12-Night Magic of the Baltics ABD Cruise Add-on – No Regrets, But Not Likely to Book Another Add-on

[aggiedog]

My question to Dee Dee:

I do have one other question. What will the maximum number of participants be for any given group? I understand that as many as 160 will be doing certain activities, but when they are broken down into individual groups, does ABD have a set maximum number they will limit each group to?

Her reply today:

Guests will be divided into groups of approximately 40 and hosted by 2 Adventure Guides. When multiple groups are going to the same location, the times will be staggered so everyone will not arrive at the same time. There is not a set maximum, but the Guides will be working within the constraints of maximum number on a motorcoach which should keep that number close to the 40.

So there you go. The max number will be "however many we can cram onto any individual bus." Hmmm. I'm not really liking the sound of that.

 

[CaliforniaGirl09]

My question to Dee Dee:

I do have one other question. What will the maximum number of participants be for any given group? I understand that as many as 160 will be doing certain activities, but when they are broken down into individual groups, does ABD have a set maximum number they will limit each group to?

Her reply today:

Guests will be divided into groups of approximately 40 and hosted by 2 Adventure Guides. When multiple groups are going to the same location, the times will be staggered so everyone will not arrive at the same time. There is not a set maximum, but the Guides will be working within the constraints of maximum number on a motorcoach which should keep that number close to the 40.

So there you go. The max number will be "however many we can cram onto any individual bus." Hmmm. I'm not really liking the sound of that.

Thanks again for passing on the info. I'm not liking the sound of that either I'm especially worried since I'm on the first cruise when presumably all the "bugs" won't be worked out. The staggered time also bothers me. I see waiting around. When I went back through the itinerary to read it very carefully, it was one of the things that stuck out to me... i.e. how are they going to get all 160 of us in a restaurant or brewery?

 

[sayhello]

Thanks again for passing on the info. I'm not liking the sound of that either I'm especially worried since I'm on the first cruise when presumably all the "bugs" won't be worked out. The staggered time also bothers me. I see waiting around. When I went back through the itinerary to read it very carefully, it was one of the things that stuck out to me... i.e. how are they going to get all 160 of us in a restaurant or brewery?

Not that I know, but they might do something like re-arrange the order of things so one group does ABC, another does BCA, another CAB, etc?

Sayhello

 

[CaliforniaGirl09]

Not that I know, but they might do something like re-arrange the order of things so one group does ABC, another does BCA, another CAB, etc?

Sayhello

Great point. I suspect they will do that when they can, but there seem to be a number of instances where that might be hard (couple of off ship lunches--one at a restaurant in Salzurg--wine tasting on ship if you don't do the long bike ride), and there don't seem to be alternative activities available. Even when there are alternatives sometimes it seems as if 160 could be broken up into two 80 groups (eek), for example in Passau in the morning there is a tour and a marzipan activity (so presumably half would do each?). It's just so hard to tell. They must have a plan, I just wish they'd share it better and explain what they will do if the self-selection process for activities ends up being very uneven. As you can tell, I'm struggling with this, LOL. I may be posting help questions later

 

[DisneyKevin]

Almost all ABD Adventures have a maximum capacity of 44 guests.

Having all guests participate in any activity on any Adventure hardly ever happens. I feel sure that some will choose to not join the excursions.

I am told that there will be eight guides per sailing. This does not include the local guides.

While I don't have any concrete answers as to how this will be handled, as none of the river cruises have traveled, ABD has learned that it's logistically difficult to keep 44 people moving in one direction. I am certain that they understand that moving more would be even more difficult.

I am also told that these cruises will continue to evolve. The first river cruise is still 11 months away.

We recently returned from an Adventure with 38 guests. While we traveled from place to place on the same coach, there was rarely a time when 38 guests participated in the same activity at the same time. The group would be divided and different parts of the activity were experienced and then we switched.

 

[aggiedog]

That's good to know. Part of me wants to assume Disney will be working hard to make this work well for everyone. Part of me is a cynic who thinks Disney is seeing dollar signs and figures as long as people are selling out their tours, exactly how they handle things won't be important.

Coming off a DCL trip this summer, the larger group actually appeals to me for the fact that my 4 kids will have a greater chance to make friends and mix it up a bit. I guess I can't have it both ways though. Just talked to a good friend who has done many ABD's all with close to 40 in their groups. He felt it wasn't an issue.

I'll sit tight for now and think some more.

 

[Woodview]

The question I am asking myself is How does an extra 5 people spoil a trip ?

From 44 to 49 . To add an extra 5 people to a bus takes no more than 2 min. There must be more seats empty in the bus anyway.

 

[*WDW*Groupie*]

When we did our cruise ABD add-on our group was 40 people. It seemed to be a perfect number. I don't think an adventure with 49 would appeal to me.

Our Australia ABD had 30 and it was a really nice number. Can't recall how many we had on our Central Europe trip last summer, but the group size seemed just right.

We are booked on the ABD China next summer and I think our trip must be selling well since the price appears to have gone up $1,250 per person since we booked .

 

[kristilew]

Almost all ABD Adventures have a maximum capacity of 44 guests.

Having all guests participate in any activity on any Adventure hardly ever happens. I feel sure that some will choose to not join the excursions.

I am told that there will be eight guides per sailing. This does not include the local guides.

Kevin, I'm just curious what you mean that all guests participating in any activity hardly ever happens? Do you mean that for the regular ABDs as well?

