Gator grabs 2 year old at Grand Floridian?

[mshanson3121]

Disney did nothing is not a truthful statement. They tell you in your vacation package planning that there is no swimming in any of the Lakes and that they are for boating activities only, If you don't take the time to read the information that is not Disney's fault that you created your own liability and it is says that there are dangerous things in the water ways like Alligators. They make it very clear that swimming is permitted at pools and in the water park only.

Telling me not to swim in the Lagoon is not even close to the same thing as telling me that there are alligators on their property, and listing out the precautions we should take such as a) not feeding them b) not approaching the waters edge at the evening c) not even stepping foot in the water.

Also, not everyone books their trip through Disney. It's their job to protect those people as well.

 

[MC0810]

This is so very tragic. I ABSOLUTELY think Disney should have Beware of Alligator Signs up. I don't blame disney for this freak accident but I do think Beware of Gator signs should be up in these areas. My heart aches for this family who were on their dream vacation. This family is from Nebraska, where there are NO gators. People need to stop assuming everyone is educated about Alligators in Florida. and to the user that said "They tell you in your vacation package planning" about the gators...do you think thats ENOUGH on Disneys part to warn people about the potential risk of Gators on their beaches??? Seriously??? do you really assume everyone has seen this vacation pack planning info?

 

[rteetz]

Except for that time it happened before... though granted it was 30 years ago and the child survived. And then, as someone else said, that time that a guest was chased by an alligator. Or the time at the MK the alligator came right onto shore. Or the fact that there are roughly a dozen attacks in Florida every year (though only an average of 5 need medical attention). So basically, no one has died before. But they have attacked before, and they have approached guests before. I realize it's not exactly high numbers, but... Disney was burying their heads in the sand, if they honestly thought it wouldn't happen at some point, knowing that the population is getting larger, and they're becoming more of a problem (more frequent in numbers) on their property.

You also didn't have media like you do today then. All sorts of news reporters are in Orlando right now and this story has only gotten bigger because of that.

Disney has felt that their plans have been working so far and to an extent they have really.

Like I have said Disney finds and captures alligators all of the time. You can't capture every single one though.

The MK alligator was also captured as far as I know. You can't prevent an alligator from going into fresh water in Florida.

 

[Ego831]

I know it is early - but I ABSOLUTELY find unacceptable that I am finding out that there are alligators in all the waters around Disney World and they do not regularly trap, kill or find some why to keep them away from guest areas. This is ABSOLUTELY the responsibility of Disney to manage this better. Even if they have to put underwater or above water fences that would keep alligators from reaching the shore. AND you also have people on jet skis and boats in the lagoon?!?!?!!

I have assumed all along that Disney either had put up some barriers (these are "man made lakes" after all) or regularly patrolled to capture and remove these animals! How can you have an environment where you have small children, events like movies on the beach that bring in crowds and then have such a danger???

I think this is ABSOLUTELY UNACCEPTABLE. I have not seen the signs myself - and do not know if they say DANGER ALLIGATORS or just NO SWIMMING?!?!?! But don't have the lakes and water ways if you cannot provide a minimal amount of safety....especially with children that no matter how much you tell them and watch them and sit over them - they may still not listen....

We regularly stay at the Boardwalk and there are several beaches around there - are you saying that if I am sitting on a lounge chair and my 4 year old is playing in the sand by the shore - and not even in the water - I should be worried about an alligator coming out and dragging him away at Disney World!?!?!? ARE YOU KIDDING ME!?!?!

My heart really goes out to the family and really wish them the best through all of this!!!!!! I cannot IMAGINE! The definition of a tragedy!

 

[mshanson3121]

You also didn't have media like you do today then. All sorts of news reporters are in Orlando right now and this story has only gotten bigger because of that.

Disney has felt that their plans have been working so far and to an extent they have really.

Like I have said Disney finds and captures alligators all of the time. You can't capture every single one though.

The MK alligator was also captured as far as I know. You can't prevent an alligator from going into fresh water in Florida.

