Disney Dining Plan Going Downhill? Your Thoughts???

[emmabemmainc]

I have been many times before the DDP and after--honestly, I didn't notice a difference. Granted, I had not been to any of the signature restaurants until we got the DxDDP, so I can't comment on those places.

However, I did not notice a difference in food quality, in fact, I actually thought some places were better afterwards!

Also--isn't it someone's choice to get the DDP? If you would rather pay out of pocket because you don't like the plan or it "doesn't work for you", then that's fine--but stop complaining about people who like getting the plan.

I think it's great--I love not having to worry about anything except handing over my card--and if you like getting an appetizer and dessert, well--get the DxDDP! It's so simple!

 

[MrsToad]

Some of these have been shared by other posters, but here are some of my random thoughts and opinions:

• It does appear to us (DH & I) that prior to the dining plan, Disney’s table service restaurants offered higher quality menus with more options but that the restaurants, in general, were less full than they are now with the dining plan in place.
  
  
• The dining plan seems to keep more guests eating meals onsite rather than going offsite for some of those meals (of course, Magical Express likely contributes to this, too). This, one would think, is a benefit Disney was hoping for.
  
  
• Over time, and once more guests were dining at the table service restaurants, it has seemed like the menus have been modified to make the most profit from the dining plan model. In addition to lower quality items and fewer entree choices over-all, it does seem like some offerings were standardized. In one small example, Le Cellier discontinued their popular Maple Crème Brulee in favor of a “standard” Vanilla Crème Brulee. When enough diners complained, it was finally brought back as a Vanilla and Maple divided dish of Brulee. When diners still complained, the full maple version was brought back, but without the nice strawberry and maple cookie garnish of the original. In addition to menu items, many of these little touches are disappearing.
  
  
• As others have discussed, in addition to modifying the menus, the dining plan itself has evolved, with the loss of the appetizer, for example. Was it because the plan wasn’t making enough of a profit, or was it because Disney wanted to see how much “the market would bear” without losing dining guests? If the restaurants stay full with fewer components included with the dining plan, what is Disney losing, even with some guests grumbling?
  
  
• In my non-expert opinion, I can’t see the dining plan going away. Some people like a perceived bargain and some like the idea of prepaying. Disney likes knowing the restaurants will be filled. If Disney can keep the restaurants filled with these changes and make a profit, what is their incentive to bring back the more varied menu offerings and special touches?
  
  
• My hope is that a few key restaurant menus will be spared for those who don’t mind paying out of pocket for a wider variety of offerings, but it seems like even “signature" restaurants have seen changes. We don’t do the dining plan, but do purchase the TIW card. Though we are not thrilled with the trend, we have some favorite restaurants that still offer entree choices we enjoy, so we don’t bother to go offsite. For now, we are the kind of guests I think Disney is counting on; we don't like to rent a car and we don't like to take time to travel offsite to dine. While true that if the decline in table service dining goes too far some diners will choose to go offsite, will there be enough diners going elsewhere to give Disney an incentive to change the current trend? I don’t see it.

 

[tiffsix]

We hate the DDP and the food quality has steadily declined over the past 10 years. The food is so mediocre anymore we don't even bother with TS. It's almost like we eat cause we have to but it used to be that we enjoyed the restaurants in Disney World. We got to a couple character meals for the kids' sake but that's it. But like everyone has said, i agree that the DDP isn't going anywhere. Disney now is guaranteed restaurants at capacity

 

[connorlevismom]

WOW! Such harsh words here! It's not up to you to decide what DW does with the DDP or just how much food those on the DDP 'deserve' to get. Or what's 'fair'. The DDP IS available to you and your family. If you don't like paying $30 for a steak at LeCellier- then get the DDP for your family.

These are business decisions that are left to DW to decide- not for you or me or anyone else. We make our DW financial decisions based on what DW offers... your post above almost makes it sound like those on the DDP are stealing food. DW makes the rules here, not those on the DDP. We are just playing by those rules.

I fail to see where my words were "harsh". I was simply responding to the person who acted as if paying $47.99 per night for 2 meals and a snack was the same as someone paying OOP. It's not. Someone paying OOP at a restaurant is probably paying more for that one meal that someone on the DDP pays for an entire days worth of meals. It is as simple as that. I don't know why your getting so defensive about it, and I certainly don't know where you got that I said people on DDP were stealing food.

