Considering to puchase DVC

[mcross923]

Hello everyone,
I’ve been lurking for the past couple of months now, thank you for all the useful information on this board. I've been thinking about joining the club and would welcome any feedback/input.

Background:
I’ve heard about DVC a few years ago and started researching it recently. I have been to WDW several times years ago but have never stayed on a Disney property. I plan to vacation at WDW every other year or once every 3 years, most likely during the first week of April or the last week in May timeframe for 5 – 7 nights. I have two children, currently 6 and 3 so a studio will suit us fine for the next 5 to 6 years, and then maybe a one-bedroom after that. Not really sure if I can predict the timing on when we’ll want more space. I’ve read up on UY and banking/borrowing booking windows, and I saw the predicted availability chart that someone posted. I think I know enough, but then again, I don’t know what I don’t know.

Home Resort:
Just from a purely research stand point in seeing pictures and reading the boards, I’m leaning towards VGF, BLT, or PVB. Main factors in the decision are: on the monorail line and longer contracts with these properties. I understand that VGF will require booking at 11 months out due to the limited number of rooms. I thought I read somewhere that BLT studios are small. PVB studios are big, but the property does not have 1 bedrooms. I don’t think I would mind staying at any one of these properties as a home resort, though I'm sure we'll also want to try others like BCV, AK, or WL.

Direct vs. Resale:
I plan to buy resale VGF or BLT. I know that I won’t get the member perks, but I don’t think these will benefit me much anyway. I won’t go multiple times in year so savings from AP discounts and dining/shopping discounts won’t be much of an impact. I doubt I’ll go to member exclusive events unless it’s happening at a time when I’m at WDW, though I admit I don’t know much about these or how fun they are. Lounge access sounds cool at Epcot though. Pool hopping, not sure how much of that I’ll do. TOTWL would be awesome since my family and I just love fireworks. If we stay at VGF, BLT, or PVB, I assume we can watch from somewhere on the property anyway.

Now if I decide on PVB, then I think I might as well buy direct since there’s not many resale listing for PVB and the difference isn’t much on a small contract anyay.

On resales, how much lower than the listed price do these sell for? Say VGF is right now around $145 a point, is it 5%, 10%, or a few dollars less, or all over the board? I know, the answer is probably, it depends. And then there’s ROFR. Just trying to get an idea.

Number of Points:
Initially, I think I can go with a 50 point contract. Bank and borrow so I’ll have 150 points in year 2 for a 5-6 night stay. Then bank and borrow and get 150 points in year 5 , year 8 and so on. I understand that this will likely push out my breakeven point. If we want to go more often or need a 1 bedroom, then I’ll add points at that time. Or maybe I’ll need a 75 point contract to have enough points and rent out the rest, but I assume if I had something like 20 points or so left over, it’s going to be tough to rent vs. having 100 points to rent, is that true?

Next steps:
Before jumping into it, I plan to rent points from a broker and do a one week split stay sometime next year at VGF and BLT, and then stop by PBV to check it out, so I know what I’m getting into.

What considerations am I missing?

Thank you for reading my post!

 

[_auroraborealis_]

I would say definitely stay on property before making any commitments. I'm glad to see you plan to do that, because otherwise, it's a big red flag to me.

BLT studios are very small. The 1BR there is a big upgrade. 1BR units also get you a full kitchen (not a kitchenette) and a W/D. If you buy Poly, you will never get home resort advantage on a 1BR, because there are none.

If you plan to buy a small contract (50-75 points), those contracts sell higher than larger contracts.

 

[KAT4DISNEY]

Going every 3 years comes with issues in that you would very possibly end up with stranded points. If booking at 11 months you would need exactly the right amount of points when banking and borrowing. And if you should need to cancel it is definitely 2 and possibly 3 years of points that are at risk and need to be used either by you or renting before they expire. Every other year is pretty manageable but every 3 years is more difficult and risky. I don't think I'd bother with DVC if that were the planned usage and just consider renting if I wanted larger units or else discounted rooms thru CRO.

 

[mcross923]

I would say definitely stay on property before making any commitments. I'm glad to see you plan to do that, because otherwise, it's a big red flag to me.

BLT studios are very small. The 1BR there is a big upgrade. 1BR units also get you a full kitchen (not a kitchenette) and a W/D. If you buy Poly, you will never get home resort advantage on a 1BR, because there are none.

If you plan to buy a small contract (50-75 points), those contracts sell higher than larger contracts.

My concern with BLT studios being small is we'd want to go 1 BR and the points needed basically doubles, whereas we could get a studio with less points elsewhere. Yup, definitely planning to stay first before purchasing. Thanks for the reply!

 

[mcross923]

Going every 3 years comes with issues in that you would very possibly end up with stranded points. If booking at 11 months you would need exactly the right amount of points when banking and borrowing. And if you should need to cancel it is definitely 2 and possibly 3 years of points that are at risk and need to be used either by you or renting before they expire. Every other year is pretty manageable but every 3 years is more difficult and risky. I don't think I'd bother with DVC if that were the planned usage and just consider renting if I wanted larger units or else discounted rooms thru CRO.