No. You can't. But everything you just said, only stresses the importance of proper signage and guest education.

 

[mshanson3121]

I know it is early - but I ABSOLUTELY find unacceptable that I am finding out that there are alligators in all the waters around Disney World and they do not regularly trap, kill or find some why to keep them away from guest areas. This is ABSOLUTELY the responsibility of Disney to manage this better. Even if they have to put underwater or above water fences that would keep alligators from reaching the shore. AND you also have people on jet skis and boats in the lagoon?!?!?!!

I have assumed all along that Disney either had put up some barriers (these are "man made lakes" after all) or regularly patrolled to capture and remove these animals! How can you have an environment where you have small children, events like movies on the beach that bring in crowds and then have such a danger???

I think this is ABSOLUTELY UNACCEPTABLE. I have not seen the signs myself - and do not know if they say DANGER ALLIGATORS or just NO SWIMMING?!?!?! But don't have the lakes and water ways if you cannot provide a minimal amount of safety....especially with children that no matter how much you tell them and watch them and sit over them - they may still not listen....

We regularly stay at the Boardwalk and there are several beaches around there - are you saying that if I am sitting on a lounge chair and my 4 year old is playing in the sand by the shore - and not even in the water - I should be worried about an alligator coming out and dragging him away at Disney World!?!?!? ARE YOU KIDDING ME!?!?!

My heart really goes out to the family and really wish them the best through all of this!!!!!! I cannot IMAGINE! The definition of a tragedy!

They do regularly trap them. But no, there are no barriers etc... Alligators can walk on land, and can find access into the waters. But I definitely agree that they is not proper signage and guest education, is unacceptable, and hopefully will change in the very near future.

 

[wewiii]

We stayed at Fort Wilderness from June 1-11. One of the first nights there after leaving the MK, we decided to watch the fireworks on that beach at Fort Wilderness. After we got there, I left to go buy something at the general store.
I left my wife and four girls (4,6,8,10) there on that dark beach where the lawn chairs were. They knew not to go in…but it would not have surprised me if one of them had walked in to just get their feet wet.
The bugs were so bad that by the time I was coming back, the girls were already packed up and heading back.
But if there are multiple alligators around The Grand Floridian, then no telling what was out and around us back there.
The stuff of nightmares.
I hate to say it, but I will never be able to think about that trip without what just happened.
Every time we would approach the lake, whether it was to go to the Magic Kingdom, or somewhere to eat, in the back of my mind I would think about the alligators and how Disney must constantly patrol and clean out. I would think that with as many people in that area with small children, they couldn’t possibly afford to have one in there. But it is Central Florida…

 

[ChipnDale79]

I know it is early - but I ABSOLUTELY find unacceptable that I am finding out that there are alligators in all the waters around Disney World and they do not regularly trap, kill or find some why to keep them away from guest areas. This is ABSOLUTELY the responsibility of Disney to manage this better. Even if they have to put underwater or above water fences that would keep alligators from reaching the shore. AND you also have people on jet skis and boats in the lagoon?!?!?!!

I have assumed all along that Disney either had put up some barriers (these are "man made lakes" after all) or regularly patrolled to capture and remove these animals! How can you have an environment where you have small children, events like movies on the beach that bring in crowds and then have such a danger???

I think this is ABSOLUTELY UNACCEPTABLE. I have not seen the signs myself - and do not know if they say DANGER ALLIGATORS or just NO SWIMMING?!?!?! But don't have the lakes and water ways if you cannot provide a minimal amount of safety....especially with children that no matter how much you tell them and watch them and sit over them - they may still not listen....

We regularly stay at the Boardwalk and there are several beaches around there - are you saying that if I am sitting on a lounge chair and my 4 year old is playing in the sand by the shore - and not even in the water - I should be worried about an alligator coming out and dragging him away at Disney World!?!?!? ARE YOU KIDDING ME!?!?!