And DDP does not work for us, we don't eat that much food and would not use most of the meals. Also, we hate making ADR's and prefer to go with the flow on vacation. So it does not work for us.

Kristine

 

[Lindsaygirl27]

I think the food at Disney is exceptionally good. Every signature resturant that I have gone to has far exceeded my expectations. Even the regular TS and CS places are wonderful. And let's not forget to mention the TURKEY LEGS!!!!!

If I do have to make an objective comment it would have to be about Sci- Fi and the San Angel Inn. Both resturants I could care less about going back to. It's a personal opinion and we are all entitled to one! Of course not every resturant or experience is going to be the BEST ....But hey isn't that what life's all about? We live and learn.. I do not think the Disney Dining Plan has ruined the food at WDW.

 

[DaisyLynn]

I hope that this link works:

Le Cellier Dinner Menu 2004

Le Cellier Dinner Menu 2009

Looking at the menu's above, I can easily find something that looks yummy on both — a PP had mentioned something about proof of menu changes, so I just wanted to toss these in there.

We get the DDP because we like not thinking about what we're spending. We normally eat at least two meals a day. We don't typically order dessert when we go out to eat, but we don't do the DDP for dessert. We do it for convenience — it's as simple as that. Fortunate for us, we've yet to have a terrible meal in Disney...we enjoy our meals as much now as we always have.

Also, FWIW, I do not order the most expensive item on the menu to "get my money's worth" - I actually find that assumption a bit offensive. I will agree that while some people do plan their meals to get the most bang for their buck (and I'd never fault anyone for choosing to do that)...I do think that there are a whole lot of people like me and my DH who do the DDP for its convenience.

 

[Andrea73]

The DDP is not free MOST of the time. Most people are paying OOP for it. If the restaurant have had to reduce the quality of their meals, it's an issue with them and Disney. They should re-negotiate their contracts. They don't have to participate in the DDP.

If someone does not want to pay $50 for a steak, they can get the DDP. If not, don't get ticked at those who are getting a deal.

I am sure Disney makes up quite a bit for the expensive meals many adults get with the 10 year olds paying full price for DDP and wanting nuggets and mac n cheese. All the while serving the 3-9 year old crowd cheap junk food. I mean, how expensive is PB&J?

 

[disneymeces]

Personally, we have had pretty good experiences both at 'Ohana and other Disney restaurants. I still feel they do an above average job for mass produced food. As for the Dining Plan, I am personally a fan as I like having my food budget all planned out before we go.

Same here! With a family of 6, I prefer it to be taken care of so I don't have to think, I can just enjoy..And since the DDP started we have only had 1 not so good dinning. But I won't judge...Beats eating at McD's!

 

[sissy_42]

I guess I am somewhat confused about the pricing. Most of the TS restaurant menus I looked at for my next trip it seems most entries were around $18-22. We are eating at Jiko one night and the entries there vary a lot more, from around $28-42. But they are a signature place and we will use 2 DDP credits each. I plan on ordering what I want to eat at each restaurant not what is most expensive. But I would like to know what TS restaurants with $50 steaks for 1TS credit are? I see Le Cellier is more expensive then the places I am going, but again, I picked my ADRs based on where I want to eat, not the price.

 

[MAYNARDS99]

If I'm not mistaken, restaurants make their profit from the sale of alcoholic beverages. For those of us using the free DDP...

When we dine out at Yachtsman and use 4 TS credits, they make their money on the $200 bottle of wine we order.

When we dine at O'hana and use 2 TS credits, they make their money on the $20 in frou-frou drinks we order.

And, so when we eat at Captain Cook's and use 2 QS credits, they make their money on the $15 in beer we order.

Oh, oh, and let's not forget the snacks! Many conveniently located in souvenir shops...

When there is FREE DDP, that leaves funds to buy those alcoholic items, and the "extras" (we tend to always order apps). In addition, I really don't get concerned about leaving food on my plate, or just nibbling on the dessert.

In summation, I feel DDP has not brought dining at DW down, and in my particular case, FREE DDP has enhanced my dining experience.

