Advice needed - teenage son

[mousefanmichelle]

I need some ideas on how to help my out of control 16yr old son. I am not sure counseling will do anything since he is becoming a master minipulator.

Here are some details of whats been going on -
He lies. Lies all the time even when we catch him he still lies. I have told him that there is no point in it since we already know the truth and yet...he lies. He has been caught with beer in his backpack. He skips college (enrolled in our middle college program). He was caught stealing a manhole cover and last week we went to court over it. His hand was slapped and that was it besides the fines we had to pay. He can't pay them since he doesn't have a job. We took the truck away from him that he bought with his money becuz he was caught racing it. We made him put it up for sale.

He is home every day from school at noon. We work an hour away and can't babysit him to keep him home while we are away. He leaves. He is not supposed to. We took all the keys out of our 3 dirtbikes so he can't ride them and today he went to take his sisters little 50cc dirtbike and go over a friends. My oldest son (18) took the key away and my 16yr old kicked and dented his older brothers car. My oldest son wanted me to call the cops on his little brother bcuz he is sick of him. I didn't because it's going to cost me, not my 16yr old, financially speaking. I can't afford that. I just paid to get his truck out of impound, court fee and lawyer fee.

I think my dh is ready to kick him out or choke him out. Not sure which. I don't know what to do anymore.

Advice from those that have BTDT?

 

[AprilShowers]

Sounds like he needs something to do. Is he active in sports or clubs? If not, that's the first thing I might encourage. After school sports practices keep kids out of trouble.
Why is he done with school so early? Can he take more classes? He needs to either be busy or supervised till you get home.
If not more classes, then he needs to get a job and work.

 

[smitch425]

I need some ideas on how to help my out of control 16yr old son. I am not sure counseling will do anything since he is becoming a master minipulator.

Here are some details of whats been going on -
He lies. Lies all the time even when we catch him he still lies. I have told him that there is no point in it since we already know the truth and yet...he lies. He has been caught with beer in his backpack. He skips college (enrolled in our middle college program). He was caught stealing a manhole cover and last week we went to court over it. His hand was slapped and that was it besides the fines we had to pay. He can't pay them since he doesn't have a job. We took the truck away from him that he bought with his money becuz he was caught racing it. We made him put it up for sale.

He is home every day from school at noon. We work an hour away and can't babysit him to keep him home while we are away. He leaves. He is not supposed to. We took all the keys out of our 3 dirtbikes so he can't ride them and today he went to take his sisters little 50cc dirtbike and go over a friends. My oldest son (18) took the key away and my 16yr old kicked and dented his older brothers car. My oldest son wanted me to call the cops on his little brother bcuz he is sick of him. I didn't because it's going to cost me, not my 16yr old, financially speaking. I can't afford that. I just paid to get his truck out of impound, court fee and lawyer fee.

I think my dh is ready to kick him out or choke him out. Not sure which. I don't know what to do anymore.

Advice from those that have BTDT?

He needs counseling. Have you considered military school? Does he have any real interests (aside from drinking), like mechanics, art, etc?

 

[Southernmiss]

he needs counseling. Have you considered military school? Does he have any real interests (aside from drinking), like mechanics, art, etc?

mte

 

[RitaE]

He is done with school at noon?

He needs to be busier. No good comes from a teen boy with too much free time on their hands.

 

[emilyltd]

It sounds like he is not mature enough for the college program and needs to be back in high school full time. I have a 16 year old son, and while he's a very good kid behavior-wise, I know that when they want to do something, it is very hard to stop them. Sometimes the natural consequences have to kick in. Unfortunately, the court system is more punishment for the parents.

I wouldn't discount counseling. If you can get someone who is experienced with teenagers, they have seen all the tricks and know a manipulator when they see one.

I'm so sorry. I know it's tough to discipline a teenager.

 

[Christine]

I agree that it's time to look for other options for him, away from your home.

I know quite a few kids who've gone the military school route. It seems to help many of them--at least gets them to adulthood without any trouble en route.

As for counseling, I don't believe that it's ever really worked for anyone who didn't want to be there so not sure he's ready for that.

I think you've done all you can do and it's time for him to get into a disciplined program. The only problem with that is the risk that he's there with a bunch of other kids who are troubled and sometimes that's not a good thing.