My heart really goes out to the family and really wish them the best through all of this!!!!!! I cannot IMAGINE! The definition of a tragedy!

So i listened to the press conference today, the Florida wildlife control said disney has full time staff members that do just that, remove gators that need to be removed. They do look for them.

You need to remember that disney has been in business for 45 years in Florida and this has never happened before.

Just because you're at Disney does not mean things can't happen to you, you should be aware of your surroundings at all times and understand that a body of water in the state of FL, most likely does have gators in them.

 

[Maleffiecent41]

I am saying it is your responsibility as a parent to educate yourself. A gator can't drown you with a life jacket on. Parents have a responsibility to educate themselves about what's around them. Alligators are pretty much in every body of water in Florida.

I have seen time and time again how many people ignoring warning signs. You are not going to be able to prevent alligators even with fencing.

 

[KStash]

I can't get over the people who think that a sign that says "no swimming" means they could wade in the water.

Even if I had no clue that alligators were in that lake, if I saw a "no swimming" sign, I would assume that meant that I was not to put my body into that water. Not my feet, not my hands, not a wisp of hair. For all I know, that "no swimming" sign is up because the lake is highly polluted, why the heck would I want to go in it? Maybe it's because I'm from NJ (where unfortunately, many of our fresh water habitats are polluted) or because I'm a city girl and have never swam in a lake in my life, but wading and swimming are the same thing.

That being said, I feel incredibly bad for the poor child and his family. This is a complete nightmare, and I do hope Disney makes their signs a bit scarier so folks don't wade in the water.

But this is not Disney's fault. No swimming means no wading means keep your body parts out of the water.

 

[Liljo22]

something that bugged me last night was I really hope this didn't happen because of pest control cutbacks...

Alligator Trappers are regulated by the state. They do not get paid by the property they remove the gator from. The state pays them and they also receive money from selling the meat and hide.

 

[MC0810]

I am saying it is your responsibility as a parent to educate yourself. A gator can't drown you with a life jacket on. Parents have a responsibility to educate themselves about what's around them. Alligators are pretty much in every body of water in Florida.

I have seen time and time again how many people ignoring warning signs. You are not going to be able to prevent alligators even with fencing.

a gator cant drown you with a life jacket on? really?

 

[Capang]

People check their brains at the door...that's always a problem.

Let me ask you this: if you live on a lake in New York...or California...a river in Arkansas or Pennsylvania...or a waterway or ocean anywhere...

Do you let you 2 year old wade in "maybe just a foot of water" in the pitch black at 9 pm?

Sound reasonable?...even if supervised?

Or do they come out when the lights go down?

How about an unlit swimming pool?

Just asking...what's the difference hear?

Mickey Mouse...lover of all children. That's it.

I live on the water in the Great Lakes. You bet we let our kids in a foot of water at 9pm on summer nights. We held their hands and walked in.
1. 9pm here is not pitch black. It is dusk just after sunset. Still a little light.
2. Up here no wildlife in the lake can kill you. Just last night we went out and put our feet in. We even saw a lake snake swim past. They are not poisonous.

I'm sorry but if Disney can post "pool rules" the likes of this at the Grand Floridian, they have no defense as to why there weren't "beach rules" as well.

They did post beach rules. It said no swimming. Granted, I would bet new signs will appear that state to stay out of water instead of no swimming. The pool is where people are expected to swim so of course they will have several more rules.

What happened is a tragedy and not the norm. My heart breaks for the family and witnesses as well. I don't care if this family was or wasn't following the rules. I'm sure they weren't the first family to do this after swimming was banned. It was just an unthinkable event. Very sad.

 

[mshanson3121]

I am saying it is your responsibility as a parent to educate yourself. A gator can't drown you with a life jacket on. Parents have a responsibility to educate themselves about what's around them. Alligators are pretty much in every body of water in Florida.

I have seen time and time again how many people ignoring warning signs. You are not going to be able to prevent alligators even with fencing.

A gator can still kill a 2 year old with a life jacket on, easily.

