A Rose by any other name......

[Cindy B]

I don't mind maam, Ms, Mrs, or Miss. To be fair, my MIL was Mrs. X, so I called myself professionally and personally Ms. X. Well- Mrs. X passed away so I could be Mrs. X now- but I don't bother changing it or my students pronunciation.

What I don't like is Mrs. Jeffrey X. Hello- I have a first name and it isn't Jeffrey! I usually only see it with cards/formal lettters but I would much prefer things to be mailed Mr. & Mrs. X. My husband know how I feel about Mrs. Jeffrey X- so he usually saves the cards/envelopes for me.

 

[luvmy3]

I disagree. She politely called him "sir." She did not make him stand at attention, salute her or do push ups. He is there to wait on her table. Politely. Making a diner feel uncomfortable by telliing them being called sir reminds you of your time in the service and you do not want to be called sir, is indeed risking making the diner uncomfortable. TMI under the circumstances. I think admonishing the diner not to call you sir crosses all sorts of server/diner boundaries. No server in his right mind would make a diner feel awkward for simply being polite. The "sir" thing is HIS hangup and it should have stayed that way. The diner did not cross a boundary....The server did.

Yes, it IS his hang-up and he told the pp why when he told her he was in the military. He asked her not to call him that, and gave her his name so she could use that instead. I don't see anything wrong with what he said to her.
I don't think anyone crossed any boundaries, she called him Sir out of politeness, he asked her not to. Why would any of that that even be an issue

 

[Becky2005]

I think it might be age also! LOL!!! I remember the thought of being called Mrs. X made me go UGH!!!

Now, I don't even think about it & actually wanted my Cub Scouts to call me that (considering in Boy Scouts -- you call ALL the adult leaders Mr. X & Mrs. X, just like in school with the teachers -- so I just figured that was better than "Miss Becky" plus seems weird to have older kids calling you that).

Now my daughter can't stand the "Miss First Name" concept but doesn't want "Miss Last Name" either...would rather just be called first name but she is 18.

When talking about teachers I still call the Mr. X or Mrs. X (mostly because I can't remember their first names all the time - since they are referred to that way in school, that is how I know their names) even when I'm talking to other adults!!!

I'm old enough now that it really doesn't bother me to be called whatever, as long as it isn't an offensive name like witch but then again, I've been called that too I'm sure! (My DD has the Wicked Witch is dead as my ringtone on her phone - which I think is hysterical but everyone else is horrified when it rings and she says "oh that's my mom calling")

In reality, I'm more annoyed when people get my first name wrong than any combination of formal name. I'm not a Rebecca but people will sometimes call me that when trying to be formal! I would rather be Mrs. X than people changing my first name.

I'm even used to Ma'am or Miss in a store when someone I don't know is trying to get my attention...I figure it is better than Hey You!

When I was younger some of this would bother me but I'm older now and it really is no big deal (I've even been known to be called the dogs name growing up as my mom went through the list of kid names trying to get to the right one of us! LOL!)l

ETA: Now that I finished everything, reading about the shortened first name version made me laugh because what do you do about the situation where the name was done one way and somehow along the way there was a shift in the name & it wasn't from YOUR doing!! My sister seemed to change the pronouncation of her married name -- so in my head it is still pronounced the way it was when 40+ years ago, then you go visit now and it is pronounced differently! I think it is because they moved states and changed from long vowel to short vowel sounds.

I've known people who I was introduced to one way, saw their name tag at work with a different version of the name & then somehow it morphed to a 3rd version of the name that we call them. I have no idea what they really go by but considering when they call, they say "this is Chris" -- which is what we call them, I'm assuming they are fine with that.

 

[mamacatnv]

If he does not want to be reminded of his time in the military, he probably has his reasons for that. I think it was perfectly appropriate for him to establish that boundary with you.

I cannot totally explain why but it did make us feel like we had somehow slighted him. It was uncomfortable.

I disagree. She politely called him "sir." She did not make him stand at attention, salute her or do push ups. He is there to wait on her table. Politely. Making a diner feel uncomfortable by telliing them being called sir reminds you of your time in the service and you do not want to be called sir, is indeed risking making the diner uncomfortable. TMI under the circumstances. I think admonishing the diner not to call you sir crosses all sorts of server/diner boundaries. No server in his right mind would make a diner feel awkward for simply being polite. The "sir" thing is HIS hangup and it should have stayed that way. The diner did not cross a boundary....The server did.