Hmm... I hadn't considered just renting every time. I originally thought we could go every other year since our schedule is such that we go overseas to visit parents every other year. Then we thought maybe we'd cruise once in a while to change it up. I'll have to run some numbers but you brought up a very good point. I guess the "want" to purchase comes from the emotional side of owning a piece of Disney vs. from a financial side. I had not thought about the possibility of having to cancel. Thanks for the reply!

 

[bwvBound]

Hmm... I hadn't considered just renting every time. I originally thought we could go every other year since our schedule is such that we go overseas to visit parents every other year. Then we thought maybe we'd cruise once in a while to change it up. I'll have to run some numbers but you brought up a very good point. I guess the "want" to purchase comes from the emotional side of owning a piece of Disney vs. from a financial side. I had not thought about the possibility of having to cancel. Thanks for the reply!

You likely already know this -- but you can't use resale DVC points towards Disney Cruises if booking through DVC Member Services. While you may use resale points through 3rd party rental brokers -- their minimum point requirements may exceed your intended account size. Not to mention that booking Disney Cruises on points is an expensive option, priced "per passenger" rather "per cabin/room." Cash is king for cruises!

 

[mcross923]

You likely already know this -- but you can't use resale DVC points towards Disney Cruises if booking through DVC Member Services. While you may use resale points through 3rd party rental brokers -- their minimum point requirements may exceed your intended account size. Not to mention that booking Disney Cruises on points is an expensive option, priced "per passenger" rather "per cabin/room." Cash is king for cruises!

Yup, that's what I've gathered from reading the forums (about how expensive it is to use points for DCL). That's why I was going with a smaller contract for DVC stays and we'll use cash for cruises. Thanks!

 

[Dean]

Yup, that's what I've gathered from reading the forums (about how expensive it is to use points for DCL). That's why I was going with a smaller contract for DVC stays and we'll use cash for cruises. Thanks!

To use for DCL it's very expensive. At this point you'd have to both buy retail AND buy more points. And the return on those points is barely the maint fees, usually $6-7.70 per point. There has never been a time in DVC's existence where buying to cruise was reasonable financially. IMO you need to both stay with DVC a couple of times AND stay on property a couple of times (combined is OK). My suggestion would be to stay on property with DVC at least twice and off property with another good timeshare at least once. I wouldn't buy for every 3 years, too much risk. You don't know enough to know what home resort would be best. Usually in that situation buying lower and getting a feel for the system is best if you decide to proceed.

 

[mcross923]

To use for DCL it's very expensive. At this point you'd have to both buy retail AND buy more points. And the return on those points is barely the maint fees, usually $6-7.70 per point. There has never been a time in DVC's existence where buying to cruise was reasonable financially. IMO you need to both stay with DVC a couple of times AND stay on property a couple of times (combined is OK). My suggestion would be to stay on property with DVC at least twice and off property with another good timeshare at least once. I wouldn't buy for every 3 years, too much risk. You don't know enough to know what home resort would be best. Usually in that situation buying lower and getting a feel for the system is best if you decide to proceed.

Thanks for the suggestions. I hate to admit it, but a small part of me does feel like I'm rushing into this. Maybe I ought to stop reading this board too much and seeing how much fun you all are having!

 

[MsTessP]

You have been given some great suggestions. I would caution you, however, in dismissing some of the other resorts simply on the basis of their resort expiration dates. Statistics suggest that only a small fraction of members will likely still own their contracts when the resort expires. At this point, my advice is still to buy the resort which suits your family the best. I also agree that renting points to stay on property before buying is a really good idea.

 

[Dean]

Thanks for the suggestions. I hate to admit it, but a small part of me does feel like I'm rushing into this. Maybe I ought to stop reading this board too much and seeing how much fun you all are having!

You simply don't have enough information to buy reasonably at this point or even to know if you want to stay on property routinely. It sounds like you need to spend a few trips getting your feet under you on this subject and it sounds like this will take several years in your situation. You've got to get past the emotions to make a good decision.

 

[MaryLovesPoohBear]

You simply don't have enough information to buy reasonably at this point or even to know if you want to stay on property routinely. It sounds like you need to spend a few trips getting your feet under you on this subject and it sounds like this will take several years in your situation. You've got to get past the emotions to make a good decision.

This is very good advice.

Make sure you actually like staying on property. What if you find out that you hate it?

 

[mcross923]

You simply don't have enough information to buy reasonably at this point or even to know if you want to stay on property routinely. It sounds like you need to spend a few trips getting your feet under you on this subject and it sounds like this will take several years in your situation. You've got to get past the emotions to make a good decision.

Did my wife tell you to post this? Ha! Many of our conversations about this includes a "But this is Disney, it'll be awesome!" argument from me. Which I know isn't really a good point, but that darn Disney just does such a great job at tugging at my emotions.

Thanks for the advice and feedback!

