2 year old and mother kicked off plane

[Lanshark]

I teach special needs kids so I understand the situation. With that said I believe the airline was correct in removing them from the plane. There was a safety issue and an issue of consideration for their other paying customers.

 

[robertsmom]

I get so, SO TIRED of the attitude that this mother seems to be exhibiting. I seem to see it more and more - "well my child has XYZ, there's nothing I can do about his behavior'. That is nothing but a cop out and an excuse for lazy parenting. My son has a multitude of behavioral problems, but I WORK to control them. I understand full well that other people should not be expected to deal with him. I hold him to the same standards of behavior that I do with my sister's children (who have no behavioral issues). Does it take more work with him? Of course. Am I going to let his issues be an excuse for poor behavior? Absolutely not. Because I know that, in the long run, society isn't going to give a flying fig about whatever problems he may have. He will be expected to conform to certain standards of behavior, and I, as his mother, have only a short time to teach him how to get along in the world.

Now I will go put on my flame proof suit because I'm sure they're coming my way.

 

[Mouse House Mama]

I get so, SO TIRED of the attitude that this mother seems to be exhibiting. I seem to see it more and more - "well my child has XYZ, there's nothing I can do about his behavior'. That is nothing but a cop out and an excuse for lazy parenting. My son has a multitude of behavioral problems, but I WORK to control them. I understand full well that other people should not be expected to deal with him. I hold him to the same standards of behavior that I do with my sister's children (who have no behavioral issues). Does it take more work with him? Of course. Am I going to let his issues be an excuse for poor behavior? Absolutely not. Because I know that, in the long run, society isn't going to give a flying fig about whatever problems he may have. He will be expected to conform to certain standards of behavior, and I, as his mother, have only a short time to teach him how to get along in the world.

Now I will go put on my flame proof suit because I'm sure they're coming my way.

I think this is a great post.

 

[marciemi]

I think this is a great post.

I totally agree!

Now to put on my flame suit. I'm just curious. I've worked with a lot of special needs and autistic children, but all elementary age or older. I was under the impression that it was very difficult, if not impossible, to diagnose that young. Basically, based on most definitions, most 2 year olds would test as autistic, whereas they are just displaying normal impulsive/hyperactive/etc. traits for a toddler. Is it really normal to diagnose a 2 year old with autism? I'm just asking because that was the first thing that jumped out of the story at me.

 

[Mad4Mickey]

I get so, SO TIRED of the attitude that this mother seems to be exhibiting. I seem to see it more and more - "well my child has XYZ, there's nothing I can do about his behavior'. That is nothing but a cop out and an excuse for lazy parenting. My son has a multitude of behavioral problems, but I WORK to control them. I understand full well that other people should not be expected to deal with him. I hold him to the same standards of behavior that I do with my sister's children (who have no behavioral issues). Does it take more work with him? Of course. Am I going to let his issues be an excuse for poor behavior? Absolutely not. Because I know that, in the long run, society isn't going to give a flying fig about whatever problems he may have. He will be expected to conform to certain standards of behavior, and I, as his mother, have only a short time to teach him how to get along in the world.

Now I will go put on my flame proof suit because I'm sure they're coming my way.

I agree 100% with you ! GREAT POST .
My kids are 20 and 22 and I can tell you that I would have taken care of the situation before anyone made it to my seat

 

[MaryAnnDVC]

Airline attendants and staff shouldn't be expected to do a better job of handling children (special needs or not) than their parents.

My FAVORITE story there: Grandma, daughter, her infant and toddller traveling. IDIOT gate agent won't let them board until the toddler can carry the two CARRY-Ons all my herself...won't let mom or grandma do it.

Um...sounds a little ridiculous. I'm sure it's BS, or that we're not hearing the whole story. But you hold THAT up as gospel truth??

Actually, I think this whole thing would have gone down completely differently if she hadn't had the front seat. FA wouldn't have had room and access to the kid -- probably wouldn't have even been able to really see him -- mom would have been able to keep her bag, and he would have been more contained and protected (no room to lie on the floor in those seats!)

I'm guessing that she chose that seat location for the extra space. But, no matter where she sat, the boy needed to be restrained, and that wasn't going to happen.

robertsmom...

 

[hentob]

Glad they were removed.

Sorry, there is little time for empathy when a plane is getting ready to head out Follow the safety rules or get off of the plane.

