Renting ECV vs Power wheelchair

[SueM in MN]

Occasionally, there is a question about renting a power wheelchair.
Most of the rental companies only rent power wheelchairs to people who are already experienced using them, but there may be places that will rent to anyone.
I wrote something up for another board to help someone decide if renting a power wheelchair made sense for her. I thought the information might be useful here as well. Since I don't expect much in terms of replies or discussion, I will put a link to this thread in the disABILITIES FAQs thread, with the ECV/wheelchair rental information in post #2.

Most companies only rent power wheelchairs to people with experience (for example, with one at home and don't want to travel with it). They are a lot more expensive and are harder to use than an ECV.
I have sometimes seen people on power wheelchairs who obviously don't have much experience - probably saw a commercial for Hoverrounds and figured it looked easy. When #2 daughter got her new power wheelchair, #1 daughter and I tried to drive it. So, I can say from experience, it looks much easier than it is.

DD's old power wheelchair (PWC) was 'rear wheel' drive, with one set of drive wheels in the back, like an ECV.
The driving wheels on a zero-turning radius PWC are close to the center, almost right under the seat. This kind is also called "mid-wheel".
My daughter found that changing to zero-turning radius means you have to change the way you turn. The rear wheel drive takes more space to turn, but it is easier to keep it going straight. You need to turn a bit wider in a rear wheel drive and can cut corner sharper with the zero-turning radius. She had to re-learn how to turn and also has to work harder to keep the new wheelchair going straight. That would be the same whether someone is changing from a rear wheel PWC or from an ECV.

This is a little (well, maybe a lot) of information that will maybe help people who have driven an ECV and might be thinking of renting a power wheelchair.
Similarities between a power wheelchair and an ECV. Both have/should:

• a power switch to turn on/off
• a lever, slider or knob to limiting the speed (often 'rabbit' for fast and 'turtle' for slow).
• one set of large wheels that are powered. They push or pull the PWC/ECV to move it.
• the large wheels are together on an axle and just go straight, don't turn from side to side.
• reverse speed is preset to be slower than forward speed.
• smaller wheels that just roll (no power). ECVs may have one wheel or a set in the front. The mid wheel PWCs have 2 sets of small wheels, one in the front and one in the back.
• lever to disengage the motor(s) when the power is off so you can push it - called freewheel and is kind of like putting your car in neutral. Freewheel is not stable; don't get on or off in freewheel and take care against it rolling out of control. Never leave in freewheel on a bus, incline or ride.
• controller needs to be protected from getting wet
• battery power guage
• a padded seat for the driver; not safe to carry any passengers.
• should be able to use WDW transportation (exception is if they are oversize/extrawide)
• brakes are not like car brakes. Braking happens automatically when the throttle or joystick is let go.
• drive in slow speed down ramps/inclines to avoid picking up speed. When going up an incline, go slowly and try not to start and stop. Go straight up and down, not at an angle. Going straight up or down a very steep ramp buts you at risk of tipping forward or backward. Going at an angle up or down a steep ramp puts you at risk of tipping over sideways. So, avoid ramps if you can. If you can't, go slowly and keep in control.

Picture of a typical ECV

Picture of the Pride Mobility PWC (typical type companies rent)

Now for the differences (ECV in regular type, PWC in italics)