That is exactly how we felt, we felt chastised like we had somehow insulted him. We live in Texas, everyone uses Sir/Ma'am I find it strange that he found it necessary to say something like that. Its not like we insulted him, we were being polite.

Yes, it IS his hang-up and he told the pp why when he told her he was in the military. He asked her not to call him that, and gave her his name so she could use that instead. I don't see anything wrong with what he said to her.
I don't think anyone crossed any boundaries, she called him Sir out of politeness, he asked her not to. Why would any of that that even be an issue

It is his hang-up and in my opinion, one he should have kept to himself, he was filling my water glass not coming to my home for dinner.

 

[IheartMickey]

I was called Ma'am a few weeks ago for the first time. I'm 27! That sure made me feel old. It didn't bother me, just felt old!

 

[disykat]

I answer to anything. I go by a nickname, so I'm used to answering to multiple names with no offense whatsoever. Same with my last name. I took my husband's name, but also still answer to my maiden name. Over twenty years later, call me either one, I don't care!

Where I live "ma'am" is really only used in place of "hey you" so I much prefer it in that circumstance.

 

[ColoradoDisneyFreaks]

Yes, it IS his hang-up and he told the pp why when he told her he was in the military. He asked her not to call him that, and gave her his name so she could use that instead. I don't see anything wrong with what he said to her.
I don't think anyone crossed any boundaries, she called him Sir out of politeness, he asked her not to. Why would any of that that even be an issue

Actually, out of politeness, he should have just said "Please call me Casey." and left it at that. The comment about being in the military seemed to be intended to be a not so suble slap at his time there, which is definitely too much information, and is an admonishment about the manners of the diner, which does cross that line.

 

[tvguy]

As for MS, MISS and MRS., I usually ask a woman what they prefer, it's just a matter of respect. I was 14 in 1971 when the real push to start using MS hit, so I was taught women were to be addressed as Miss, or Mrs only.

My supervisor is married and hates Mrs. My wife hates Ms. As both are redheads, you BEAT I want to get it right.

 

[Pooh67_68]

I don't care what i am called and i know a few people who call me Holly instead of Heidi.

I was called ma'ma once. I was was a senior in high school and he was a freshman, didn't bother me in the least.

I also don't get the hang up (that some woman have) being called Mrs. husband first name, last name.

I was taught to call Mr. or Mrs. but i will use ma'ma or sir if trying to get their attention.

Example: Excuse me ma'ma you dropped your mail.

 

[mom2cookies]

I don't say anything, but it bugs me when children ( minors ) call adults by their first names. I know it is because how i was raised, but it was even considered even remotely to call any of my parents friends by their first names. Mr and Mrs Last Name. That was it. Aunt and Uncle First Name. As far as Mrs His first and last name, feels not to show possession but to clarify which Mr last name the card or envelop was meant for.
I don't care what people call me. Except lol Diane... my name is DianA not diane! Nothing wrong with that, but really is it so difficult to say " uh ". I don't care for Di either but i will use that when filling out forms ( like for fun stuff), so i know where junk mail or non-family or non official mail is coming from.

 

[PaulaSB12]

Does what people call you really matter? I'm not referring to insults but rather every day names. Ma'am vs Miss vs Ms. Ms Ann Smith vs Mrs John Jones? Is ego and self esteem all wrapped up in titles?

I am me no matter what I am called and that is enough.

Ms irritates the heck out of me my name is MISS PaulaSB12 not MS. I prefer that and dont like being called ms.

 

[Imzadi]

Does what people call you really matter? I'm not referring to insults but rather every day names. Ma'am vs Miss vs Ms. Ms Ann Smith vs Mrs John Jones? Is ego and self esteem all wrapped up in titles?

I am me no matter what I am called and that is enough.

Psychological research shows that people's Identity of themselves is the most important set if beliefs a person can have. It is also the hardest to change. It is people's center. It is how people show up in the world, how they present themselves, what thy say to themselves and about themselves and how they feel about themselves.

