TSA wants more of your money for carry-ons

[sam_gordon]

Longer lines means that the security check point has to operate over a longer period of time. If it takes X minutes per bag and we've gone from 1000 bags to 2000 bags (totally making up numbers), it will take 2X more minutes. So, either they are paying each worker for more hours or they are going to have more workers (working in sequential shifts).

Depends on how much is mechanical vs. "hands on". If an x-ray machine can only handle 60 bags per minute, it doesn't matter how many employees you have or how long they work. Now, if a worker has to manually inspect EVERY bag, you have a point. If the worker can only get through 3 bags a minute, then another employee ups that to 6 bags a minute. But how many bags get manually inspected?

 

[crashbb]

Depends on how much is mechanical vs. "hands on". If an x-ray machine can only handle 60 bags per minute, it doesn't matter how many employees you have or how long they work. Now, if a worker has to manually inspect EVERY bag, you have a point. If the worker can only get through 3 bags a minute, then another employee ups that to 6 bags a minute. But how many bags get manually inspected?

Even if ALL the bags go through the x-ray machine, I have a point. The x-ray machines don't work alone. If the machine can handle 60 bags per minute, you'd need an extra minute of staffing for every 60 extra bags (and, you'd need more than one person working, so really it would be an extra 2-3 minutes of staffing). Okay, 2-3 minutes of staffing isn't much but I suspect that the machines do not handle 60 bags per minute (that is one second per bag!) and there are a lot more 60 extra bags per day.

Now, if we had automated x-ray machines, that could be used in absence of any workers, I wouldn't have a point.

 

[NYDisneyKid]

if the TSA end up getting more money for this then they better start carrying it on and storing it in the overhead compartment for me.

 

[NYDisneyKid]

There is a limit to how long the lines can be before the airport, airlines and passengers object.

The fancy new whole body imagers cost $$$. Costs $$$ to hire (and train) the extra TSA people necessary to run the machines.

Airlines charging to check bags, and passengers "cheating" the airlines out of the fees by bringing large carryon bags, has been going on for years.

What's changed is the money needed for the whole body imagers.

next thing you know there will be a "fee" to get yourself scanned and go through the metal detector

 

[Vijoge]

next thing you know there will be a "fee" to get yourself scanned and go through the metal detector

Yeah, kind of like the old pay toilets that most of you are too young to remember. Insert coin (well probably debit/credit card) , enter scanner, bzzzzzzt, exit.

 

[ssawka]

Yeah, kind of like the old pay toilets that most of you are too young to remember. Insert coin (well probably debit/credit card) , enter scanner, bzzzzzzt, exit.

You've probably all seen it, but CarMax has a current commercial where they have credit card readers for everything in the airplane bathroom. Very funny!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dRwrVSu8ag8

 

[Vijoge]

You've probably all seen it, but CarMax has a current commercial where they have credit card readers for everything in the airplane bathroom. Very funny!

 

[stargazertechie]

These fees are getting a bit out of control. I'm told I can't check my electronics, I have to bring them onboard. I bring them on board, I'm charged additional.

 

[Jeff_G]

Problem Solved!!!! So just like fridge swap, suitcase with clothing swap. One size fits most... Wash in between use optional.

 

[goofy4tink]

Even if ALL the bags go through the x-ray machine, I have a point. The x-ray machines don't work alone. If the machine can handle 60 bags per minute, you'd need an extra minute of staffing for every 60 extra bags (and, you'd need more than one person working, so really it would be an extra 2-3 minutes of staffing). Okay, 2-3 minutes of staffing isn't much but I suspect that the machines do not handle 60 bags per minute (that is one second per bag!) and there are a lot more 60 extra bags per day.

Now, if we had automated x-ray machines, that could be used in absence of any workers, I wouldn't have a point.

But, my point is that 'how many TSA people are going to actively be working that machine'?? There is only so much room, and only so many bags can go through the machine. I still don't understand how it will take more people to work the line (so to speak) if more passengers are bringing on carryon bags. I haven't seen it take any longer for my bags to go through with the longer lines...once I get to the scanner, the bags take the same amount of time. It's the line thats longer, not the time spent at the scanner. So....I must be missing some part of the equation here. Why would there be a need for more TSA people unless they add more scanners?? There are only so many scanning belts and only one bag at a time can go through that scanner.

 

[sam_gordon]

Even if ALL the bags go through the x-ray machine, I have a point. The x-ray machines don't work alone. If the machine can handle 60 bags per minute, you'd need an extra minute of staffing for every 60 extra bags (and, you'd need more than one person working, so really it would be an extra 2-3 minutes of staffing). Okay, 2-3 minutes of staffing isn't much but I suspect that the machines do not handle 60 bags per minute (that is one second per bag!) and there are a lot more 60 extra bags per day.

I disagree. If an X-ray machine can handle 60 bags a minute, it doesn't matter how many humans you have staffing the machine, you're still only going to get 60 bags/minute. Assuming a 24-hour security checkpoint, and employees working 8 hour days, you still only need three employees (not counting days off). Adding more employees won't increase the scanning count. You need to add more machines.

Even if the scanner is only open 16 hours, you only need two employees. Again, more humans does not mean more bags (unless you add more machines).

 

[Lewisc]

I'm not sure if the price list is current but last time I checked the Venetian hotel (Vegas) price list for accepting packages:

0 - 15 lbs. $7.00
15 - 30 lbs. $12.50
31 - 50 lbs. $15.50
51 - 75 lbs. $21.00
76 - 100 lbs. $40.00
Over 100 lbs. 75¢/lb.

Price sending a 40lb box from you local area to Orlando. Check UPS ground and FedX ground. Checked baggage fees will almost always be cheaper, even without a hotel package acceptance fee.