 

[mkleinbe]

Also, FWIW, I do not order the most expensive item on the menu to "get my money's worth" - I actually find that assumption a bit offensive. I will agree that while some people do plan their meals to get the most bang for their buck (and I'd never fault anyone for choosing to do that)...I do think that there are a whole lot of people like me and my DH who do the DDP for its convenience.

Thank you for saying this so eloquently. I'm the same way, I order what I want, not the most expensive thing. BUT if I want the most expensive thing then it's nice to not have to worry about it with the DDP. At home, when we go out to eat at home we don't normally splurge like we do on vacation (ANY vacation).

I say again, I'm not willing to blame the decline in food quality and service on the DDP. I think it's just a sign of the times all around. I used to LOVE TGIFridays. Won't set foot in the door now. Service is terrible-food is poor any more.

 

[Tiger926]

I hope that this link works:

Le Cellier Dinner Menu 2004

Le Cellier Dinner Menu 2009

Looking at the menu's above, I can easily find something that looks yummy on both — a PP had mentioned something about proof of menu changes, so I just wanted to toss these in there.

We get the DDP because we like not thinking about what we're spending. We normally eat at least two meals a day. We don't typically order dessert when we go out to eat, but we don't do the DDP for dessert. We do it for convenience — it's as simple as that. Fortunate for us, we've yet to have a terrible meal in Disney...we enjoy our meals as much now as we always have.

Also, FWIW, I do not order the most expensive item on the menu to "get my money's worth" - I actually find that assumption a bit offensive. I will agree that while some people do plan their meals to get the most bang for their buck (and I'd never fault anyone for choosing to do that)...I do think that there are a whole lot of people like me and my DH who do the DDP for its convenience.

You are definitely not of the norm. Just read the thousands of threads on this board, or take a listen to the guests around you who have no problems with ordering food they aren't going to eat, ordering desserts to actually throw them away, and guests who order adult meals with kids credits. All of this costs money. Most, and I will say most, order the most expensive items because they want to get the most out of Disney that they can. As I mentioned in one of my earlier posts, when we did the DP, we were encouraged by servers to overorder food. This is the mindset that Disney has set up with guests, as well as staff. They correct this wastage by removing food, adjusting server wages, substituting subpar products, etc. As I stated, I come from an Italian restaurant family, so I can know how and why margins need to be shrinked. Disney knows what that are doing, and they will continue to do so until such time as their profit margins shrink below an acceptable threshold.

I guess I am somewhat confused about the pricing. Most of the TS restaurant menus I looked at for my next trip it seems most entries were around $18-22. We are eating at Jiko one night and the entries there vary a lot more, from around $28-42. But they are a signature place and we will use 2 DDP credits each. I plan on ordering what I want to eat at each restaurant not what is most expensive. But I would like to know what TS restaurants with $50 steaks for 1TS credit are? I see Le Cellier is more expensive then the places I am going, but again, I picked my ADRs based on where I want to eat, not the price.

There are no $50.00 steaks at 1 TS credit restaurants. You cannot take 1 item and use that as your credit total. You need to take that item, the dessert and beverage that goes with it, and add tax, and as was stated, you can definitely get close to $50.00. You then still have a CS meal (entree, dessert and drink), plus snack, so you will be well over the total cost of $41-$46.99 DP cost. So, for guests who are getting the most expensive items, they are usually always going to be over the daily DP cost. Where do you think Disney makes these margins up? There are many ways, as I mentioned above, but the easiest way is to change food products.

Thank you for saying this so eloquently. I'm the same way, I order what I want, not the most expensive thing. BUT if I want the most expensive thing then it's nice to not have to worry about it with the DDP. At home, when we go out to eat at home we don't normally splurge like we do on vacation (ANY vacation).

I say again, I'm not willing to blame the decline in food quality and service on the DDP. I think it's just a sign of the times all around. I used to LOVE TGIFridays. Won't set foot in the door now. Service is terrible-food is poor any more.