There is no choice.

Two years old and already dx'd w/ autism?

 

[hentob]

http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/story?id=5238571&page=1

Here is the video of the mom.

 

[Pinnie]

I get so, SO TIRED of the attitude that this mother seems to be exhibiting. I seem to see it more and more - "well my child has XYZ, there's nothing I can do about his behavior'. That is nothing but a cop out and an excuse for lazy parenting. My son has a multitude of behavioral problems, but I WORK to control them. I understand full well that other people should not be expected to deal with him. I hold him to the same standards of behavior that I do with my sister's children (who have no behavioral issues). Does it take more work with him? Of course. Am I going to let his issues be an excuse for poor behavior? Absolutely not. Because I know that, in the long run, society isn't going to give a flying fig about whatever problems he may have. He will be expected to conform to certain standards of behavior, and I, as his mother, have only a short time to teach him how to get along in the world.

Now I will go put on my flame proof suit because I'm sure they're coming my way.

NO flames from me but Kuddos for being such a wonderful, attentive and caring parent. Thank you for not being an enabler to your child.

The mom needs to get control of herself before she tries something like this again.

The airline was well within it's rights taking her and the child off the plane.

All my best to you, robertsmom.

pinnie

 

[TDC Nala]

If the kid can't stay in his seat with his seatbelt on, they can't move that plane. The screaming, the crying, okay, get in the air and then deal with that. But the story says the child was "on the floor rolling around" prior to takeoff, to quote the mother. Everyone age 2 and over has to be in a seat with a seat belt on before a plane can take off.

Wasn't there some story awhile back about some parents being removed from a flight because they refused to put the seat belt on their kid? The kid didn't want to wear it, and they didn't want to force the kid to do anything he or she (can't remember which) didn't want to do.

Those parents were on TV. I can't recall if they were threatening to sue anyone.

 

[Pinnie]

From the other link:
Without having been on the flight, it's difficult to say who, if anyone, was at fault. If a child is literally out of control, we can understand why this would necessitate the child's removal from the flight, especially since it was still on the ground. If indeed it was necessary, we just wish it could have happened in a way that didn't leave Jarett and his mother so upset.

It's a he said/she said situation. It ultimately comes down to the pilot having the right to remove passengers that he thinks will not be able to fly for whatever reason.

BINGO! The pilot does have the last say and if he thought the child would be a hindrence on the flight, than he has the right to remove him and his mom.

pinnie

 

[sdarwkcabemanmy]

robertsmom--kudos from me as well for being such a caring parent. I mean, isn't it up to us as parents to control our children and teach them in turn to control their own behavior, emotions etc?

 

[Planogirl]

The Mom didn't handle it well but I feel sympathy for her. I remember once coming back from Orlando, DS then about 3 decided that he did not want to wear the seat belt. Of course that wasn't an option so I had to fight him into his seat and then hold the seat belt shut until we took off with him screaming the whole time. I was beyond embarassed but I couldn't do anything else at the time.

The weird thing is that he'd flown plenty prior to then and did so without issue from then on but that one day he decided to throw a fit. I can't begin to imagine how tough it can be when the child has issues.

That said, it was right to remove them for their own safety.

 

[bumbershoot]

The weird thing is that he'd flown plenty prior to then and did so without issue from then on but that one day he decided to throw a fit. I can't begin to imagine how tough it can be when the child has issues.

I wonder if he was a little freaked out by the other flight that had been canceled, the one where the FAs did let him walk around before it was canceled?

I know my son (though a year or more older) was really worried about flying home when on the way to San Diego he had big time ear pain for the first time.

I'm guessing that she chose that seat location for the extra space. But, no matter where she sat, the boy needed to be restrained, and that wasn't going to happen.

Yes, I'm assuming she chose the seat, thinking it would be better for him.

Mouse House Mama, I was meaning that the FA could have talked in HER ear. Others had said that it might be hard for the mom to hear the FA if the child was screaming and yelling, and I was saying that speaking really close and low could have taken care of that problem that would exacerbate the stress in ANYone (having a family member yelled at), if the FA was indeed yelling at the mom or kid in order to be heard.



Please note that I'm not saying the FA needs to know how to deal better than the mom, I'm just thinking that from our recent experience with a FA who needed some training on how to deal with a totally fine, not acting up, doing what he's supposed to do ADULT, that not all FAs know how to deal with people, let alone a kid having a tantrum, regular 2 year old variety or otherwise.