• Many ECVs can be taken apart for transport in a car trunk. Almost all PWC can't be taken apart and will need special arrangements for transport in a van (won't fit in a car).
• While stopped, ECV seat can be unlocked and rotated. Especially helpful in theaters and restaurants. Pull straight in, turn the seat to face show. When done, turn to driving position and drive forward to get out.PWC seat fixed in place and can't be turned.
• ECV has a key; put it in and turn it to start. Take it with you to prevent people from driving ECV.PWC has NO KEY. Only a power button or switch. Turn it on and it can be driven away.
• ECV has 2 throttle controls - one for forward. one for reverse. They are usually far apart so it would be hard to reach for the wrong one. The same one joystick controls Forward and reverse on a PWC.
• ECV needs to come to a complete stop to switch into reverse (similar to a car).PWC goes instantly from forward to reverse; it all depends on joystick position
• ECV throttle control lever needs to be pushed for ECV to move. Located where it's unlikely to get hit accidentally & if hit, would only go the direction for that throttle. PWC joystick is out in the open and can get hit accidentally. If it's hit, the PWC will go in whatever direction it is hit.
• ECV steering is similar to a bike or car. Tiller (or 'yoke') attached to the front wheel(s) and actually turns turns them. Tiller only moves side to side and can only turn so far. If yoke in one position, it will stay that way until you move it. Same PWC joystick controls speed, forward/reverse and turning direction all at the same time. The front wheels are not controlled at all.
• backing up ECV works roughly the same as backing up a car; the back wheels stay straight and the direction of the front tire(s) controls which way it will back. Mid-wheel PWC small back tires swivel freely and the direction they are turned partly determines which way PWC turns. It's not that hard to back straight, if you start with all wheels straight. Backing and turning at the same time is a challenge. I sometimes have to nudge the wheels on my daughter's chair to get it rolling in the correct direction. You can't see the wheels, so it's hard to know where they are pointing. Small wheels on PWC that Buena Vista rents seem to be fixed and don't swivel. Front & back wheels on my daughter's PWC both swivel.
• One motor in the ECV controls the rear wheels together. One 'freewheel' lever. Each PWC rear wheel has its own motor. 2 motors means there are 2 freewheel levers.
• ECV drive wheels are smaller and are behind you.Mid wheel PWC wheels are directly below you - be careful of hanging clothing which could get caught.
• ECVs have very few (or no) settings that are individualized for each driver.PWCs may have many individualized settings. MY DD's has 8 different parameters that were set for her on the computer that controls her PWC. They include things like the top speed for forward, top speed for reverse, how quickly it accelerates, how quickly it stops, speed for turns, acceleration for turns, how responsive it is for turns.

So, there are quite a few differences, but the biggest is the joystick!
The joystick controls a computer that sends power to the motor for each of the large wheels. How much power is sent to each motor depends on the joystick position.
Held perfectly straight, both motors get the same amount of power; the wheelchair will go straight.
Push joystick away from center toward one side, one motor gets more power; that wheel goes faster and the wheelchair turns.
Instead of moving only side to side like the ECV yoke, joystick moves freely in all directions.
Think of a clock sitting on a table in front of you.

• The joystick has a stick pointing straight up at the center where the clock hands would be attached. In that position, the wheelchair is set to go straight forward, but is not moving. The joystick returns to that starting position whenever you let go of it.
• Push away from you towards 12 o'clock to go forward. Push as far forward toward 12 as possible (toward the 'outside' of the clock circle) and it will go straight, as fast as possible. Push it less distance away (still toward 12, but the stick more straight up), it goes slower.
• Pull the joystick toward you (toward 6 o'clock) to go backwards. Pull it farther toward you (away from the center) and it will go faster.
• Push joystick away to the right (toward 3 o'clock), wheelchair turns right. Push it away to the left (toward 9 o'clock) to turn left. The farther to the outside of the circle you push it away from you, the faster you will turn. If you keep pushing on the joystick straight to the same side, you will eventually turn a complete circle.
• You can turn and go forward at the same time by pushing at an angle. If you push toward 10 o'clock, you go forward to the left. Pushing toward 2 o'clock is forward to the right. Forward and turning would be any where between 9 and 3 o'clock. Back would be from 3 to 9 o'clock.
• The ability to move in all directions makes it very manoueverable, but also hard to keep straight. You may be trying for 12, but if you are actually at a bit less (like 11.90) it will be steering slightly left. My daughter had a lot of trouble with that and still does when she's tired.
• Joysticks were designed for people who don't have much strength or flexibility, a small movement of the joystick can make a big movement of the wheelchair. It doesn't take strength to use a power wheelchair; it can be driven with light pressure from your pinkie finger.