The strongest example is the "N" word. It is probably the single most derogatory word in American culture. It was a word that symbolized how a people were thought of, and when taken on by a slave as their Identity, how they thought about themselves and their PLACE in the world and in ASSOCIATION to the people around them. Back when a slave called himself the "N" word, his ideas and identity of himself were far different from the northern slaves, or slaves who were treated better.

Actor, Sidney Poitier, from the Caribbean Islands, had never heard of that term as he grew up. He didn't have that sense of himself or interactions with white people where he was less than white people. So, naturally, that word and that concept was offensive to him. Because of it, instead of that word taking him down and making him less than, he would not OWN that word as part of his Identity. He was very influential in making movies during the civil rights era and influencing culture at that time.

In his great movie, In the Heat of the Night, a white police chief in the south, Carrol O'Connor, an obvious racist, is trying to put Sidney Poitier in his place. His contempt for Poitier's character is obvious & palpable. At one time he says, "What do they call you up there?" up north, where Poitier's character, Philadelphia PD's number one homicide detective, is from.

One if the great historical lines of of the film and of that civil rights era is Poitier's response, "THEY CALL ME MR. TIBBS!"

He said that word and that line with such, grace, eloquence, outrage and dignity and strength. It was his Identity. He and the films he made at that time, because he knew who he was and how he wanted all black people to show up in the world, changed American culture.


Another example of when demanding to be called Mr. was important, was for Nelson Mandela. He said in the prison where he and his fellow inmates were imprisoned for 27 years, they all DEMANDED that they be called "Mr." He was Mr. Nelson Mandela Even while being punished, they all demanded the respect of being called "Mr." On Oprah, Pres. Mandela said something like, "The battle for dignity is fought in large & small ways every day." And when one's dignity goes, everything else is not far behind.


Last, at the end of financial expert, Suze Orman's show on PBS, Suze Orman: Women & Money: Owning the Power to Control Your Destiny, she ends the show with teaching women to say their own name proudly and with dignity. Again, she says, how you say your name, who you think you are, how you feel about yourself, and how you sound to your self and to the world is reflected in your NAME. And YES, if you want to have a particular title attached to it, (or not) goes with your Identity.

 

[kathie859]

I believe there's power in names. By not taking the time to learn the way a person wants to be addressed and the correct name one prefers sends a message of subtle disrespect.

What I absolutely detest is casual meetings (thinks servers, cashiers, etc) where the person uses "Hon", "Sweetie" and the like. It smacks of insincerity.

I'm an older, married woman and have no issue with being addressed as Ms. Or Mrs. and if someone uses my first name it's usually no biggie though it's nice when someone asks if they may call you by your first name.

 

[Becky2005]

I don't care what people call me. Except lol Diane... my name is DianA not diane! Nothing wrong with that, but really is it so difficult to say " uh ". I don't care for Di either but i will use that when filling out forms ( like for fun stuff), so i know where junk mail or non-family or non official mail is coming from.

My niece is Diane and we were told when she was born even when they were telling people her name -- it is Diane not DianA...Unfortunately, I think you have the same curse that Carolyn & Caroline have....I thought it was such a simple, easy to pronounce name that couldn't really get messed up...I was wrong. Never in a million years even gave it a thought that it could be mixed up. DD's blood just about boils everytime she is called CaroLINE...basically she is polite the first couple times correcting you saying it is CaroLYN but after that, she actually just refuses to acknowledge you are talking to her -- assuming there must be someone in the room named CaroLINE and you are talking to them (which actually HAS happened in school & voice lessons, so she really does assume you must be talking to the other person).

Now the last name she will answer to no matter if that is mispronounced because it happens to have a silent letter that people like to pronounce, so we are so used to that, we correct once and let it roll off our backs & because of the silent letter no one knows where to look for things when looking up last name so we automatically say "X name, spell it out"

 

[EMom]

Yes, it IS his hang-up and he told the pp why when he told her he was in the military. He asked her not to call him that, and gave her his name so she could use that instead. I don't see anything wrong with what he said to her.
I don't think anyone crossed any boundaries, she called him Sir out of politeness, he asked her not to. Why would any of that that even be an issue

A server is there to do many things. Bring water, take and deliver orders, bring you an extra fork and later, your check. He is NOT there to tell you his life story, his hangups, pet peeves, etc. If I was having a nice dinner with my husband, I would be less than happy that a server saw fit to tell me what bugs him. In Texas, being called "Sir" is perfectly normal and done out of politeness. To tell a diner that their polite behavior is not welcome is a sure way to get a crappy tip. And put a damper on the person's dining experience. It's just rude. "Sir" needs to suck it up when a patron uses that term toward him or find another line of work.

