Teacher forced to resign over inappropriate pics on her phone. Something is just wrong here

[PollyannaMom]

I still think she was wrong to not have the phone locked if she's going to leave it somewhere others will have access to it. If she's going to let kids use her phone, she was wrong to leave the pictures on there (take the picture, send to spouse, delete the picture). However, I don't think either mistake is worth losing her job over. At most, a 2-3 day suspension.

Oh, I agree. Even though I still personally think she has an uphill battle on her hands with the kids, it should be her choice whether to fight it. She shouldn't be fired.

As for me, I am a teacher (a substitute), and I do wear a more modest swimsuit when my son has friends over who may later be my students.

 

[morgan98]

But, if students hear that teacher busting a student over the school dress code after this, or reminding a student that grades are far more important than looks, I do think they're going to be less likely to believe she really means it.

I don't understand this line of thinking. I think the adults need to be role models for the these teens and tell them to grow up and get over it. I would venture to guess almost every teacher in that building gets naked and engages in some "adult" behavior. Heck, I would venture to bet many of these teens who are losing respect for a married teacher do the same things with their girlfriends and boyfriends!

Just because you share pictures of yourself with your spouse in a state of undress has nothing to do with respecting dress codes or thinking looks are more important than brains? This happened outside of school, outside of school hours. School dress code has nothing to do with it.

I really cannot believe the excuses people are making for this.

 

[Paradise18]

What would the consensus be if the student was texting in class and the teacher picked up his phone off his desk once he laid it down and read the texts out to the class? Would people say the student's privacy was violated?

 

[nkereina]

Haven't read all the posts after this one, but I DO put my phone and wallet away when guests are over (if they aren't on my person), and I would NEVER abandon my phone on a table in a restaurant while I went to the bathroom. Or leave it on a counter at a party. If I ever did, I'd be relieved to find it still there when I returned, and I'd blame myself for my carelessness if it got stolen. Of course I'd blame the thief, too, but I'd recognize that I'd screwed up and paid the price for that.

And no, I'm not cheating on my husband. My mum raised me that if you don't look after your things, then you have to accept your share of the blame when they get broken, lost, stolen, etc. I learned that lesson the first time I was too lazy to lock up my bike before running off to play.

I wasn't making a blanket statement. I said people who are ALWAYS conscious of their phone would be in the minority, so I would consider you in the minority. If in a public place with strangers around, I think most people would take the proper precautions to be aware of their phone and keeping it secure so it's not stolen. But in the presence of people you know, the majority of people would probably admit to relaxing the grasp on their phone.

 

[nkereina]

What would the consensus be if the student was texting in class and the teacher picked up his phone off his desk once he laid it down and read the texts out to the class? Would people say the student's privacy was violated?

Apples and oranges. I would suspect the rules in most schools for students is no texting in class. If the consequence is that the teacher reads your texts aloud if caught, there's a chance students know this up front. Either way, if the rule is that the student shouldn't be texting in class, they can reasonably expect their phone may be taken away and there may be a price to pay. As far as I've seen, the school did not have a rule about a teacher leaving their cell phone on their own desk.

 

[Kogo Shuko]

Would everyone's opinion be different if instead of "semi nude" photos the photos were of a teacher clearly breastfeeding a baby that were being circulated to shame said teacher? Both would obviously show boobs. But I keep seeing all these ads and posts and articles about how nudity isn't sexual, it's normal, and that we need to stop shaming women. But the moment a teacher has "semi nude" photos on her phone, then she's to (at least partially) blame for someone illegally going through those photos and sharing them publicly?

 

[smiths02]

Would everyone's opinion be different if instead of "semi nude" photos the photos were of a teacher clearly breastfeeding a baby that were being circulated to shame said teacher? Both would obviously show boobs. But I keep seeing all these ads and posts and articles about how nudity isn't sexual, it's normal, and that we need to stop shaming women. But the moment a teacher has "semi nude" photos on her phone, then she's to (at least partially) blame for someone illegally going through those photos and sharing them publicly?

You wouldn't see her whole boob if it was breastfeeding because of the baby's head. Also, that is feeding the baby. We can argue about taking a picture of breastfeeding or your husband's hemarrhoids or whatever or a sporting event like a swim meet, but the pictures in question were not art, medical, feeding a baby...they were meant to be sexy AND involved nudity.

 

[smiths02]

What would the consensus be if the student was texting in class and the teacher picked up his phone off his desk once he laid it down and read the texts out to the class? Would people say the student's privacy was violated?[/QUOTE
Depending on the technology agreement the school has, I can see the teacher picking it up and reading it. If she found something really alarming, I could see her reporting it. However, reading it to the class seems like a bad idea (discipline wise) even if it doesn't violate his privacy...it could be bullying the child

 

[AnnaFloridaLover]

I think there is a big difference between excusing behavior and acknowledging thoughts. My kid would be in just as much trouble if he misbehaved in the class of a teacher he had seen a racy picture of as he would if he misbehaved in the class of a teacher he hadn't. I definitely don't agree at all with saying men/boys cannot be expected to control their behavior, whatever religion is saying it, and whatever women/girls are wearing.