Some people ship luggage because it's easier. Not generally a big cost saver.

 

[tiki23]

But, my point is that 'how many TSA people are going to actively be working that machine'?? There is only so much room, and only so many bags can go through the machine. I still don't understand how it will take more people to work the line (so to speak) if more passengers are bringing on carryon bags. I haven't seen it take any longer for my bags to go through with the longer lines...once I get to the scanner, the bags take the same amount of time. It's the line thats longer, not the time spent at the scanner. So....I must be missing some part of the equation here. Why would there be a need for more TSA people unless they add more scanners?? There are only so many scanning belts and only one bag at a time can go through that scanner.

I've never seen all scanner lanes open at SEA, but maybe that's because TSA had more staff at a different location that was busier?

However, if it's the case throughout the airport that not all of the scanner lanes are open, then they could bring in more agents to run those lanes or more P/T agents could get F/T work...but now they can't hire anyone new because of a hiring freeze.

 

[NYDisneyKid]

Yeah, kind of like the old pay toilets that most of you are too young to remember. Insert coin (well probably debit/credit card) , enter scanner, bzzzzzzt, exit.

oh i remember those, i actually crawled under the door. remember when payphones were a dime? you could actually get it to work with a penny if you did it right.

 

[cm8]

if the TSA end up getting more money for this then they better start carrying it on and storing it in the overhead compartment for me.

What do you think First class is for

I guess we can see people will gladly stop stuffing their carry on cases and use the bottom of the plane like they were supposed too

 

[lllGurulll]

What do you think First class is for

I guess we can see people will gladly stop stuffing their carry on cases and use the bottom of the plane like they were supposed too

I generally always check one bag. I'm not changing my carry on habits though. Especially if they are going to levy this charge even on the travelers that don't use carryons.

 

[ssawka]

I guess we can see people will gladly stop stuffing their carry on cases and use the bottom of the plane like they were supposed too

Maybe if the airlines would charge a reasonable baggage fee people wouldn't try to get around the fee. IMHO, $25-$35 per bag is not reasonable. We still check one bag, but with fees like that it is only human nature to try to avoid those fees.

 

[goofy4tink]

Do I like all these 'fees'??? Absolutely not. I'm not sure which is better...charging fees for particular things so that passengers can decide how they want to go, or just hiding those fees within the actual fares. But, we're going to continue paying...we are never going to go back to rock bottom fares, with no addtl fees. That just isn't realistic anymore. Way back when, flying wasn't as 'common' as it is today. If you told someone you were flying to Florida, they were in awe. Most people drove everywhere. Only the well to do flew. But for the past decade or so, flying has gotten cheaper and much more commonplace. People got spoiled by the ridiculously low fares. I mean, seriously....we all read the threads from those who want to know when the $79 fares from New England to MCO are going to show up again!!!! Sure they were terrific fares. And sure, they got a ton of people in the habit of flying to Florida yearly. How many posts do we see from those who say that unless fares return to those levels they won't be able to go to Florida??

I don't know which is better....higher fares with no fees, or lower fares with fees. But I do know that we aren't going to see lower fares with no fees again. Yes, SW allows those two checked bags...but they're getting the money for 'em somewhere. SW isn't a charity..it's a business. Their fares have steadily increased in the past 18 months or so. They're covering those baggage costs somehow.

So....it's probably a good idea to just accept the fact that there are going to be fees. BUT....I'm not sure we need the TSA putting in a fee for all the carryon bags they have to scan. I mean, isn't that their job??? If the demand requires them to work more hours or to hire more people, so be it. Now...if the airlines charged per carryon, that would almost make more sense. No, I'm not saying they should but I could understand it. I would almost rather each airline charged per piece of carryon. If it had to go in the overhead, there would be a charge. Not a huge amount...maybe $10 per bag. Then, the airline could lower the checked bag fee...maybe to $15 for the first and $20 for the second checked bag. Seems more equitable.

 

[Lewisc]

Maybe if the airlines would charge a reasonable baggage fee people wouldn't try to get around the fee. IMHO, $25-$35 per bag is not reasonable. We still check one bag, but with fees like that it is only human nature to try to avoid those fees.

The airlines wouldn't be charging baggage fees if passengers were willing to pay profitable fares. Airlines found passengers are more willing to pay fees then pay higher fares. Jet Blue still lets you check on bag for free and Southwest two.

I agree people like to avoid fees. Spirit now charges for bin bags. I suspect other airlines will start enforcing size (and weight) limits on bin bags.

 

[eliza61]

The airlines wouldn't be charging baggage fees if passengers were willing to pay profitable fares. Airlines found passengers are more willing to pay fees then pay higher fares. Jet Blue still lets you check on bag for free and Southwest two.

I agree people like to avoid fees. Spirit now charges for bin bags. I suspect other airlines will start enforcing size (and weight) limits on bin bags.

I think truthfully Lewis folks are going to have to get use to the airfare going up. You are absolutely right, airlines need to make enough to be profitable. Do we really want to see a bunch of them go under? No.

What we are begininng to see is that airlines are running out of things to charge for. Hence the strick adherance to guidelines. when people began carrying every thing and the kitchen sink in the carryon, many airlines took it in stride. I flew USair last week and about 30 mins before boarding the gate agents were announcing that any carryon that did not fit in their little "bin" was not legal and would be checked at the passengers expense.

With no other place to add a "fee" the only option is to either make "cuts" or raise fares.

I think the problem is we've gotten so "used" to low fares. I'm a bit longer in the tooth than many so I remember flying in the late 60's and 70's. It was not cheap and most people did not flying regularly like we do now. IMO flying now is considerable more affordable.