ETA: Suppose you call a server "Miss." She responds, "Please don't call me Miss. I am not married even though I'd love to get married and have kids and when you call me 'miss,' it remimds me that I'll probably never get married." OR "Please don't call me Miss. I am a married woman and proud of it. You can call me by my first name or Mrs. X." Same as the server with the military/sir hangup. TMI. TMI. TMI.

NOT the diner's problem, but by telliing her about his "issues," he made it her problem. He was out of line.

 

[Bounce_Tigger]

I started working in retail at age 14. I learned quick not to call a woman of any age "Ma'am" - every woman thinks that she's too young to be called that. In any professional setting, I call men sir and women "Miss." I think it's polite.

 

[luvmy3]

A server is there to do many things. Bring water, take and deliver orders, bring you an extra fork and later, your check. He is NOT there to tell you his life story, his hangups, pet peeves, etc. If I was having a nice dinner with my husband, I would be less than happy that a server saw fit to tell me what bugs him. In Texas, being called "Sir" is perfectly normal and done out of politeness. To tell a diner that their polite behavior is not welcome is a sure way to get a crappy tip. And put a damper on the person's dining experience. It's just rude. "Sir" needs to suck it up when a patron uses that term toward him or find another line of work.

ETA: Suppose you call a server "Miss." She responds, "Please don't call me Miss. I am not married even though I'd love to get married and have kids and when you call me 'miss,' it remimds me that I'll probably never get married." OR "Please don't call me Miss. I am a married woman and proud of it. You can call me by my first name or Mrs. X." Same as the server with the military/sir hangup. TMI. TMI. TMI.

NOT the diner's problem, but by telliing her about his "issues," he made it her problem. He was out of line.

Well to be fair he didn't give her his life story, he just said he was in the military so if you want to compare it to your example, it would be like the waitress saying "Please don't call me miss, I'm married. My name is Jane". I'd say "sure, Jane can I have a refill" Of course I'm the type of person who sees my servers as people, with stories to share and I don't even mind listening to them tell me some. If I only saw them as people who are there to be seen and to serve me, and not heard, I suppose I'd think it was TMI and rude too.

 

[disykat]

I started working in retail at age 14. I learned quick not to call a woman of any age "Ma'am" - every woman thinks that she's too young to be called that. In any professional setting, I call men sir and women "Miss." I think it's polite.

I think if people want to be offended about a title a stranger is using, calling a mature woman "miss" could also be reason for offense. I wouldn't care enough to comment, but as a middle aged woman I would find it odd to be called "miss."

 

[EMom]

Well to be fair he didn't give her his life story, he just said he was in the military so if you want to compare it to your example, it would be like the waitress saying "Please don't call me miss, I'm married. My name is Jane". I'd say "sure, Jane can I have a refill" Of course I'm the type of person who sees my servers as people, with stories to share and I don't even mind listening to them tell me some. If I only saw them as people who are there to be seen and to serve me, and not heard, I suppose I'd think it was TMI and rude too.

I am not trying to go all Downton Abbey on anyone, but I believe it is a server's job to facilitate a smooth, pleasant dining experience. By saying what he said, this server made the patron feel awkward and uncomfortable. That is what makes it TMI.

 

[aimyourarrowshigh]

For titles I use Ms.
It doesn't really matter when it's spoken if someone calls me another title; I'm not likely to correct them unless it's an important conversation where it would matter rather than just a casual one - or if it's a situation where I would need to be referred to by a title frequently.
But if there's not a 'Ms.' option when filling out a form, it really irritates me. I leave the title blank if I have to choose 'Miss' or 'Mrs.', I figure it's not fair that I should have to disclose my marital status when men filling out the same form don't have to.