Disney Ethics - another WWYD? Thread

[littleblackegg]

I assume that Disney, as a huge, multi billion dollar corporation, has already figured out all the wiggle room on these rules. Even if guests break them, the company will always come out ahead. It's probably to their advantage to let guests think they are getting one over. Then they think they have an extra 20-30 dollars to spend on something else. It's like Vegas rules. The house always wins! I was annoyed by it until I thought about it critically. If Disney was losing a lot of money from the breaking of these rules, they would enforce them. As for what families with small children must do to navigate lines and potties and noise and snacks and nuclear meltdowns? God love them. I will do whatever it takes to help them get back their place in line or on the curb if one needs to dash off to calm one down or take them to the bathroom. Always preferable to remaining in a line with a screaming, unhappy child.

 

[maxiesmom]

Am I the only one taken aback by the fact that a teacher is posting about how they lie and steal during their Disney vacation??

 

[kaytieeldr]

I'm not exactly sure what you are saying here- that all adults should have to rent their own rooms? Eighteen year olds might be able to enter into a contract, but in MANY hotels you must be 21 or older to check it (or be the lead person on the reservation... obviously a 5 year old can technically "check-in" if they are with mom or dad, but one of them must be 21 or older), so it kind-of pokes holes in the thought that hotels are doing you a favor by not requiring other adults to get their own room.

Not should, but can. This thread is about Disney ethics, not hotel ethics. WDW resorts allow anyone 18 or older to agree to the room contract. Where the minimum age is 21, the hotel is protecting itself.

 

[littleblackegg]

Ugh. Also, lying about kid's ages in order to pay less for food or tickets or reservations-yikes. I don't have any kids of my own but I worked with them in several programs. Lying in front of children or asking children to keep a secret or a lie always seems to create a sort of cognitive dissonance. Kids are pretty concrete thinkers up until ten or so. They are pretty black/white in their thinking. If I was worried I would be caught, embarrassed, or had to explain why I told a lie I think the humiliation would keep we away from it. How uncomfortable!

 

[littleblackegg]

I'm pretty sure 90% of park attendees would be glad to let you leave the line. It has nothing to do with having 2 parents. I understand some people have very strong feelings about wanting everyone to stsnd in line the whole time, never, ever, ever leaving. Those people are in the severe minority, and they've probably all posted on this thread. I have never blinked an eyelash at a parent and child, or even a teenager or adult saying they needed to get back to their family from the restroom. I've never seen anyone else upset either. We all know the lines are long. We all know you're supposed to stay hydrated, especially in the summer. So if you're in a 2 hour long line what do you want people to do? I certainly don't want to be the person who gets seated in the ride vehicle after the kid who peed her pants because she didn't want to make her siblings go to the end of the line. I also don't want to be in line with someone who is about to pass out or start vomiting from heat exhaustion because they didn't leave the line and get water. People need to just relax, use a little empathy and understand that sometimes you can't stand in line for hours at a time and not leave. Off these boards, the general public is mostly happy to accommodate you and make the wait doable. If you have an ADR timed such that one family, or even 20 families having a change in line would cause you to miss it, perhaps you need to plan your time differently. Most rides at wdw load a whole lot of people rather quickly. You would need dozens, if not hundreds of people to somehow get ahead of you to push a 5 minute wait to 30 minutes.

Well stated.

 

[littleblackegg]

I have to disagree with you there. Yes seating may be limited but would you go to to Be Our Guest or Le Cellier at dinner time to eat food you brought into the park? Quick Service or not those table are for paying customers. I can not tell you how frustrating it to get food at quick service restaurant and not be able to find a table to sit at because they are filled with guest who packed their own food and are not patrons of the restaurant.

As difficult as it can be to swallow, all four parks allow all guests to use the QS table seating and shade. It is part of their overall plan to prevent/manage guests who allow themselves to get overheated and/or dehydrated. Having a cool place to rest and either have a snack you brought into the park or some water without having to purchase anything is a public health initiative that affects the bottom line. And it works. If there was no place to do this, we would see tons more EMS workers (creating disruption). The whole WDW complex is set up to prevent/manage/swiftly deal with health problems, crime, fires, you name it. What frustrates me at the moment could be part of their prevention plan!

 

[maxiesmom]

As difficult as it can be to swallow, all four parks allow all guests to use the QS table seating and shade. It is part of their overall plan to prevent/manage guests who allow themselves to get overheated and/or dehydrated. Having a cool place to rest and either have a snack you brought into the park or some water without having to purchase anything is a public health initiative that affects the bottom line. And it works. If there was no place to do this, we would see tons more EMS workers (creating disruption). The whole WDW complex is set up to prevent/manage/swiftly deal with health problems, crime, fires, you name it. What frustrates me at the moment could be part of their prevention plan!