 

[mcross923]

You have been given some great suggestions. I would caution you, however, in dismissing some of the other resorts simply on the basis of their resort expiration dates. Statistics suggest that only a small fraction of members will likely still own their contracts when the resort expires. At this point, my advice is still to buy the resort which suits your family the best. I also agree that renting points to stay on property before buying is a really good idea.

Thanks. I was thinking that if/when the time comes to sell, wouldn't the properties expiring beyond 2060 command a premium with more years on the contract than those ending in 2042? But I guess the counter point to that is, points are more expensive now for properties with longer contracts vs. shorter contracts.

 

[Lynne M]

I guess the "want" to purchase comes from the emotional side of owning a piece of Disney vs. from a financial side.

And that's exactly how Disney separates people from a great big chunk of their money. There's nothing concrete that a DVC purchase gives you that's not available to you as a non-member. You can stay in all of the same properties, and have all of the same experiences, without ever purchasing a membership. DVC is simply an alternate way of paying for those stays and experiences. To me, getting emotionally attached to DVC is like getting emotionally attached to a mortgage or a car loan. Attached to Disney? You bet I am. Attached to my DVC membership? Only in the sense that it's been financially advantageous for me.

 

[pmaurer74]

It is great you are putting a lot of thoughts into this. From what I have observed it seems DVC owners get the itch to add on, it seems like there is never enough points. I know we are running out of ours next year and will have to take a week off. As your kids get older they will likely want more space. DVC is great for that. From what I understand right now they are not offering VGF direct so resale would be the way to go for that. I would suggest buying direct for Poly since the difference in price especially for a small point contract would not be much different and you would get the benefits. BLT there are more contracts available and it would likely be a slightly cheaper option though a few years less on the contract. Like others have said, end of contract is a very long way away. If you liked the other locations, you might be able to get double the points for the same price as the ones you have mentioned but there contract is shorter. Good luck on your decision!

 

[Dean]

Did my wife tell you to post this? Ha! Many of our conversations about this includes a "But this is Disney, it'll be awesome!" argument from me. Which I know isn't really a good point, but that darn Disney just does such a great job at tugging at my emotions.

Thanks for the advice and feedback!

No but she sounds wise. From what I understand you have only been a few times with the last several years ago and you've never stayed on property. What type of properties have you stayed at off Disney? Do you have any timeshare stay experiences in general? At this point it's all hype and emotions it sounds like. DVC and timeshares in general are a compromise and on property is a lot more expensive than off. It sounds like you'd need a minimum of one good off site timeshare stay and 2 DVC stays to get enough information to even start to make an informed decision. Even then you need to spend at least some time exploring the other resorts if it still looks like something you might want to do. Any lost savings over buying now is minimal when you consider dues and up front costs and the potential cost in making a bad decision could easily be $5-10K. I'm unclear why you've not been in a few years but in general I'd say that anyone that can't afford to go on cash in some manner routinely and stay on property can't afford DVC. The other issue is DVC is very questionable at every 3 years and often not reasonable if that's the plan. We wish you luck.

 

[suebeelin]

We stayed only once at BWI, once at CBR and once at the Hilton before deciding to purchase at bwv. We hated CBR and staying offsite at the Hilton across from downtown Disney. We enjoyed BWI.

We also decided we were going to Disney at least 5 more times. The difference in price btwn doing Disney deluxe (pricing it at $400/night with tax) for another 5 trips made it reasonable for us to buy dvc. Our break even point was 7-10 trips. We are currently have 5 trips under our belt as dvc members, with a 6th trip scheduled this upcoming December. We are close to our break even points based on our initial calculations.

We also invited 9 families to come to Disney a few years ago, booking a standard studio at bwv for 2-5 days per family. That was about 30+ studio nights, which (even at a discount) almost paid for our initial dvc purchase. We did not plan this trip when we bought dvc. We also would not have given/hosted 30+ hotel days for friends and family at bwv out of our pocket but if not for dvc.

Sometimes you don't need to research too much before buying if you know you'll be 1) doing a yearly trip, 2) staying onsite in a deluxe or moderate and 3) you can afford the maint fees, initial outlay and trip expenses without going into debt or financing.

Good luck

 

[mcross923]

Thank you pmaurer74, Dean, and suebeelin for your reply. Can't wait for our WDW trip next April and I'll be renting points to stay at DVC properties first before deciding. Thank you all for giving me the things I need to further consider. It's why I posted here and I appreciate everyone's input and advice.

 

[rg35]

Thank you pmaurer74, Dean, and suebeelin for your reply. Can't wait for our WDW trip next April and I'll be renting points to stay at DVC properties first before deciding. Thank you all for giving me the things I need to further consider. It's why I posted here and I appreciate everyone's input and advice.

Please note that you don't need to rent points at DVC resorts to stay at them. You can book directly from Disney and pay cash. It is generally cheaper to rent points but there are some risks involved - primarily that you are completely the mercy of the renter being upstanding and that your reservation won't be cancelled for any reason. There are rental brokers who can try to mitigate some of that risk, but they can't completely eliminate it. Just something to keep in mind.