 

[aaarcher86]

I agree that it's time to look for other options for him, away from your home.

I know quite a few kids who've gone the military school route. It seems to help many of them--at least gets them to adulthood without any trouble en route.

As for counseling, I don't believe that it's ever really worked for anyone who didn't want to be there so not sure he's ready for that.

I think you've done all you can do and it's time for him to get into a disciplined program. The only problem with that is the risk that he's there with a bunch of other kids who are troubled and sometimes that's not a good thing.

I'd agree with this. I certainly don't think he'd go to a job if he was forced to get one.

Sometimes it really is just the kid and there's nothing you can do about it.

I would absolutely look into some form of military school.

 

[momz]

I can't say I've been there. My oldest is just 12. But, I've watched my nephew struggle through similar issues.

Bailing him out of his messes didn't help him at all. My nephew's parents would intervene with the school when he got in trouble there. They would talk with his coaches when he got in trouble in sports. They would talk with the police when they were called. They would talk with the judge. Every time, he got in trouble, they would be there to beg and plead, they would provide every excuse under the sun for WHY he did (whatever the deviant behavior of the day was). It was always someone else's fault. The rules were not fair, everyone else is doing it too, every one else is doing something worse, his friends got him to do it...blah blah blah. Now he's 21, can't keep a job, can't complete a semester in college even though he's started 3 times. Is living with his parents. Plus, every other conversation with him involves him rambling on and on about how awful his parents are because they won't give him $$$ for (whatever the desired item of the day is). He is not a responsible contributing member of society and I'm doubting if he ever will be. Pass the marijuana please....

So, paying his fines, getting his truck out of impound, whatever...don't do it! Let him experience consequences for his choices and do not intervene to try and lessen the consequence.

Be there for him when he is ready to express remorse.

I feel for you.

 

[mousefanmichelle]

He is not into sports. He is done everyday at noon because he only has 4 high school classes and 2 college classes and college is out now as of last week - so he is home by noon. Every. Day.

I agree with you all that he has too much time on his hands. 100%. I am not sure how to change that. We live in a rural area, in Michigan, and jobs that are available are few and far between especially for a 16yr old, who now does not have any wheels since we took them away.

What kind of disciplined programs are there?

 

[mousefanmichelle]

Oh yea, we also think, just based on what's been going on with him the he or his friends have stole some alum. tire rims (8) of them from our yard for scrap. We can't prove it but as soon as my dh noticed they were gone and made mention of it my son disappeared into his room and became very moody and upset.....

Here's your sign I guess...

 

[Handbag Lady]

Does he have to pay anything back to you for the times you've bailed him out? I would suggest consequences for the boy. He now has to work x hours to pay back every $10 you spent to clear his fines. He seems interested in scrap you have, make that work for you somehow.

It was no big deal to lose his truck because he has other methods of transportation open to him.

 

[packofjedis]

No advice, but Being a parent is hard! Who knew that our tiny cute infants would grow up to talk back and be crazy teens?

 

[Liberty Belle]

I have not BTDT, but to me it sounds like he desperately needs counseling. Something is not right - either he feels really bad about himself or there's something undiagnosed. I would definitely call a therapist asap. Therapists can help you learn how to deal with him, too.

 

[NotUrsula]

He is not into sports. He is done everyday at noon because he only has 4 high school classes and 2 college classes and college is out now as of last week - so he is home by noon. Every. Day.

I agree with you all that he has too much time on his hands. 100%. I am not sure how to change that. We live in a rural area, in Michigan, and jobs that are available are few and far between especially for a 16yr old, who now does not have any wheels since we took them away.

What kind of disciplined programs are there?

Court-ordered community service would be a good thing; if he gets into trouble again, that is what I would suggest that you ask the judge to set, unless you prefer to let him do some time in the county jail as shock therapy.

Or, do you know a farmer who could use an unpaid hand in summertime? That might be an option to have him work to earn his wheels back.

If you work an hour away, can you take him with you to a job near yours? It might mean kicking your heels at the Y or a library while you wait for him to finish a shift, but perhaps that is something that you are willing to do.

