Gay Days 2015 - Help me a Dad Out

[ChloeH]

Deleted because I didn't want to accidentally offend anyone.

 

[MrsAyres]

PLEASE DELETE THREAD - ITS ASSANINE

It's spelled "asinine".

This is my first post. Sorry I don't know all the initials yet.

When I came across the title of this thread, I bristled. I thought, "Oh, man. Here we go." It still has ended up a little "Oh man. Here we go.", but not the way I thought it would.

Just wanted to say I am truly, truly touched by the support of the LGBT community on these boards. Though things got highly contentious on this thread, I think it was mostly in service of the idea that LGBT people deserve respect and acceptance. And that's great!

Hey, OP! I thought your first post of questions was super-reasonable! I also thought a lot of people's responses were super-reasonable! I think you got a lot of great advice on what to say JUST IN CASE your kids ask questions about why two dudes are holding hands or kissing or whatever. That advice wasn't there to upset you; it was there to help make your trip great! And I hope your trip turns out great. I haven't been to Gay Days, so I don't know what it's like personally. But I do know that the more gay people you encounter and see and deal with in your life, the more you realize that people are people, and the answers to those tough questions are easier when you're thinking about a human being than an abstract concept.

Anyway, have an AMAZING trip, OP! I suspect that the worst thing that happens is that you're extra-surrounded by kind people who love each other...in red. And it was really nice to see (other than the "women who kiss each other don't exist because those aren't our values" person) that most of the responses, whether heated or measured, overwhelmingly were in the spirit of inclusiveness and personal liberty. And love! And geez, can you think of anything more Disney?

Saturday marks three months until my week-long November trip to WDW with my partner. Animal Kingdom Lodge! I can't wait. We'll probably hold hands looking over the savannah. I mean, how could you not?

-M

It'd be great if it was! But that's not reality. Things like Black History Month and Gay Pride (and Gay Days) exist to lend visibility to groups that have historically been underrepresented and marginalized. Saying there should be hetero days and white history months assumes there's a level playing field. There isn't.

One day, these special gatherings and distinctions won't be necessary. But as long as people are discriminated against for the color of their skin or who they love, we will have these things to give a face and voice to our struggles and victories.

And one day, threads like this will be unnecessary. And even though by that time we'll probably be wearing sun-suits while fighting aliens, it'll be a good day.

again!

I apologize... it was not intended the way that many have taken it. Notwithstanding, to paraphrase Dumbledore, if you are waiting for universal approval it will unfortunately never happen. People have biases no matter... correct or not... that's simply part of human nature.

BTW - Dumbledore, gay. I'm just saying.

 

[Luvchefmic]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maleficent Dragon View Post
I believe the biggest point of difference is that those of us who hold to conservative/Biblical values do not believe anybody is born homosexual. We believe it is choice and free will.

Tolerance goes both ways this isn't appropriate either.

 

[AnOtHeRdIsNeYfReAk]

I believe the biggest point of difference is that those of us who hold to conservative/Biblical values do not believe anybody is born homosexual. We believe it is choice and free will.

Anyone with this belief probably hasn't had an actual conversation with someone who is LGBTQ. No one wants to be "different". My friend was forced to "pray away the gay" as a teenager when his parents suspected he was gay. He wanted to be straight, but could not ignore the fact that he wasn't interested in women. They eventually kicked him out as an 18 year old and still at 32 have nothing to do with him. He definitely would not have "chosen" being gay over losing everything.

It is like saying a straight person chooses to be attracted to the opposite sex. No one chooses who they are attracted to. Its just part of who we are as humans.

 

[Missyrose]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maleficent Dragon View Post
I believe the biggest point of difference is that those of us who hold to conservative/Biblical values do not believe anybody is born homosexual. We believe it is choice and free will.


Tolerance goes both ways this isn't appropriate either.

It's also inappropriate to be quiet and tolerate intolerance such as people claiming that being gay is a choice and a lifestyle.

 

[Luvchefmic]

It's also inappropriate to be quiet and tolerate intolerance such as people claiming that being gay is a choice and a lifestyle.

The poster stated what she believed based on her faith. No one has to agree with her feelings but a dismissive eye roll is just as belittling.

If someone posted :" I am gay and I have known it since I was a child" and that same poster said nothing except posted that same eye roll, people would have been all over that poster.

What's needed is respect all around for everyone.

 

[LaurenT]

This is my first post. Sorry I don't know all the initials yet.

When I came across the title of this thread, I bristled. I thought, "Oh, man. Here we go." It still has ended up a little "Oh man. Here we go.", but not the way I thought it would.

Just wanted to say I am truly, truly touched by the support of the LGBT community on these boards. Though things got highly contentious on this thread, I think it was mostly in service of the idea that LGBT people deserve respect and acceptance. And that's great!

Hey, OP! I thought your first post of questions was super-reasonable! I also thought a lot of people's responses were super-reasonable! I think you got a lot of great advice on what to say JUST IN CASE your kids ask questions about why two dudes are holding hands or kissing or whatever. That advice wasn't there to upset you; it was there to help make your trip great! And I hope your trip turns out great. I haven't been to Gay Days, so I don't know what it's like personally. But I do know that the more gay people you encounter and see and deal with in your life, the more you realize that people are people, and the answers to those tough questions are easier when you're thinking about a human being than an abstract concept.