 

[mukorasirish]

a gator cant drown you with a life jacket on? really?

No - they can still cause damage but if they can not submerge they let go.

 

[closetmickey]

Perhaps there isn't a system to not allow gators into the lake. i'm clearly not an expert on wildlife management, it sounded reasonable, but perhaps that doesn't exist.

And to some extent, yes, I think the "i didn't know" is a plausible defense here. If Disney knows that there are gators in the lake, which it seems they did, then they should put up signage to warn people. Thats not asking a lot. They shouldn't assume that everyone staying on their property knows that gators are there and can attack people. I did not, and I assume many others do not know this as well. However, Disney knew, so they should have the responsibility to warn people.

Its no difference than every ride being reminded to keep my arms in the car. Why doesn't Disney just assume that people know that they can get injured on a ride? They don't, and instead they remind people every ride. I assume this is because they realize there is a risk of injury, and its cheap to remind people of this. Why not do the same for the lakes?

Agreed. The rules and reminders in print and in voice are ridiculously plentiful at every. single. ride. in the parks. So why are the resorts not held to the same standard. I hope they will be now.

 

[closetmickey]

Disney did nothing is not a truthful statement. They tell you in your vacation package planning that there is no swimming in any of the Lakes and that they are for boating activities only, If you don't take the time to read the information that is not Disney's fault that you created your own liability and it is says that there are dangerous things in the water ways like Alligators. They make it very clear that swimming is permitted at pools and in the water park only.

But "no swimming" is entirely different from what this little one was doing. Especially when coupled with the graphic on all the signs!!

 

[mshanson3121]

Interesting to see their Facebook page is saying nothing about this tragedy at all. No condolences, nothing. But some comments are starting to come in. CNN had an article about the financial aspect, questioning how it may hurt stocks etc...

 

[Val]

I am professor of animal behavior at a major state university....I teach about this stuff. In defense of the alligator- it was just being an alligator and going after "prey". Unfortunately, because it has now attacked a human, this increases the likelihood of it doing this again- thus it must be found and put down. In defense of the parents, "no swimming" doesn't mean "don't even touch the water". Given the proximity of the children's play area to the beach, this will likely be considered an attractive nuisance and Disney will likely settle any lawsuit. Of course, that doesn't bring back that precious little boy. However, the MOST important issue (to me, as an animal behaviorist) is that alligators are losing their natural habitat as the area in and around Disney World becomes increasingly developed (as is the case for most wildlife). This forces the alligators into areas they normally wouldn't inhabit, decreases their natural food resources and, in a way, sets them up for just such an incident. We see this with coyotes, bears, and other predatory animals. Disney could, and should (in my opinion) take the proverbial bull by the horns and 1) teach their visitors about wildlife while gently warning them about the dangers; and 2) plan their future developments with conservation in mind. In the meantime- be careful. There are snakes, alligators, bears, coyotes and many, many other animals out there. It is their home, too. And think of the situation from THEIR perspective: I would eat you, too, if you looked like food in my cupboard (as the child on the beach might have the alligator), or you forced your way into my house/yard (as the snake did to the child simply reaching in to plants to retrieve a toy). This is SO sad and tragic...but events such as this will likely increase until we can find a way to co-exist. And getting rid of alligators will cause an increase in other unwanted animals and upset the whole ecosystem.....now, don't even get me started about the darn pythons that some idiot let loose in the Everglades or people who try and get their pictures taken with the bison out west! Prayers to the family that lost their little boy, and maybe a small prayer for the alligator who was just being an alligator and now will die, too. Too much sadness for the Orlando area this week.

 

[wewiii]

Disney definitely dropped the ball on this. I would bet you money that, after today, they will clean them off the property and away from people. I don't see how they can't at this point.
If I am right, and if they take a proactive approach to ridding them, then it could have been done, it should have been done, yesterday, two weeks ago, twenty years ago.

Can you imagine actually staying at the resort right now? At the GF? It must be horrendous.