I'm also not saying that they shouldn't have taken them off the flight. But I do have lots of empathy and sympathy for the situation as I'm reading it, b/c when your kid is flipping out it is HARD, especially when traveling. And if the kiddo has an accurate diagnosis, at only 2 the mom hasn't had much experience with it yet, she's very likely not perfect, and for her to have burst into tears it means she was overwhelmed.

And the whole thing just sounds awful for everyone, and I have no interest in talking about what she should have done in any sort of mean way.

 

[DisneyMommyMichelle]

I would totally want them off of my plane if I paid the money to fly. I have a 2 yr old and If I can't control him then heck yeah they should throw me off!!

(look out for the news on the 5th we're on a looong flight to Mexico! hahaa)

 

[#1hockeymom]

I had a really long post written up then comcast went down for most of the night. My son just informed me it came back on so I wanted to check on this thread.

My major point of the lost thread was to question why that mother didn't bring on her child's car seat? He would have been in a familiar seat and it probably would have helped.

After watching the video I am now more mad at the mother. Seeing her son run around watching his DVD player in the kitchen, with a snack box open right next to it within reach I have to wonder who is really ruling the roost there.

I guess I am also disenchanted with the current "sue" state of America where everyone else is responsible for YOUR mistakes. I see this lady trying to take this to court, or at least get something out of this situation. What about the people who had to put up with these antics? They were actually the people who were hurt during this.

 

[Julia M]

I totally agree!

Now to put on my flame suit. I'm just curious. I've worked with a lot of special needs and autistic children, but all elementary age or older. I was under the impression that it was very difficult, if not impossible, to diagnose that young. Basically, based on most definitions, most 2 year olds would test as autistic, whereas they are just displaying normal impulsive/hyperactive/etc. traits for a toddler. Is it really normal to diagnose a 2 year old with autism? I'm just asking because that was the first thing that jumped out of the story at me.

I assess preschoolers (just turning three) many of whom have an autism diagnosis. So, yes, it is not uncommon to already have that Dx. (Having said that, I see a number that have been misdiagnosed, and/or not dually diagnosed, but that's another thread... )

Also, just because the article says he's two, we don't know how old that actually is. Two can mean 25 months and it can mean 35 months.

I am sympathetic to the mom and know the situation must have been difficult. However, from what I have read, the issue was not that the child was screaming, the issue was that the child was not restrained in the seat. In that case, my understanding is that the airline has alot more latitude in making decisions.

It's probably going to happen more and more in the future. Rising gas prices mean airlines with less flights, so more crowded planes, passengers on tighter schedules, people paying LOTS more for flights (so less sympathetic).......in general, airline travel is going to get alot worse before it gets better

Julia

 

[Cool-Beans]

If your child's special needs are that he needs to be rolling around screaming on the floor and he needs you to not pick him up and strap him in and make him stay there, then just drive and let him roll around the backseat screaming.

Don't hold up a whole plane full of people, for Pete's sake.

 

[tw1nsmom]

Like I said before, there doesn't seem to have been any other choice but to have removed the child and mother from the plane.

Now that I've thought about it though, I have even more sympathy for the mother. If the child is two and has been diagnosed with autism, it must be a fairly recent diagnosis. The mother probably hasn't learned the different skills she's going to need to keep her child focused and under control. She hasn't learned his triggers.


Again, the child, and her were out of control and needed to be removed. I still think IF the flight attendant behaved the way the other described she needs a little training in how to deal with autistic children. The mother definitely needs more time and training to understand the particular needs of her son.

I do have empathy though. The early stages of a diagnosis can be very traumatic and it takes time to realize that your child won't react in the way a typical child would. She should probably stay off planes until she has a better handle on it.

 

[crashbb]

I am sympathetic to the mom and know the situation must have been difficult. However, from what I have read, the issue was not that the child was screaming, the issue was that the child was not restrained in the seat. In that case, my understanding is that the airline has alot more latitude in making decisions.

I would think that they'd have a lot LESS latitude in this case. Screaming is annoying - an unrestrained child is not safe (at two he is too old to be a lap child). FAA rules state that the plane cannot take off with an unrestrained passenger (other than a lap child) as it is unsafe both for them and for the other passengers (if they go flying they become a human projectile).