can/want to get another one? So, in order to not stand in a line at a ride, I have to stand in line to get a fastpass? How does this make any sense?

 

[DisDayz]

April 25th. This is what is already gone.. not sure that the 4th. fast pass is going to help much at all.

9:45 am Toy Story Mania FPP gone
9:55 am Test Track FPP gone however back up at 10:10 and gone again at 10:20
9:55 am Splash Mountain FPP gone
10:00 am Soarin FPPgone
10:04 am Rocking Roller Coaster FPP gone
10:12 am Mission Space FPP gone
10:25 am Big Thunder Mountain FPP gone
10:25 am Peter Pan FPP gone
10:40 am Space Mountain FPP gone
10:40 am Tower of Terror FPP gone
10:42 am Safari FPP gone

I get that it honestly stinks FPP is gone for these attractions early but I think there are really two big problems. First, the increased visibility that the new system brings is pushing more people to use Fast Pass Plus, making running out a self-fulfilling prophecy. I liken it to tickets to college football games here in Knoxville. During good years people expect tickets to sell out to basically every game. Because they expect sell outs, they buy tickets early, increasing demand and reducing supply. As people see the games selling out (simply because people are buying early) they jump on the wagon and start buying to assure they get something. Soon the game is a sell out simply because people expected it to sell out. This same phenomenon is causing Fast Pass Plus to run out earlier as well. People really want to ride Toy Story Mania and are afraid Fast Pass Plus will run out so they take whatever they can get when it becomes available, causing them to run out.

Second, the increased visibility also puts the fact that Fast Pass Plus is used up for certain attractions right in front of all of us where in the past you had to be there to see it. For instance, I just went through previous threads on Fast Pass return times. There are many threads about Toy Story Mania fast passes and many of them talk about Fast Passes being gone for the day by 10:00 am or, if Fast Passes remained they were for late in the evening. Some even talk about "we went at rope drop, rode once and by the time we got off the ride there were no more Fast Passes." Similar threads exist for Soarin' where the return times were 8:00 pm or later by 10:00 am. Test Track during busy times wasn't much different and the general consensus was that Splash Mountain Fast Passes would be gone by late morning on hot days. Kilimanjaro Safari always went fast as many planned on grabbing fast passes early in the morning for afternoon rides. I recall that typical return times were late afternoon by about 10:00 am to 11:00 am.

So, I don't know that the times we are running out of fast passes has shifted dramatically (admittedly it has shifted some). It seems that over the past years the fact was hidden from us whereas now it hits us right in the face anytime we get on a mobile app.

 

[erose]

Well.... My vacation starts Monday, so I'll literally be one of the first guinea pigs trying this whole extra FP thing out!!

I've gone the way of prescheduling most of my FP+ in the morning to get my priorities done and then the afternoon and evening allows for park hopping as the mood strikes. That's generally how I toured in the past, so I don't really have much to gripe about, yet, as this is the first time we're using FP+ (well, that's not really true either, we were there for 36 hrs after thanksgiving, so being able to preschedule priorities were key.. plus legacy FP still worked with old KTTW cards, but enough about that)

I'll be interested in seeing what is available and how the whole "next extra FP" will work. Like if I'm done with my first 3 at MK and decide to head to EPCOT, can I book from a MK kiosk something at EPCOT, or do I have to wait until I get over there. I haven't dealt with the kiosks at all as we did things via MDE app last time around.

All in all... this is gonna be interesting.

Of course you'll be reporting back to all of us how it goes as soon as you can!?! Right??

 

[mickeygirl78]

Do they have FP+ windows during extra magic hours?

 

[OtherScott]

It would take a lot to offset having people in front of you making decisions about which attraction and what time to select. With legacy FP you didn't get in line unless you liked what you saw on the sigh. Then you just put in the ticket and took what it spit out.

And besides, you could previously check FP distribution times and availability on an app so you didn't have to head over to that part of the park unless you liked what you saw there.

"A lot" is relative, just like "somewhat." Burning your 3rd FP on Space Mountain and using app to find BTMRR has FPs available still required you to go to BTMRR to pull it - assuming it was still available after the walk. Going from Buzz to SM, not so much.

If you use the platforms Disney has provided (smartphone, computer) to pre-book and make changes, the only thing you have to do at a kiosk is book additional FPs. Kiosks are located throughout the parks and guest will exhaust their 3rd FPs at staggered times. The same app available now can be utilized by guests to decide if it's even worth going to a kiosk to try for 4th FP.

Aside from other problems guests may have with FP+, I just don't see this as being much of one.

 

[CarolinaBlue]

Do they have FP+ windows during extra magic hours?

I hope not.

 

[mickeygirl78]

I hope not.

I hope not too! Just calculating that into my strategy for what FP selections I make.

 

[GeorgiaHoo]

What this change ultimately will accompish is to make the standby lines longer later in the day for rides that didn't have them. No more walking on to Pirates or Haunted Mansion at 8PM.

Of course, I could be completely wrong. Will be there next week when it is supposed to be relatively slow and will be able to find out if that is the case.

 

[Love Tink]

Tiering isn't a given, unless I missed something?

Dan

What you are missing is "Math."

Or, alternately, "Logic."

 

[Love Tink]

What this change ultimately will accompish is to make the standby lines longer later in the day for rides that didn't have them. No more walking on to Pirates or Haunted Mansion at 8PM.