Again, I think you are not of the norm. Now, there are a good many people who do this, and Disney makes money this way, just as they do with the people who don't use all of their credits, but the majority of guests, do order the most expensive items. I've eaten in pretty much every restaurant, multiple times, and I can see the wastage that happens, and I can hear the conversations about ordering the most expensive entrees, or desserts that aren't going to be eaten. It's a vicious cycle that Disney has created, and is in total control of - they raise menu prices (which hurts those of us who pay cash) in order to add more value to the DP. Then, they raise the DP, and start all over again. There will be a threshold at some point, but for most families who are packaging their trips up, a few hundred dollars here or there isn't going to be noticed. It is noticed by those of us who pay cash though, and by those of us who have been eating at Disney for years, and who have eaten at every restaurant on property. We have seen a decline in food and service. Is it all attributable to the DP? Probably not...but the nature of that program pretty much guarantees that food and service will suffer at some point as it's a program that heavily relies on the manipulation of numbers, menus, food products, server contracts, etc. as a way of justifying itself.

Tiger

 

[Lindsaygirl27]

If I'm not mistaken, restaurants make their profit from the sale of alcoholic beverages. For those of us using the free DDP...

When we dine out at Yachtsman and use 4 TS credits, they make their money on the $200 bottle of wine we order.

When we dine at O'hana and use 2 TS credits, they make their money on the $20 in frou-frou drinks we order.

And, so when we eat at Captain Cook's and use 2 QS credits, they make their money on the $15 in beer we order.

Oh, oh, and let's not forget the snacks! Many conveniently located in souvenir shops...

When there is FREE DDP, that leaves funds to buy those alcoholic items, and the "extras" (we tend to always order apps). In addition, I really don't get concerned about leaving food on my plate, or just nibbling on the dessert.

In summation, I feel DDP has not brought dining at DW down, and in my particular case, FREE DDP has enhanced my dining experience.

What an excellent point you bring up!!! I 1000% agree with you.

 

[daisygirl902]

This debate always makes me laugh a bit....second only to the DVC complaints that "We don't get free dining..." There are always going to be 2 sides to the story, as these threads teach us time and time again.

I for one, consider myself a foodie - I eat out often, and grew up in a restaurant. I am by no means picky, but I do like good food and great service. While we always have 1 meal in an 8-10 day trip that I am unhappy with (either the service or the food - and btw on my last trip ir WAS Ohana), I normally overall love Disney food and service. There are many GREAT selections....for example on our last trip we ate at Kona - our server Peter was phenomenal (so much so that 8 months later I remember his name). The steak that my fiance got was a good quality steak that was perfectly done...my tuna was amazing...my friend got the chicken almond salad and that was also phenomenal. We had many other stand-out meals on our last trip as well...

We do tend to order desserts when on DDP that we normally may not, but we eat them and enjoy them and it's nice to treat ourselves while on vacation...

IMO Disney is brilliant when it comes to business decisions. They push the envelope sometimes, but we still go back every year....and although many people mumble and groan about the DDP...many of THEM still go back to it on their next trip...Disney is in business to fill their seats, keep people from going off property to eat, and sell their wares....it's what they do and IMHO they do it well. They offer "free" dining, which when you consider other discounts isn't really "free" at all - but it fills seats and gets people to travel when they normally may not...I know the math, and have done it many times....yet have taken 2 trips in the past 4 years that I likely wouldn't have taken if it weren't for "free" dining...

And btw - again although I'd love to flame Disney for taking away the appetizers while on the DDP - I can't because it's a brilliant business decision...I love appetizers, and still order them with many of my meals, and that's another $10 per person who does that! So again, although I am at the losing end of their decision, I can't fault them for it - they make money by doing it - it didn't stop me from ordering what I want when I go to eat....it just means I pay a bit more than the $41.99/day that they charge me for DDP.

All in all - DDP works for some, and doesn't for others...and for me it works every time!

 

[keishashadow]

This debate always makes me laugh a bit....second only to the DVC complaints that "We don't get free dining..." There are always going to be 2 sides to the story, as these threads teach us time and time again.

!

im going to guess u r not a DVC owner/regular on the DVC boards or you'd realize the very few DVC owner posts u find on the DIS whining for FDP are typically from a noob owner who perhaps didn't do their homework & has experienced a 'V-8' moment that perhaps DVC may not be right for them if they want to jump on the CRO packages.