But, if students hear that teacher busting a student over the school dress code after this, or reminding a student that grades are far more important than looks, I do think they're going to be less likely to believe she really means it.

I can't for the life of me figure out what the dress code has to do with this. Also, why ever would a teacher think she should "remind" students that grades are far more important than looks? Maybe for some but many people have made a mint off their looks. Good for them.

 

[AnnaFloridaLover]

You wouldn't see her whole boob if it was breastfeeding because of the baby's head. Also, that is feeding the baby. We can argue about taking a picture of breastfeeding or your husband's hemarrhoids or whatever or a sporting event like a swim meet, but the pictures in question were not art, medical, feeding a baby...they were meant to be sexy AND involved nudity.

What makes you qualified to say that the pictures aren't art? I disagree. Art can be sexy and involve nudity.

 

[smiths02]

What makes you qualified to say that the pictures aren't art? I disagree. Art can be sexy and involve nudity.

Is the teacher an artist submitting these pictures to her portfolio? Did she say they were art?

 

[Magpie]

I wasn't making a blanket statement. I said people who are ALWAYS conscious of their phone would be in the minority, so I would consider you in the minority. If in a public place with strangers around, I think most people would take the proper precautions to be aware of their phone and keeping it secure so it's not stolen. But in the presence of people you know, the majority of people would probably admit to relaxing the grasp on their phone.

Fair point... I, and everyone I know personally, is very cautious of our belongings. I tend to take that for granted, and I probably shouldn't. In our family, no one touches another person's phone, or asks for another person's password, or handles another person's computer. Privacy, and protecting your information, is something we drilled into them at a young age.

And - as I told my kids when they were young - school is not home. It's not a place where you can relax and let your hair down and just be yourself. Always be aware of your surroundings and keep an eye on the people around you. They're not family, and they won't necessarily have your best interests in mind. School IS a public place, and with the exception of a few close friends, your schoolmates are as close to strangers as makes no difference.

So I'm guessing this teacher was just a trusting, naive (if the reports are true, that she had been allowing kids to use her phone) 40-something lady, who has never been the target of bullies or opportunists before. As I said earlier, it's a hard lesson. *Especially* if the reports are true, and she was allowing students to use her phone, prior to this incident.

I love the kids I teach, but I don't expect them to love me back. Or to treat me like a friend. It's just not that kind of relationship. If they're well brought up, they'll be respectful. But, I can't count on that. (This young thief, for example, is clearly not well brought up, or he'd be facing consequences for his actions and not doing media interviews.)

Upon further reflection... I'd like to see her get her job back. If she's got decent student support (as seems to be indicated by the petition students' started on her behalf), I think she could manage her classroom effectively. However, given her superiors' animosity toward her, and the embarrassment this entire incident has brought on the school, I do wonder how long she'll last. So, even if she does get her job back, she'd probably still be best off using that grace period to look for another position.

 

[Kogo Shuko]

You wouldn't see her whole boob if it was breastfeeding because of the baby's head. Also, that is feeding the baby. We can argue about taking a picture of breastfeeding or your husband's hemarrhoids or whatever, but the pictures in question were not art, medical, feeding a baby...they were meant to be sexy AND involved nudity.

But they were "semi nude" not "nude", there is a distinct difference.

Mind you, I live somewhere where women are allowed to go topless in public if they want. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Topfreedom_in_Canada)

I've read in this thread many people referring to said "semi nude" photos as pornography, and it astounds me. I didn't realize boobs were that taboo unless there was a baby attached to them.

And for the record, I've seen PLENTY of breastfeeding photos that show LOTS. Not all women are discreet when breastfeeding, especially those who take numerous photos at multiple angles and share them on Facebook and publicly. (and you know what? It's their right to do so.)

Whether they are sexy photos of her partially naked or any other kind of photo of her partially naked, it was never her intention for them to be released, and what that teen did was clearly illegal. How can one child put red pepper flakes in a teacher's drink and get charged and another illegally spreading personal information about their teacher get by without so much as an expulsion? It really shows the jagged divide on opinions in this world.

I see a few problems this event is instigating:
1. Continuing to allow society as a whole to force women to be ashamed of their bodies.
2. Teaching not only women but everyone that rather than teach people to be good, teach them to fear the bad people who were never taught to be good.
3. Perpetuating stupid phrases like "kids will be kids" and "boys will be boys" attitude, despite the fact this child is 16, and in many places (not all) in North America would be old enough to not need a parent present for many important legal decisions (doctors appointments, opening up a bank account, living on his own, eloping, etc).