Last, I'd suggest:

• Turn the power off whenever you are stopped to avoid the joystick getting bumped.
• Avoid backing up if at all possible. Try to turn around in one place instead.
• Be careful in doorways, it's easy to bump your 'driving' hand. My daughter broke her joystick going thru a door the first week she had the new PWC.
• Be careful driving close to tables - the joystick may hit the table before the PWC is in place.
• Be careful not to leave it unattended; no key means it can be driven away by anyone who can turn it on.

 

[goofieslonglostsis]

Great info yet again, Sue! I'm sure it will be helpfull for a fair amount of people.

Just one thing that I noticed;

[*]ECV has a key; put it in and turn it to start. Take it with you to prevent people from driving ECV.PWC has NO KEY. Only a power button or switch. Turn it on and it can be driven away.

There are some PWC's out there that besides the powerswitch also come with a key, which the user can decide either to use or not. For instance some of the types of permobil PWC's come with them (don't know about all types, so can't say about them all). I've seen other chairs with them, but didn't check the brand back than. The times I did run into them (and the one I've got on my permobil) it would require the user to plug the key in underneath the control panel.



About transportability of PWC's. Hope you don't mind me adding this (if so, please just edit any of my babbling out), but maybe somebody could use the info when looking into getting their own pwc to fit personal lifestyle. The PWC's of Otto Bock (C1000, B600 etc.) can be taken apart for transport in a car. If you ask me it's too much of a hassle to do so, but maybe that's just me. Unlike many of the ECV's I've seen with this feature, these PWC's actually are very sturdy looking and feeling.

And just for my curiousity ; are the mid-wheel chairs pretty 'standard' in the US? Standard like, it's this or backwheel stearing? I was like 'what does she mean with mid-wheel', until seeing the picture. If I'm correct, the PWC in the pic has the front set of small wheels touching the floor, right? I've never noticed PWC's having that before. While my permobil has got 2 small wheels in front, they are about 2 or 3 inches above the floor and more there for security than daily driving. I have seen that a lot of times, but these types of chairs are called frontwheel stearing. Or at least they do overhere? Sure makes me curious about the possible difference of just using other terms??


PS; if DD keeps finding it to be more difficult/draining more energy than desirable to drive in a straight line, did you know there are features out there that can help with this? They've got different names per brand, but with the feature it will be easier. You can still make just as small turns from stand still or driving slowly, it will not interfere there. However when driving in a longer straight line, the feature will kick in and reduce the ability of how quickly and far you are able to move the joystick around. So instead of being able to go 360 degrees within a part of a second, you are now in a situation you can only move the joystick in a triangular way. The point of the triangle would be at the front end, meaning it is easier to keep the joystick at that one position. Slow down and/or stop and you can move the joystick 360 degrees again.

 

[videogal1]

If you pull straight into a restaurant table you end up with the tiller between you and your dinner plate. If you plan to rotate the seat to sit at the table you need to park the ECV sideways to the table and then rotate the seat. Mostly there is never enough room to do this.

With an ECV the accelerator is a continuous bar that can be activated by either the left or right thumb. Push forward to go forward and pull back to reverse. They're built that way to accommodate the loss of use of either hand. One-handed operation, not two. On some ECVs you actually have to select a different direction setting by a button or switch in order to go in reverse.

Also, there are some ECVs that have a plug-in connector like you find on the end of a stereo system cable instead of a key. The Bruno Cub is like this.

If you are very tall taking corners on an ECV is especially treacherous because of the location of the center of gravity is higher, which makes it much easier to tip over when cornering (especially on an incline).

 

[Talking Hands]

Jazzy has a way to disable the controller with a special key. My 1103 has one. It doesn't come with it but has to be bought separate. It was developed because users like us who go to Disney were concerned about the safety of their PWC.

 

[Barbday62]

My husbands PWC has no key but he can lock and unlock through a serious of joy stick maneauvers. (Forward and back so many times)
Sue this is excellent resource. I agree its much easier looking to drive a PWC than to actually drive one. LOL I know from expierience when he needed to take a short walk.