I have never seen it stated anywhere that people using the quick service areas for their brought in meals is part of Disney's plan. Having a cool play to rest and have a drink does not equal having your peanut butter and jelly sandwiches, pringles, and grapes.

 

[littleblackegg]

I have never seen it stated anywhere that people using the quick service areas for their brought in meals is part of Disney's plan. Having a cool play to rest and have a drink does not equal having your peanut butter and jelly sandwiches, pringles, and grapes.

I don't think it is a specific. I think it is more about making the areas welcoming so people will be more likely to use them. Sometimes these ideas in a big corporate plan are multifactorial. I'm sure they weren't designed as lunch spots for people who bring their own food. My friend who works in public works in Orange County tells me that Disney is constantly looking for ways to improve the comfort and safety of the parks, use existing structures, and minimize risk. It is so interesting the stuff they do every year!

 

[usd2bmd]

My feeling is that if you need to take a child to the restroom prior to entering the queue, then your party should wait for you while one parent takes care of that child and you should all enter the queue together. The same goes for stragglers. You don't send a runner ahead to mark your place in line in order to beat out one or two families. Your entire party should enter queues together.

If your child has a bathroom "emergency" while in line, then a parent exits the line with that child and takes care of things. The rest of the party can choose to leave the queue as well or continue on to ride the attraction. The parent and child who left the line for the bathroom can either get into the queue when they are done taking care of things or meet their party at the exit and skip the attraction. If it's important to all of you that you ride together, then members of your party who are ahead in the line can wave on everyone behind them until the whole group is once again together. The rest of the world should not be inconvenienced and be expected to move aside and backwards because of you.

I agree with this completely. we should not let you back in to "catch up" with your party if you left the line to do anything. The fact that it doesn't happen all the time tells me that the majority of people agree with me. If you have to go to the bathroom then you go and start over at the end of the line, anything else (IMO) is just rude.

 

[usd2bmd]

Taking a cue from another thread, I thought that I would pose some Disney-related ethical questions. Feel free to add your own. But please be respectful of one another's opinions.

Is it ethical to:

• Lie about your child's age in order to get a cheaper ticket? Or cheaper dining? Or *free* adult dining? Or to avoid paying the extra adult fee for the room? Or to be able to have a 5th person in the room without having to move up a resort level? No
• Have more people in the room than what Disney allows? What if it's a DVC villa that allows more people for DVC members but not for people staying on cash? Again, No. whether it's Fire code or Disney's way of maximizing profits I don't know and don't really care. If they tell me that a room only allows 4 or 5 then that's the way it is. Not to mention a PP stated the rooms are small enough as it is without cramming another person in it.
• To have a phantom person registered in your room in order to get more *free* dining credits? How about more than one phantom? This never made sense to me, paying for someone who isn't there to get extra dining credits/ even if it's free dining, you're paying for it.
• Make throwaway room reservations so that you can book FP+ at 60 days out? Or using a second MDE account for your current reservation so that you can use the MBs from a previous visit to make a second set of 3 FP+ on the day of? I don't have that kind of time
• Take a seat at a QS location but eat the food that you brought into the park? If you don't agree, would it make a difference if the person doing this bought a soda at the QS location? Does it make a difference if the restaurant is crowded and the people who purchased meals there cannot find a seat? The only food we have ever brought in is snacks; granola bars and things like that, which we can eat while walking. We have sat down in one location after some of us got food from other locations, But that is the extent of it.
• Cut the line to meet up with the rest of your party? Does it make a difference whether it's a group of Brazilian teenagers or a mother who took her toddler to the bathroom? No, I think it's rude, no matter the reason,
  
• Purchase one Early Bird Check In on Southwest and then save seats for the rest of your party? What if it's only one other person for whom you are saving a seat? Or two? If you're okay with saving some seats but not a lot, how many is too much? This has never occurred to me. We are flying SW this trip and if we don't check in early enough to be seated together then we just don't sit together. If i was worried about being seated together we would buy it for everyone,
• Save spots at Fantasmic! or a parade for members of your party that haven't arrived yet? What if it's because they were riding another attraction while you saved the spots? Is it a different answer if it's because a parent was taking a child to the restroom or dealing with some other need? What if it's because the family has a child who would become disruptive while waiting, so the parent left with them to keep them distracted until closer to show time so that they didn't negatively impact the people around them? No. But I am usually the only one watching them anyway
  
• Pool hop? Ever? Or only if you're a DVC member and only specific resort pool? What if you have friends/family staying at the resort you're hopping to? the only pool hopping we do is from the quiet pool to the main pool at CBR.
  