I don't disagree that this teacher made some mistakes (forgetting to protect her phone and blindly trusting teenagers whose upbringing she is not necessarily aware of). But the teenager in question DID do illegal things, and I do not think the teacher should have to forfeit her job because of information that was shared after someone committed an illegal act against her.

I think it might be important to note that this is a female teacher teaching a subject that is primarily thought a man's job.

 

[AnnaFloridaLover]

Is the teacher an artist submitting these pictures to her portfolio? Did she say they were art?

Oh I had no idea in order for a picture to be considered art it had to be submitted to a portfolio. This is news to me.

 

[Magpie]

Oh I had no idea in order for a picture to be considered art it had to be submitted to a portfolio. This is news to me.

My mother's an art historian. No one's yet come up with a really good answer to the question of "what is art?" But, there ARE folks who do indeed say that a fundamental part of "being art" is in both the intention of the artist to make art, and the reception of the public acknowledging that this is indeed art. So that by submitting something to a portfolio, you are making art. Whereas when Anthony Weiner sent pics of his undies to folks, he was not, in most people's minds, creating "art".

But, the question of "What is art?" is certainly something folks have been fighting about since... probably the first time a person drew a naked someone on a cave wall and another person frowned at it and said, "That's not art!"

 

[smiths02]

But they were "semi nude" not "nude", there is a distinct difference.

Mind you, I live somewhere where women are allowed to go topless in public if they want. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Topfreedom_in_Canada)

I've read in this thread many people referring to said "semi nude" photos as pornography, and it astounds me. I didn't realize boobs were that taboo unless there was a baby attached to them.

And for the record, I've seen PLENTY of breastfeeding photos that show LOTS. Not all women are discreet when breastfeeding, especially those who take numerous photos at multiple angles and share them on Facebook and publicly. (and you know what? It's their right to do so.)

Whether they are sexy photos of her partially naked or any other kind of photo of her partially naked, it was never her intention for them to be released, and what that teen did was clearly illegal. How can one child put red pepper flakes in a teacher's drink and get charged and another illegally spreading personal information about their teacher get by without so much as an expulsion? It really shows the jagged divide on opinions in this world.

I see a few problems this event is instigating:
1. Continuing to allow society as a whole to force women to be ashamed of their bodies.
2. Teaching not only women but everyone that rather than teach people to be good, teach them to fear the bad people who were never taught to be good.
3. Perpetuating stupid phrases like "kids will be kids" and "boys will be boys" attitude, despite the fact this child is 16, and in many places (not all) in North America would be old enough to not need a parent present for many important legal decisions (doctors appointments, opening up a bank account, living on his own, eloping, etc).


I don't disagree that this teacher made some mistakes (forgetting to protect her phone and blindly trusting teenagers whose upbringing she is not necessarily aware of). But the teenager in question DID do illegal things, and I do not think the teacher should have to forfeit her job because of information that was shared after someone committed an illegal act against her.

I think it might be important to note that this is a female teacher teaching a subject that is primarily thought a man's job.

If the story is exactly as the teacher says, she should not be fired AND the student should have school and legal consequences.

 

[AnnaFloridaLover]

My mother's an art historian. No one's yet come up with a really good answer to the question of "what is art?" But, there ARE folks who do indeed say that a fundamental part of "being art" is in both the intention of the artist to make art, and the reception of the public acknowledging that this is indeed art. So that by submitting something to a portfolio, you are making art. Whereas when Anthony Weiner sent pics of his undies to folks, he was not, in most people's minds, creating "art".

But, the question of "What is art?" is certainly something folks have been fighting about since... probably the first time a person drew a naked someone on a cave wall and another person frowned at it and said, "That's not art!"

I wonder if Neanderthals referred to it pornography and were aghast.

 

[Magpie]

I wonder if Neanderthals referred to it pornography and were aghast.

Who can say? But they might've. Many cultures develop interesting taboos around nudity and the depiction thereof. It's not just a "we're primitive and free and therefore we're totally comfortable with our sexuality" thing, any more than it's a "we're modern and enlightened, therefore we've risen above all these hangups about our sexuality". Human civilization does not just ascend or descend from freedom to repression or from ignorance to enlightenment. We're constantly trying out ideas and rules and new ways of living in order to make this whole social group experiment thing called civilization work.

 

[AnnaFloridaLover]

Who can say? But they might've. Many cultures develop interesting taboos around nudity and the depiction thereof. It's not just a "we're primitive and free and therefore we're totally comfortable with our sexuality" thing, any more than it's a "we're modern and enlightened, therefore we've risen above all these hangups about our sexuality". Human civilization does not just ascend or descend from freedom to repression or from ignorance to enlightenment. We're constantly trying out ideas and rules and new ways of living in order to make this whole social group experiment thing called civilization work.

You know I was joking, right?

 

[DisneyMommyMichelle]

I saw an interview with the teacher last night on the news and I think she should not have been fired, she did not share the photos, they were stolen from her. How many inappropriate things are on all the phones in that school if they were to be stolen (students and staff alike)?