As to the lying, whatever you do, don't bait him to lie. Parents tend to do that: ask a leading question on the theory of giving the kid a chance to come clean. The thing is, a habitual liar will NEVER go for coming clean, and giving him the option to stick to the lie will always cause him to go for it. Just don't do that -- if you know that he lied, then call him on it, but don't bait to see if he doubles down. Doing that will only frustrate you and make him work harder at being a better liar.

 

[PrincessKsMom]

I can't say I've been there. My oldest is just 12. But, I've watched my nephew struggle through similar issues.

Bailing him out of his messes didn't help him at all. My nephew's parents would intervene with the school when he got in trouble there. They would talk with his coaches when he got in trouble in sports. They would talk with the police when they were called. They would talk with the judge. Every time, he got in trouble, they would be there to beg and plead, they would provide every excuse under the sun for WHY he did (whatever the deviant behavior of the day was). It was always someone else's fault. The rules were not fair, everyone else is doing it too, every one else is doing something worse, his friends got him to do it...blah blah blah. Now he's 21, can't keep a job, can't complete a semester in college even though he's started 3 times. Is living with his parents. Plus, every other conversation with him involves him rambling on and on about how awful his parents are because they won't give him $$$ for (whatever the desired item of the day is). He is not a responsible contributing member of society and I'm doubting if he ever will be. Pass the marijuana please....

So, paying his fines, getting his truck out of impound, whatever...don't do it! Let him experience consequences for his choices and do not intervene to try and lessen the consequence.

Be there for him when he is ready to express remorse.

I feel for you.

My husband has a friend like this. His mother always bailed him out, no matter what. With bookies, with police, with courts...you name it she bailed him out for it. Never let him pay the price for anything he did. Well, she's dead now and he's a useless, unproductive adult (47 years old) who is on permanent disability due to one too many DUI accidents. Do not do this to your son. Let him pay the price. Since you already paid to get your son's truck out of the impound, make him sell it and keep the money toward the impound fees, court costs, etc. And if he doesn't like it, there's the door. Or, alternatively, if he's not old enough to be on his own (legally), remove EVERYTHING from his room. Take it all and sell it. Leave him a mattress and some clothes but that it. And if he steals from you again, call the police and have him removed. Maybe a little while in juvenile/jail might be the wakeup call he needs. Sit him down and tell him this is how it's going to be and the reprecussions. And I would also take away any keys to the house. When the family leaves for the day, so does he. He's not welcome back at the house until someone else is home. Good luck

 

[Liberty Belle]

I agree that it's time to look for other options for him, away from your home.

I know quite a few kids who've gone the military school route. It seems to help many of them--at least gets them to adulthood without any trouble en route.

As for counseling, I don't believe that it's ever really worked for anyone who didn't want to be there so not sure he's ready for that.

I think you've done all you can do and it's time for him to get into a disciplined program. The only problem with that is the risk that he's there with a bunch of other kids who are troubled and sometimes that's not a good thing.

He may not even know he wants to be there until he tries. And, for all we know, he may want to be there.

 

[CPT Tripss]

Sounds like the kid needs treatment . . . . voluntary or involuntary. OP really needs legal counsel about the kid's criminal/delinquent behavior. Is Mom really on the hook for his fines? That's a legal question for a MIch lawyer. Sounds like older brother know what needs to happen . . . Call the cops at every offense.

 

[shortbun]

So sorry this is happening to your family. I'd say a psychiatrist/meds and also talk therapy for both your family and solo for your son. He's in real trouble and could have a serious imbalance of organic or brain type. He needs lots of help, professional help. Also, your 18yo should not be his police. I was the police for my mentally ill brother and it was not fun. I felt lost, abandoned and hated my brother although I knew he needed me. 18yo children can not handle their siblings, YOU as the parents can't even do it. Also, and I will not engage in a debate, get all weapons out of your home for now.

 

[NaLisa]

I have a family member who just went through something similar with a teenage child. I suggest family counseling immediately. This situation is detrimental to you, your spouse and all your children. The therapist will likely recommend individual counseling for your 16yo, but a family counselor is the place to start (your son can't manipulate and lie so easily if the rest of you are there to share your side of the story). You all need to be on the same page as to how to deal with this situation, and you need the guidance of a good counselor to get started down what's probably a long and difficult road.

Good luck to you.