• Park at DtD or a resort parking lot in order to avoid paying for parking? What if you have an ADR at the resort? Or if you're an onsite guest but that resort's lot is more convenient (i.e. CR's lot is great for getting out after Wishes or YC/BC lots are great when IllumiNations is done)? Does paying for valet parking make it okay? I don't think this is ever ok either. But that is just me.

I have broken plenty of rules. I speed and do other things I shouldn't But I have not ever done any of these nor would i.

 

[smidgy]

As difficult as it can be to swallow, all four parks allow all guests to use the QS table seating and shade. It is part of their overall plan to prevent/manage guests who allow themselves to get overheated and/or dehydrated. Having a cool place to rest and either have a snack you brought into the park or some water without having to purchase anything is a public health initiative that affects the bottom line. And it works. If there was no place to do this, we would see tons more EMS workers (creating disruption). The whole WDW complex is set up to prevent/manage/swiftly deal with health problems, crime, fires, you name it. What frustrates me at the moment could be part of their prevention plan!

so Disney ditches this "overall plan" to prevent dehydration, etc. during the hot summer months, or hot spring breaks weeks when the CMs only allow those with trays of food to occupy the tables? lol

 

[smidgy]

I agree with this completely. we should not let you back in to "catch up" with your party if you left the line to do anything. The fact that it doesn't happen all the time tells me that the majority of people agree with me. If you have to go to the bathroom then you go and start over at the end of the line, anything else (IMO) is just rude.

so families with little kids should just spend their day waiting in the same line. leaving it to use the bathroom, start over at the end, leave it to use the bathroom, etc etc. how ridiulous.
Itisi wrong for one parent to get in line as a spot saver and the other take the kids to the bathroom and catch up. you all get in the line together. and you make the kids "try" to pee before getting in line.
but, hey, often kids have to go again and just can't hold it! which leads to people letting their kids pee in the bushes in line.
Bathroom emergencies(ow sickness) are instances where I WILL let people REJOIN the line.

 

[littleblackegg]

so Disney ditches this "overall plan" to prevent dehydration, etc. during the hot summer months, or hot spring breaks weeks when the CMs only allow those with trays of food to occupy the tables? lol

My understanding is that Disney does all sorts of stuff to accommodate those who wish to bring in food, and that CM's tell guests with their own food and drinks they can use the QS areas for eating, rehydrating and relaxing. I guess when they decide to change this plan, they will provide another area. Maybe some sort of guest picnic area? Maybe a covered picnic area would serve all of these purposes?

 

[rucifee]

My understanding is that Disney does all sorts of stuff to accommodate those who wish to bring in food, and that CM's tell guests with their own food and drinks they can use the QS areas for eating, rehydrating and relaxing. I guess when they decide to change this plan, they will provide another area. Maybe some sort of guest picnic area? Maybe a covered picnic area would serve all of these purposes?

They weren't allowing people into Pecos Bills just a few hours ago unless they had something they purchased from Pecos or a surrounding restaurant. They were actively telling guests to go buy something if they wanted to sit as they tried to go in the doors.

 

[Debbie]

Until Disney provides a picnic area, then I would say families are free to rest and eat at a quick serve location. I know that I have (gasp!) sat in Pinocchio's to cool down in the throes of summer heat. Would I remain if the restaurant were busy? No. If I were having a paid for drink or dessert? Yes.

To be honest, I don't care to let what others do get my knickers in a knot. I prefer to go and enjoy the magic that being at Disney brings to me. Not in a hurry-especially now that the kids are grown and it is just DH and myself. And if the time comes that I get to go with grandchildren, I hope to remember the lesson I learned the first time I took my 3, 4, and 5 year olds......chill, go slow, immerse yourself in the joy. (it was a hard lesson, but one I learned well )

 

[smidgy]

My understanding is that Disney does all sorts of stuff to accommodate those who wish to bring in food, and that CM's tell guests with their own food and drinks they can use the QS areas for eating, rehydrating and relaxing. I guess when they decide to change this plan, they will provide another area. Maybe some sort of guest picnic area? Maybe a covered picnic area would serve all of these purposes?

then I'm sorry you misunderstand Disney's policy. they do not "kick people out" of the tables and shaded areas of the QS restaurants.. unless it is a busy time.. and then, as a PP witnessed. they direct those with food from the QS restaurants to the tables when they have their food. not only do they not allow people to use the tables with outside food or just to rest, they don't even allow those purchasing food to sit down until they HAVE their food. these are just the facts.

my point was to debunk the "disney's 'overall plan' to keep people well and hydrated theory" to defend using a table at a QS to eat your own picnic lunch.

do I care? not really. unless I have food I purshased and nowhere to sit.. then I care.