Anyway, have an AMAZING trip, OP! I suspect that the worst thing that happens is that you're extra-surrounded by kind people who love each other...in red. And it was really nice to see (other than the "women who kiss each other don't exist because those aren't our values" person) that most of the responses, whether heated or measured, overwhelmingly were in the spirit of inclusiveness and personal liberty. And love! And geez, can you think of anything more Disney?

Saturday marks three months until my week-long November trip to WDW with my partner. Animal Kingdom Lodge! I can't wait. We'll probably hold hands looking over the savannah. I mean, how could you not?

-M

Welcome! I love AKL! We're leaving in 9 days!! Are you staying Jambo or Kidani? On the Kidani savannah, be on the look out for the poor lonely waterbuck who always tries to hang out with the zebras who don't want him around. I know waterbuck stink, but I just want to take him home...

 

[LaurenT]

I'll give the OP the benefit of the doubt although as a gay man, it is insulting to think they could possibly believe that Gay Days at Disney could be like New Orleans Mardi Gras.

Which reminds me of a story that happened to me this year at Gay Days 2014. I normally arrive the weekend before so I can do Disney and Universal at my own pace before friends come to town mid-week. I got a great deal at POFQ so I had 5 nights there before changing hotels for gay days events. On Monday June 2nd, I took the boat to Downtown Disney to see a late showing of Maleficent. When it was over, my only option was to take the DD bus back. At that time, the bus was being shared with Riverside. About 12 people got on. I sat in the upper section in the back next to the door if you know Disney buses. There were a few people in the lower section including a couple of kids. Two heterosexual couples, middle aged at that, sat up in the back section with me. Against the back wall.

They were drunk beyond belief. Being very loud and using very salty language if you will. You could hear sloppy kissing going on in the dark. The bus went to Riverside first. When we arrived at the first bus stop, the lights came on. The 2 couples in the back with me must not have known that would happen. One of the women, approximately late 40's early 50s mind you, had her hand up the cargo shorts of one of the gentlemen. He... how can I say this... seemed very happy about this. They all broke into hysterics with the lights came on. There was a little girl sitting across from the mid section door. Maybe 9 years old. Her mother looking at a smart phone oblivious. Not sure if the girl saw anything. The 2 couples probably didn't care. Everyone had gotten off the bus by the 4th Riverside stop except me and the 2 couples. At the last Riverside stop, they staggered off the bus. One of the women asked me if I wanted to go swimming. I said, kinda sarcastically, that I didn't have my swim trunks. She yelled "F*** swim trunks! We're going skinny dipping!"

Not sure what kind of debauchery happened at the Riverside pool later after that but I can tell you from attending Gay Days Disneyland 6 times and Gay Days WDW 3 times, I have never seen such inappropriate behavior at Disney. Us gays are way more clever than that and usually at worse resort to tees with double entendres if anything. So before believing rumors that a gathering of gays is going to be like drunken New Orleans Mardi Gras, just remember it's straight people that give Mardi Gras it's reputation and on any given day, there are way more straight people on Disney property that have the chance to be drunk and act the fool than gay ones.

Wow! As i've said, I'm not a fan of extreme PDA no matter what the gender combination - those people need a 12 step program.
But i will disagree that it's always the straight people causing the problem. I have gay and straight friends - both can be equally inappropriate at times. There was a young couple trying to swallow each others tongues (straight couple) at another theme park once - that made me pretty uncomfortable - but I've been to disney a few dozen times and have never felt awkward there...

 

[Southern Bell]

I have been to Disney during gay days, yrs ago when it first started. If you are asking if I noticed , the answer is no. LOL! But my daughter did, about 10 yrs old at the time. Don't quote me on this, it may not be exact, but...The event has grown from about 3,000 to 150,000. So... you would have to be blind, like me, to not notice! LOL! At least the red shirts! LOL! She noticed and asked why some men were holding hands, I think I did answer because they love each other and that was that. Afterwards I noticed one man dressed in short black leather hot pants! Don't know if that defined him as gay or not, but.. either case he did not look good in his hot pants! LOL! We never saw any behavior from teens or adults, gay or straight, as being inappropriate. We did begin to notice a lot of red shirts, (which my husband was wearing) so we could find him. LOL! Other than that one brief moment (of my daughters question)it was just a normal day at Disney, single people and families (gay or straight) just doing Disney . We never gave it another thought until we got back to our camper and heard on news that it was gay day at Disney and they all wore red shirts. LOL!

I wanted to add, My husband is very cute, even if he is mine, and usually walks ahead of the pack leading the way, and he was never approached or bothered by anyone! LOL!

 

[20yBWDW]

I am liberal. My children know men can love and marry men and women can love and marry women. I have no problems having them around families different from ours. I would still ask questions before taking them to any event with a theme based on sexuality because I am not ready for sexuality to be an issue for them.

 

[Maleficent Dragon]

Anyone with this belief probably hasn't had an actual conversation with someone who is LGBTQ. No one wants to be "different".