 

[SueM in MN]

And just for my curiousity ; are the mid-wheel chairs pretty 'standard' in the US? Standard like, it's this or backwheel stearing? I was like 'what does she mean with mid-wheel', until seeing the picture. If I'm correct, the PWC in the pic has the front set of small wheels touching the floor, right? I've never noticed PWC's having that before. While my permobil has got 2 small wheels in front, they are about 2 or 3 inches above the floor and more there for security than daily driving. I have seen that a lot of times, but these types of chairs are called frontwheel stearing. Or at least they do overhere? Sure makes me curious about the possible difference of just using other terms??


PS; if DD keeps finding it to be more difficult/draining more energy than desirable to drive in a straight line, did you know there are features out there that can help with this? They've got different names per brand, but with the feature it will be easier. You can still make just as small turns from stand still or driving slowly, it will not interfere there. However when driving in a longer straight line, the feature will kick in and reduce the ability of how quickly and far you are able to move the joystick around. So instead of being able to go 360 degrees within a part of a second, you are now in a situation you can only move the joystick in a triangular way. The point of the triangle would be at the front end, meaning it is easier to keep the joystick at that one position. Slow down and/or stop and you can move the joystick 360 degrees again.

Saw 2 things I never replied to (only a few years too late).

First - my DD's power wheelchair has 6 wheels - 2 big ones in the middle, 2 small ones in the front and 2 small ones in the rear. All of her tires are always in contact with the ground. Her wheelchair is an Invacare TDX.

She has a friend with a Permobile wheelchair which also has 6 wheels, with 2 big ones in the middle, 2 small ones in the front and 2 small ones in the rear. The 2 in front are about 2 inches off the ground and are seldom down in contact with the ground. Permobile wheelchairs are not as common in the US, so I am not sure exactly how they work.

DD does have 'straight driving' technology on her power wheelchair. The brand name for the techonology on hers is called TruTrack and it is helpful when going straight long distances and also when going on uneven surfaces (like sideways on a ramp area).

 

[SueM in MN]

My daughter got a new power wheelchair in 2016, so I thought I would update this thread.

Her new power wheelchair is a Permobil 5 VS which I have attached a picture of.
This is her third power wheelchair and is very different than either of her other power wheelchairs. This wheelchair can be reclined, the seat can be raised about 14 inches while she is seated so that she can drive at eye level with people who are walking with her. The wheelchair can also put her into a standing position, where she can alsso drive. This is a very important feature for her since she can't stand without support.

The Permobil has a set of large drive wheels in the middle, uder the seat. They are further forward than her previous power wheelchair, so even though she is a very experienced power wheelchair user, there was a bit of a curve for learning/relearning how to turn.
Her other chair was considered mid- wheel drive and this one is front wheel drive with the drive wheels closer to the front of the chair.
There are 2 casters (non- powered wheels) in the rear and 2 casters in the front. The 2 front wheels are for balance when standing or elevated and don't normally touch the ground.
Those features, plus recline are options (and expensive ones at that). It is a very cool, high tech wheelchair.

All of the features were chosen for her and had to be documented and approved.

 

[Kenneth Williams]

I have a Golden Compass CP600 and it uses 2 drive wheels and 4 castor wheels. I like that I can turn 360 without moving F/B meaning I can get out as easily as I got in some places. The way I deal with leaving it behind is I plug in the charger cable. the chair won't move with it plugged in and most ppl don't know that.

Another way would be to pull the control cable out. I did that a few times too.

My chair comes apart and can fit in a trunk or the back of an SUV but the base at 88 lbs can be difficult to load without a lift.

 

[50surgeries2012]

Last year my new power chair just a few weeks before my guy Dan Haugen, our support worker Bonnie, and I left for our trip to Disney World. I debated canceling my power chair reservation I had with Care Medical, and taking my own power chair. But, both my mom, and Bonnie advised me against it. Since it was a brand new power chair. It would be too risky to take it. This was the rental power chair I had on that trip, and it was fun to drive it. I was just starting out learning how to drive a mid-wheel drive power chair from my old rear-wheel drive one. But, after driving a power chair for the last 13 years. I was experienced. This is the type of power chair that some of the rental companies rent out. For someone like me who needs special seating in hers. The seating in this was quite comfortable. My back was happy.