Most DVC owners are 'regulars' & the know the disney-drill, which is why while we still enjoy dining @ WDW. It's hard not to notice the differences in dining overall & tend to point the finger @ the DP, especially the free version; as things seemed to change drastically once it was offered.

btw, i enjoyed a non-DVC trip last Dec precisely for FDP, so I do realize the value of the offer but wouldn't trade my pre-paid vacations for what could be a limited-time offer. Many r biting their nails hoping for what FDP to be announced this year, it's become the norm for them...sad to think many won't be able to visit if it isn't forthcoming.

jmho, lecellier is heck of a deal @ 1 TS and the steaks are very good, certainly not equivalent to a $50 meal or steak 'outside of the world'

 

[daisygirl902]

im going to guess u r not a DVC owner/regular on the DVC boards or you'd realize the very few DVC owner posts u find on the DIS whining for FDP are typically from a noob owner who perhaps didn't do their homework & has experienced a 'V-8' moment that perhaps DVC may not be right for them if they want to jump on the CRO packages.

Wrong on both counts ...I am actually a DVC owner - and spend quite a chunk of time on the DVC boards....and have watched the "free dining" debate many times with many DVC owners...sorry for the generalization, it wasn't meant to step on toes....I just find it funny that anyone can compare the value or a DVC stay to that of a "free dining" stay at a value resort...not to say I won't take advantage of both occasionally....but I will not complain that I have to pay rack rate to get "free dining" if that's what I choose to do. I agree that many of the people engaging in that debate just got into DVC with the wrong expectation...and likely should have figured out what was important to them prior to signing their contract.

For the most part, I am very happy to stay at BLT and pay rack rate for dining plan....best of both worlds IMHO

 

[keishashadow]

Wrong on both counts ...I am actually a DVC owner - and spend quite a chunk of time on the DVC boards....and have watched the "free dining" debate many times with many DVC owners...sorry for the generalization, it wasn't meant to step on toes....I just find it funny that anyone can compare the value or a DVC stay to that of a "free dining" stay at a value resort...not to say I won't take advantage of both occasionally....but I will not complain that I have to pay rack rate to get "free dining" if that's what I choose to do. I agree that many of the people engaging in that debate just got into DVC with the wrong expectation...and likely should have figured out what was important to them prior to signing their contract.

For the most part, I am very happy to stay at BLT and pay rack rate for dining plan....best of both worlds IMHO

exactly, it's comparing apples to oranges

yet, imo, very very threads arise in proportion to overall thread count on this subject, it's cyclical - a few get upset when any FDP is offered & post their vents & that's okay

i remember many DVCers rallying against having the opportunity to even purchase the plan (duh!) when they announced our ability to book beginning in '06. i think it's a wonderful option extended to DVCers.

 

[DaParkers]

I fail to see where my words were "harsh". I was simply responding to the person who acted as if paying $47.99 per night for 2 meals and a snack was the same as someone paying OOP. It's not. Someone paying OOP at a restaurant is probably paying more for that one meal that someone on the DDP pays for an entire days worth of meals. It is as simple as that. I don't know why your getting so defensive about it, and I certainly don't know where you got that I said people on DDP were stealing food.

And DDP does not work for us, we don't eat that much food and would not use most of the meals. Also, we hate making ADR's and prefer to go with the flow on vacation. So it does not work for us.

Kristine

Where do you think that $47.99 per night is coming from? OOP! It's OOP either way. You are CHOOSING to pay more and want to penalize those that CHOOSE to pay less. Question. Should those with AP's or those who get corporate discounts or free tickets from timeshare presentations experience less attractions because their per day cost of a ticket is less than yours?

 

[phyllis1966]

Our trip this past November had us trying the DDP (for free) for the first time. We'd prefer a room discount, but just couldn't snag one, so we felt the Free DDP offer was better than no savings at all.

Well, we thought it worked out pretty well, and our group of 7, 5 of whom are serious foodies, enjoyed our food as much as ever. We aren't the types to order the most expensive items on the menu to get our money's worth, we just order what sounds good to us. DD was 10 1/2 and truly enjoyed ordering from the adult menus (finally, she said!). It was usually too much food for her, though.

We all enjoyed our selections at Citricos (that tropical fruit creme brulee is my fave dessert in all of WDW), Le Cellier (yummy, as always), Jiko (mmmm), the Wave (first time here - awesome), Restaurant Marrakesh, and the Plaza Restaurant. We haven't been to 'Ohana since 2003 and 2004. We thought it was good both times we went, but a bit overrated.