And that is where you would be wrong. My oldest brother is gay, was married to his wife for 8 years before choosing to go in a different direction. My co-worker and sweet friend was married to her husband for 4 years before choosing to leave him for a woman. Both have told me why they chose a same sex partner and left their spouses. Neither one of them believe they were born gay.

When a person very openly "flaunts" anything about themselves, to the point of demanding attention and recognition, it is most certainly a choice.

I stand firm on Biblical principals/teaching and the authority of what is inspired and written within those 66 books. However, I also believe every person has the right to choose (free will) what they believe and follow and I will respect them and love them even if we do not agree. As I said in an earlier post, we all bleed, hurt, have feelings and desire to be loved.

 

[heartse]

I believe the biggest point of difference is that those of us who hold to conservative/Biblical values do not believe anybody is born homosexual. We believe it is choice and free will. That is the defining line for acceptance of the lifestyle. It doesn't mean that people who disagree with the lifestyle hate people who are gay. We all have feelings, we all hurt, we all bleed, we all need to be loved.

Please don't speak for me. I am a conservative, practicing Catholic, but I do realize that people are born gay. I have had many a friend, particularly in high school or college, that you just knew something was up, but they weren't acknowledging it, for whatever reason - hadn't worked it out for themselves, fear, whatever... but you simply KNEW. I understand that. That said, I do believe that there are some younger that chose it, for however brief a period of time, because they are rebelling against their parents or because they thought it would be cool (not fully understanding the full ramifications and obstacles they would ultimately be confronted with), or maybe they were simply curious. Kinda like the gay person who tries to be straight for various reasons... it goes both ways. In that respect, some do make a choice.

Why in the holy bleeping heck would we choose to be gay? Let me tell you, straight from the horse's mouth: you are wrong. You have been misinformed. If it's a choice, you choose it. Right now. I'm waiting! *taps foot* And please stop calling it 'the lifestyle'. Say what you really mean: gay sex. We're okay and you can like us so long as we remain celibate, right?

In other news: oh my god this thread is still going!

You also don't get to put words in my mouth... When I said/say lifestyle, I don't mean gay sex... couldn't care less what any couple, straight or gay, does in their bedroom. It was an inelegant wording, not realizing it is a loaded word, that I used for shorthand - which I now regret ever bringing into the conversation.

BTW - Dumbledore, gay. I'm just saying.

I already knew that, and I should care because?!?! I still love Dumbledore.

The poster stated what she believed based on her faith. No one has to agree with her feelings but a dismissive eye roll is just as belittling.

If someone posted :" I am gay and I have known it since I was a child" and that same poster said nothing except posted that same eye roll, people would have been all over that poster.

What's needed is respect all around for everyone.

This!

But i will disagree that it's always the straight people causing the problem. I have gay and straight friends - both can be equally inappropriate at times. There was a young couple trying to swallow each others tongues (straight couple) at another theme park once - that made me pretty uncomfortable - but I've been to disney a few dozen times and have never felt awkward there...

This!

 

[lizzi6692]

The poster stated what she believed based on her faith. No one has to agree with her feelings but a dismissive eye roll is just as belittling. If someone posted :" I am gay and I have known it since I was a child" and that same poster said nothing except posted that same eye roll, people would have been all over that poster. What's needed is respect all around for everyone.

Since science is well on it's way to disproving her faith, an eye roll is appropriate. Somebody can believe the sky is green, that doesn't mean I need to respect it if it's not true.

 

[Maleficent Dragon]

The poster stated what she believed based on her faith. No one has to agree with her feelings but a dismissive eye roll is just as belittling.

If someone posted :" I am gay and I have known it since I was a child" and that same poster said nothing except posted that same eye roll, people would have been all over that poster.

What's needed is respect all around for everyone.

Thank you, Luvchefmic, but I truly am not offended nor do I feel belittled. Respect tends to go only 1 way when a person does not support the LGBT group.

 

[Maleficent Dragon]

Since science is well on it's way to disproving her faith

Haha! Now THAT is funny!

 

[Luvchefmic]

Haha! Now THAT is funny!

 

[lizzi6692]

Haha! Now THAT is funny!

Laugh all you want, it doesn't change the fact that scientists are working very hard(and getting very close) to completely disproving your antiquated belief that being gay is a choice.

 

[JoshuaShaw]

Why in the holy bleeping heck would we choose to be gay?

Duh. For the sweet parades.

 

[Luvchefmic]

moving on

 

[FLchick415]

I've really TRIED to stay out of this conversation, but I can't anymore.

Nobody CHOOSES to be gay. Just like nobody CHOOSES to be straight. Just because someone was married to a person of the opposite sex and then left them for a person of the same sex, doesn't mean they CHOSE it. They could have been in denial for many years, trying to live the "lifestyle" society says they should live. But there comes a time when you can't deny who you are anymore and you have to start living for yourself and not for other people. Do you really think anyone would CHOOSE to be ridiculed and hated and looked down on? I have an aunt that is gay. She dated boys when she was younger, because my grandparents are very conservative, but she always knew. It was never a CHOICE.