Why is it...

[G2MAmber]

Why is it BWK offers guest 2 bedrooms but not DCV members!? Ugh... I have been trying for months to make a reservation Nov 27-Dec 5 and they say they have nothing available but when I call as a regular guest they have plenty available….

 

[vicki_c]

They are 2 different pools of rooms. If a member trades their points out of DVC, then a room equivalent to those points is given to Disney Reservations to book for cash. Additionally, DVC owns their own points at resorts that they can give to Disney to book for cash.

The first week of December is one of the most popular times for DVC members booking. You really need to book that week at 11 months out. I think you are much too close to those dates now for BWV.

 

[Deb & Bill]

Why is it BWK offers guest 2 bedrooms but not DCV members!? Ugh... I have been trying for months to make a reservation Nov 27-Dec 5 and they say they have nothing available but when I call as a regular guest they have plenty available….

That needed to be booked at the end of Dec 2011 if you wanted it for the end of Nov 2012.

But you are more than welcome to pay cash for that stay.

 

[bigAWL]

They are 2 different pools of rooms. If a member trades their points out of DVC, then a room equivalent to those points is given to Disney Reservations to book for cash. Additionally, DVC owns their own points at resorts that they can give to Disney to book for cash.

The first week of December is one of the most popular times for DVC members booking. You really need to book that week at 11 months out. I think you are much too close to those dates now for BWV.

I'm not sure I understand. I get that points that were traded out are available for renting as cash stays by Disney. But are you saying that Disney is holding particular rooms for particular dates and dedicating them for cash stays? And that they do not wait for a potential cash guest to request dates and then check for availability?

I guess it makes sense for DVC if they know they will have a lot of cash demand for certain villas at certain times. But it sucks for members trying to get those on points. I assume they only do this after the 7-month window opens.

 

[vicki_c]

I'm not sure I understand. I get that points that were traded out are available for renting as cash stays by Disney. But are you saying that Disney is holding particular rooms for particular dates and dedicating them for cash stays? And that they do not wait for a potential cash guest to request dates and then check for availability?

I guess it makes sense for DVC if they know they will have a lot of cash demand for certain villas at certain times. But it sucks for members trying to get those on points. I assume they only do this after the 7-month window opens.

Disney vacation development owns points themselves and they are free to do with them whatever they want, basically turn them over to the Resorts arm of Disney to make money. No they do not wait for a cash guest to be looking for a DVC room. That's why villas are often included in discount offers through Disney Travel. And it wouldn't be after the 7 month window either. I'm probably not explaining it that well today, but I'm just on a quick work break so don't have more time.

 

[bigAWL]

Disney vacation development owns points themselves and they are free to do with them whatever they want, basically turn them over to the Resorts arm of Disney to make money. No they do not wait for a cash guest to be looking for a DVC room. That's why villas are often included in discount offers through Disney Travel. And it wouldn't be after the 7 month window either. I'm probably not explaining it that well today, but I'm just on a quick work break so don't have more time.

I think you're confirming what I thought you were initially saying. Except you say they don't wait until the 7-month window. Do they at least keep the points within the appropriate resort? In other words, when an OKW owner trades points into DCL for a cruise, does DVC only block off villa space at OKW? Maybe after the 7-month mark they can use those points to block off space at BLT instead.

 

[wdrl]

Each DVC resort's master declaration has language that states that DVD has the same rights and privileges as other members of the respective condo associations. As Vicki_c points out, DVD has at least a 2% holding at each DVC resort. At BWV alone, this amounts to a minimum of 97,000 points each year that it can use as it chooses. The number of points actually available to DVD at each resort is much higher because of points DVD reacquires through foreclosure proceedings, ROFR, and other buyback reasons, points it might never have sold to the general public in the first place, as well as points DVD controls due to exchanges made by the members. Thus, DVD has tens of thousands of points at each resort at its disposal to fund cash reservations if it so chooses.

 

[bigAWL]

The revelation here for me is that they can/do block room inventory before they have cash reservations for it.

I'm an owner at VGC which has only two grand villas. Potentially, if DVD wanted to, they could automatically book both of those GVs for particular times of year if they thought they could get cash for them. I would then never stand a chance at getting either of them even at my 11-month window.