I've only been on 4, but out of all the activities over the four I've done, I can only think of two activities that did not have the participation of every single person on the trip. One was in Peru, when two people opted not to go on the raft trip and met us at the end, and the other was in Italy, when my own family chose to stay in Florence on the day the group went out to the farm. Other than that, the groups were complete and no one skipped any activity at all. Even on the activities that the group was split in half and alternated, there was not a chance to opt out completely. Many times, if one did opt out, the only option would be to wait on the bus, as so many activities take place en route to another area of the country.

I realize here you are offering reassurance about the river boat excursions, but still, I do not think it is the norm for people to pay ABD prices and then not participate. If you're not going to do the excursions, why book this trip at all?

 

[Calfan]

The question I am asking myself is How does an extra 5 people spoil a trip ?

From 44 to 49 . To add an extra 5 people to a bus takes no more than 2 min. There must be more seats empty in the bus anyway.

Personally, I also think 44 is too many people, but you'd be surprised by what the addition of 5 people can do. And, no, there were not empty seats on the bus anyway. The bus was about as full as it can be with 49 people. I realize some people might not care about the size of the group, but it definitely had a negative impact on our experience. Sadly, I think it is likely that we won't go on too many future ABDs, at least not those that have a target maximum of 44 (or, God forbid, a higher max). For me, the ideal is somewhere between 20 and 30.

 

[DisneyKevin]

Kevin, I'm just curious what you mean that all guests participating in any activity hardly ever happens? Do you mean that for the regular ABDs as well?

I've only been on 4, but out of all the activities over the four I've done, I can only think of two activities that did not have the participation of every single person on the trip. One was in Peru, when two people opted not to go on the raft trip and met us at the end, and the other was in Italy, when my own family chose to stay in Florence on the day the group went out to the farm. Other than that, the groups were complete and no one skipped any activity at all. Even on the activities that the group was split in half and alternated, there was not a chance to opt out completely. Many times, if one did opt out, the only option would be to wait on the bus, as so many activities take place en route to another area of the country.

I realize here you are offering reassurance about the river boat excursions, but still, I do not think it is the norm for people to pay ABD prices and then not participate. If you're not going to do the excursions, why book this trip at all?

I just completed the Adventure where we combined the San Francisco weekend and the Backstage Magic for DL's 60th.

There was only one motor coach, so we all traveled together, but there were many events where people chose to not participate. There was a bike ride in SF and about 1/3 chose to do that. The rest opted for an open trolley tour. We toured Silverado Winery and 13 of our group chose to not do the wine tour, tasting and blending. we participated in another activity. I could go on...but you get the point.

My original point was that it's been my experience that a large group is usually broken into smaller groups. There are two guides and usually a local / step on guide. The group is often split and then rotates through activities.

There will be times when that's not possible. The scenario you described is one of them.

There are many reasons to book an ABD trip. I have several folks (myself included) that often find that there are things at a destination that they would rather see than that which is offered by ABD. As I have stated elsewhere, I have participated in two London/Paris trips and have never been to Versailles, although both groups spent the better part of a day there. I had a list of things I wanted to do in Paris and not enough OYO time to do them. I chose them over the day trip to Versailles. Out of our group of 40, 7 others joined me. We rented a van and a driver and explored Paris. I made the choice to see what was important to me.

While you have paid for all experiences on an ABD trip...you are required to do none of them. I tell my guests that travel with us on DIS Exclusive trips and guests that book their trip through me.....it's your Adventure. See what you want to see. Just be at the train, bus, plane etc on time. It's also good form to let the guides know if you strike out on your own. This way the group doesn't wait for someone that isn't going to participate.

 

[evilipoo]

The question I am asking myself is How does an extra 5 people spoil a trip ?

From 44 to 49 . To add an extra 5 people to a bus takes no more than 2 min. There must be more seats empty in the bus anyway.

Well, on our trip we had 44 + guides and that honestly was too many. 40 would have been better and probably 35 or so even better.
In theory, loading and unloading another 4-10 people does not make a difference. In practice however, that is 10 more people who might be dragging their feet coming back from shopping or sights or 10 more kids that might be challenging to corral. And if those extra 9 people are all women and we all need to use the bathroom someplace with limited stalls or access (Like Peterhof or the Hermitage)??? God help you, that is an extra 15+ minutes at every stop.

Speaking from experience...

 

[tufbuf]

Just want to share my experience with Tauck Bridges on their Danibe River cruise. We did the trip last year and I'm not sure if it was a full tour. Anyway the whole group was divided to three and our group had 33 ppl with one Tauck guide (there were three total). Each group has its own coach and own local guide. We alternated activities like in Durnstein, one group biked first followed by the town tour. Another group did the reverse. A number opted out of the biking (mostly the elderly). There was also an option to hike up the castle which many opted out. It's an old tour and we thought the whole tour was well organized.

 

[disneyphx]

Thanks for sharing your thoughts. I have thought about the cruise add ons, but not after reading this.....I think my main incorrect assumption was that the sea days would involve some ABD magic or special treatment. And 49 would have pushed me to the edge. The Central Europe 42 was too many for me -although we met great people! Our other ABDs have been around 25-35....and that works well for us.

 

[Calfan]

Thanks for sharing your thoughts. I have thought about the cruise add ons, but not after reading this.....I think my main incorrect assumption was that the sea days would involve some ABD magic or special treatment. And 49 would have pushed me to the edge. The Central Europe 42 was too many for me -although we met great people! Our other ABDs have been around 25-35....and that works well for us.

Totally agree with you about our Centeal Europe ABD . After the add-on experience and having 42 in Central Europe, we've definitely decided that 20-30 (or even smaller) is our target range. We booked Thomson for China with a max of 20, and are looking at a NatGeo hiking tour in Ireland for 2017 with a max of 16. We had been looking at Tauck Bridges for Ireland but are concerned about their average size of 40 for that trip.