It is just DH and me, so we have often asked others walking around with food and nowhere to sit if they would like to join us.

I don't believe Disney has ever had "picnic areas" such as I have seen at other amusement parks ie, rows of picnic tables for just that purpose. you are allowed to bring in your own food, but they would rather you purchase it from them.

 

[brookmey]

I'm going to preface all of this by saying my mom is the type of guest that most people get worked up over. She used to lie about our ages to pay cheaper prices, she would have all 6 of us stay in a hotel room (we used to have to walk in separately so no one would notice), she had us pool hopping, and she was the queen of re-using refillable mugs. Well, back then it was just cups, but she would let us get pop on the first day, then she made us save our cups for the length of our stay and re-use them at our resort. It was so embarrassing as a teenager, being right there as my mom brought out our cups and passed them around. I hated it and I hated having to lie about my age. I was always so uncomfortable and I knew it was wrong, but as a kid, what can you do? So with that...

• Lie about your child's age Not ethical, but I will admit I told DS it was OK to lie about his age if a CM asked so he could ride Barnstormer with his older sister. He was 2 months shy of 7 and he was tall for his age. They wanted to ride it for the bazillionth time and I had already gone 4 times with him. That was enough for me. I explained why to him and told him it was the only time he could pretend he was 7. I had mixed feelings because of my experience as a kid, but it wasn't a lie that was hurting anyone or cheating any system, so I let him go on the ride.
• Have more people in the room than what Disney allows? I personally have not and never will do it, but I do understand why some families do it, so it's not really my business. But I don't see how this could work anymore, with magic bands, ticket packages, Magical Express, etc.
• To have a phantom person registered in your room in order to get more *free* dining credits? I have never heard of this, but no, I don't think it's ethical. I'm assuming people did this during free dining promotions?
• Make throwaway room reservations so that you can book FP+ at 60 days out? I don't think this is unethical, but it's definitely working the system. I won't do it simply because it's too much extra work for me to keep track of everything, but I'm not going to get all worked up over it if other people do.
• Take a seat at a QS location but eat the food that you brought into the park? I don't see this as an ethics question, more of whether or not it's considerate. If it's really busy and you didn't buy anything, not even a drink, then I do think it's inconsiderate to take up a table inside intended for paying customers.
• Cut the line to meet up with the rest of your party? Rejoining a line you left to take your child to the bathroom is fine with me. This past February I took my son by myself, so I was a single parent during that trip. We were in line for Peter Pan and all of a sudden he had to go #2. We had stopped at the bathrooms before we got in line, but he didn't have to go then. When he told me I was like "great, we're going to lose our spot in line." I asked him if he could hold it and he said no. Luckily the family behind us told me they would hold our spot for us so I could take him. I was so grateful. If you've never been in the line and you want to join your group ahead of me, that's not OK. Not really unethical, more like inconsiderate.
  
• Purchase one Early Bird Check In on Southwest and then save seats for the rest of your party? Nope, if it's that important to you, then you need to pay for everyone.
• Save spots at Fantasmic! or a parade for members of your party that haven't arrived yet? Saving spots for a couple of people, that's OK. Saving for 4 or more, that's not.
  
• Pool hop? I really don't care if other people do this. It's not even something I think about or notice when we're at the pool.
  
• Park at DtD or a resort parking lot in order to avoid paying for parking? Like with the pool, I don't really care about what people do. I'm not going to let things like the pool or parking bug me on my trip, so I don't think about whether or not they're ethical.

 

[njpyro]

Just as a side note, as a former child who had parents who chose to sneak me into the parks for free by lying about my age (I was very small), I turned out fine. That experience didn't teach me to lie to my parents or anyone else for that matter. I am a well adjusted adult, don't worry.

 

[maxiesmom]

Just as a side note, as a former child who had parents who chose to sneak me into the parks for free by lying about my age (I was very small), I turned out fine. That experience didn't teach me to lie to my parents or anyone else for that matter. I am a well adjusted adult, don't worry.

That still doesn't excuse them in essence stealing from Disney.

 

[BagOLaughs]

That still doesn't excuse them in essence stealing from Disney.

Wow, harsh