 

[jekjones1558]

The part I don't understand is how DVD decides which dates and villa sizes will be turned into cash reservations when someone trades out. For example: I use 700 of my BWV points to go on a Disney cruise. How does DVD decide exactly which dates and size of villa at BWV worth 700 points go into cash inventory? They could choose dates that are not likely to sell out quickly on points (like September) or they could choose dates that are very likely to sell out on points (like Oct. - Dec. stays). Who exactly decides and how do they decide?

 

[drusba]

There is no set rule as to how DVD must allocate its room reservation time. Because of fiduciary obligations to members it must act fair and reasonably. But that does not mean it has to allocate its usable time to slow times. In fact, it would be considered fine if DVD allocated its own controlled time pursuant to known demand factors which could mean, for example, that DVD could (and probably does) allocate a higher daily percentage of its time to holiday periods than other times. Moreover, it could allocate according to regular resort demand patterns rather than DVC patterns.

The same rule applies to type of rooms. For example, it cannot hog all the GVs by allocating all of its time to them but it can potentially hold one of those for a key time like Christmas week when there are only two like at GCV.

As for OP's query, I would guess that DVD does not actually allocate much to the period you mention, end of Nov into first week of December. From its viewpoint that is a harder time to sell to regular resort guests than many other times of year. You were not able to get it as a DVC reservation because you only started trying to do so "months" ago. If you want that time of year at BWV you need to book 11 months out because that first week of December is in fact the highest DVC demand week of the year (even more so than Christmas week).

 

[bigAWL]

There is no set rule as to how DVD must allocate its room reservation time. Because of fiduciary obligations to members it must act fair and reasonably. But that does not mean it has to allocate its usable time to slow times. In fact, it would be considered fine if DVD allocated its own controlled time pursuant to known demand factors which could mean, for example, that DVD could (and probably does) allocate a higher daily percentage of its time to holiday periods than other times. Moreover, it could allocate according to regular resort demand patterns rather than DVC patterns.

The same rule applies to type of rooms. For example, it cannot hog all the GVs by allocating all of its time to them but it can potentially hold one of those for a key time like Christmas week when there are only two like at GCV.

As for OP's query, I would guess that DVD does not actually allocate much to the period you mention, end of Nov into first week of December. From its viewpoint that is a harder time to sell to regular resort guests than many other times of year. You were not able to get it as a DVC reservation because you only started trying to do so "months" ago. If you want that time of year at BWV you need to book 11 months out because that first week of December is in fact the highest DVC demand week of the year (even more so than Christmas week).

Perhaps I misunderstood, but I thought the OP's point was that those particular dates were unavailable for booking on points, but the same dates were available for cash. But I agree it seems odd that DVD would choose that timeframe to sell for cash.

 

[wdrl]

Perhaps I misunderstood, but I thought the OP's point was that those particular dates were unavailable for booking on points, but the same dates were available for cash. But I agree it seems odd that DVD would choose that timeframe to sell for cash.

I don't think its odd at all. In theory, since DVD owns a minimum of 2% of each DVC resort, it could have 2% of each resort available for cash stays each and every week of the year. If you add in all the points DVD controls because of foreclosures, ROFR, buybacks, and exchanges, DVD could have substantially more points at its disposal to offer for cash reservations.

Some might argue that DVD shouldn't use its points during 'peak' DVC times. But when should they use their points? Keep in mind that according to the Master Declarations for each resort DVD has the same rights and privileges as any other member.

 

[Tara]

The revelation here for me is that they can/do block room inventory before they have cash reservations for it.

I'm an owner at VGC which has only two grand villas. Potentially, if DVD wanted to, they could automatically book both of those GVs for particular times of year if they thought they could get cash for them. I would then never stand a chance at getting either of them even at my 11-month window.

I think the nuance here is that there is a certain amount of inventory that is never in the DVC points inventory because it is owned by DVD. So those rooms aren't really "blocked out" - they just might as well not exist. If those points are not declared into DVC, then they aren't available for point bookings, period.

I don't really understand how they determine how many rooms of each size during each day are part of that DVD inventory, but perhaps someone could explain.

 

[Deb & Bill]

If DVD needs to pay for members' non-DVC trips, I would imagine they would want to try to sell the most desirable villas at the most desirable locations. Now if they are limited to selling the villas from the members' points, then you can understand them selling all of the resorts. Plus they have members also selling their stays to non-members ("renting points") to compete with.

The same for the points they own.

It would be nice to exactly how they pick to sell to DRC.