That - in my opinion (I haven't seen an official announcement) - is exactly what it will do. Which is why this announcement doesn't seem like great news to me.

Basically, this is extending one of the biggest problems of FP+, which is that now there are FP lanes in so many rides where they didn't used to be. Now they are increasing the number of FP they are giving out for all those secondary rides.

So, FP has blown up touring strategies in these ways:

Rope drop diminished, because people are in the FP lane at 9:00am
Tiers and one-and-done limits on the FP you can reserve
FP lines are longer because of the higher usage
Secondary rides have longer lines because they are now part of the FP system

This change really doesn't help any of those problems, in fact it exacerbates them. I can appreciate that an effort is being made to improve the experience, but I don't think this will do it.

 

[DisneyFive]

What you are missing is "Math."

Or, alternately, "Logic."

No, I'm not missing it. I fully understand the math and logic. What I'm saying is that I'm upset that FP+ has caused this decision to tier these attractions. My point is, FP+ has taken away the ability to FP my two favorite attractions on the same day at both EP and HS. (things I used to do before with paper FP) If they didn't have tiering, I don't think I'd have any complaints about FP+.

Technically, tiering isn’t necessary for FP+ to function. It’s a choice that Disney made. Clearly they felt that there would be less guest frustration, and more revenue/benefits with tiering than without.

OP, sorry for the off-topic discussion re. tiering...

Dan

 

[mom2rtk]

That - in my opinion (I haven't seen an official announcement) - is exactly what it will do. Which is why this announcement doesn't seem like great news to me.

Basically, this is extending one of the biggest problems of FP+, which is that now there are FP lanes in so many rides where they didn't used to be. Now they are increasing the number of FP they are giving out for all those secondary rides.

So, FP has blown up touring strategies in these ways:

Rope drop diminished, because people are in the FP lane at 9:00am
Tiers and one-and-done limits on the FP you can reserve
FP lines are longer because of the higher usage
Secondary rides have longer lines because they are now part of the FP system

This change really doesn't help any of those problems, in fact it exacerbates them. I can appreciate that an effort is being made to improve the experience, but I don't think this will do it.

But you can sleep in and ride TSMM now!

Oops...... broke my own rule.

 

[morethananyonex]

No, I'm not missing it. I fully understand the math and logic. What I'm saying is that I'm upset that FP+ has caused this decision to tier these attractions. My point is, FP+ has taken away the ability to FP my two favorite attractions on the same day at both EP and HS. (things I used to do before with paper FP) If they didn't have tiering, I don't think I'd have any complaints about FP+.

Technically, tiering isn’t necessary for FP+ to function. It’s a choice that Disney made. Clearly they felt that there would be less guest frustration, and more revenue/benefits with tiering than without.

Dan

Trust me, you are preaching to the choir when you're talking about your feelings on the tiers. Many, many of us agree with you, even people who do overall like FP+.

Tiering is necessary for FP+ to function in the way Disney wants it to. And that's what counts. That's why it's not going anywhere until those parks see significant expansion.

 

[OtherScott]

So, I don't know that the times we are running out of fast passes has shifted dramatically (admittedly it has shifted some). It seems that over the past years the fact was hidden from us whereas now it hits us right in the face anytime we get on a mobile app.

For years the response to complaints on these boards about FPs running out was that one had to do their research, get in early and use an effective touring strategy. Those who couldn't/wouldn't make RD were characterized as "choosing to sleep in" or other such throwaways.

While probably earnestly given on a personal level, this was always hollow advice in the sense that this strategy relied (knowingly or unknowingly) on the fact that only 50% of guests were even using FP. It was cost-free advice from the giver because there was no way overall use would rise enough to affect one's personal usage. "What's a couple more hypers*, right?"

Had this "do research, arrive early, tour effectively" advice resulted in 90% of guests adopting and using it, the result would have been similar to FP+.

Disney developed a mechanism to put this advice into practice across a broad group - more broadly than some would like.



* not everyone who uses an effective touring plan is a hyper-planner.

 

[PlutoMars]

For years the response to complaints on these boards about FPs running out was that one had to do their research, get in early and use an effective touring strategy. Those who couldn't/wouldn't make RD were characterized as "choosing to sleep in" or other such throwaways.

While probably earnestly given on a personal level, this was always hollow advice in the sense that this strategy relied (knowingly or unknowingly) on the fact that only 50% of guests were even using FP. It was cost-free advice from the giver because there was no way overall use would rise enough to affect one's personal usage. "What's a couple more hypers*, right?"

Had this "do research, arrive early, tour effectively" advice resulted in 90% of guests adopting and using it, the result would have been similar to FP+.

Disney developed a mechanism to put this advice into practice across a broad group - more broadly than some would like.



* not everyone who uses an effective touring plan is a hyper-planner.

Very much true. If FP- usage was a much higher percentage in the past, many of the same complaints that you are hearing now would have been voiced earlier.

People benefited from people's ignorance, willful or otherwise, of the FP- system.

 

[TNDisneyNut]

I'm not complaining, but this just turns FP+ into regular FP. Ride a ride, get a fastpass. Only difference is being able to pre-book 3 fastpasses.

Disney may as well have just kept the old system in place, LOL.

But you DO get to book 3 in advance, which to me is just awesome! I've never been a FP commando, so this works for our family. We go during low crowd periods and have never used more than 3. At least I feel like Disney is listening to the people who were unhappy and trying to make some changes. Let's hope it keeps evolving and getting better!