I think your opinion regarding WDW food depends quite a bit on the restaurants you choose. Many of the complaints I notice refer to restaurants that our family feels are just OK. This sounds obvious, but if someone picked all so-so places for their dinner meals, they'd leave WDW with the impression that the food is just OK, maybe even sub-standard. Of course, a so-so restaurant for me may be one of your favorites - it's just all so subjective.

My overall impression of the DDP was a positive one, but I can see how many original and perhaps more expensive entrees would have to be taken off the menus of 1-credit restaurants - it makes good business sense. My only complaint is the included dessert. We love sweets, but many times would rather have a salad as an appetizer, and skip dessert. Sometimes we want to go somewhere esle for dessert. With the DDP, you now have to pay extra for that salad (and I had some delectable salads!). I wish you could choose whether you'd prefer an appetizer or dessert with your meal.

 

[goofy4tink]

im going to guess u r not a DVC owner/regular on the DVC boards or you'd realize the very few DVC owner posts u find on the DIS whining for FDP are typically from a noob owner who perhaps didn't do their homework & has experienced a 'V-8' moment that perhaps DVC may not be right for them if they want to jump on the CRO packages.

Most DVC owners are 'regulars' & the know the disney-drill, which is why while we still enjoy dining @ WDW. It's hard not to notice the differences in dining overall & tend to point the finger @ the DP, especially the free version; as things seemed to change drastically once it was offered.

btw, i enjoyed a non-DVC trip last Dec precisely for FDP, so I do realize the value of the offer but wouldn't trade my pre-paid vacations for what could be a limited-time offer. Many r biting their nails hoping for what FDP to be announced this year, it's become the norm for them...sad to think many won't be able to visit if it isn't forthcoming.

jmho, lecellier is heck of a deal @ 1 TS and the steaks are very good, certainly not equivalent to a $50 meal or steak 'outside of the world'

Have to agree. Those that you see 'whining' about not being able to get free dining are usually those who have just bought into DVC or those who are renting points from someone. The vast majority of us 'get it'. I also went down in Dec and had a stay at POP with free dining in the middle of my two week stay..which was mostly DVC. It was fine. I did upgrade to the regular dining plan from the offered QS plan.

I've been doing the DDP since it began. I seldom pay for it any more, and don't think it's all that great a deal with it's offered free. I hate that I have to get a dessert rather than an appetizer. I haven't used the ddp for several years now. I sit and compare my costs, paying oop with my TiW card, against my costs using the DDP. A lot of people forget to add in the considerable cost of tips when figuring out the DDP costs. I know that the cost of tips, for my trip in Aug (12 days) will be close to $200. If I used the DDP, I would have had to pay close to $1500, plus an addtl $200 for tips, as well as a few oop meals. Using the TiW card allows me to forget about the tips. The discount is about the same as I tip..so it's a wash for me.

I just think the dining plan has had a negative effect on the restaurants. With so many guests using the dining plan, it would seem that the restaurants can rest on their laurels..so to speak. They don't have to offer anything different or special anymore. Disney knows that the restaurants will be filled due to the DDP. Many of those offerings that were a bit special or out of the ordinary have disappeared from the menus. The character buffets are all the same now. It used to be that Crystal Palace had it's special stuff, while Chef Mickeys had theirs. Now..other than characters, the buffets are pretty much identical.

I have to agree that the ddp isn't going anywhere soon. But...I do think that Disney should limit the free dining to the QS plan only. If you want to upgrade, it should cost you extra...maybe $20 pp a day. I also have no problem with Disney limiting certain dining offerings to those on the DDP. Maybe they could bring back some of the nicer things they had and make them not available to those on DDP. Not a punishment for those of you on the DDP. At least, not a punishment any more than the punishment to those not on the DDP got when Disney took away a lot of those offerings. They tell you that you can't get any lobster on the DDP...so why not some other things. I wish they would allow us to order appetizers instead of desserts. But, people would complain that I am getting more for my ddp money that they are because I'm getting a more costly appetizer and they have chosen a cheaper dessert. Ah well.